sociopathy

ROFL...just sayin'....meow(=

I've read several other threads where Myers has posted. I think he's very aware of his thoughts, feelings and actions and seems to be very good at controlling himself here and IRL(from his posts about his life). So I think Myers really makes the effort to function the best he can IRL, particularly with his family. He realizes his short comings and his advantages.

I don't believe he's given up on coping well in life, just because of his diagnosis - he's not saying his life is hopeless due to being a psychopath. In fact he probably does better than most of us because of less emotional clutter/obstacles. He's doing just fine, so I think we should stop analyzing him.

Woot......mew...~W~

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is like telling a person with major depression to ignore whatever sadness and suicidal thoughts they have and pretend to be happy for the sake of everyone else. Can it work? They can sure try. But, as we all know, without proper treatment, therapy, anti-depressants, etc... a depressed person is still depressed, and that sadness is going to rear its ugly head despite the efforts of the individual to hide it,

But...that's exactly what CBT does for the patient, especially the depressed patient, changing the way one thinks does indeed change the behavior. Going on feelings rather than what one knows logically to be true, coutering the negative thoughts does produce better behavior and better feelings follow.

Now if the disorder means one can't feel feelings, how does that change that they need to do what they know is right, when running on feelings isn't the best thing anyway?

Pegasus is a member of the British Psychological Society and may very well be up on this topic. I, however, tend to avoid sociopaths.

Regarding the amygdala, it has been found to be suspect in a number of disorders including PTSD.

True, for depression... But, to date, there is no therapy that has been proven effective in the treatment of psychopathy, unlike the numerous avenues which can be taken to help treat depression. Most professionals consider us a lost cause and won't even try to treat anymore. You pick up any professionally written, layman's book on psychopathy, and what you'll find is page after page of utter contempt for the psychopathic personality, numerous details of the horrific acts of certain psychopaths, a great emphasis on the concept that us psychopaths cannot be changed or helped - so give up all hope while you still can, and warnings to avoid us at all costs - even how to spot us so you can avoid us better. There is not a single piece of literature that I've come across written for a psychopath on how to cope with psychopathic behavior. There is a proposed treatment that was released just recently by Dr. Bob Hare, and it'll take years for psychologists to even become familiar with it, and it will probably be restricted to forensic units; i.e., prisons. Furthermore, even if this treatment does work, it will only address the violent minority of psychopaths. It will not help those law-abiding psychopaths maintain healthy relationships, control harmful behavior, and learn to be happy, functional members of society.

Now, you might not be a psychopath and probably don't care. But I happen to find this notion very discouraging with respect to seeking help and support. Frankly, I have returned society's contempt for me and my kind.

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Now if the disorder means one can't feel feelings, how does that change that they need to do what they know is right, when running on feelings isn't the best thing anyway?

Try changing an innate part of your personality, such as shyness. It's extremely difficult, no? Psychopaths are innately manipulative. I can see and work angles almost subconsciously. When I talk to someone, I'm constantly reading them and constructing an appropriate "mask" without even thinking. I can't even identify which parts of my personality are real and which are a clever mimic of human emotion anymore. But we have to do this, lest we be shunned by society.

In most cases, there's really no good reason for us to do what we know is right, other than to avoid prison. And, quite frankly, why should we? ... other than to avoid prison. Many psychopaths grow up believing they are the bane of existence, a notion which is constantly reinforced by parental figures, teachers, law enforcement, the media, etc... As a consequence, many psychopaths (myself included) grow up hating virtually everyone, and/or it creates the "us against them" mentality, and we feel rather justified in our "lashing out" at society.

Not to mention you all speak a language I can't even begin to understand: emotions. That just furthers the divide between myself and the rest of humanity.

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Pegasus is a member of the British Psychological Society and may very well be up on this topic. I, however, tend to avoid sociopaths. Regarding the amygdala, it has been found to be suspect in a number of disorders including PTSD.

Pegasus can speak for herself. And I am aware that she is a member of the British Psychological Society. I was wondering what was her specific area of expertise. If she is an expert in psychopathy, I'd love to discuss it with her.

Regarding the brain abnormalities in psychopathy, the amygdala is not the only culprit. fMRI brain scans have also found abnormalities in the prefrontal cortex as well as faults in the wiring which connects these areas of the brain, hence the remarkable lack of ethical judgment, emotions, and ability to identify odors.

I originally came into this thread to show you that change can happen, that there is hope. As the thread went on I saw that I am coming under fire for my views. I'm then goaded to tell you my credentials. This thread is not about me, it's about sociopathy and the view that a psychopath can't change.

I have worked with many, many different types of personality disorders and seen great results with psychotherapy. But like you say Myers, some people still stick to the old view that a psychopath cannot change. This is not true, I've seen cognitive behaviour therapies really work, no it won't change your overall personality but it will help you cope with it. (Behaviour therapies have been around for a real long time.)

The trouble is that many psychopaths end up in prison and they don't receive the therapy therefore they don't change. See?

Now, if you want you can spend your time hating the world and prove that the old view is right. I know psychotherapy works because I've seen it right infront of my eyes.

Psychopathy is much more than a personality disorder. Psychopaths in prison do receive therapy ... and get worse. I have been to therapy, and the therapist either refused to treat me or ended treatment after no progress was shown.

Regarding your studies and profession, it was a simple question.

I'm just saying as a general statement - since the original thread topic is sociopathy and not "Psychopaths Named Myers" - I would say this thread is

I'm unsure that what I posted required a counter.

From the focus of the thread, it appears that most members consider the terms sociopathy and psychopathy to be totally interchangeable.

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The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) notes that there are some differences between sociopaths and psychopaths, but classifies them together as Antisocial Personality Disorder. The International Statistical Classification of Diseases And Related Health Problems (ICD) refers to Dissocial Personality Disorder. Both disorders involve the following characteristics: Failure to conform to social norms, by repeatedly exhibiting behavior that leads to arrest. Decietfulness, conning, and lying for personal pleasure or profit Impulsivity and failure to plan ahead Irratibility and aggressiveness with repeated acts of violence or fighting Reckless disregard for the safety of self or of others Consistent irresponsibility, leading to inability to maintain a job, sustain a work discipline or to uphold financial responsibilities Lack of remorse, manifesting in indifference to or rationalizing having caused the suffering of others, by mistreating, hurting or stealing from them Lykken (1995) uses the congenital aspect of being born with the disorder to distinguish psychopathy from sociopathy. Sociopathy is viewed under this classification as one who is "socialized" into becoming a psychopath, rather than being born with the dysfunction. Stout (2005) extracts the following as being a function of sociopathic personalities. Egocentricity; Callousness; Impulsivity; Conscience defect; Exaggerated sexuality; Excessive boasting; Risk taking; Inability to resist temptation; Antagonistic, deprecating attitude toward the opposite sex; Lack of interest in bonding with a mate. The DSM lists the common psychopathic traits: Glib and superficial charm; Grandiose sense of self-worth; Need for stimulation; Pathological lying; Conning and manipulativeness; Lack of remorse or guilt; Shallow affect; Callousness and lack of empathy; Parasitic lifestyle; Poor behavioral controls; Promiscuous sexual behavior; Early behavior problems; Lack of realistic, long-term goals; Impulsivity; Irresponsibility; Failure to accept responsibility for own actions; Many short-term marital relationships; Juvenile delinquency; Revocation of conditional release; Criminal versatility Another way is to view the two factors of Episodic Aggression as assigned to psychopathy; and Organized Sociopathic Hatred as assigned to the sociopath. The traits indicate very different factors and behaviors between the two disorders. Most noteworthy are the evidence of genetic disorder, biochemical symptoms and psychological impairment, along with more violent and aggressive behaviors that are assigned to psychopaths. Psychopaths have abnormal temperaments while sociopaths may have normal temperaments. Statistically, there are no official DSM or other terms for sociopaths, but most are male, with an increasing number of females. Absence of a father, sexual promiscuity, being born out of wedlock or with divorced parents and other abnormal or problematic socialization factors are the noteworthy factors with sociopaths. Finally, sociopaths may live their whole lives with few of the more devastating outcomes, but may also transition into becoming psychopaths. Sociopaths are not always benign individuals and can have serious elements of being sadistic and harmful towards others. There are explanations from past experience for sociopaths while psychopaths are considered to the the true "monsters" for whom there is no explanation." http://www.helium.com/items/1734051-difference-between-sociopath-and-psychopath "

Another interesting comment: http://www.suite101.com/content/narc...hopathy-a34297

I personally believe that most all can be treated. How difficult that treatment is, how slowly it progresses, and how much the patient cares to improve are all variables. No one needs to be without hope. The approach (mentally) may be different, but the outcome can often result in improvement.

TC

I will be writing an article for this forum on psychopathy addressing these very issues. The debate on psychopathy is very complex, much more so than is implied by the previous post, and it requires its very own thread.

Until then...

Please lock this thread...

I agree Myers. I would like to add, sociopathy and psychopathy have very clear distinctions as stated in this psychcentral link:

http://blogs.psychcentral.com/forens...s-psychopathy/

I'm locking this thread at this point as it has gone way off topic from what the original poster was first discussing. Please remember that PsychCentral is a supportive community, and that all posts should be supportive in nature and should abide by the Community Guidelines.

As well, especially in this forum - it is for those dealing with the disorder themselves, not a place to discuss our issues with others who are dealing with the disorder. If you're having issues with someone dealing with a mental illness or disorder, please post in the Caregivers Support forum or Relationships & Communication or elsewhere. We are trying to have these personality disorder sub-forums as a place of support for those dealing with their own issues.

Thank you for your cooperation!

Christina86
co-administrator