[ScarletPimpernel]

The last few days, I have done well thanks to everyone's advice. I stopped criticizing and pushing myself. I listened to my body and emotions and have only done things that I felt I was able to do. I mostly rested, but it gave me the energy to start doing some chores around the house. That's the good news.

But this week has been a pretty bad week. I had multiple breakdowns. I'm still dealing with my depression and thoughts. Was in the ER. Seeing my Pdoc was emotional for me. Still hate group. My puppy had her spay surgery, so I have to watch her basically 24/7 (or put the cone on her). And not only does my mom probably need neck and shoulder surgery, she might need back surgery, she might have skin cancer, and she collapsed Sat night because she didn't have enough oxygen in her blood and she has a blood clot in her leg.

About SUI:

Possible trigger:

When I went to the ER, one of the prescriptions they gave me was Lidocaine. W/o going into details, the Lidocaine only helps with my SUI plan. I do NOT currently have any intentions of following through.

Not a fun week to say the least.

And now, like clockwork, 1-2 days before I see my T and I don't want to go. Last week was a lot of arguing. I do not want to do that again. And most of my issues this week I don't want to talk to her about. It's difficult talking about feelings concerning my mom. I do feel for her and worry, but at the same I'm kinda numb about it. Nothing to talk about concerning the puppy. I'll break down crying if I talk about my Pdoc. I can't talk about group because she geys mad. And I do not want to talk about my thoughts. It will just worry my T, and she'll threaten a "higher level of care" which will trigger my abandonment and rejection issues which will derail any sort of processing. On top of all of this, I still, after 3? weeks, feel a disconnect with her. So if I bring up the disconnect, she is going to get frustrated and we will argue for at least half the session before she gives me any type of reassurance. And now that she's too busy to be a support to me outside of session, I just feel more distant.

So I'm left with 4 options:
1. I call/email and cancel this week. BUT...she will simply respond with something that will convince me to come in. And because she always convinces me, I come off like I'm testing her or manipulating her.
2. I email her all my concerns. WELL...she will read it and be irriated I wrote it instead of coming in and talking about it. Plus, she'll respond to come in and talk with her.
3. I don't show up. BUT...then she'll call the police on me and she'll really be pissed.
4. Just show up. BUT...wth do I talk about? As I mentioned above, there's really nothing to talk about that will be helpful to me at this time. I'm "in trouble" whether I express myself or not. When I express myself, I'm focusing on the wrong thing or blowing things out of proportion or going down a bad path. When I don't express myself, then I'm wasting both our time, not being open, being resistant.

I'm stuck. I know that a lot of these issues with my T are my own issues. But she isn't perfect. But even then, she gets upset if I put any blame on her. Ugh!

What do I do? I'm so angry, hurt, and frustrated with her and everything else. I need to get out of this hole!

[stopdog]

Seriously, I found putting it into a power point helped. Little bullet points of where she was failing me.

[ScarletPimpernel]

Originally Posted by stopdog

Seriously, I found putting it into a power point helped. Little bullet points of where she was failing me.

I should do a presentation. Just have no way to present a powerpoint. She probably wouldn't even be shocked if I did.

I'm tempted to tell her to sit in silence while I talk.

I'm also tempted to ask her what she sees as her role in my treatment. Maybe our ideas on what a T should be is different.

Or maybe this is just me throwing a tantrum. Either way, I'm not happy.

[unaluna]

How does it FEEL to do the positive things? I can always talk about how unnatural it feels. How to make these things a daily habit rather than a once a week or once a month occurrence. Then come back and tell me please!

[SnakeCharmer]

Scarlet, I'm sorry you're having such a hard time. Help me understand here ... did this downward spiral and feeling of disconnection with T begin when she said something about the relationship not being the main thing in your therapy with her? I don't remember the exact words, but I do remember the gist of it and that it was distressing to you. Am I remembering correctly?

At the time, I took her statement to be about a therapeutic approach, philosophy or point-of-view, not a personal comment about her feelings about you or the quality or importance of the relationship with you.

I happen to agree with that point-of-view. I personally find therapy that relies on the relationship as the main thing highly risky. The chances of the T not being able to fulfill the role of being there and doing the right thing most of the time, much less all the time, seems extremely risky to me. It sets the client up for devastation if the T fails in some way, moves, gets sick, even if they go through a bad patch themselves and get cranky and impatient.

If your T's statement about "the relationship" was the trigger for you, that might be worth talking about. It could be reassuring in many ways.

I'm also worried about the "breakdowns" you talk about. I don't know exactly what you mean by that -- highly emotional, collapsing, crying, a panic attack??? I just don't know. But that's something to talk about with T.

In my mind that's related to the comment about the relationship. A relationship with T is nice, it's important, but we also need knowledge, skills, ways to cope, understanding of cognitive distortions and how our bodies react during a panic attack or other type of "breakdown." Our Ts can't always be there for us, sometimes it's up to us to calm ourselves sufficiently to prevent or stop or pull out of a breakdown when it's hitting us.

I think, from what you've written in various threads, that was what your T was referring to when she made her comment about the relationship. That's worth talking about with her and if you don't feel like talking much, maybe it would be okay to bring up the subject and to listen to what she has to say about it, about her therapeutic approach and what she meant when she made that statement.

Knowing our Ts therapeutic approach, what they believe about the therapeutic process, and how they see their therapeutic style is, to me, a very important part of developing a trusting relationship.

I'm wondering, Scarlet, if you're feeling very down, rejected and disconnected because your T has more on offer than a relationship. She also sees skills for you to use between sessions as highly important. Maybe she worded it bluntly or tossed it off without explanation and it triggered you. Is that worth talking about with her?

Let us know what you decide to do. I'll be thinking about you.

Edited to add: As you said, Scarlet, "Maybe our ideas on what a T should be is different." That's major. It's time to find out if you're both on the same page.

[ScarletPimpernel]

Originally Posted by SnakeCharmer

Scarlet, I'm sorry you're having such a hard time. Help me understand here ... did this downward spiral and feeling of disconnection with T begin when she said something about the relationship not being the main thing in your therapy with her? I don't remember the exact words, but I do remember the gist of it and that it was distressing to you. Am I remembering correctly?

At the time, I took her statement to be about a therapeutic approach, philosophy or point-of-view, not a personal comment about her feelings about you or the quality or importance of the relationship with you.

I happen to agree with that point-of-view. I personally find therapy that relies on the relationship as the main thing highly risky. The chances of the T not being able to fulfill the role of being there and doing the right thing most of the time, much less all the time, seems extremely risky to me. It sets the client up for devastation if the T fails in some way, moves, gets sick, even if they go through a bad patch themselves and get cranky and impatient.

If your T's statement about "the relationship" was the trigger for you, that might be worth talking about. It could be reassuring in many ways.

I'm also worried about the "breakdowns" you talk about. I don't know exactly what you mean by that -- highly emotional, collapsing, crying, a panic attack??? I just don't know. But that's something to talk about with T.

In my mind that's related to the comment about the relationship. A relationship with T is nice, it's important, but we also need knowledge, skills, ways to cope, understanding of cognitive distortions and how our bodies react during a panic attack or other type of "breakdown." Our Ts can't always be there for us, sometimes it's up to us to calm ourselves sufficiently to prevent or stop or pull out of a breakdown when it's hitting us.

I think, from what you've written in various threads, that was what your T was referring to when she made her comment about the relationship. That's worth talking about with her and if you don't feel like talking much, maybe it would be okay to bring up the subject and to listen to what she has to say about it, about her therapeutic approach and what she meant when she made that statement.

Knowing our Ts therapeutic approach, what they believe about the therapeutic process, and how they see their therapeutic style is, to me, a very important part of developing a trusting relationship.

I'm wondering, Scarlet, if you're feeling very down, rejected and disconnected because your T has more on offer than a relationship. She also sees skills for you to use between sessions as highly important. Maybe she worded it bluntly or tossed it off without explanation and it triggered you. Is that worth talking about with her?

Let us know what you decide to do. I'll be thinking about you.

Edited to add: As you said, Scarlet, "Maybe our ideas on what a T should be is different." That's major. It's time to find out if you're both on the same page.

I first felt a shift in the relationship when I disclosed to her something from my past. Part of it was me putting up a wall by thinking that she would judge me (part of me still believes this). I asked her that day if I could hold her hand. She said no because touching other people's hands was a boundary. I have never challenged it, but it doesn't make sense. She will shake people's hands and do pinky swears. I explained I just wanted her to touch my skin so I know that she was repulsed by me.

The relationship is different. I used to be allowed to talk about my feelings and thoughts w/o being constantly challenged. She usually wrote back to me once a week. I don't know.

And yes, when she said that the relationship isn't important, that hurt me deeply. But I addressed that with her last week, and she said basically what you wrote: that the relationship is important, but for my progress the other things like coping skills is more important.

The problem is that, for me, if I don't feel secure within any relationship I won't open up. Why would I? So maintaining that connection is important to me. It's necessary.

I understand that part of her job is to get me to focus on the positives and to help "correct" my thoughts. The CBT model is thoughts, feelings, and behaviors affect each other, so change one and you can change the others. She also uses ACT which is basically learning to acknowledge and accept thoughts and feelings as what they are: thoughts and feelings, not facts. I get that challenging my thoughts, feelings, and even behaviors teaches me to redirect myself towards a more positive direction. She teaches mindfulness to help me be aware and present.

But she used to listen to me! She used to empathize. Now she simply says "Why does it matter if I understand?" BECAUSE IT DOES!

This was supposed to be a partnership. We were supposed to be equals. Supposedly, everyone tells me I'm smart. And she has even said that there's really not much to actually teach me because I already know it all. Then why am I always wrong? Why am I constantly being told I'm being resistant or challenging her?

This is so hard to explain. I know what's bothering me. She's doing to me what I used to be able to do (still sometimes do ) to other people: to "win" conversations by misdirection. There's different types of conversations: ones that stay straight, others veer off course, some go in circles, and what my T does which is make a 180. Actually, I think one of my first posts you responded to was about this.

But it's more than that. I emailed her about my mom...no response. She used to respond to emails like that. She used to show she cares. Now when I ask for reassurance, I have to figure out how I already know xyz. Doesn't it feel nice when someone reassures you?

She said that my problem maintaining a connection and problems with abandonment will be my core issues to work on. She said that I could bring it up as much as I needed to. I have confronted her many times about this and each time there is an argument before she understands that arguing isn't helping. She won't own up to her mistakes ever. But when I tell her that she comes across as "perfect" all the time, she laughs and brushes it off. Last time she said she'd have to tell her husband that she's perfect.

I know I have a mental illness. I know I struggle with relationships. I have thought distortions. But why is it that I'm in the wrong? Why is it that she's always right? I thought I was a competent adult!

I'm sorry. I'm extremely frustrated and upset. I really need to just feel connected so I can move on from this. That is what is most important right now. With that, I can stop focusing on her and focus on myself. I need her. I want to see her. But I want nothing to do with her when she does this misdirection thing. It's annoying. Why is it so bad to want to be listened to? To know that this person sitting across from you, who you only see an hour a week, is safe? That they care? I am divulging things that I don't usually tell people. She knows something about me that I have only told to 5 other people in my life, something that I can't even verbalize.

I'm not mad at you, SC. If you feel the anger and frustration it's not at you. It's from many different things. I just need help, and I'm not getting what I need. I don't even know how to define that need. Words like support, reassurance, and connection are vague in this case.

My T has been able to figure out what I need before...many times. I just hope she can do it again. I'm sure she would be willing to do "it" if we could just figure out what "it" actually is.

[ScarletPimpernel]

I think I'm going to call her and leave her a msg saying I don't want to argue. I want to remind her that she said we can always revisit discussing feeling connected/talking about the relationship when I need to.

I also am thinking about writing something up to read to her and just asking her to not talk while I'm reading.

[SnakeCharmer]

Scarlet, I had no feeling you were directing anger at me (but even if you did or ever do, it will be all right.) It's a very frustrating situation. Looks like you showed right there you have plenty to talk to T about. Hard stuff. But definitely worthy of discussion. Hang in there. I hope the two of you can work this out and start moving forward again.

[Middlemarcher]

I know that you've said before that you & your T have agreed that when she has an emotional response during her interactions with you, you've both agreed for her to express it-- as a modeling of more real-world reactions & healthy relationships. Perhaps in some ways she's taking this further than is therapeutically useful for you? Like, in the real world, there is a limit to how much some people will reassure you before they don't want to do it anymore. But that doesn't have to be the case with your therapist, and may not be useful for you.

Wishing you luck in getting this worked out. It sounds like you're on the right track.

[ScarletPimpernel]

Here's the msg I left her. I actually wrote it up and read it I hope it's a good lead in for tomorrow. And then I'll work on writing up a letter I can read to her tomorrow. My hope is to remove my "attitude" so she doesn't get defensive, but still clearly communicate how I'm feeling.

"Hi T. It's Scarlet. I'm scared to see you again. I'm sorry I'm struggling and worrying you. I don't like it when we constantly argue. You once told me we can talk about me feeling disconnected whenever it comes up. But I'm really scared to talk to you because I'm afraid that you're going to get mad and leave. Can you please help me tomorrow reduce the anxiety I have concerning you?"

You know, I think I'm communicate better with writing because I have to use my logical part of my brain already to write coherently.