Who's to blame?

So when we get manic, who's to blame?

Say we say something hurtful, was it you or the bipolar?

What if we do something dangerous, who's at fault?

I always find interest asking this question, always good answers. When do you put your hand up and say you messed up or does it continue to be all the disorder?

I think it's a two way street, we can't blame ourselves if mania occurs but we can if we had decided to sneakily stop meds in the first place. Catch my drift? Now where do you stand?

I think it's very important to distinguish yourself from the mental disorder. I'm not proposing that you blame your actions and behaviors on the bipolar, but it's important to remind yourself that during times when you don't make the best decisions, it's not really you as a person saying something hurtful... it's the bipolar clouding your judgment and your decision making skills. It's good to take responsibility for your actions and do the best you can to make up with those people that you hurt or fix the situation you may have caused during the manic episode, but you shouldn't beat yourself up about it. Now, if you choose to stop meds when they were working for you previously, then you would be to blame. It's a very fine line.

I think you're right when you say it's a fine line. Alot of the things we do aren't always in our control and the people around are usually pretty good at figuring out you're not being yourself but after everything has happened we must realise that even though we did not mean it the words came from our mouths and the actions as a result of our clouded judgement

I think that BP really does interfere with our judgement and then there are those manic episodes where we have no control. I've been in that situation and although things may not have happened if I wasn't BP, I still take responsibility to some degree and apologize and explain when needed.

This may sound mean, but bipolar doesn't randomly jerk your tongue and vocal cords to say hurtful things. It's YOU who says it.

Can't sent bills to bipolar (although it'd be awesome).

If it happens first time, it's understandable and apologizable. If it happens over and over and over.... than you are at fault and "bipolar made me do it" will make the situation only worse.

There are ways to stop yourself from acting impusively. It just takes lot of work. Roadblocks. Learning to sleep on big decisions. Learning to recognize your and your impulsive disordered thoughts. Learn to get hold of yourself when going into the danger zone....

Im responsible for anything I do or say while dealing with my Bipolar .. Why ? Because its up to me to do everything I can to avoid hurting anyone.. Has it happened .. sure a few times and I make sure to make ammends..But, I have worked so so hard learning ways to stop myself from causing harm.

I have a huge toolbox of coping skills and know how and when to use them , I have support in real life and also on here with wonderful friends .. I remind myself that I am responsible ! No one goes to bed on a monday nite and wake up tuesday full blown mania.. There are always signs that your not doing " well" Its up to everyone to monitor themselves and reach out for whatever help they need .

I dont blame Bipolar for my actions.

Just my opinions of course

but when all is said and done we are looking out and not seeing ourself as the world does, so your {mine} opinion is not always the truth that "I" think it is......just my opinion

My bipolar can influence, alter, and even determine how I am able to perceive, think, and, at times, act. However, I can do the same. I can influence, alter, and, yes, even determine the severity of my bipolar and thereby the severity of the outcomes of my actions.

I can learn how to be as stable as possible and not accept failure on that account.

I can learn how to moderate my behavior by noting how I've failed to do so in the past.

I can admit when my cognition is impaired and do what I can to exercise caution thereby gaining ever
greater mastery of my impulse control. I must do this for I have no choice but to live with the consequences of my actions. If I allow my bipolar to fully determine my actions I forfeit any right to claim an action was, truly, outside of my control.

I think it very well may depend on the subject and matter.. while I do agree it's your mouth and your tongue.... in a severe manic state I can't control exactly how my mind and mouth want to go to work.. that sounds wrong I know... but when people trigger you and continously trigger you over and over in a short period of time... I lose my wits and go off... it's gotten ten times better but it's not perfect.... I don't understand it.. it's just hard.. I see two therapists as well and this is the stuff we discuss... I did great for 3 months.. but i always end up stumbling. . And unfortunately that's not good enough for some people.... someone

I'm not sure what my view on this is as I've had an "easy" ride of things in terms of mania (but DEFINITELY not with depression - I was almost given ECT) because, until a few days ago, I have only had compulsions that have burned themselves out quickly and led only to embarassment -- either keeping stupid purchases hidden, or having to explain fantastical business plans and goals to bewildered friends and family after I come out of the mania / psychosis.

But lately I've become more and more stuck in this self-centric belief system that has asserted itself in which I have BELIEVED with 100% CERTAINTY that I had some special knowledge or insight that I HAD to share with people. This has happened three times now in the last month and defied all insight and a rational sense of social norms and conventions when it has occurred.

I can directly relate it to a significant spike in stress, and I even saw some of the warning signs after my first episode to tell a trusted friend but they dismissed it as an anomaly as it was largely harmless. The second two were not. The last was particularly bad as it involved me sending a long and angry rant to my partner's mother over her relationship with a prisoner and allowing her daughter to form an emotional bond with him. I CC'd my partner the email because I 100% believed I was doing the right thing by warning of the dangers when nobody else was.

My partner read the email, recognised that it was written in a manic / psychotic state and made sure her mum deleted it without reading it. But she is extremely angry at me for not seeing the warning signs, although I have NEVER done anything hurtful while manic before in the two years I've had bipolar for certain.

This was a huge shock to me as I never imagined I would do something like that and have such a lack of insight, especially as I'm sure a careful writer and normally constantly re-read my emails before I send them. I didn't re-read that one. Not for a second. And I had no thoughts for how it would be received or the consequences.

Now I am feeling like a terrible person because I took my mania so lightly and didn't work hard on recording episodes, noting down the warning signs and building up knowledge so that something like this wouldn't happen. I've had so many weeks when I've felt no compulsions at all and been convinced that I don't have bipolar, never have had it, and if I just concentrate hard the symptoms will disappear forever.

Then I do something incredibly stupid and it hits home like I've been stabbed in the stomach with a sharp knife...

I've been to courses/workshops where they say don't blame others and external situations for how you feel. Take responsibility for yourself, making own choices. But, you can't blame someone for things that are related to their illness and not to do with the person. Don't blame the character of the person who's having difficulty managing life with challenging chronic illness and who receives unhelpful negative responses from others.

Thanks for sharing this. I recently also sent out some very ill-advised emails in which I was CERTAIN I was right and I would set other people straight. I did not have any insight at the time that I was in a manic phase ... Like you I have been beating myself up about this, and I hope this will result in my being more attentive and vigilant about signs that I manic before acting in mania...

Thanks again!

This whole thread was very helpful.

I guess that is what is so valuable about these forums. I remember the first time I talked to someone who had bipolar -- when I barely even knew what it was -- and telling them about saying inappropriate things at times and not understanding it all because the DSM IV says you have to do it consistently for four days (or is it seven), and then that person saying "half the people who come in here are in tears because they say exactly the same thing... but it's called losing your 'social consciousness' ".

And when that person said that to me it was so helpful, but admittedly I had said a few things that were inappropriate (a work colleague made a complaint about one but it was dismissed by my manager at the time) and another colleague actually asked me "are you alright?" when I did no work that day and instead talked non-stop to her.

But this is the first time I've had a full blown manic episode where I've ranted which is why I'm so cut up about it.

Funny though, as soon as I read your words I wanted to say "I hope you can get through it and not beat yourself up too much about it" but I can't say that to myself.

I have a card I carry around that has my no 1 value on it, which is "self-acceptance" so perhaps I should listen to it. But I've always judged myself by different standards to other people -- my mother did it when I was a child and it's stuck...