[dbtzk2000]

Dear all,

I’m in a relationship with a girl who I dearly love. And she loves me, too, which is great. But the relationship has been problematic pretty much since the beginning. We’ve now been dating a little over two years (she's 33; I'm 31). So, as you can see, I’ve stuck around, partly because there are improvements. Still, I want to ask your advice because the relationship continues to be problematic to an extent that it really gets to me. For now, I have decided to continue the relationship. There are three main reasons. First, we really love each other. Second I believe that it takes time to get the fine tuning right. Third, however, I also have to admit that I am afraid of breaking up. I know why I love my girlfriend very much and I know it will be hard to find someone with interests as closely aligned (very specific interests).

The problems, in a nutshell, are that my girlfriend is easily offended, very moody, jealous, terrible at apologizing and even worse at self-reflection and empathy. Add to that a tendency to withdraw completely as soon as things go south (she’ll lock me out, turn off her phone, and even leave abandon me at places without me having any chance of getting back by myself). All of these things don’t happen every day, of course. But they continuously show up. It’s a repeating pattern. Things will be great for a while (“I want to have kids”, “I love you”, "I know I can be an ***", etc.) and then absolutely horrendous—pretty much without any warning (though PMS is a good indicator).

I can give you countless examples. But perhaps one will suffice. The other week, we wanted to go to the gym. She suggested a gym that was rather far away. So I said “hey, I know you don’t like driving very far, so have you thought about that other gym? Might that be an idea?” She said she was happy to try it out. But when we got there, the gym had “women’s day.” Which meant I couldn’t go inside. At that point my girlfriend got very upset. My repeated attempts to tell her that she can gladly go on her own and that I had checked the hours before and hadn’t read anything about a “women’s day” did not calm her down. I had to leave the car as she was getting increasingly furious. Later one, she apologized. But I could tell she was still mad.

This small anecdote really is a great example of our problems. My being understanding, empathetic, apologetic just does not help. Sometimes it does the opposite. It makes her furious. Now, in the last half year or so, I’ve started to not be the “nice” one all the time. I’ve started to give her clear boundaries. She often reminds me of a child (I work as a teacher), which is why I started setting such limits. I also know that I’m not innocent. I can set her off. I can be condescending. I’m mentally (but not physically) withdrawn at times. Still, knocking on wood, I’ve had a very fulfilled life and very few problems so far. My friends describe me as loyal, self-reflective, idealistic and mentally strong. But this relationship is really my ultimate challenge. One thing I’ve noticed is that it brings out a “needy” side in me. That is, when my girlfriend withdraws completely (like for days on end) it really makes me nervous; I sleep poorly; and I usually and ultimately then reach out to her apologizing for things, which I often think I should not be apologizing for.

Having said all this, I have some speculations why my girlfriend is the way she is. First, it’s her character. Even her parents say that she could be very angry as a little child. Second, I know that she was not taken care of very well during childhood. One could even say that she was neglected. Add to that many bad experiences with guys. She really has a terrible record of guys cheating on her. I don’t think she’s had even one boyfriend who didn’t cheat on her (except me). She’s also been to a therapist who, too, complained that he couldn’t get through to her because she’s too aggressive and closed.

Having said all this, I want to ask for your guidance. My goal, at this point, is to find coping mechanisms. I think one thing that would really help me is to figure out how you would describe her behavior. Sometimes, I wonder whether she has a borderline personality disorder or maybe it’s just passive-aggressive behavior? I wonder about this not to judge her, but because I would love to understand where she’s coming from. If I had a clearer understanding of what internal struggles she faces, I could cope with it much better. I have also thought about buying books about how to deal with a possible illness she may be suffering from. With all this, I don’t want to “pathologize” her. Indeed, she has complained that I do that. I just want to make this relationship get on to safer grounds more quickly. The worst behavior has slowly decreased, but it’s a very hard process.

Thank you so much!

[seesaw]

Hi, so I'm vary wary of you trying to diagnose your girlfriend. There is a lot we can't know and there's no way to diagnose someone from a third party account. She could have borderline personality disorder although what you've said does not sound like it to me. So far you've mentioned symptoms that are attached to numerous illnesses. You said her PMS is an indicator of her mood, that makes me wonder of she is suffering from PMDD. That is very treatable through medication. Anyhow, regardless of what is going on with her, it does sound like she has anger issues and the two of you should talk about that.

I'm also worried about you in this relationship. You say that numerous times she's abandoned you somewhere with no way of you getting home, and yet you haven't broken it off with her? I know 2 years can seem like a long time, but honestly, time can fly by in a relationship. I wouldn't hold on to something bad just because you are afraid there won't be someone else out there for you.

In the end, you cannot control her or how she responds to things, you can only control how you will respond to things. Putting boundaries in place is a great idea. Just remember, boundaries are for you, not for her. Boundaries are about what you will do when she steps out of line, they aren't rules for her to follow. For example, when my mother starts bad mouthing my father, I leave the room. The boundary is I won't listen to that stuff or be around it. The boundary is not: you can't talk badly about my father. Now she has to learn that if she wants my company, she can't badmouth my father. So if your boundary is about her anger, it's about what you do in response to her anger. So if she leaves you somewhere and abandons you, you won't come over to see her unless it's to discuss her behavior or until she apologizes. If she's on the warpath, you will leave until she is calm enough to discuss things. By setting boundaries like this she will learn she can't have your company unless she behaves. But it's not a rule you place on her. Otherwise you're just setting rules, and should call them such. Boundaries are what we place on ourselves as people as what we will accept and not accept.

[Travelinglady]

Hi, dbtzk2000, and welcome to Psych Central! As seesaw said, we don't like to try to diagnose. After all, we aren't professionals, and even if we were, she would still need diagnosing in person.

I honestly don't think anything you do will make a difference with your girlfriend. You can try setting boundaries, but I think that would make her even more angry. Love cannot conquer all problems. She seems to have serious mental/emotional issues, regardless of any label she might be given.

I suggest you talk to a therapist about her. You will get some insights into her and into yourself. I agree with seesaw about wondering why you are happy to continue such a relationship.

Please keep us informed and again, welcome!

[Bill3]

What do you love about her?

[fairydustgirl]

I have this issue myself this is why I ask, do you think part of the connection is that she is a 'project' for you to try and take care of, or fix? You are also researching answers to why she behaves the way she does that leads me to think if you found the 'answer' you would be able to take care of the problem.

Something I wanted to mention as well, I was well trained by my ex to behave the way you do when given the silent treatment (or any other anxiety inducing behavior), I automatically scan my self and my environment to find out 'what did I do?'...and normally I didn't do anything. and yes I did find myself apologizing for things that were not even my fault. I have done it recently with a boyfriend because I knew something felt off but as usual, I thought it was me. and it wasn't, it was him. but I had done the apologizing.

It's not right, it's not fair and it's painful to be treated like she is treating you. Especially leaving you in circumstances where you are unable to get home, what would she think if you did that to her??? That's just wrong on so many levels. I'm guessing what your 'interests' might be and you might be right, it might be difficult to find someone whose interests are well aligned with yours. However, I can be certain that another person is out there and will treat you in the manner you are worthy of.
Something I have tried to keep in my mind...I can't fix anyone. Trust me, I have tried to be helpful, I have tried to be a sounding board, I've looked up resources for one bf to get him assistance. things he could have done himself but chose not to...lazy? unmotivated? not sure. in the end, I ended up feeling resentful and used and I left the relationship.

I don't have answers for you, but I do wish you the best in your journey.

[Rostou]

Originally Posted by dbtzk2000

Dear all,

I’m in a relationship with a girl who I dearly love. And she loves me, too, which is great. But the relationship has been problematic pretty much since the beginning. We’ve now been dating a little over two years (she's 33; I'm 31). So, as you can see, I’ve stuck around, partly because there are improvements. Still, I want to ask your advice because the relationship continues to be problematic to an extent that it really gets to me. For now, I have decided to continue the relationship. There are three main reasons. First, we really love each other. Second I believe that it takes time to get the fine tuning right. Third, however, I also have to admit that I am afraid of breaking up. I know why I love my girlfriend very much and I know it will be hard to find someone with interests as closely aligned (very specific interests).

The problems, in a nutshell, are that my girlfriend is easily offended, very moody, jealous, terrible at apologizing and even worse at self-reflection and empathy. Add to that a tendency to withdraw completely as soon as things go south (she’ll lock me out, turn off her phone, and even leave abandon me at places without me having any chance of getting back by myself). All of these things don’t happen every day, of course. But they continuously show up. It’s a repeating pattern. Things will be great for a while (“I want to have kids”, “I love you”, "I know I can be an ***", etc.) and then absolutely horrendous—pretty much without any warning (though PMS is a good indicator).

I can give you countless examples. But perhaps one will suffice. The other week, we wanted to go to the gym. She suggested a gym that was rather far away. So I said “hey, I know you don’t like driving very far, so have you thought about that other gym? Might that be an idea?” She said she was happy to try it out. But when we got there, the gym had “women’s day.” Which meant I couldn’t go inside. At that point my girlfriend got very upset. My repeated attempts to tell her that she can gladly go on her own and that I had checked the hours before and hadn’t read anything about a “women’s day” did not calm her down. I had to leave the car as she was getting increasingly furious. Later one, she apologized. But I could tell she was still mad.

This small anecdote really is a great example of our problems. My being understanding, empathetic, apologetic just does not help. Sometimes it does the opposite. It makes her furious. Now, in the last half year or so, I’ve started to not be the “nice” one all the time. I’ve started to give her clear boundaries. She often reminds me of a child (I work as a teacher), which is why I started setting such limits. I also know that I’m not innocent. I can set her off. I can be condescending. I’m mentally (but not physically) withdrawn at times. Still, knocking on wood, I’ve had a very fulfilled life and very few problems so far. My friends describe me as loyal, self-reflective, idealistic and mentally strong. But this relationship is really my ultimate challenge. One thing I’ve noticed is that it brings out a “needy” side in me. That is, when my girlfriend withdraws completely (like for days on end) it really makes me nervous; I sleep poorly; and I usually and ultimately then reach out to her apologizing for things, which I often think I should not be apologizing for.

Having said all this, I have some speculations why my girlfriend is the way she is. First, it’s her character. Even her parents say that she could be very angry as a little child. Second, I know that she was not taken care of very well during childhood. One could even say that she was neglected. Add to that many bad experiences with guys. She really has a terrible record of guys cheating on her. I don’t think she’s had even one boyfriend who didn’t cheat on her (except me). She’s also been to a therapist who, too, complained that he couldn’t get through to her because she’s too aggressive and closed.

Having said all this, I want to ask for your guidance. My goal, at this point, is to find coping mechanisms. I think one thing that would really help me is to figure out how you would describe her behavior. Sometimes, I wonder whether she has a borderline personality disorder or maybe it’s just passive-aggressive behavior? I wonder about this not to judge her, but because I would love to understand where she’s coming from. If I had a clearer understanding of what internal struggles she faces, I could cope with it much better. I have also thought about buying books about how to deal with a possible illness she may be suffering from. With all this, I don’t want to “pathologize” her. Indeed, she has complained that I do that. I just want to make this relationship get on to safer grounds more quickly. The worst behavior has slowly decreased, but it’s a very hard process.

Thank you so much!

Hi dbtzk2000. First up, I'm wondering why you think you and your girlfriend love each other. Secondly, since you asked, I would describe her behaviour as very abusive, inconsiderate, self-centered and mean spirited. That's a description, not a judgment. Really, how somebody else behaves is all we really have to go by.

How much longer do you think you can stick this out. And why are you settling for somebody who treats you so badly?

I personally don't know of any ways to really cope with a person like her. You are guaranteed a lifetime of misery I'd say. But, if you find out how, please let me know as I am long-term married to an abusive person and my life with him is hell. Sure, there are some good things, but none of them are to do with the relationship per se and abuse is abuse & has its effects.

[dbtzk2000]

Hi everyone,

Thank you so much for your feedback. You are confirming something I that my "rational" self know very well: That this relationship is not making me happy at a very fundamental level and won't make me happy anytime soon.

To answer some of your questions:

The first one is arguably the most central one: What do I love about her? I can honestly say that I just very much enjoy her smell, her looks, holding her in my arms, her kisses. Essentially anything intimate. But, I also have to admit that there are many things that I really don't like about her at a fundamental level. How she approaches other people (distant, sometimes hostile), her mood swings, opinionatedness, lack of curiosity. It's really a strange situation where I like her physically, but I'm not a big fan of her character.

Am I treating her like a project? That's a really good question. Sometimes, I do think I have that tendency. I want to be the one that doesn't leave her (she's been left and cheated on many times). I want to be the one that gives her grounding and support. I also want to be the one who helps her find happiness, open-mindedness, supports her to become friendly, enthusiasic. But, reading all this out loud I realize that this isn't a good basis for a relationship. I shouldn't go into this wanting to change her. But, if she doesn't change, I just don't see this relationship (including possibly marriages, etc.) working out.

Finally, I think the suggestion of seeing a therapist is a great one. I really should do that and I have already reached out to a person.

I'm always open for other opinions, and I will keep you posted on how things evolve.

Best

[Bill3]

I am sorry to say that I am not heartened by your last post. Two things in particular concern me.

Physical attraction but not attracted to character: I do not see that as a basis for a satisfying long-term relationship.

She has to change for the relationship to work out: It is unwise to expect or hope that people will change in a fundamental way. If anything, they will get worse after a possible marriage or long term relationship starts--many try to be on their best behavior at the start of a relationship.

What is her thinking about trying to change?

It sounds like you might be a better fit for her as her therapist than as her lover/partner.

[Crazy Hitch]

Yes, the things that you pointed out that you like about her are physical ... it's very important that we connect with people on a physical level, but if there's not much else holding the relationship together, then it's a very weak relationship.

[Erebos]

Basically you fancy her, if only EVERYTHiNG else was different. I am afraid no matter how physically attuned you are she will never meet your emotional needs. And when you find that woman who does you will bang your head off a wall wondering why it took you so long to see the light.

Seriously though I wish you all the best, and say there is nothing more intimate than a true meeting of the minds.