Why Is It?

I wrote this post out ready to post in the "Men Focused forum", but i wanted answers from both women and men, so i made a last minute decision to place it here...

I often stop and wonder why it is wrong for men to have feelings and emotions.

i grew up with my dad always making it seem it is not allowed to show emotions. he would drink his emotions away - still does, and he bottles them and expresses them with violent outbursts. i would never want to be like that, and i think that is partly due to why im so open and honest about how i feel. yet it seems harder for men to be accepted for having feelings without being labelled gay for instance.

i know it is becoming increasingly acceptable these days for men to express emotion, but it is still a taboo with many people for men to "feel". if i ever feel down and depressed, my dad will pick up on it and tell me to "snap out of it", "stop being a wimp", and i need to "get a grip of myself". he isnt the only one like that, so many people are, as im sure you will agree. obviously those "words of encouragement" as they are to him make no effect on me, and i just walk away.

both men and women were blessed with the same emotions, the same feelings, so why cant we - as humans - be allowed to comfortably express whats inside without being considered a freak, a wierdo, or gay. im not any of those things...well - i may be a freak and a wierdo lol.

do any of you experience this too, were your parents like that, or are you like that now (im guessing that last question is void otherwise you wouldnt be in a supportive community such as this, but you may still think its a sin to confess feelings and emotions). or to you women reading this: do you have a partner who is consistently hiding their true feelings and finding it more destructive to hold it within?

many men, and even women, consider it a weakness to express emotion, yet i see it as strength. the weakness is holding it in through fear of being "exposed", even "manipulated", and through fear of being considered "cowardly". it seems a macho thing for men to have no emotions, to feel nothing and be this "hard" person. but it is these people that will bend and break easily...so is it safe and healthy in the long run to be that way? i think not.

simon

I, as a woman, got a slightly different but similar "training" in that I was too sensitive. It is my experience that men are not comfortable with women crying (partially because they aren't comfortable with their own feelings?) and women can be thought of as crying too much or being "*****y"/moody, etc. which is a similar negative judgement. Woman sometimes are allowed to express feelings but I don't think they're accepted a whole lot better than men's non-expression is. I don't know if having them bottled up or having them and Self belittled because of them is worse? I think it's both sexes that aren't quite raised right in this regard.

Women are irrational, that's all there is to that!
Their heads are full of cotton, hay, and rags!
They're nothing but exasperating, irritating,
vacillating, calculating, agitating,
maddening and infuriating hags!

Lerner, Alan Jay and Lowe, Frederick, "A Hymn to Him" from My Fair Lady Soundtrack Lyrics, http://www.stlyrics.com/lyrics/myfai...ahymntohim.htm

My dad was that way too except he didn't need alcohol for his violent outbursts. He was never wrong in his life. He could always justify what he did in some way or another. He also was very liberal with curse words and insults to us. Constantly insulting us, putting us down. I finally realized that he was the one with the problem. He has never admitted that he has a problem, and never will. He is 63 now and has mellowed a bit, but the problem still shows up occasionally.

simon,

((((((((hugs)))))))
maybe men of a certain generation do think that showing emotion isnot good for a man. it is an antiquated point of view. give me a man that cries and shows his feelings any day - more ofa man if you ask me, butnooffence to men who find itdifficult.
my husband is very cold. doesn't know how to hug with feeling or emotion, even to my kids which i find hard because i am very demonstrative and touchy feely.i loveto hug and give love. i am not getting the support i need off my husband right now, i feel maybe we are not suited. he is an excellent dad in every other way. but he shows anger soo much easier than love.

please be yourelf and feel free to show your emotions and love and sadness. it takes a real man to cry. pm me any time, i feel for you and want you to learn to be yourself.
take care, don't listen to 'get a grip'. not possiblewhen you are feeling down orscared orinsecure. i am here for you if you need a shoulder

concerned, lovekerry(jinnyann )xoxoxoxoxox

Simon,
My Dad up till I was 12 years old never showed anything..
When I was 12 I was told he had the stomach flu. He had had a nervous break down,
Both my parents drank everynight before dinner. Till well you know how it goes.
Even then it was my Mom who showed emotion. My Dad could not express himself. Only if I was hurt, then I knew he loved and cared for me.
I wish that he could have showed more, he was tormented inside!
I hate to write this.....but i do not know if my Mom wanted him too.
I think if a guy can express himself makes for a better person. No weekness there. Shows you are brave!
Sorry this came out longer than I intended. TC

Simon,

I do agree that in general it's still "taboo" as you say, for men to show emotion. It's a shame it's still like that to a degree-- but yes, it's changing! I'm sorry you struggle with that.

With that said-- I grew up with parents that -- both-- didn't want emotion shown. I was ignored or made fun of if I got angry-- and would never dream of crying in front of my family-- I never did.(what a wimp!-- according to my parents and a few siblings that are like my parents) It's like we were all supposed to be robots or something! This expectation has been a part of the dysfunction amongst my family.(a deceased sister, 2 other alcoholic siblings)

The "key" I believe, is that-- each person is different-- male or female- some are less emotional than others and some are more. It shouldn't be an issue of right or wrong--male or female-- it's emotions(IMO). If a parent forces their way of dealing with things onto their children and their children are on a different "emotional spectrum" -- then is makes things very difficult.

Maybe if you can distance yourself, to a degree, from your father and see that the way he deals is the way he deals and the way you deal with things is YOUR way. Your way is not wrong if it works for you and his way is not wrong if it works for him. Does that make sense?

What I'm trying to say is-- there is no right way to be. We are all so different-- I would never expect my mother to cry or show compassion towards me, now that I'm an adult-- because that's the way things work for her. --- though sadly, she is unable to accept the way things are for me..........

Simon-

mandy

mandyfins,

i wish i could say my dad deals with his emotions by doing what he does, but he doesnt...he makes people think he does but he lives a life dominated by alcohol. this has led to some very disturbing behaviour yesterday and today...but thats for another post maybe. i just wish his way was the right way for him, i really do.

you are all making good points here. i find it very fascinating reading other peoples experiences, i learn so much from this.

simon

Hi Simon -- I'm sorry that you are struggling with this.

It isn't wrong for males to show emotions, if by wrong you mean a moral judgment.

It is true that some segments of society are particularly unaccepting of it. Some of the segments of society where it seems strongest are traditional working class male groups, such as firefirghters, police, and even newspaper reporters. New immigrants groups arriving from patriarchal cultures are not accepting.

I have seen some Muslim men cry, but I'm not familiar with that culture to the extent where I can say whether such expressions are more normaltive.

More artistic co-cultures and my younger students seem much more egalitarian and accepting.

I hope you will find a place where are comfortable expressing your emotions in way that are meaningful for you.

Please forgive me Simon, I'm not so good at expressing myself(- think I missed the childhood building blocks on that-- so I struggle--*sigh*)..... what I meant to say is that, the way your dad deals with things is the way he "knows"...... not necessarily the way that works best for him....

It's odd how people will do things over and over the same way, sometimes even knowing there could be a better way-- but still they do things that can be destructive....maybe it's the familiarity that keeps them "stuck"...

Anyway, I'm so sorry you are going through a difficult time-- I've had much alcoholism in my family too-- it can be very upsetting. I do believe that you wish your dad's way was the right way for him..... and I'm sure it's very hard to see that it's not.

Please be sure to give yourself credit for seeing a way that is healthier-- that is a plus on your side.

Thinking of you--

mandy

Simon,

I also grew up in a household where my father drank away his problems without expressing them. Instead, he would take out his frustrations on me with verbal lashings. I agree when you say that the reason you're very open now is because you gre up in a household where you're father looked down upon you for acting like a "wimp."

Speaking for myself, I'm quite open now. I'll tell anybody who is willing to listen what ails me. I see why you say it's not proper for men to express their feelings because it shows weakness. But, that's society. Hopefully, one day it'll change. Until then, I guess we can call ourselves the original-men-who-express-their-feelings-to-other-people-without-caring-what-men-think, lol.

I hope things are better. Feel free to message me if you want, in the future.

Taylor

Have you read Robert Bly's Iron John? I haven't, because right now I'm educating myself about female archetypes, and what an enriching and soul-deep journey it is. But I know of his work, and I think you might find it touches you.