Feeling bitter and resentful about therapist's situation

Of course everyone can "see" it - its not happening to them! Every time i write about my wishes about wanting my t to take care of me, nobody can relate, im a coconut. Everybody here on pc (with a few exceptions) also hates DBT. I say, fart away!

In my fantasy, i had my ts showing up to Sunday family dinner. Looking back, i cannot for the life of me imagine why that would have made the dinners any better. But marrying my t i was sure would fix everything. Doh. Would that make them accept me? No. But at least somebody at that dinner table would like me - geez i just figured that out NOW.

So i would challenge the other posters - when have you been in a similar situation of wanting something "unreasonable" from your t, and how did you resolve it?

Eta - mm - yeah it took me a loooong time to understand he wasnt gonna kick me out for having a good week. I think it goes back to toilet training (all psychology does) - wipe your butt right once, and lose your mothers attention forever: youre grown up now!

Questions: Do you think it unreasonable to be expected to take the initiative and find your own solution? What are you prepared to do on your behalf?

@justafriend306: I'm really tired. I'm also hesitant to respond to your questions because I would be repeating what I had been saying in this thread, and to which all of you have responded against and tried explaining in multiple different ways but I remain blind. I could respond, but keep it short. I don't think it's unreasonable to be expected to take initiative to find a solution to what's happening. I'm going to be slammed again for my next statement. But in my mind, I still see the therapist as having a share of responsibility because it originated from her. LoL.

Firstly I'd like to apologise if I was harsh. Yes, trust is individual and unique and depending on if the other person is trustworthy.

I'm not saying trust can be blindly and broadly generalised. I'm saying (as my therapist loves to harp on at me about) that your much loved therapist Is Not the ONLY Safe and trustworthy person you will have in your life.

For years I trusted only my therapist and partner. Had zero friends. Then she had to go on maternity leave and was heavily considering becoming a stay at home parent.

I had to meet with another therapist. Rebuild, see if I can trust again. Ex T was the person I trust the most. More than my partner.

I trust current T now and she's teaching me how to determine who is trustworthy in my life. It involves risks and I've been badly burned a couple of times. Yet I have found some degree of trustworthiness in good people. Is my giant Mistrust schema resolved? Oh hell no. But I hope my therapist is right. That there's extremely trustworthy individuals out there. She finds most of the world safe, I don't.

Speaking about "unreasonable" demands...

... I once got REALLY ANGRY because my T wouldn't get training just for my specific minority but sizable demographic population in a country which rejects us.

I remember some posters calling me entitled.

I did resolve it with my T. No, I didn't "get my way".

And I do wish my T could actually...adopt me lol. Just never talked to you about wanting T to take care of me

Mindmechanic, I think you were onto something when you rejected the idea of undertaking psychoanalytic work with a new therapist. I guess my impression earlier was that your T was not going to be doing depth work with you while she's away--but now it sounds like she is. If that's true, then why would you need a T locally who works in the same modality? I can't even see really how 2 such depth processes could be handled concurrently. And why pay for a level of skill not utilized?


I think it would be helpful if she explained more clearly what exactly the local T adds to the process. Apparently, there's a need for a local contact for malpractice/maybe legal requirements. But what is at the heart of that? Is this local T needed basically as an eyes-on suicide watcher? Someone local who could be contacted quickly in an emergency, legally expedite a hospitalization sort of need? Because if that is really the basic condition needing to be covered, any mental health person could fulfill that role. A social worker, or other non MD, non PhD would do. Why couldn't it just be someone for you to check in with once a week and engage in non-depth work? That would be more comfortable for you and also dramatically lower the cost to you. Surely she must have such a colleague whom she would be professionally comfortable with?

In my area, PhD fees are @ $80--$120/hr; LCSW, MSW, etc are @ $40--$50.

ETA: Sorry I never answered your question in post #26 about how to let go of resentment and not magnify it. I think a start is to take control of crafting the solution. The more control you can take, the less space there is emotionally for the resentment to fester, so it weakens. Trying to make your T fix it all fuels the resentment because it mirrors the experience of being a helpless child. (I suspect that may be why your T said you have to deal with your finances.) Helplessness is a deeply fearful state to experience. I think it's very self-protective that we don't have the biological capacity to consciously remember the deeply helpless states we experienced as infants and young children. So when we have experiences as adults that stir up that unremembered helplessness, I think we feel the fear and squash it by feeling something else that's less threatening--anger, grandiosity, resentment, etc.

I want my therapist to hug me. He's told me no. The feeling persists, and it's something I continue to struggle with.

But I still realise that my therapist is perfectly within his rights to say no to hugging. I recognise my feelings don't mean he has to automatically accommodate me. My feelings can be there, and my therapist is going to have to talk about them, but he doesn't have to change because of them.

I also have the option to decide whether I want to change my situation (ie get a new therapist). I considered it very seriously at the start of the year, but in the end decided that the benefits of seeing him outweigh what he can't give me.

So I guess the answer is bearing witness to feelings, acknowledging what's reasonable for another person, and deciding whether I want to change my situation, while aware that no situation or therapist will ever or can ever give me everything I need.

The OP's feelings are very valid. Expecting her therapist to make sure his/her situation didn't change... is not.

I just wanted to say ‘good work’ on continuing this conversation with your T, and even showing her these threads. You are very brave. Only you and your T can give real insight into your struggles.
Best of luck, and continue talking with her.

You seem to be very open to working on this. That's commendable. Good luck, I sincerely hope things will get better for you.

Thank you all for the encouragement.

@feralkittymom: So apparently, it's not a written professional rule that if a therapist moves away, patients need to have a local therapist to see in-person in order to do phone or video call therapy. The therapist said that it's just a standard of practice in the field when it comes to patients who can get into dark places. I did ask the therapist if I could see a therapist here as a med-check kind of thing where I'm checking in or touching base with that person, but she said no, she would like me to have a relationship with that therapist where I feel safe enough to go in and talk to him or her. This is still the part that I don't understand and I feel pushed or cornered into talking to someone else. I'm not even sure what I would say to that person and at this point where I'm at internally, it feels exhausting to have two therapists do deep work. I asked the therapist if I could go in to see that person two or three times a month especially given that s/he would definitely charge more than her, but she said no. Again, I don't understand her rationality behind it. When she is away, we would still be doing a single and a double once a week. To have to see someone else weekly on top of that is exhausting. Why not cut down my sessions with the therapist? I like what we have going; it works. I feel very pressured and cornered to do this and that or risk losing the therapist entirely. I will ask the therapist to explain her rationale again why can't I see that person two to three times a month in the calendar instead of weekly. Too much therapy isn't good either especially when you're so committed to the process; it can really consume you.

Exactly! I can understand your t wanting you to have someone on hand for you to see locally. I think that's responsible of her to suggest (not demand). The frequency of how often you see that t should be entirely up to you though, not her. What is it that you do now when you get into your dark place? Do you call or email your t? Will that option no longer be allowed once t moves?

What about seeing a new t twice a month to start? Maybe during the weeks you see new t, you could just do 1 phone session with current t during that week. That would help with the finances and reduce the overkill of therapy. Just a thought. Remember, you are the one in charge of your therapy. You know what you need and you know what you can handle -- mentally and financially. Also remember nothing is carved in stone here. You can make changes along the way.

Yeah; I like this route much better. I feel that I can breathe better not being forced to see someone every week and do deep work with that person. It's comfortable emotionally and mentally and would probably work better for me financially.

A little over two months ago, I was suicidal and was thinking about dying by drowning in the lake. I haven't had any suicidal ideation since. Some things are changing in that realm in regards to my thoughts about dying. But that might have been a scare to the therapist - enough that she feels more security if I see a therapist in-person every week. I don't think that's what I need, and it can be an overkill - both financially and mentally as you put it.

I reach out to people when I'm in a dark place or need to talk. Sometimes I reach out to the therapist through text or email and other times I contact friends or acquaintances. If I need to talk to someone, I reach out. When I was suicidal, I reached out to the therapist. I guess I wasn't ready to die then yet even though it felt like I had hit rock bottom.

I told the therapist that it would be exhausting to start over with a new therapist. She responded that I would find that I'm not starting over, but just continuing or something along those lines. I disagree, though. Where I'm at internally, trust is still a big problem. And it's a lot of effort and energy to invest into a new therapeutic relationship in that context. I cannot trust that new therapist through the therapist; it's something I have to experience on my own and in my own way and time. My therapy work with the therapist is often times overwhelming enough.

What I could work with is seeing a therapist in-person two to three times a month and take it from there. Like you said, nothing is carved in the stone. Heck; maybe I would find myself connecting more with the new therapist and cut down the sessions with the therapist. I think that a gentle, slow approach is where I'm at right now internally. I'm not in a dark place so often and do reach out to people when I am. I would reach out to the therapist, the new therapist, or friends if I'm in such a place. But the impression I got was that the therapist really wanted me to see someone once a week. Maybe it was that suicidal scare. I don't know. I'll talk with her about this and hopefully we can find a middle ground that works for both of us.

This is another thing I feel resentful about and don't want to feel that way because it would just pollute my work with the therapist. I don't want to have to invest or go in to see the new therapist for the sake of preserving my therapy work and relationship with the therapist. I want to be have that relationship with the new therapist and do whatever work we might do together when I'm mentally, emotionally and internally at that place for it. Just because an external situation happened does it mean that I now have to somehow change or expedite my therapeutic journey to doing something that I'm not ready.

ETA: Or perhaps half sessions weekly with the therapist in-person for the start, too. Or the therapist could join through video the in-person session I would have with the new therapist. That's less of an overkill. I wonder if that would somehow be less expensive, too. I'll talk to the therapist again about the weekly in-person sessions - what exactly is driving it and her agenda or goals for me versus where I'm at and what I need and what would work for me.

Mindmechanic, I am sorry your T is going away. We suspend our disbelief in order to participate in therapy- that they are intimate with us, that they do care. . A wake up call like T going away for a year would be the end of the relationship for me, fair or not fair. Broken attachment is very , very painful, whether we pay or don't pay.

I still fail to understand how you can blame the therapist for the situation. She did not purposely cause this child to be premature with health problems. You argument suggests you believe she did. Her priority is to her family first. Your argument suggests you believe otherwise. She is not obligated to do everything for you. Your argument suggests you think otherwise. The responsibility for solving this at this point is yours. Your argument suggests you feel otherwise.

I asked some very reasonable questions of you. You chose to ignore them in the very same manner you are ignoring the fact that you have your own responsibility to resolve this situation.

It is unreasonable to expect that you be a priority in your therapist's life given the crisis in her personal life.

It is unreasonable for you to expect the therapist continues to be responsible for your care.

It is unreasonable to expect that you should do nothing while others do everything regarding your care.

Have you tried putting yourself in her shoes? For goodness sake. wake up and take some initiative.

@justafriend306: We have moved away from that and it's something I'm still working on understanding. I've answered your questions in an earlier post. No; I didn't put myself in her shoes because it is not my position as the patient to care about her. Like I said, I did express to her that I hope everything is okay. If I'm not taking some responsibility or charge of the situation, I would not even be posting here. I would not even have gone in to talk to the therapist. I would not be sharing these posts with her. I am trying. I am who I am and where I am internally. If I could get all of it right away, the heck would I even be in therapy for? Are you telling me that if you were in my situation or something similar were to happen to your therapist - God forbid - you would take it like a champion not feeling angry, resentful, or hurt at all? Well; let's all bow down and worship you as a perfect patient, then.

I completely understand your distress at losing
a secure and regular routine with a safe person.Iam desperately sad at the loss of my long term T at this moment and there cannot be any further contact
4 years-sudden end-I am angry sad self harming dissociated etc but I don't expect him to to sort it-

I absolutely cannot understand the sense of entitlement

To many clients (expecially elderly, lonely. ill or otherwise vulnerable people)my role as their companion animals veterinary surgeon and ultimately their humane euthanasia is extremely important to them

I don't stay home unless I'm vomiting- don't leave in the middle of a clinic if I develop a migraine and have worked until the day I gave birth and with a leg in plaster and all night and for free for a local charity where abuse is common
Ive missed parents evenings sports days birthdays and Christmases

This is how seriously I take the responsibility I have chosen to take

However. if a serious issue arose with MY FAMILY I would do as your therapist -has done -suggest a vet who works similarly to myself and whom I trust etc and of course I would think about my longterm patients from time to time BUT
would I feel responsible for paying the new vets fees/mileage if its further to travel cost of a replacement pet if it passed away etc?
Sounds ridiculous and is ridiculous-You may find you get more genuine help from your T if you stop being so demanding and unreasonable
She obviously cares a great deal for you- but she is entitled to a life also

ETA when I had to take time off during chemotherapy due to inadequate blood counts my regular clients wished me well even bought gifts -its called empathy
and when I returned I was happy whether they chose to stay with the new vet or return to me

FWIW I think you are trying to be part of the solution here. Rationalizations are usually a defense. Your feelings wax and wane because that's what feelings do, but it doesn't reflect anything about your commitment to finding a solution.


I don't fully understand your T's position about the kind of work you would do with a local T. I agree that it is necessary to have someone you can trust enough to be honest with in the event that you get into a dark space and need help to get out of. And I think it takes a certain amount of time and sustained contact to build a mutually trusting relationship with that person. When a T takes on a client who may become suicidal, it imposes upon them a level of practice that insures both parties will be safe. So weekly contact probably is necessary for as long as it takes to reach that level of mutual trust. But once that is established, and the new T has confidence in your commitment to reaching out, it seems to me bi-weekly may be very possible.

I do wonder if your T insisting on depth work--or someone at least skilled in such work--reflects more a bias in her practice? As I said before, I can't really envision undertaking depth work with 2 Ts concurrently--I just don't understand how that functions. Even if the 2 Ts are theoretically in sync, they are not clones and will respond differently. It would seem a confusing way to proceed to me, particularly in the area of transferences. I hope she can clarify to you her thinking and why she is so committed to this singular course going forward.

@feralkittymom: I agree with your thoughts and share the same confusion with you. I will be meeting with her again later and intend to talk about this with her. I hope we will be able to come up with some kind of middle ground that works for both of us.

What is the best way to talk to the therapist about this? Because she seems to hold quite strongly her position about seeing someone in-person once a week.

You know, one other thing occurs to me: If a client pursuing analytic work were to say to his analyst that he wanted to also begin a second course of analysis with another analyst concurrently, I suspect the analyst would strongly discourage such action. They would cite the analytic relationship as primary. So what makes the difference in this situation? I don't see trust as exclusive to an analytic relationship, but it seems like your T does, at least for you. I'd want to know more about why that is.

ETA: I agree with the local contact, once a week at least to start, for the reasons above. It's the skill level of that contact and how that contact is conducted that I don't understand.

@feralkittymom: It seems that some analytic-oriented therapists are against that idea while others think it could be good. The therapist once mentioned something about how I needed to internalize other objects as opposed to only her. That said, however, I still think it could be confusing.

My t said quote screw the insurance. You have resources here on pc that you didnt have before, yes? If she wants an in-person, can you just do an AA type meeting? Altho a lot of those are by phone or online now too. I would start with defining the problem.

Even if a T believes that theoretically as an ideal practice, would she have been pushing for it at this time if she were not leaving?

@feralkittymom: Good point. She said, "I want you to have someone here who you feel safe enough to go in and see when you are in a dark place." On the other hand, she is pushing it for once a week in-person. And the therapist who she has found for me is a self-psychologist. The therapist said that self-psychology is the approach that she has been using to work with me.

I think what I need to convey to the therapist when I see her this evening is what exactly does she need to cover her practice as good and responsible? What is the minimum "requirement" versus her agenda or goals for me in treatment. I'm not wording this very well.

ETA: She also said that she wasn't talking about a hotline that I would call if I'm in a dark place. She wants someone who I can see in-person. For some therapists, that kind of safety plan would suffice. Not her, I guess. And does seeing someone in-person give the therapist an illusion of security because of the immediate physical proximity? Because safety plans like hotlines can help a lot.

I understand her wanting an in person once a week contact. I don't think she intended a contradiction between "when you're in a dark place" and "once a week regular contact." As I said, both T and client need to build up trust and that requires time and regular contact. And I understand her preference for someone who works how she works: they say "like hires like"--it's a natural bias. But is there an objective need for this bias in this situation? Can she accept the possibility that you can develop trust with someone not doing depth work?

In the event you do get into difficulty, wouldn't you work it through with her over the phone anyway? So isn't the need for a local T to keep you safe until you can work it through with her? I do believe a relationship--not just a check-in occasionally--is necessary to provide that safety. But I guess I question whether her focus on what she sees as a "best case scenario" is really the only possible solution.