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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 04:42 PM
  #21
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@MisterPaul yes what do you have to go back and change in what you did this last year?
@Open Eyes I didn’t do much to feel vulnerable because that wasn’t my goal. I focused on “successful socializing” with people. I used to be either awkward or just weird since my mindset is just “different” because of my injury. I tried to learn how to have a good time without acting. I did incredibly well but opening up to others is still something I’d label as “impossible”. I strongly believe that if you stripped me off all the progress I made, you would meet a really strange, traumatized individual as default, and you would reject that person right away. It’s true. I feel it in my soul. I’m not wrong, unfortunately.
 
 
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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 04:49 PM
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You know what's ironic? I am very empathetic and I often times have found myself involved with the wounded, the tragic and those who have been traumatized, because I can empathize SO much. And of course, by you saying if you stripped everything away, you would see the traumatized person. which naturally pulls on my empathy. But being SO empathetic has proven to bring me only toxic, unhealthy and abusive relationships in the end. I myself am a traumatized kid in an adult body. I guess i am attracted to other traumatized people and men. I am still trying to figure it out, at the age of 50! You're far ahead of the game, at your age. You're very young still, but very aware. You know what works and what doesn't work for you. That's being far ahead in my opinion.

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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 05:13 PM
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But being SO empathetic has proven to bring me only toxic, unhealthy and abusive relationships in the end. I myself am a traumatized kid in an adult body. I guess i am attracted to other traumatized people and men.
People have this stupid way of thinking where victims are always the good ones. No, they are not. Lisa Montgomery was a victim of severe child abuse...
 
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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 05:22 PM
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People have this stupid way of thinking where victims are always the good ones. No, they are not. Lisa Montgomery was a victim of severe child abuse...
What do you mean by that? Was that a dig at me?

I personally? I happen to be a very kindhearted, moral, ethical, honest and decent human being. I consider myself one of the good ones, and regardless of trauma caused to me.

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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 05:28 PM
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What do you mean by that? Was that a dig at me?
No, it wasn't. I'm dissing the society in general.
 
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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 05:52 PM
  #26
Victims aren’t always good ones. Victims often become perpetrators. And then some people have victim mentality, so they’ll milk their victimhood in detriment to others. They’ll make everyone to take care of them with 100 excuses and they’ll never accept responsibility, being a victim becomes their identity and they use others to their advantage. So certainly it’s not all black and white.
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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 05:54 PM
  #27
Mister Paul learning successful socializing isn’t a bad goal, yes it might be surface deep but there is benefit in learning that skill
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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 05:58 PM
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Victims aren’t always good ones. Victims often become perpetrators. And then some people have victim mentality, so they’ll milk their victimhood in detriment to others. They’ll make everyone to take care of them with 100 excuses and they’ll never accept responsibility, being a victim becomes their identity and they use others to their advantage. So certainly it’s not all black and white.
I've been a victim of abuse in my childhood, and in my adulthood numerous times. I am none of the above. I am not a perpetrator nor am I a perpetual victim who needs to be saved by everyone else.

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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 05:58 PM
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You know what's ironic? I am very empathetic and I often times have found myself involved with the wounded, the tragic and those who have been traumatized, because I can empathize SO much. And of course, by you saying if you stripped everything away, you would see the traumatized person. which naturally pulls on my empathy. But being SO empathetic has proven to bring me only toxic, unhealthy and abusive relationships in the end. I myself am a traumatized kid in an adult body. I guess i am attracted to other traumatized people and men. I am still trying to figure it out, at the age of 50! You're far ahead of the game, at your age. You're very young still, but very aware. You know what works and what doesn't work for you. That's being far ahead in my opinion.
Being drawn to treat/help/heal/teach/ guide/advocate for vulnerable population could be a good guide for a profession choice. Or volunteer position, if not a career. They don’t need to be your romantic partners or close friends, but they could be people/kids/elderly/sick/misfortunate you help to thrive. I am not suggesting you change career of course, just a food for thought.

Sorry Mister Paul, didn’t mean to hijack
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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 06:01 PM
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I've been a victim of abuse in my childhood, and in my adulthood numerous times. I am none of the above. I am not a perpetrator nor am I a perpetual victim who needs to be saved by everyone else.
You aren’t. I was just replying to mister Paul agreeing that not every victim is a wonderful person who do only good in life.
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Default Jan 13, 2021 at 06:02 PM
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Being drawn to treat/help/heal/teach/ guide/advocate for vulnerable population could be a good guide for a profession choice. Or volunteer position, if not a career. They don’t need to be your romantic partners or close friends, but they could be people/kids/elderly/sick/misfortunate you help to thrive. I am not suggesting you change career of course, just a food for thought.

Sorry Mister Paul, didn’t mean to hijack
Well, as you know, I have a self help blog and Facebook page that do help people in need, so that does satisfy that desire in me.

Sorry as well to hijack the thread.

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Default Jan 19, 2021 at 06:30 PM
  #32
I posted this link to someone else, but after reading what you shared about needing to protect that deep injury, I thought you may find this information useful. It's important to understand that some things that hurt you in your past, like abandonment are not the same for how you CAN manage as an adult. It's not a bad thing to develop better social skills, you are not LOSING by doing that, but instead actually gaining and in so doing can develop a sense of self that may be able to no longer feel that need to protect that deep hurt part in you.

When I looked up "what kind of person needs fantasy" the first thing that came up is in fact "narcissist". Narcissists often have that inner child part that fears abandonment and struggles with self esteem. So they protect and create their own "fantasy" and if anyone dare not fit into THEIR fantasy, well, there is the rage and even desire to "wish that person dead". Their reputation as you have said "I am the bad guy" typically develops due to how they behave when their "fantasy" is threatened. They remember things about others and can seem to listen attentively, however, what they are doing is gathering whatever it is about the other person that they can use to punish them should they not remain loyal to the "fantasy" desired. They also like to use information gathered for manipulation purposes as well.

I have to say that so far I don't see the typical red flags in you MisterPaul, usually a narcissist is very skilled at drawing others into their game and they learn hoovering methods that work well.
Fantasy and Its Effect on Your Reality | Psychology Today
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Default Jan 19, 2021 at 06:52 PM
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Default Jan 20, 2021 at 05:18 PM
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I have to say that so far I don't see the typical red flags in you MisterPaul, usually a narcissist is very skilled at drawing others into their game and they learn hoovering methods that work well.
Or I'm just that good at fooling you even when I don't want to. I am the only person who knows what is in my head and what my priorities are and, trust me, you should stay away from people like me.

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Default Jan 20, 2021 at 05:26 PM
  #35
It’s pretty much that way with everyone where they only share what they want others to know.
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Default Jan 20, 2021 at 06:02 PM
  #36
Honestly, the only thing people don't get when it comes to me is that I just simply do not care about others. I only care about winning and getting any kind of action that stimulates me in one way or the other. I never loved anyone. It's super easy for me to discard someone I know and move on as if nothing happened (I've done that many times). The only "rule" I have is not to hurt anyone. But that's simply because I've been hurt many times before and I know the taste of that feeling.
 
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Default Jan 21, 2021 at 01:00 PM
  #37
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. I only care about winning and getting any kind of action that stimulates me in one way or the other.
Yup, that is typical of narcissistic behavior. That is what I have been dealing with in my older sister. Only, with my sister if she knows she is hurting you that is when she feels that she is winning. My sister WANTS others to act bad so she can blame them and play the victim. It's incredible the things she does to bait people. Plus she can be a stalker and likes to single out her victims and get them alone. She WANTS others to feel powerless as that's what gives her a sense of power.

So what can be very distorted is what the narcissist considers "winning". For you "hurting" isn't a win or so you say, but for other narcissists that's part of what they feel is a win.
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Default Jan 22, 2021 at 02:50 PM
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I never loved anyone. It's super easy for me to discard someone I know and move on as if nothing happened (I've done that many times)
That is why it is said that narcissists tend to have a trail of hurt discards or situations where they could not get the position they felt they were entitled to have. In their mind they refuse to be "the loser" and they will fantasize many situations where they are the winner.

Most narcissists that I have come across tend to really struggle if they don't have some kind of audience to get their feed from. They seem to need to think that whatever environment they are in is "theirs" and would not be of value without THEM. Ususally, there is a need to stand out to make up for how they failed to stand out in some positive way in their childhood. That is what I find sad.

(((MisterPaul))) I am so sorry because you won't hurt that guy that is overweight or whatever else others picked on about you, instead, you will look to prove you can be better than the ones that picked on you.

I got to know another person that admitted he had malignant npd. He shared with me what it was like for him and he was also writing a novel. He described his novel to me and how it reflected who he was too. At the end of his novel the surpise was how the one who ended up having so much power was in fact a child. I felt honored that he shared all that with me and what I felt the saddest about was how there was nothing I could do to help heal him and even he knew that about himself. He had developed masks he could wear where he could fool all different kinds of people. Like you, he never cared, instead it was just something he figured out how to do to get HIS needs met.

I am coming from a very different place than you. I witnessed the cruelty towards someone that was hurt like you. I saw this every day and every day it traumatized me. What I witnessed was children hurting someone and they did not care how much they were hurting him either. The child in me hurt because I wanted to stop it but I was too little and powerless to stop it because I did not know HOW. I could not believe that no one would try to stop it, not even the bus driver. It was a while before I was able to understand that the other children joined in or just watched because they did not want to be a target themselves.

I thought somehow people just grew out of that kind of behavior, but the truth is THEY DON'T. I am no different in that I never stopped wanting to find a way to help that child I saw picked on over and over again. You know what I observed MisterPaul? Some children develop on the chubby side growing up and some of these children actually grow up into handsome men, good men, kind hearted men. Often the boys that seem to "have it" when young don't when they become men. Often like the story about the ugly ducking, the so called ugly ducking actually does turn into a swan. What I find sad is when the swan happens but inside that swan holds onto the ugly ducking.

I spent a lot of time with young children and what made me feel good was when I helped that child walk away from me feeling good about themselves. I did not realize how I wanted something for each child that had not only been missing in myself, but for that child I watched hurt over and over again that I was too little to know how to help. The win for me was seeing that child feel good about themselves and what they accomplished that day. You know that saying "we may not remember exactly what someone says, but we never forget how that person made us feel?". Well, when I come across a child I spent time with teaching, the win for me is how when they see me they light up just as they did when they walked away from me feeling good about themselves often so many years ago.

How do you win when you are on a journey to be better than what you feel are the ones that picked on you by seeing if you can contribute to their feeling small in some way? Most of the time when I begin to realize a person is like that I let them feel they won and then I just walk away. I already know there is nothing I can do that will be good enough or right enough or enough of anything at all. When I spent time with that one man who shared with me the only thing I could do is feel sad for him. And it basically all boiled down to that child that got hurt too just as he shared about in his novel with me, and the child finally had the desired power after all, at least in his novel.

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Default Jan 23, 2021 at 08:56 AM
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Or I'm just that good at fooling you even when I don't want to. I am the only person who knows what is in my head and what my priorities are and, trust me, you should stay away from people like me.
Unfortunately MisterPaul, I know all too well what it's like to have to deal with a dark triad. You dare get in their way of what they want and they want you dead. If they can't physically kill you they try to do so mentally/emotionally.

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Default Jan 25, 2021 at 01:36 PM
  #40
MisterPaul, what I just stated isn't so much about NPD as it is more reflecting my own history and things I have observed, but the one thing that is different is the label. And from what I have been learning is these labels tend to develop from some kind of trauma in that person's childhood, or, it can be something that child was encouraged to be too.

I grew up in the late 50's and early 60's and that time was a lot different then today. Things I witnessed in my own childhood today would be considered "child abuse". When another person says "behaviors reflect good and bad etc." or something to that affect, it doesn't set well with me tbh. The reason for that is due to how I witnessed how badly my older brother was treated because he had behaviors that did not fit into what was desired so he was constantly punished and with what is known today, how he was treated would be considered "abuse".

When I listen to someone that feels bad because they can't seem to do something a certain way, I think about my brother and my mother and my father and even my older sister. My older brother had severe ADHD, and I believe he also had Dyslexia. My brother was severely abused and punished for something he could not help. My brother was told he was stupid, the sad thing about my brother is that he was actually extremely intelligent. When I sit and talk to my therapist, he talks about how his son has ADHD, and his wife also has it, yet his wife has a genuis IQ. What is nice about talking with my therapist about this is how what he shares is coming from a new understanding of something I had witnessed my older brother be abused for. My therapist talks about how this type of individual literally multitasks in their brain thinking about several things at once so in effect they are mentally multi-tasking. While AD tends to mean attention deficit, all that really means is that it's harder for that individual to have to sit and focus on one thing for too long. Often, what it means is how a person can think about five things at one time while another individual may need to focus on one thing at a time and may get frustrated if expected to think about five things at once. It can be the difference of how one person can have five different businesses going at once instead of only being able to handle one business needing all their focus to be on that one business alone. OR, it can be the difference of a person being able to wait on five tables at once in a restaurant compared to someone else that can only handle a couple or otherwise can get overwhelmed. And then there is what is called the hyper active part, and that is describing how this individual does best "in motion". So now we have "in motion thinking about several things at once". Does that equate to "stupidity"?

Well, given what I just shared lets see if ADHD equates to "stupid". Walt Disney had ADHD and it allowed him to build an empire and make many products that people love and want even long after his death. Micheal Phelps, who was the most decorated athlete of all time winning 14 gold medals. Micheal jordon, Jim Carrey, David Neeleman Aviation Entrepreneur, Will Smith, John F Kennedy, and Albert Einstein known to have both ADHD and Dyslexia. That's just a few.

There were plenty of reasons my older brother would struggle with self esteem. There are plenty of reasons my brother may have some narcissitic challenges. My brother was never ugly, and he was never stupid, yet, there is a child part in him that grew to believe he was ugly and also trying to prove he was not stupid. At your age he was often angry and had a lot to prove yet. Often the healing journey is a tough one when carrying some deep wounds that my brother carried.

MisterPaul, you are still young yet, perhaps in time you will heal and come to terms with what you see as those you must consider the ones you must be better than. You see, there is no black and white and when a person is young it can seem that way if they experienced being treated like less than. It's believable that you don't care, considering what you have shared. It can be sad when someone grows into a swan but carries around the ugly duckling. The hardest person to convince often is one's self.
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