[shaddix]

This is an email I got from my girlfriends mother..... I get all the support I need from God, i'm looking for advice.... please ask questions about anything you need to know.

The email was directed at her daughter, (she sent it to me and her both)

If he feels all of this so deeply and you do too, then why do I only hear it from him and not from you, too?

He's trying to poush me emotionally and I'm not having it. :P

I am dissappointed with you only because you lack the ability to protect yourself from people like this (if he's doing it to me, then he's doing it to you). AND when other people try to help you - you act like they're the problem.

You know that you do things that you shoudn't. You know that other people are leading you away. You know what you are doing is wrong and you don't care.

These are exactly the situations that all of your books tell you not to go into and to run away from and you (smiling and acting Godly the whole time) are shutting your eyes and following anyway.

I didn't mind that you spent the extra night. If you are going to decide to do things the wrong way, like I told you before, leave me out of it. Quit calling and asking for permission to do the wrong thing. I'm not giving it.

I'm not going to fuss at you or give you a hard time. If you tell me that you are going to Faithe's and you spend the weekend with Shad - that's your deal. If you're going to be late just call and say , "I won't be home until tomorrow." You don't have to go into the whole whining thing.

Just know, once again, that it will not continue very long. Every time you do it, you are taking one more step away from this family.

I'm not mentioning it to you to fuss. I'm just wanting to make sure that I am clear and that you understand everything up front. I don't want you to be able to play around in Knoxville, then come home and say, "Oh, well. I was wrong. I think I'll go back to normal life now." That won't happen either. I don't want to watch you gently easy yourself off track, knowing that I'm not allowed to say anything.

You wouldn't let you friends do that would you? You wouldn't just watch them make the wrong decisions and sit back and watch? Well, I guess you might. You don't seem to be standing up to anyone or any thing.

I'm sending this to Shad, too, since he seems to think that his place is between us (like he's mentioned in his E-mails).

It's not his fault or his problem. It's yours. Quit passing the buck and accept some responsibility for yourself. If you're gonna be adult then act like it. Quit whining. Stop making excuses for your bad behavior and just admit it.

Saying, "I have decided to go off on weekends and spend the night with a bunch of people who don't even know God and could care less if they did. They live however they want to and ignore God in their lives and I think that's just fine," is better than what you are doing because at least you are being honest with yourself and not saying to yourself (in a whiny voice) "Well, I guess it's all right."

Give me a break, BOTH OF YOU.

(tiring of the games and deciding to be direct) Shad, all this psycho - babbling you are doing - it's nothing but babbling trying to sound like you know what you're talking about. You've taken nothing to heart and you are using Jessica and luring her in by talking about God. It's fake. It's obvious to everyone but Jessica and that's not because she's a nice person or real loving or trusting or anything like that - it's only because she wants to go off and do all of these things that sh'e not supposed to do and she's using you as an excuse - to herself - to justify the things she's doing. Once she's tired of it - she'll be gone and more on. If you don't get tired of the game of trying to control her first. You are both using each other for your own personal, selfish things and it's pathetic. It has nothing to do with love. Grow up a little - get your head out of the movies. Life is not a romantic Anamie.

(she sighs) I'm sorry I ever gave you the book. Looks like you are one of the % who just takes the info and uses it to control people.

(quite disappointed and tired of the drama) No more E-mails Shad. Jessica, I don't know what else to tell you except that we won't be having this conversation again. You have to live with your own decisions, I don't.

Thanks for listening.

[kimmydawn]

Shaddix,

This is one email, so it's hard for me to know the entire story. However......WOW.

One thing...she seems to be telling alot of ppl how they are feeling about God (and it's not good enuf to her) and she's doing some major judging. The Bible says "judge not lest ye be judged". well, that's self explanitory. Also, who is she to decide another's personal conviction that God may give that person. God does not direct us all in the same way...he uses each person to His design. What he may want her mother to do and think and feel, may not be the same for her daughter...that's why so many ppl interpret the Bible if different ways...because God is directing them to get out of it what He wants them to.

It sounds like she is doubting her daughter's commitment by her actions and that's judging. And she's said everything BUT that she wouldn't forgive her daughter when she comes home if she continues in her behavior. What kind of example is she??? What if God hadn't forgiven her and wouldn't forgive her for her actions right now???

The Bible also says for children to obey their parents, but in that same chapter it follows that the parent should NOT provoke their children...we seldom hear that part of it.

As I said, I don't know the whole story. This may be a mother who is simply at her wits end and is feeling this way for good reason. In that case, she just may be a concerned, caring mother who's grasping at straws. I wish you all well here.

Be safe,

Kimmydawn

[shaddix]

thank you for the input, she is doubting her daughters commitment, but i believe this to be because she herself got messed up with drugs and drinking, got raped at a party when she was 15 years old and had my girlfriend as her child.

I believe the mother may be feeling some kind of rejection from her daughter..
Thank you again for your input

[gloria]

My two cents:

If you are using Jessica and she is using you, so be it. We all use each other for all kids of things such as SUPPORT AND LOVE.

I use everybody in this forum to recharge my battery every time I come in. I use my children every day to get energy and go on with my life. I use everybody in my life!! Using is not the same than manipulating, or abusing. So there!!!!!

GO ON AND USE JESSICA TO FILL YOUR LIFE WITH WHAT MAKES YOU FEEL GOOD, AND ALLOW HER TO USE YOU FOR HER NEEDS AS WELL, that is call reciprocity and is part of every honest relationship in this world.

period.

[shaddix]

i use her to exercise my ability to love and be intimate with another human, and also use our relationship as an example and a testament to our faith

[nothemama8]

Shad if you love Jessica and she loves you, then tell her Mom to find herself someone she sounds jealous

[misty]

The question in truth would be, Do you think you are being fake?

[shaddix]

not in the least, i have a healthy concept of love and have experienced the true bond that lasting love can create in the tiniest sense.

I have considered the idea after she told me, I try to always examine myself for anything someone else says no matter how absurd it sounds to me at the time, but in this case I believe I truly have chosen to love her with no selfish hidden motives.

[bethannaTN]

<font color="purple">Hi, Shaddix,

Wow, what a letter. One of the things that I read in the letter (and please correct me if you feel that I am wrong.)
Is that her mother doesn't want to be in the middle of what you and your beloved do. It sounded like you and your girlfriend both email her - and I have no idea what you email her about, but the letter sounded like a round about way of saying "please stop." I've noticed in my own life that people will attack someone's character in order to set a boundary that they do not feel they have a right to ask for. She has the right. She also has the right to delete mail she does not feel like reading if she so chooses. She sounds to me that you and her daughter's actions are in conflict with what she knows to be safe in her belief system - what she defines HER belief system to be. This is a free country, she can choose to believe anything the wants to believe. That doesn't make her wrong, it makes her different. It doesn't make you and your girlfriend wrong, it makes you different. Perhaps one day she will see and understand that, but for now, she is setting a boundary - or at least trying to. Your choice is whether you choose to respect that boundary or not. Your girlfriend has the same choice, and who knows what she will choose.

Integrity is proven by time. You know who you are and what your motives are. People tend to judge what they see by measuring what they see against their own values. While the Christian faith warns agains prejudgement or judgement, it's a safety net for people - it's how we protect ourselves from things we do not understand or are afraid of. We can choose to face our fears or we can chose to live in them - but it's our own individual choice. No one can change that choice for us. It's something we have to do for ourselves. She may come around, she may not ever come around. Either way, she is asking for some distance from your relationship. There are things that I have hoped to see in my own grown children's lives - that I don't see. But they have to live with their own shoes. I can't wear those shoes for them. Not every parent is there - my own mother would love to wear my shoes for me ever single day, and I'm 41!! I chose what I want to share with my mother, and what is actually none of her business and I live my life. I respect what boundaries she sets for herself, I do not respect what boundaries she sets for me. I live my life, and go on.

Shad, she can't see your heart, she can only see your actions, and for her those actions are uncomfortable for her to witness. That uncomfort is based on what she knows to be true in her own definition of life. Your truth may be very different. The fact that her daughter is chosing what she sees as YOUR truth instead of HER truth is shaking her up a bit. It will be good when her mother is seeing that your girlfriend is making her own definitions for herself. Perhaps one day she will let your girlfriend fly on her own two wings. Parents worry, and fret, and turn themselves inside out over their children. It's a part of life. It's very very difficult to let them go and let them fly. The fear is not based on the actual flight, it's based on the crash landing. Crashes happen, though it's not usually the general rule. I guess this letter is about 'seeking first to understand' - (her position) then you have the knowledge to not take her actions/words so personally. It isn't about you, Chad. It's about her own discomfort in letting go.

In a way, by attacking your character, she sets herself up for not getting what she is asking for - perhaps because she doesn't feel like she has the right to ask for those boundaries. Your focus went immediately toward the character attack - which is exactly what she wanted. If you don't hear the point, then she gets to say "SEE!! THIS IS PROOF!! HE DOESN'T CARE!! HE WON'T RESPECT THE THINGS I HAVE ASKED!!" Don't get caught up in that. Respect what boundaries you can, leave her character assasination of you behind. Let it go. Don't allow it to work for her. Response goes a lot further than reacting does.

She is threatening the exclusion of your girlfriend from her family. That's a pretty powerful matriarcle statement. Perhaps she is capable of doing that, perhaps she isn't. It is up to your girlfriend to decide whether she is up to deal with that threat - and what it means to her. For me (and gosh knows I've heard that threat soooo many times!!). It has been my experience that some people live up to the threat, others cannot give up the control that easily, and cannot bring themselves to actually shut the door. Others need to shut the door for a little while to see if the person will bend to their way of thinking. Your girlfriend will have to decide for herself what she is willing to do to live her own life and what she is willing to sacrifice for that. For me, living my own life on my own terms was just too important to me. Some doors closed permanently, and never opened again. (The parties that closed the doors are now deceased) Some closed for a minute to see what I would do, then opened again once they realized I would not bend to the threat. Some never actually closed, ha, just new tactics were tried. They didn't work either.

I would caution you too, that if the relationship with your girlfriend does not work out, let it not work out on its own terms - and don't allow guilt concerning her mother's words keep you in a relationship that may not be healthy for you. But for now, enjoy her, treat her like a princess, and let that love build. Despite.


Beth </font>

[shaddix]

You have given me insight into her thoughts and I am very grateful for that.

Strange thing, to me her mother is not just "my girlfriends mother" she is actually someone very important to me that took part in my realization of the Christian faith. So I do have some attachment to her and I care and want her to see that her actions to help me have helped me, I want her to see the fruits of her Christianity. But I cannot, at least not right now, so I have been told by you and several others to just continue and focus on my relationship with God and Jessica and mom will eventually come around.

Thank you again, &lt;3s

[bethannaTN]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
So I do have some attachment to her and I care and want her to see that her actions to help me have helped me, I want her to see the fruits of her Christianity.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Good morning, Shad!!
When you can, (when things are calmer) this is something that you can tell her, not in an argumentative way, but in a way that tells her that she is important to you. It may or may not help - as you have no control over how she acts/what she believes/etc. But it is a fine communication to give. It just basically says, "I care, YOU are important to ME, and you have not wasted your time on me." Shad, you can look at this situation as an opportunity, or you can look at it as a road block. From what I hear in your words you look to her as a mentor - let her know what the effect of her help has done for you - when you can, in little ways - but in keeping true to yourself. Your actions will always speak louder than words, what is it in your life right now that she guided you to and has made your life better? Knowing those things in your own heart will keep the appreciation for her fresh until this passes - and she begins to relax a little concerning her daughter. One day you may well be 'caught' doing something good by her, and you can turn right around and give her a hug, and say "You had a lot to do with this, thank you. I can't even begin to tell you how much you mean to me."

As a mother of a twenty three year old young women, I can understand what spending the night with people she does not know means, and why her mother would be so upset. My daughter was slipped a micky and raped in one such circumstance. Her boyfriend was slipped the same - and could not protect her. Not to lessen the trauma of the rape, but now days it can mean a death sentence for a young woman with AIDS and the other diseases that are so common. For me talking to my daughter about her life style and making good choices for her self was not for the sake of my faith, or hers, but the sake of her SAFETY. Please, I urge you, if you are in the company of your gf, please keep in mind her safety, make wise decisions about what you both expose yourselves to. The world can be a very unkind place. My father, never ever drank when he was taking my mother out - I asked him why - as my mother would come home pretty three sheets to the wind. He said "I can't protect her if I'm drunk." That spoke worlds to me.

I am assuming that you both are in your young twenties? - please correct me if I am wrong. I urge you - faith aside - to be very careful with her and with yourself. Make good choices that will build you both and will protect you both from harm.

(big heart!!)
Beth

[shaddix]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
Please, I urge you, if you are in the company of your gf, please keep in mind her safety, make wise decisions about what you both expose yourselves to.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Yes Yes, everything that I do involving her is only for her well being, everything, even if that means losing her.

Also, the response about how to handle being grateful to her mother, thank you, I am impatient.... and in my mind if I can't do something right now, I'll never get the chance ever again. I need to learn otherwise, thanks <3s.

awwwwwww you're so nice <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 thank you <3 <3 <3

[bethannaTN]

((((((Shad)))))))) go get 'em!

Beth