[Sometimes psychotic]

So when I read about psychosis and sz the prodrome supposedly contains social withdrawl, but I'm wondering if its more like social exclusion. Probably for like ten years I only had people to talk to at work and no real friends on the weekend. I think that may have contributed to my illness. Too much time alone talking to myself. Since my recovery I have one really good outside friend who I met by following the advice of my cbt therapist. I starting to wondering if having people around who care about you is essential to recovery. So what do you think about either your prodrome or now is it that you are being excluded by people or that you actively withdrew from society? That is if you don't have great social relations. I have a hard time believing that anyone actively withdrew because you are all here seeking friendship online.

[The_little_didgee]

I always wondered if my loneliness contributed to the development of my illness. A few years before I got ill, I began to withdraw from the world. Eventually, I wasn't socializing at all. I thought it was depression but was reluctant to get help for it since I was previously misdiagnosed with a personality disorder.

The social exclusion came after I recovered. I have ASD so this has always been a problem. It became more obvious, because I changed. I lost interest in people and lacked motivation to do anything, even socializing.

People help for sure. I don't socialize much but I try. I also have one really good friend. He is pleasant and fun to be around. A sense of belonging definitely promotes good physical and emotional health. Class has helped me feel a lot better about myself too.

[Atypical_Disaster]

is it that you are being excluded by people or that you actively withdrew from society?

I think for me it's a combination of both.

[Gr3tta]

I withdraw from social interaction. I like online acquaintances because its so low maintenance. I don't have to get dressed and figure out what to wear and what to do and what to order and how to decide and... you get the point.

[Mountainman2013]

For me it's isolation. At work I talk to maybe two persons. But these are meaningless conversations that go nowhere. You know the kind. It's by choice. I don't want to interact unless I'm forced to do so. At home I must interact. But sometimes I'd rather not and don't.

[faerie_moon_x]

Okay so one of my Dx is schizoid (which not sure that makes sense, but when I "test" for it I always get it, I don't know.)

So here's my experience. I want friends I just don't trust people to be friends or even be nice and respond. I only like to work in a group if I know the people in the group and they are not bossy (I like doing my own thing.) I like to be alone but I don't. I love my family very much, but I like them to let me kind of do my own thing and not "hover." I attached yet detached at the same time. I like to be private but I still like to talk about things. I'm a huge basket of contraditictions and I realize that.

Now, another thing I experience is that I think people "know" that something is different about me. I think all people know but it depends on how they handle it. There are either group a) the avoid group which are people who try to avoid having to be around me. Group b) the bully group who pick up that something is different and bully me. Group c) the compassion group who are people who pick up that something is wrong but they are good hearted people so they don't mind. Most people fall into group a. So, I think that is true with others as well, not just me.

Another thing I experience is that I often feel people around me don't understand. Either they don't understand what I'm going through or they don't understand what I'm communicating. So, I tend to pull back from people and be more internal. It is hard to reach out to others when you feel they won't understand, listen, or care. This has been a big issue that came about with my personal experience.

Lastly, I find it can be really hard to communicate when my thoughts are not linear and when I tend to forget what I'm saying. I seem to have a lot of thought blocking. My mind just goes blank suddenly. This seems to be progressing in the past year, I'm noticing it a lot more than I used to. That's also another thing to get around.

I think all these hurdles cause a combination of withdrawl and exclusion. Mixed together it becomes isolation. Sorry this was so long, I'm having a bit of trouble getting what I want to say out.

[Sometimes psychotic]

I hardly encounter group B the bullies but I term group A the avoid as Xenophobic while the compassionate group I term Xenophillic. Xenophillic people are among the most fun people out there, they are looking for new and different experiences and not the same old thing.

[sandysay]

I've been married to a schizo-affective for 12y. He has been on disability for about that long too. So, when we would socialize, he wouldn't want to tell anyone that he wasn't employed and he'd lie about what he did and couldn't keep his lies straight. Eventually, I stopped doing anything w/anyone b/c his schizophrenia and lies made relationships impossible.
He has no healthy friends, but one schozophrenic and one bi-polar friend. Their relationships are bizarre and he says so too. But, he can be himself and talk about his illness to them. He thinks he can only have friends who also have a mental illness. No one else would understand him.
Well his beliefs, lies to family and friends, have made me a friendless person. He is home all day and I can't have anyone over b/c they may ask why isn't he working, is he off, when does he work. I stopped lying, but b/c I can't answer their questions, I have to be alone.

[faerie_moon_x]

Originally Posted by sandysay

I've been married to a schizo-affective for 12y. He has been on disability for about that long too. So, when we would socialize, he wouldn't want to tell anyone that he wasn't employed and he'd lie about what he did and couldn't keep his lies straight. Eventually, I stopped doing anything w/anyone b/c his schizophrenia and lies made relationships impossible.
He has no healthy friends, but one schozophrenic and one bi-polar friend. Their relationships are bizarre and he says so too. But, he can be himself and talk about his illness to them. He thinks he can only have friends who also have a mental illness. No one else would understand him.
Well his beliefs, lies to family and friends, have made me a friendless person. He is home all day and I can't have anyone over b/c they may ask why isn't he working, is he off, when does he work. I stopped lying, but b/c I can't answer their questions, I have to be alone.

This is a problem generated by our society, which has put the belief in people's heads that you're only worth something if you are making money. It's a horrible thing and it's terrible that your husband is ashamed and feels he has to lie. There are people in this world who do not value people by the amount of dollars in their pocket. It takes learning to understand that anyone who shames you for being disabled is not worth your time. They are the ones who have the problem, and their eyes are clouded by the demon we call money and it is filling their hearts with hate.

You are your husbands caretaker and caretakers can also benefit from talk therapy. Have you tried therapy to try to work through some of this? Also your husband might want to talk about this with his therapist and learn strategies to better cope with his feelings of shame on this issue.

[Sometimes psychotic]

Originally Posted by sandysay

I've been married to a schizo-affective for 12y. He has been on disability for about that long too. So, when we would socialize, he wouldn't want to tell anyone that he wasn't employed and he'd lie about what he did and couldn't keep his lies straight. Eventually, I stopped doing anything w/anyone b/c his schizophrenia and lies made relationships impossible.
He has no healthy friends, but one schozophrenic and one bi-polar friend. Their relationships are bizarre and he says so too. But, he can be himself and talk about his illness to them. He thinks he can only have friends who also have a mental illness. No one else would understand him.
Well his beliefs, lies to family and friends, have made me a friendless person. He is home all day and I can't have anyone over b/c they may ask why isn't he working, is he off, when does he work. I stopped lying, but b/c I can't answer their questions, I have to be alone.

I still work but one solution to this that I've seen is taking a hobby and making it the profession, ie if you like photography or writing or anything like that you can say that's what you do. Its really not about the money people just want to know who you are and what you like.

[sandysay]

I have no shame, nor problem telling others about my husband. But, my husband doesn't want me to say anything and he has lied about all the different places he allegedly works that honest healthy relationships aren't possible.
I think he does it b/c of the way his own family reacts to him and his mental illness. They don't believe there is anything wrong w/him. They have been in denial ever since the psychiatrist first told them, when he was first hospitalized. So, he has no reason to be on disability. Besides, disability is for physical disabilities. They believe he is physically capable of holding down a job. They are ashamed of him.

[faerie_moon_x]

Originally Posted by sandysay

I have no shame, nor problem telling others about my husband. But, my husband doesn't want me to say anything and he has lied about all the different places he allegedly works that honest healthy relationships aren't possible.
I think he does it b/c of the way his own family reacts to him and his mental illness. They don't believe there is anything wrong w/him. They have been in denial ever since the psychiatrist first told them, when he was first hospitalized. So, he has no reason to be on disability. Besides, disability is for physical disabilities. They believe he is physically capable of holding down a job. They are ashamed of him.

Yes, this is exactly what I was thinking it must be and because of that he's ashamed of himself. It's terrible for them to do that.

What your husband needs is a place where he feels safe that he can talk about his illness with others who are understanding. Perhaps a support group? Maybe if he meets others in similar situations he can build healthy friendships outside of his family, people who are seperate. And, perhaps you can then also be free to find seperate friends away from his family that he won't be ashamed to be around.

[sandysay]

He was in a support group and then a program. Through the day program he met the schizophrenic & bi-polar friends. I have not had anything to do w/his family for over a year. He has an unhealthy pull towards his family and continues to visit and speak to his parents. He has put their needs and requests ahead of our family, to the detriment of our 5yo son & me. We went to couples therapy and he was told that his relationship w/his parents was undermining our marriage.
He will never go back to therapy or a support group b/c he thinks he's had enough. Last May, we legally separated, on my request. We are still living together. I've told him I would like him to leave, but I know he has no where to go. I care about what happens to him, yet this arrangement is depressing me. My depression has been well controlled by meds for over a decade. This past year I have been feeling worse and having difficulty functioning.
My husband can't live at his parent's house b/c his 2 other siblings moved back home. Even if there was room, they wouldn't take him in as long as he is on SSD. He doesn't receive enough to rent an apartment and he needs to be close to our son.

My doctor thinks I'm socially withdrawn but I don't know. I don't like most people. I try to not communicate with people around because I don't like them. I want friends, but I don't like anyone here. I isolate myself from everyone. So I suppose he's right...

[faerie_moon_x]

Originally Posted by sandysay

He was in a support group and then a program. Through the day program he met the schizophrenic & bi-polar friends. I have not had anything to do w/his family for over a year. He has an unhealthy pull towards his family and continues to visit and speak to his parents. He has put their needs and requests ahead of our family, to the detriment of our 5yo son & me. We went to couples therapy and he was told that his relationship w/his parents was undermining our marriage.
He will never go back to therapy or a support group b/c he thinks he's had enough. Last May, we legally separated, on my request. We are still living together. I've told him I would like him to leave, but I know he has no where to go. I care about what happens to him, yet this arrangement is depressing me. My depression has been well controlled by meds for over a decade. This past year I have been feeling worse and having difficulty functioning.
My husband can't live at his parent's house b/c his 2 other siblings moved back home. Even if there was room, they wouldn't take him in as long as he is on SSD. He doesn't receive enough to rent an apartment and he needs to be close to our son.

Have you checked with your county about disability housing? Where I live it's a 3 year waiting list and it's first-come-first-serve, not needs based. But, once a place is availble it's a price that a person on disability can afford, based on a sliding scale for his income. Yes, life would be harder for him, but if you are truly done with the relationship it would at least give an "end in sight" type of scenario for you so that you don't feel you're stuck with him forever.

[Tsunamisurfer]

Originally Posted by Sometimes psychotic

... I starting to wondering if having people around who care about you is essential to recovery. So what do you think about either your prodrome or now is it that you are being excluded by people or that you actively withdrew from society? That is if you don't have great social relations. I have a hard time believing that anyone actively withdrew because you are all here seeking friendship online.

So many others have hit the nail on the head in response to you, Sometimes psychotic.

I think having caring people around you is a huge advantage to recovery, in my experience, anyway. You spend less time being driven into your shell to avoid painful stigma from others. Having a sense of being loved and therefore being valued gives you something to counter the negative responses you get from other people.

The issue of social exclusion and social withdrawal is a bit of a circular one. I think we naturally withdraw from others when we have a psychotic episode, or if manic, cause people to be cautious of our overbearing and probably grossly self centred manners.
When depressed or suffering from trouble reading social cues, we feel inadequate, and also receive awkward feedback from others. That is often read by us as rejection when it is initially just people subconsciously responding to our lack of involvement. That then spirals into more defensive withdrawal from us, and then into a loss of social connections and lowered social appeal to others. etc.
It can be very difficult for us to break that cycle. For me, having people who understand what we are struggling with, and who actively assist us by including us in social situations has been a tremendous boost toward recovery.

[justmeandmyhead]

I feel that i have been excluded by some people because i can come across as being 'odd', but i think mostly i have withdrawn from everything as it's just too much when there's so much weird crap going on in my world. I think it doesn't help that the world doesn't feel real as it makes you want to be involved in it even less. Just my two cents.

[newtus]

for me i withdrew the more that people excluded me. i still do.

like tsunami said. its a complete spiral down. the further down it goes - it becomes 10x harder to come back up.

[Brosci]

I'm not even sure if i'm schizophrenic or have psychosis but i do know i have depression which is one symptom of both. I'm leaning towards psychosis which can be caused by events. But anyway I began to seperate myself from friends as they began to treat me different as I felt down and depressed. Which intern made me more depressed