..........

10 % maybe? Not many. And there's no science behind any of it. I would guess way more people are harmed. And what does "helped by" even mean? Functioning better in the world? Feeling better about yourself? Feeling acceptance? Sometimes people go to therapy and think they're doing better, but they're treating the people around them like absolute crap. I'm not sure that is successful therapy. It's way too confusing.

[wotchermuggle]

Who knows. That would really be hard to judge, especially since so many different people get treatment, some not willingly, and there are so many diagnoses and individual situations....

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by mian síoraí

..........

here where I live and work there are no statistics on how many therapy has helped because that is subjective to each clients own reasons why they enter therapy, what their individual goals are and whether that client wants the help they are seeking or being given. you see many people enter therapy and sometimes once therapy begins they may decide that its too hard, not for them or just not ready to face their inner demons so to speak.

that said here where I live and work the state, cities, towns and agencies all keep their own statistical data on how many people are in the mental health system. example at the crisis center where I work at any given time there are well over 2000 clients divided up into caseloads of each treatment provider having a caseload of between 40 and 65 clients a week.

the hospital that I also work at, their statistics are considerably higher.

to find out what the statistics are in your location you can contact any mental health agency in your location. they will be able to tell you how many clients they serve.

[KayDubs]

I've read estimates anywhere between 60-80% of therapy patients see benefits, but "benefits" is such a difficult word to pin down and define in this context. I feel it's been enormously beneficial for how I relate to myself and others, but I also know people who went for entirely selfish reasons and continued to treat others poorly.

[JustShakey]

I'd still be in an abusive relationship if not for therapy. And I know I'm not alone in saying that. I'd say that's helpful.

Long, but interesting

The Effectiveness of Psychotherapy: The Consumer Reports Study

[KayDubs]

Originally Posted by lolagrace

Long, but interesting

The Effectiveness of Psychotherapy: The Consumer Reports Study

Nice! Seligman was the authors of one of the sources I alluded to in my earlier post. He estimates around 65% of clients benefit from therapy, IIRC (but I read that in one of his books, so I can't link it here). I'll definitely read this--thanks!

I think its possible there are a lot of people who try it out and slink away silently, feeling a little harmed, but never say anything to anyone, and these people are under the research radar.

Interesting article about that survey:

https://forbiddenpsychology.wordpres...psychotherapy/

Originally Posted by Brown Owl

I think its possible there are a lot of people who try it out and slink away silently, feeling a little harmed, but never say anything to anyone, and these people are under the research radar.

I agree. Where are the surveys and studies on how harmful therapy can be? Those people get shamed into being silent. They get blamed and are scared to speak out because who would believe them anyway. They're the mentally ill. They're the ones who didn't cooperate in therapy and that is why it "failed."

Ugh.

[missbella]

Except for one blatantly abusive bout, I was convinced therapy was doing great things. I was therapy's biggest cheerleader. It wasn't until much later that I realized that therapy was like a New Year's Eve party, convincing me briefly that I was turning an important page, only to discover on Jan 3, that life continues the way it did on December 31. But worse, I drove away friends with my self-absorption, self-pity and obsession with it .

I was very suggestible and joined my therapists in their delusions.

[ragsnfeathers]

I also wonder how much therapy is a case of "Good Cop, Bad Cop"; how much of it is a way to motivate people to accept society's unspoken rules, and how much personal pain is structural punishment for not accepting those rules in the first place.

Clearly not all therapy and/or not all aspects of any individual therapy experience.

[KayDubs]

Originally Posted by ragsnfeathers

I also wonder how much therapy is a case of "Good Cop, Bad Cop"; how much of it is a way to motivate people to accept society's unspoken rules, and how much personal pain is structural punishment for not accepting those rules in the first place.

Good point. In a situation like this, where does the client draw the line? How much is an exercise in conformity? Not that all therapy is like this, but I can see something like this playing out in certain situations.

The title of this thread doesn't actually match the question that was in the post, but I had to delete it for personal reasons.

Thanks for the comments.

[MoxieDoxie]

I'm alive and planned on absolutely attemptin suicide again. I am alive because of my T and thinking of a future. So I say it worked. I do believe it all depends on the dedication of the therapist.

[Partless]

Originally Posted by mian síoraí

..........

I can't find reliable stats overall, but main types of therapies studied are quite effective.

But there are a few problems with some of the findings, in my opinion.

1. Just because the research says a therapy is effective it does not mean it is truly effective in a way that is meaningful to a particular person. They might use specific criteria, like reduction of certain symptom or being able to work or whatever, as signs of success. But the patient might see those as improvement but not feel truly helped by therapy, as you say.

2. Some studies don't use good methodology. Sometimes people with worse symptoms actually drop out of the study. The people who complete it are not the same as people who drop out. They might be more determined, bigger believers in the modality used, etc. In addition, some mental health issues are time limited. Like some episodes of major depression lift on their own after a number of months (even without therapy). And so on.

3. Many different kinds of therapy have similar results. Which is why some research now indicates (not a consensus though) that success is more about the therapist and client match and connection, client engagement, etc, than about a particular modality.

In my view therapy is not helpful for all people or with all problems. Sometimes you can't know that till you've gone for therapy. Then again, sometimes people go for therapy when they give up hope of finding any other way to better their situation.

Originally Posted by ragsnfeathers

I also wonder how much therapy is a case of "Good Cop, Bad Cop"; how much of it is a way to motivate people to accept society's unspoken rules, and how much personal pain is structural punishment for not accepting those rules in the first place.

Clearly not all therapy and/or not all aspects of any individual therapy experience.

Interesting observation, and a not so uncommon criticism of psychotherapy, as enforcer of societal status quo.

[musinglizzy]

I didn't see the original post, but, although I have changed in a few ways since starting therapy almost 10 months ago (extensively, twice per week), I seem to find it just adds other, non related issues. Therapy, lately, has just caused more pain, more emotions, more turmoil. We are at the mercy of our T.... and they decide what they think is best for us. Mine recently changed her tactic, without discussing it with me, without even telling me, I just had to "notice" on my own. That was extremely hurtful to me.

I have a session in 12 hours. I tried to cancel (for a break, not to quit). She coaxed me into going, but I'm reluctant. At this time, I've decided to just work with what she knows, and not add any more to the mix, I've decided to do what I can to not let myself feel vulnerable and cry.

I rarely go anywhere, and just went away for the weekend, but had this dark cloud hovering over me. My therapy. This session ought to be interesting. I told her I'll go, but that may be the only thing I accomplish for the session, showing up. I'm ready to walk away. Sorry to be so negative.

I've changed due to therapy. but I wanted to change. The place I was in before therapy was a living hell.
No, I'm not in heaven now. Life isn't the b/w. But for me, I've got what I was so desperately lacking before therapy.

[growlycat]

I feel it has saved my life overall and I continue to chip away at my issues.

However, I have had bad therapists and indeed they do a lot of harm!!

[LindaLu]

Interesting articles. Think back to history class about the rise of specialization, trades, and guilds in Middle Ages. Psychotherapy is a powerful industry and getting stronger due to lobbying and health care.

Is that good or bad, who knows? But combine that role specialization with the fact that humans have narrative bias, confirmation bias, aversion to admitting sunk costs. So they are inclined to justify time and expense of their own therapy.

For example I had a sweet moment connecting with a new acquaintance that I ATTRIBUTE to my having had therapy (e.g.,learning about being vulnerable). So I'd be one of those people in a survey saying therapy helped me. But is it TRUE??

During the seven years of seeing my ex therapist I thought I was being helped, but the horrible termination wiped out most if not all of the "good" effects. I have tried really hard to see some good in the whole disaster, but the pain of the ending wiped most of it out. Actually, all of it because I can't think of him or anything we did without feeling the pain and trauma (and it is trauma). It's really like nothing I've ever experienced and I have no idea how to heal from it.

[baseline]

I don't know but I was a skeptic all my life about T. As a last resort my doctor encouraged me to go and one year later I feel like I am coming around. It was hardwork, embarrassing, frustrating,and discouraging at times. But I didn't give up and I'm around to feel the positive results!

Therapy has been very helpful for me over the years. I'm in a much different and better place in my life finally than when I started this process. It was a long road for me, and it wasn't a road in a direct line toward improvement; it tended to meander and take u-turns and detours along the way. But for the most part, I think I truly reached my destination. I suspect I will always deal on and off with the symptoms of depression and bipolar disorder as they crop up for me; no therapy can completely wipe out those issues for me. But I am MUCH more equipped to handle those issues proactively, healthily, and effectively now than I was before I entered this therapy process. I have gained a level of mental health and stability that eluded me for many years.

[dj315]

Originally Posted by _Mouse

I've changed due to therapy. but I wanted to change. The place I was in before therapy was a living hell.
No, I'm not in heaven now. Life isn't the b/w. But for me, I've got what I was so desperately lacking before therapy.

This is a great reminder for me. I've been having some fiercely negative emotions surrounding therapy recently, but like you said, my life was a living hell before I started going. My anxiety was so bad that I was on the verge of not being able to function anymore. Even though an NP had to refer me to get me to even consider the possibility of therapy, I did want to change and therapy provided a constant in my life I had never had before that allowed me to do so.

Now I also feel like I'm completely in over my head with therapy right now But I'm trusting my T to either help me work through it or know that it's time to let me take a break or end it.