Feeling bitter and resentful about therapist's situation

@feralkittymom: Thank you for making these insightful distinctions. The therapist said she is more eclectic, but uses self-psychology with me. Even though the in-person therapist who she thinks would be good for me does self-psychology, the therapist is open to me seeing another therapist in-person if for whatever reason I do not feel comfortable with that therapist or I cannot afford the fee.

You're right. I'll ask her if seeing that person once a week for a start would be fine until we establish trust, and depending on how things work out, decrease the meeting with that in-person therapist.

By the way, I'm meeting that other therapist this coming Monday. The therapist will be joining us. So three of us. I don't like this, but I'll do it.

ETA: And I do not self-harm or anything like that at all. I don't engage in risky behaviors. I don't know if maybe my suicidality a little over two months ago scared the therapist. LoL.

Well, the conditions they work under, they have to take such thoughts very seriously, and that's good. The trust helps you, too, because it serves as a brake on any over reaction. And if you aren't impulsive, that also gives a T a lot of confidence.

If she's open to you seeing someone else, it sounds like you've almost solved the issue! Maybe do some local research for other providers to start compiling a list of possibles. If you do the research, especially regarding credentials and expertise, she may be amenable to helping to narrow the possibilities. If she has some buy-in to the choice, she will also be more comfortable (but meanwhile you've kept a lot of control by making the initial list.)

@feralkittymom: Cool. Does it also sound to you like the therapist would be open and flexible about not having to see the new therapist once a week? For a start, perhaps, yes, and understandably so in order to establish some level of trust and safety. But after that, does it sound to you like she would be open to less sessions a month? This option makes me feel less suffocated and somehow it also makes me feel less resentful and stressed out.

I think that's something that can only be a wait and see. If you can accommodate the once a week idea now, and then, as time goes by and you and the new T experience trust, talk with the new T about spacing contact out as a trial. If the new T agrees it would be safe, then your current T is likely to agree (unless she sees something in your work with her to contradict the idea.) I don't think it's a prediction your T can agree to hypothetically, but in real time, with evidence that supports a change, she'd be likely to agree. So I think flexibility is called for. The best thing you can do to work towards that is to be open and honest with both of them which will give them both confidence and keep you all on the same page.

@feralkittymom: That makes sense. I'm feeling nervous about going in to talk about the therapist about this. I really hope we can find a middle ground that works for both of us. I'm meeting with her again in a couple of hours.

ETA: I asked the therapist what she has shared with that other therapist. She didn't tell that therapist anything about how I can go to dark places or about my suicidality a little over two months ago.

Maybe printing out these posts (maybe not # 127) to refer to would help keep your discussion on target and less emotionally charged?

I think the therapist and I are on the same page now after our session yesterday evening. I told her how I didn't want therapy to be an overkill both mentally and emotionally aside from the financial aspect; she said that she didn't want it to be an overkill either. The therapist also said that she didn't want to stipulate the frequency of meetings with that other therapist. She said that she just wants me to have someone who I would feel safe going in to talk to when I'm in a dark place - both for malpractice insurance and for me. Well; that sounded different from the impression that she had left me when we met the day before on Thursday. When we met on Thursday, she said it had to be every week and was apprehensive when I asked her what about two to three times a month. I think the therapist also doesn't want to be too absolute about it especially after telling her how I didn't want it to be an overkill and that it can be confusing seeing two therapists at the same time. I did ask her how seeing someone is different than calling a hotline or reaching out to her or friends. She said that sometimes when I'm in a very dark place, that in-person presence could do more. We kind of disagreed on that, but it wasn't an impasse.

I'm meeting that other therapist on Monday. The therapist will be there, too. I hope it works out. The therapist leaves end June, and I just want to be done with and not have to go hunting for a therapist who I would see in-person. I guess the therapist thought it would just be a bonus if the therapist in-person practices self-psychology as that's the approach she uses with me. At the end of the day, she just wants me to have someone who I'd feel comfortable turning to in-person if needed.

Where I'm at, even LCPCs and LCSWs charge 100 dollars upwards. Some charge even 200 dollars.

Post Script: The therapist said that you guys are a really great and supportive group. I know I annoyed some of you, but thank you again.

I'm so glad to hear this mindmechanic! Seems like you're on a way to solving this issue is a positive way :-) I'm looking forward to your updates!

She might just mean that having someone in person might be or at least feel more supportive in person as opposed to over the phone, which is kind of a disembodied voice. Plus, the therapist would be able to assess how you're doing better because sometimes body language tells a lot more of the story and you wouldn't get that over the phone

Update: I met the other therapist for the second time yesterday. The therapist was in the room with me, too. I don't think that that therapist and I are a match. She did and said something that made me very uncomfortable yesterday.

I usually sit on the floor in therapy if I'm feeling schizoid or depressed. I was feeling that way yesterday, so I sat on the floor. Halfway through the meeting, I asked my therapist to join me on the floor. After some time, that other therapist sat on the floor on her own accord. I said that you've to be invited to sit on the floor. She insisted that she was going to sit on the floor, anyway, and that she was feeling left out. I didn't hear her very well, but my therapist later told me that the therapist also said, "It's my floor."

"It's my floor" - that's a childish comment. And I told my therapist that that is a deal-breaker - a therapist who is pushy like that. I also told her that this was what I was worried about: having to now care about two people's feelings. I'm not so worried about my therapist; I'm worried about the other therapist. H/She has to respect that I already have a relationship with my current therapist, so I would be letting her in more than you. It's not a "competition." It takes time. My therapist said that she was probably kidding when that therapist said that she was feeling left out. I doubt it. For one, she insisted on sitting on the floor even though I expressed discomfort. And she made that childish comment that it's her floor. Heck. If it wasn't for my therapist, I'd be walking out the door. That therapist did later move back to the couch, though. She said that as long as I give a reason why, it's fine. I don't think I'm obligated to give a reason why, am I?

I need a lot of space in therapy. That therapist was asking a lot of questions. When I commented on how personal her questions were, she said that she is a "nosey" person. She described herself as such multiple times. I think that therapists should have a different identity in the therapy room. It's not about them; it's about the patient. If you already know that someone is schizoid and needs space, why would you still be pushy instead of toning yourself down?

I'm seeing my therapist today for our regular meeting. We did get to talk for a bit in the hallway after meeting with that other therapist yesterday. I asked her if she thinks that therapist and I are a right fit. She said that she isn't sure. I'm just not feeling it.

Yeah, shes acting like its all about her. Like shes the child, has to be the center of attention. When what is wanted, is really for her to take almost a supervisory role, more stand-back-ish? By standing back, she would gain authority; by what she actually did, she lost relevance.

Exactly. If she maintained her composure and respected the space, time, and process, I'd have more respect for her as a therapist. Even though she was probably trying to get to know me - what works for me and what doesn't - I think that therapists should use their intuition and let it guide them. Either she wasn't using her intuition at all or her intuition was way off. Or maybe like you said, she was making it about her. She already knew that I'm schizoid and need space and time, but yet she insisted on pushing her way in. Isn't it common sense at that point to know not to be intrusive when working with a schizoid patient? I think she let her countertransference get in the way - in a bad way. I wasn't suffocating; I was choking. Even though she did eventually back off to the couch, I just don't think that her personality is going to allow for a safe space in the room. I'm not even going to waste time talking about the childish comment that she made that it's her floor.

She wanted the therapist to leave the room for a while so we could talk. For one, I was already talking to her even though my therapist was in the room. And if it wasn't for the therapist, I would have already walked out of the room when she insisted on sitting on the floor and refused to back off. I was in distress internally at that moment. If I found this therapist independently on my own, and she did and said those things, I wouldn't return for another session; I'd be out that door and wouldn't look back.

MM, I feel for you. When you are in what feels like a safe pattern with a trusted therapist, it is disorienting and distressing to have it suddenly change, even if it is changing for an understandable reason.

I imagine that your therapist cares for you and therefore feels conflicted. She feels she must aid her family in a time of need. But also doesn't want to be leaving you in the lurch. And so she does seem to be trying to help you transition to a new situation.

But do you think this year of phone/skyping is really going to work for you? I mean, is it going to give you what you need from your current therapist? Have you ever had Skype or phone sessions? I know some people do them, but personally I would find the transition from in-person to on-the-phone very difficult.

I know you don't want to "start over" with another therapist, but the reality is that your therapist is leaving for a year. It seems to me that if you need support, it would be good to find some locally. Your therapist seemed to think that too but now seems to be backing off it. As you find a local person who would be available to you to help, perhaps it would be better to not have the initial meetings with your current therapist in the room, as it could produce all kinds of three-person dynamics like the floor one you discussed. If your current therapist was not in the room, perhaps you and the other therapist might have had a very different interaction.

In other words, what I am trying to say is--I believe your therapist is sincerely trying to help you, but I wonder if this help is truly helping or is just complicating what is already and unavoidably going to be a painful situation/transition for you. Since you mention countertransference, I wonder if your therapist's countertransference feelings are affecting what you are being offered. Would it be better for you to simply take a year's break from your therapist and work with someone else? After all, the point of therapy is to learn lessons we can take beyond the relationship of us-and-therapist and apply them elsewhere. You wouldn't have to do psychodynamic therapy and cover all the same ground again; you are a different person than you were two and a half years ago, and you may be able to approach therapy in a different and also useful way now in a way that was not possible before.

Anyway, I do have great sympathy for you. When therapists make changes, even just changing the arrangement of the chairs in the room, it can be very anxiety-producing for some of us. My hope for you is that in navigating this transition, you can use some of the skills you have been learning in therapy, and perhaps a couple years from now you will look at this painful time as a time that was actually filled with personal growth.

What makes me sad is that you have been seeing this woman intimately for some time but unless I missed it you never once express pain or sorrow or even worry for this poor woman going through a hellish time in her life. Do you only care about yourself and your own problems?

@Wonderfalls: We have moved away from that in this thread, but for the record, yes I did say to her that I hope everything is okay. I also mentioned that in at least one of my posts here. So maybe back off? Also, this thread isn't about the therapist; it's about my feelings about the situation. And at that time when this thread started, I was feeling resentful and bitter. It is a process

For what it is worth, I've had very good luck with a remote therapist. I've never met her in person, but she's probably the best therapist I have ever had. I hate skype so we just talk on the phone. I do miss the non-verbal stuff that happens in therapy, but she is very good about using tone of voice to make up for it. It does force me to be verbal when I'm upset. I can't count on her reading my body language.

Does your regular therapist have any other suggestions for a different therapist? Would you be able to stand this one for emergencies until you found one on your own?

FWIW I agree with wonderfalls- considering a perfunctory “ I hope things will be ok” as an adequate expression of humanity shocks me
Yes session time is all about the client whether it be therapy medical dental veterinary etc but heaven forbid your provider took ill on your time-would your resentment and anger at YOUR trajectory in therapy being disturbed override the need to provide care -what if illness immediately stopped all forms of contact as inmy case recently-I feel no resentment or entitlement just visceral sadness for both of us and atm have no idea how I will come through this- I have 2 choices and he can’t help me -**** mountain is where many of us reside and I feel blessed that someone sat with me for 4 years (and I had to pay £80 a session so could only afford every 2 weeks-to have had a chance of weekly would have been a delight but 3 times weekly for less than I paid fo once every 2 weeks would have been a dream

@maybeblue: I have done phone and video call with the therapist when I was away for a couple of months during the summer. I thought it worked out well. Some things are easier shared when you can't see each other's face; on the other hand, sometimes it's in-person is helpful. The therapist and I met today, and I think do have another option that I could check out. It's probably more affordable as well. The therapist said that professionally, she needs me to have a therapist who I see in-person in order for us to do phone and video call; she said it's for her malpractice insurance in the event that something happens to me. She also said it's also good for me if I have someone in-person who I feel comfortable with going in to talk to when I'm in a dark place. I'll keep looking. But that other therapist is, I think, out of the question after meeting her for the second time yesterday.

ETA: @Nelly_yallop: I don't think that I have to type word for word what I expressed to the therapist. And as someone who is schizoid, expressing such feelings can be too intimate of a task. That's great you didn't feel any resentment or anger that your therapeutic trajectory changed. But not everyone has the same internal issues such that we would have the same reaction. You feel sadness? Well; some patients might not even feel sad. I think that any feelings that come up for patients are valid and is something to be worked through. So no; I'm not sorry for feeling resentful or bitter or confused or sad and only vaguely emotionally understanding what's happening. It's also not my job to worry about her. I used to do that with past therapists, but not anymore. To me, that's growth. For what it's worth, I did express concern to the therapist in our meeting today if she will be alright in the other state. Just because I don't share these things in this thread doesn't mean it's non-existent. Like I said, this thread was about my feelings of resentment and bitterness at that time over two weeks ago.

This thread contains some of the type of attitudes which sent me to therapy in the first place-it truly is possible to be a compassionate and caring member of society as well as participating in a high level of self care
For me it all revolves around the strength of ones sense of entitlement regardless of what is fair reasonable or even possible.when this is wildly out of synch I am reminded of emotional blackmail and bullying by my mother

That doesn’t mean that I do not understand the pain of losing a trusted t - I do right now and can not afford to start again with a new one- the great British NHS will provide medications but no psychiatrist/psychologist and no inpatient programmes- outpatient programme is 10 days of you presenting yourself at clinic to be given 1 days worth of meds at a time and if you survive ten days you are discharged by phone and never followed up again-group therapy does not exist and if you OD as soon as you’re awake enough to get into a car you’re gone with no follow up-last time I still had all the ecg pads stuck on me and and iv in my arm-I have sold furniture guitars my horse basically everything of any value to fund my biweekly therapy as my wages as a veterinary surgeon for a charity equate to 20 percent of the hourly rate for private therapist
Private health insurance provides a policy total of 16 sessions and even if you change provider it is excluded
No point in having a sense of entitlement here in UK- you’re basically on your own unless you are a danger to others
It sounds to me as if the overavaibility of many different therapies and therapists at the same time largely covered by insurance evening and weekend appointments extensive outside contact etc does not do a great deal to support independence - neither system seems fit for purpose

It sounds to me that you do not truly understand the mindmechanics situation and are even trying to. I see that you rather want to discuss your own pain. It would be more appropriate if you would start your own thread and then people could support your specific problems. It really isn't appropriate to make someone else's situation down because you really want to discuss your own difficulties. In a sense, you are right now doing exactly the same that you accuse the OP of doing - minimising someone else's situation in order to emphasise your own problems.

Thank you. Well chosen words and thought out post.

No desire to discuss or elicit sympathy for my situation-I specifically said I have no anger or resentment-just sadness-merely attempting to make the point that we don’t always get what we want in life even if we think we’ve paid for it or are owed it

June 27 is approaching - that's the date when the therapist is flying out. I didn't feel angry the past few weeks, but now that the date is approaching, I'm feeling triggered. I have two more sessions with the therapist before she flies out. I feel like I blew our meeting yesterday because I was feeling angry. I don't want to be angry at her or the situation. I also woke up in the middle of the night feeling scared. Deep down, I'm really sad. But somehow it feels easier to be angry than to be in touch with the feelings of sadness.

I can definitely appreciate that. I'm not the best at expressing my emotions, especially anxiety, so anger/aggression usually comes out instead of fear or whatever else I'm feeling.

My take on this is empathy with you, and totally getting it- the feeling she made emotional bonds with you under what now seems like false pretenses.

My T tells me he is here to stay, to stay the course with me, even though he is new to our state. Could he decide( or his wife) he hates it here, and head back to the opposite coast? I could see it easily. The problem with therapy is that the therapists act " As If" what the clients need in relationship is true, and are trained to do so. They don't really believe they have responsibility commensurate with the tone of promise and investment they convey. Just my observation.

Digging deeper, I also understand resentment of The Baby for a zillion of my own reasons; it is a social norm to be understanding of family first, but not so easy if you are the one working overtime constantly bc your colleague has kids and you don't, or for the T to quit in mid stream over a grandbaby. for everyone calling you entitled, I kind of want to call the therapist "enmeshed".

All this is shaped by the experience of a T who kind of works while work is quite high value to me and I work in a helping profession expected to go the extra mile and dig down deep. My T is more affluent than me and the other clients, and works a four day week so he can go to his second house at a famous resort location with his wife and kids in a neighboring state every weekend. Every weekend is a long vacation weekend for him. His deal with work /life balance- a little work and a LOT of balance, partly bc he is old to have kids so young and partly bc he put his time n in psych hospitals and he can afford to do a part time private practice. He is amazing in session, but his policy for outside contact could be summed up as See Ya Wouldn't Want To Be YA and he is the Vineyard Vines catalog come to life as well as a brilliant kind life changing T while actually working . Hmmmm. I am judgy, judgy bc he doesn't meet my basic needs for As If- I don't quite suspend my disbelief anymore that this person cares about my welfare all that much.

I totally get his project to raise these kids with a magical childhood, but he dens care that much about work . That is hard when I think how I am his work, when we share intimacy 2x a week.

Your T moving but saying it is temporary, clearly puts you in your place- the work place. However, some of therapy, is based on both agreeing to put reality aside and act "as if" you have a primary sustaining real relationship. I am so sorry this is happening, and I would be grieving and angry too- feeling fooled too.