Does bipolar cause a sufferer to lie ?

I'm bipolar schizoaffective and will tell the truth, and tell someone how it is regardless of my mood state

Okay thank you Valentina

I will look at this interesting article to see why the author knows that people with Borderline Personality disorder lie

I am glad that the author had the honesty to place the disclaimer:

A disclaimer: not all people with BPD or knowingly NPD lie.

Perhaps the title could be misleading, it's a bit of a stererocast:

Why Do Narcissists and Borderlines Lie So Much?j

It makes for an interesting read.

Thank you for sharing.

Let me take another stab at this. I do not think BP causes us to lie. Many here either do not lie or choose not lie anymore in mania. BP mania just makes it easier and maybe even more compelling to lie. Then there is the lying used to cover up what terrible things we did to others during mania. The validity of lying in this way is debatable. This approach may not permit personal accountability.

(I hope this does not stir up any emotions and turmoil here)

Also, it is possible that mania can change the perceptions of the person who is having it, so they may say something that appears to be truth to them, but to other people who are not in mania, it appears to be a lie.

True.

I think any and all people can and do lie.

High 5 Valentina - I totally agree -

I think any and all people can and do lie.

For 17 years I was the manager and later the partner in charge of a real estate agency office dealing with the sale of residential property. I was often described by my peers as the consummate professional ; known for my honesty integrity and fairness. I won Estate Agent of the Year Awards. Despite this, I was always modest.

Briefly I have suffered from depression since 2008, if not earlier.

In 2010 somebody in my workplace found out about an embarassing congenital problem which my wife had experienced. I was subjected to anonymous emails which were threatening and blackmail in nature. I reported it to my senior business partner who said I should report it to the police. However, I thought the repercussions would be too severe and would affect innocent people like the culprit's family (I initially suspected an employee who was the son of my best friend) and also the embarassment of my wife's problem would have been public knowledge and cause ridicule and embarassment for her, myself and my sons.

Therefore I tried to appease my tormentor by ascertaining what the issues were and I even tried to meet what appeared to be demanded of me.*

Anyway, I became more paranoid and very depressed. I went on a sabbatical in 2012 and had a few therapy sessions with a psychiatrist and a psychologist. I was given anti-depressants which gave me awful side effects. I experienced hallucinations and heard voices. In June 2012 I was feeling terrible. Another junior colleague started spreading inaccurate rumours that I had a mental breakdown, would not be returning to the firm and he was taking over my job. I reacted by sending my senior partner an email to which he replied. I misinterpreted his reply and I sent a hastily written, ill-considered response which lost me the support and goodwill of my business partners.

I became suicidal. I had hallucinations. I decided that I must get access to the emails on my office computer and retrieve the emails and have them traced to the culprit and then my partners would see with their own eyes what I had been subjected to. However the senior partner would not allow me near the office ; perhaps because he feared who the culprit might be. I was distraught and suicidal. I emailed the Samaritans and decided the only way to prove the identify of the blackmailer was to gain access to the office by whatever means, but I failed.*

This was totally out of character. I had always been honest in everything i did ; personal and professional, but I had lost touch with reality and my reactions a judgement was totally lacking rational thought.

Regrettably I left the firm after 17 years. I have been suffering depression, remorse, guilt, trauma ever since.

What followed is a longish story which I can forward to you by a separate email if you wish.

I have tried to persuade my former partners ever since 2012 to allow access to my old PC and prove who the source of my problems was. But they are disinterested and I fear its because they cannot afford to lose the person I (and others) suspect.

I had never lied until after sending that fatal email in June 2012, and only because I was suicidal and obsessed in discovering who it was blackmailing me and then took advantage of my mental ill health and ruined my life and that of my family.

I am in continual torment ; partly because I cannot understand what went wrong with me. How I allowed the illness take control affect my thoughts and reactions ; for me to react in totally uncharacteristic ways. Also the torment of not being able to achieve closure by knowing for sure who it was who persecuted me for nearly two years.

Does mental ill health, psychosis, hallucinations cause prople to think irrationally, lose a sense of reality, loss of judgement - in my case doing some things which werr hitherto totally out of character and contrary to my previously high principles and morals ?

Can you help by giving your thoughts please ?

*****

It can for some people. Mania causes low impulse control. It sounds like you lost control of thinking and behaving clearly. You did something that you now feel guilty about.

Your psychiatrist should have explained all this too you if they were a good doctor.

It has been an interesting and varied discussion.*

1) is the answer "it depends if the action is premeditated or on impulse" ?
2) is it different when psychotic ; not in touch with reality, no sense of judgement ?

Ok. Are you a lawyer, judge, lawman or philosopher?

ReallY, what are you getting at? Clearly it isn't about your dilemna. Are you just throw out scenarios for discussion?

No, it is simply a case of asking people who have suffered illness to get thrirvexpetiences rather than rely upon the theories of psychistrists etc who can only imagine what it's like to experience the illnesses. I sm tryinh to fimd answers to why i have actrd totally out of character in the recent past. I am grateful to you and everyone for your views.

Gareth,

Thank you for responding to my message.

You are the victim of blackmail, insidious foul play that cost you your job, your work relationships and your mental stability. That the culprit remain unrecognized and unpunished must multiply your anguish. I am so sorry to hear that you had to endure this ordeal. It sounds tragic and horribly damaging. No one deserves to suffer as you have, especially someone made more vulnerable by mental illness.

Yes.

However, completely independent of mental illness, personality and morality, the stress and desperation of your circumstances could drive someone without any kind of mental disorder to do things completely out of character and contrary to high principles and morals. What happened to you and your family was a punishment right out of the Book of Job. Your disease made the situation more painful and vastly more difficult to negotiate successfully, and worse, has made you question your most fundamental ideas about yourself.

What happened was not your fault. You are obviously a good person who cares deeply about his family and his own morals and behavior. I hope that you can recover from the torment of blaming yourself, as it is terribly wasteful and self-destructive to compound your trauma by attacking yourself. You did the best you could to defend your family and yourself against a criminal assault, and you didn't get the support and understanding you deserved. I hope that you are able to heal from this terrible experience and overcome the doubts you now have about yourself.

Discussing these issues with a therapist better qualified to help you than a concerned stranger informed only by his own disease and pain (that would be me) could be very helpful. I offer my sincere sympathy and whatever consolation my commentary can provide.

Irrational Behavior :: Minnesota Law & Politics

PLEASE LOOK AT THE ABOVE WEB LINK

Reading what happened in the case being discussed is upsetting and seems very unjust. There is a saying "the means justifies the end". However, although the end result of the method may be moral and equitable, the means can be criticised if it is considered immoral.

I think it is very hard to judge anyone who has not been in a similar position themselves.

It is difficult enough for many bipolar sufferers going through mania or anyone suffering psychosis to act rationally, to make appropriate judgments. It must be made all the more worse when being the victim of some form of blackmail (or any offence) to then act rationally.

I assume in your case Gareth Monkton you are looking for the answers as to why you did not act rationally or consistently with your character. The answer may be that "it was the illness and NOT you as a person".

I agree and speak as someone who is medically trained.

As the writer above says "completely independent of mental illness, personality and morality, the stress and desperation of your circumstances could drive someone without any kind of mental disorder to do things completely out of character and contrary to high principles and morals".

"Your disease made the situation more painful and vastly more difficult to negotiate successfully, and worse, has made you question your most fundamental ideas about yourself".

You MUST try to forgive yourself.

You are clearly going through considerable psychological trauma ; torment, guilt, remorse, perhaps bewilderment in not understanding why you acted contrary to previously high-held principles and morals.

Fortunately you are not suffering from a terminal illness but I can appreciate that those suffering from mental health issues seldom get the sympathy and understanding that they so richly deserve.

You Deserve To Be Forgiven, To Be Pardoned, But YOU MUST Also Forgive Yourself.

I know there are Psychiatrists out there who will agree that IT WAS THE ILLNESS that caused you react out of character, and that in the absence of the illness you probably would have acted appropriately at all times. PLEASE forgive yourself or your recovery will become more prolonged.

If you are not currently receiving help from a psychologist or psychiatrist then please do so. Good luck with a speedy and full recovery.

You absolutely positively nailed it.