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#1
Dec 02, 2011, 01:03 PM
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do we choose who we idealize?
i don't think i choose who i idealize, but maybe i do, i mean with the right person, i feel a special connection with them, they understand me, they are full of deep insight, i understand them, i cling to them... they consume my thoughts and share in everything. but do i choose who understands me? no you can't make anyone understand anything. but it is a choice to share so much with someone. i read on someone elses board (not on psych central) that we choose who we idealize and we know we're doing it, and that is why we manipulate and lie to hide what we're doing. i think this person does not have a clue into understanding our disorder. how can they when they aren't one of us. |
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#2
Dec 03, 2011, 03:47 PM
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I think your question brings up a few things...first would be the stigma that we PURPOSEFULLY manipulate and lie to get something we want or "play" mind games. I was recently told that we are just like anyone else in the world in that when we have strong emotional responses because our minds tell us that there is great danger/fear/trouble that we tend to react strongly. Our minds and hearts tell us this a lot more than other people's do. So we react more strongly than most people do and react longer than most others do. This can be mitigated and we can learn to balance our reactions over time and learn to take a step back and evaluate our responses better. We are just trying to find our way the best way we can and until we learn better tools and ways to balance our emotions, I don't think we are "evily" manipulating people, we are just trying to get people to help us or to soothe the raging hurt inside of us. Secondly, your question talks about idealization. I know when I have idealized someone, it has not been intentional, but over time, when I saw that it was not in line with reality, I have been able to put it more in perspective. Also, I have been lucky to have had it happen with people that were well grounded that did not let it go to their head and were able to help me see themselves more clearly. In one case, I even put my T in a glass box in order to keep him at a distance and idealized him to make him less "real" to me so that he would not get close to me. When I was ready, I even told him that I was letting him out. Then came a period of emotional instability where I was far TOO vulnerable. So I can definitely shift like a pendulum. But the more that I am aware of it, the more I can TRY to find a balance and watch for the counter-swings and look for that middle ground. In your other question, I think this is also why it is extremely important for you to look for T's with good professional boundaries. It made it very easy for me to resolve some of my swings when he was always so consistent and caring and professional. That idealization is also what makes us so hot for new relationships and then cold when we realize they are not what we had made them out to be. I've gone the opposite way and refrained from them to avoid it all together which is also NOT healthy. Again, looking for that middle ground all the time. I think that idealization is also what causes some of us to lose ourselves in relationships because we "think" they are so much better than ourselves, and we tend to want to change to be more like them. In reality, they are not...It just that idealization or pedestal we put them on. I hope this answer hasn't been too long. I'm just feeling my way along in this stuff too. I wish you only the best. Wysteria Blue 
__________________
 Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your heart. Who looks outside, Dreams... Who looks inside, Awakens... - Carl Jung |
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#3
Dec 03, 2011, 05:11 PM
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That's a good question. Do we idealize everyone? If no, then there must be a reason why we idealize those we do. I don't think it is choice though. I think it is subconscious. I suspect we idealize those we fear, for example; when we idealize the person, we make them not threatening because our magical thinking says they are safe (based on our idealizing, which is not based on reality).
It's a good question and deserves much thought. |
 Wysteria
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#4
Dec 03, 2011, 10:12 PM
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I tend to idealize one or two people at a time, one person who "gets me" and its based on a mutual indentity, we have to share a lot of common ground. I also will idealize someone who is superior to me, more dominant than I am, someone I consider "togther". (I usually will mirror traits in both these people as well)
I do think I have some say over who I idealize, but not in the sense I go out and look for them. It sort of happens, so some of it is subconsciously, but I don't lie to myself and idelize people who dont fall into the above criteria and obviously not everyone will fit into the criteria. lol. Does that make any sense? |
| Wysteria
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#5
Dec 03, 2011, 11:50 PM
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I always idealize intelligent, strong, most of the time older (but not too old..lol) men. I'm just now realizing how much of my life I have done this...even when I was very young. I hold them up...and if they let me down-my world crashes around me...I can't tolerate it. I don't search out these men-they just come into my life-I have found I can only have one man in that role at a time...right now it's T. I have never idealized a woman...and I don't think I ever will...as a matter of fact I hate weak women who can be manipulated-they enrage me. hmm...now that I'm thinking about all this I feel completely crazy!!! lol ; )
__________________
"Wake me up...when September ends" 
Last edited by delicatefade26; Dec 04, 2011 at 02:03 AM. |
| Wysteria
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#6
Dec 04, 2011, 01:46 AM
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...it's a life risk to get involved...
we are in their heads too much? i might be wrong.. but it sure seems that way... cos all my actions are un-natural and everyone gets confused |
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#7
Dec 04, 2011, 07:12 AM
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I agree, the idealizing does come from being in our heads too much: idealizing is deciding that a person is a certain way based on our own thoughts and not on the reality of that person, so that is certainly in our heads. Being in our heads seems like a safe place to be, when the world seems too frightening. On one level it makes perfect sense to protect ourselves that way! But on another level, it isolates us from the very thing we want: closeness with others and the more comforting safety in that. |
| Wysteria
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#8
Dec 04, 2011, 12:07 PM
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I've been thinking about your response...and felt similarly.. But I have sort of idealized some women especially those that are like old souls or very spiritually centered and wise. Like you I often really don't like women that are easily manipulated or abused or lie a lot, etc. I also remembered how they say that we normally detest in others what we don't like about ourselves, and we can learn about ourselves in that which we don't like about others. I don't like women a lot because I don't understand them very well. I can normally communicate much easier with men because I thought they were normally more direct or blunt. Normally, I too idealize men much more. This isn't a new realization for me, but one I've struggled with for a while. Being that abuse is common to our backgrounds, I didn't know if this might relate to you or others as well. Just kind of thinking out loud and hoping that you or someone else might help me think it through some more.. I hope I'm not hijacking the thread, but it also might lead to who or why we idealize as well...Like Echoes was saying, I don't think it's conscious really, it's just who we are drawn to and maybe who offers safety or comfort as well. I really don't know. Wysteria Blue
__________________
Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your heart. Who looks outside, Dreams... Who looks inside, Awakens... - Carl Jung |
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#9
Dec 04, 2011, 07:07 PM
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Hmm Wysteria...you got me thinking about this a lot now...and I thought I had an answer to this-but back to my analyzing I go-I kinda want to talk to T about it. I will have to get back to this...
what I do know is that my idealization of strong men comes from my childhood experiences...such a strong desire for that safety and comfort and stability...and probably also how I experience women-but I'm still looking into what it all means!!!
__________________
"Wake me up...when September ends"
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#10
Dec 10, 2011, 04:15 PM
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I sure hope you are right.... can it be safe in our heads? is there a way to make it so? does some-one else intervene with their head? can we trust them? I believe in being comforted by others...otherwise I would not bother at all... perhaps this is the same with all people...and I reckon it is... how do we trust anyone?.... I know I have trouble simply because I know how difficult I am... I imagine others are as difficult or most likely more.. therefore it's lonely yep. |
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#11
Dec 10, 2011, 04:42 PM
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This is an old thread. You probably should not post your reply to it, as the original poster is unlikely to see it.|
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