[adam_k]

This has been on my mind recently and I thought this may be the best place to get advice. I don't think I ever learned how to develop healthy releationships. I don't mean romantically, but just everyday releationships, aquintenances, friends and co-workers.

I thought about it recently and I came to the realization that I tend to be the person people around me expect/want me to be. I mean we all show different sides of ourselves to different people, but this has felt like more than that. It evens effects how I feel about some issues and how I think about things. To me that doesn't seem quite right. I feel I should have my own opinion on things and that should be irrevelent to who is around me. We don't always tell the truth or share our opinion, but I feel like my opinion should not be affected by others that are around me.

I have a bad tendancies to keep people at arms length. Sort of very cautious to reveal how I really deal about things and hestitent to make a connection. It isn't alway by choice, sometimes I think I just do this out of habbit or sub-consciously. Maybe I am too pessimistic or maybe I just see the world as a dangerous place. Paranoia possibly. It makes it hard to develop friendships and more than working relationships with people when I do this.

When I do find someone interesting, I want to jump in with both feet so to speak. This works out two ways. They do the same and things are intense and awesome, or they hesitate and I feel, rejected I guess and my feeling turn on them. I completly lose interest in them and go to complete avoidance of them, like they don't exist anymore.

I don't know where I picked up these habbits or why I do this. Maybe it was some emmotional neglect in my early years, I don't know.

How do I learn how to, be more reasonable and less neurotic about this? I know there may be no easy answer for this, or maybe no advice people provide. I would just like to have more meaningful friendships in my life and I seem to be the one who prevents that from happening.

[Big Mama]

Adam, I don't know where we learn this. I do this to. I assume it has to do w/ upbringing as a child. I keep everyone at arms legnth and I keep my true feelings to my self. In a crowd I mingle but don't speak to a lot of people. No one speaks to me either. On the rare occasion that I do hit it off well w/ someone it is more of "eeek sorry I asked" kinda vibe I get from folks.

To answer your Question I have no idea where we get this, or how to change it. Sorry. The above is just what I do. It sounds kinda similar to what you do to. But here it appears neither of us are like that. Very strange indeed.

[SaraSkyblue]

I feel like I have to explain myself to everyone I meet. They don't understand why it's hard for me to go into Walmart, I say "I don't like people." Well that's not enough for them. They don't understand why I act the way I do. How else is there to explain it? I say "I just don't see things the way everyone else does." They ask me why. So everyone I meet I feel like I need to give my whole life story to, but that's not what I want. No one seems to just accept me It's really hard. So I just avoid meeting new people...that doesn't go very well either .-.

[Ithilanar]

I never even thought of this before as a borderline thing, I just always thought it was a social anxiety issue. Very enlightening! I feel the exact same way, I pretend I am someone else with others the entire time in fear of them really seeing me and rejecting all of that. I wear a mask and I always come off as a people pleaser, to strangers at least, where I always agree with their opinions (rather pretend to) and seem overly friendly yet very reserved and quiet. I guess I just think of how I want to be treated as well and often find people rude in general, so I don't want to be that way. I want to come off as friendly. But behind the mask, I feel a lot of resentment and anger towards those that seem to come off as rude or inconsiderate. I can't speak up against them but at home I'll feel overwhelmed by anger. I understand why we burst at times if we're constantly suppressing ourselves and what we feel because we don't know how to show it in a stable, normal way like everyone else.

definitely something from childhood. i suck at making/keeping friends. everyone is at arm's length or further away, except husband. but even he gets pushed away sometimes because i don't want him to think bad of me.

i was raised on a metaphorical island out in the middle of nowhere and wasn't allowed to get out and do things with other kids. no after-school programs because parents told me they wouldn't come pick me up at night and i didn't have anyone to give me a ride home. we lived too far out of town for it anyway. i didn't have anyone to count on, i guess, for a lot of things. so i can't bring myself to trust other people. i'd rather just do it myself. if my own parents don't want to help, why would anyone else, right?

"healthy" relationships require a certain amount of trust. but at the same time, i think i've done okay making friends with the people i work with. granted it took me months to start talking to them about anything other than work when i first started, and i still guard a lot from them, but they share a lot with me and they just accept that i'm a secretive person. people around here don't mind secrets. (which isn't always good but it works out fine for me, lol)

as for how i make friends, i think i posted about it on another thread before, but i don't think it was taken too well. it's just a matter of finding or making common interests. finding out what a person likes and then learning about it so you can make conversation later. a lot of people have interesting interests. you just have to ask questions. people love talking about themselves, so it's not hard once you figure out the right questions.

[littlebitlost]

I had a happy, emotionally secure childhood with my mother. My father was in sporadic contact and never seemed to seek out my attentions, and ths was a sore spot with me for many years. He died suddenly on 09 just as we were starting to make progress, I feel.

I have unhealthy relationships with people, and I think that trying to be what they expect of you, is a good start. At least for me, as I don't really know who the hell I am.

I feel that personally, I am an unworthy person due to things I think, feel or have done, and rarely tell people about.

I really only have a few close friends, who know my history, have seen me behave badly and still loved me for it anyway. That is real friendship. When someone knows the bad sides of you, and still loves you despite it. Getting close to people is hard, because you never know who to really trust. :/

Good luck darling. x

[echo_violet]

i too keep people at arm's length...i feel like i just don't relate to most people.

[Phreak]

@littlebitlost - I understand how you feel but you should never try to mould yourself to somebody elses expectations, it's not healthy and will only work in the short term.

Concentrate on being the best you that you can be. Live up to your own expectations and desires.

Phteak

[The_little_didgee]

I don't know how many times, I have read this thread and thought about it, since I first read it the night before last. Now, I think, I can type out a decent reply.

You are right about the answers to your questions.

Many of your answers can be found through knowing and understanding yourself. Experiences allow for self discovery, as long as we take the time to contemplate those experiences and our emotions. Living in the confines of the majority will deny this, at least that is what it was like for me. I have found accepting myself has allowed me to grow, since effort is put in myself rather than on pleasing and conforming to others.

Once you know yourself well enough, it will be evident in your relationships. People seem to notice, when we have accepted who we are. One lady described it to me as "at peace with yourself".

How do you communicate with others? How is your view about yourself and others. If you are pessimistic about relationships, it will be evident in all your interactions with others and in your body language.

Theory of mind deficits seen in people with Asperger's Syndrome (AS) interfere with relationships, because of the lack of perspective taking. It also interferes with the expression of emotions. Another thing that gets them into trouble is what they think others expect from them. I think this can be applied to BPD.

BPD, like AS, is a developmental disorder. People meet milestones in their emotional development later, than the average person. Trying to conform to the norm, only deprives one's development. It is best to learn about yourself, at your own pace.

[LadyShadow]

Originally Posted by The_little_didgee

I don't know how many times, I have read this thread and thought about it, since I first read it the night before last. Now, I think, I can type out a decent reply.

You are right about the answers to your questions.

Many of your answers can be found through knowing and understanding yourself. Experiences allow for self discovery, as long as we take the time to contemplate those experiences and our emotions. Living in the confines of the majority will deny this, at least that is what it was like for me. I have found accepting myself has allowed me to grow, since effort is put in myself rather than on pleasing and conforming to others.

Once you know yourself well enough, it will be evident in your relationships. People seem to notice, when we have accepted who we are. One lady described it to me as "at peace with yourself".

How do you communicate with others? How is your view about yourself and others. If you are pessimistic about relationships, it will be evident in all your interactions with others and in your body language.

Theory of mind deficits seen in people with Asperger's Syndrome (AS) interfere with relationships, because of the lack of perspective taking. It also interferes with the expression of emotions. Another thing that gets them into trouble is what they think others expect from them. I think this can be applied to BPD.

BPD, like AS, is a developmental disorder. People meet milestones in their emotional development later, than the average person. Trying to conform to the norm, only deprives one's development. It is best to learn about yourself, at your own pace.

This is very insightful and very true. I have an extremely hard time maintaining friendships. Like I lack discipline in my life, I lack the commitment to make to other people, just friends, not romantically. Romantically I tend to smother my partner (when I had one).

I work in extremes, either all or nothing. Life needs balance and that's what I'm working on.

But I do believe it starts with yourself. Making peace and understanding yourself, then you can branch out into other relationships. I have a lot of work to do in that arena, and even though I am taking time to do it, there are times where I feel lonely and lost.

Keep on working with yourself, then the relationships will come and it will just flow naturally, that's how I view it.

Originally Posted by The_little_didgee

I don't know how many times, I have read this thread and thought about it, since I first read it the night before last. Now, I think, I can type out a decent reply.

You are right about the answers to your questions.

Many of your answers can be found through knowing and understanding yourself. Experiences allow for self discovery, as long as we take the time to contemplate those experiences and our emotions. Living in the confines of the majority will deny this, at least that is what it was like for me. I have found accepting myself has allowed me to grow, since effort is put in myself rather than on pleasing and conforming to others.

Once you know yourself well enough, it will be evident in your relationships. People seem to notice, when we have accepted who we are. One lady described it to me as "at peace with yourself".

How do you communicate with others? How is your view about yourself and others. If you are pessimistic about relationships, it will be evident in all your interactions with others and in your body language.

Theory of mind deficits seen in people with Asperger's Syndrome (AS) interfere with relationships, because of the lack of perspective taking. It also interferes with the expression of emotions. Another thing that gets them into trouble is what they think others expect from them. I think this can be applied to BPD.

BPD, like AS, is a developmental disorder. People meet milestones in their emotional development later, than the average person. Trying to conform to the norm, only deprives one's development. It is best to learn about yourself, at your own pace.

Everything you've said about knowing one's self is very good information. I think that one of the most significant things that has helped me has been learning about myself.

I'm curious about two things though. Being one that is actually very likely AS myself I'm wondering if you can clarify your meaning of "theory of mind deficits" What exactly is that referring to? Just curious.

Also can you cite where BPD it's been shown that it is a developmental disorder? I know there are things that are related to developmental issues with bpd people but I'm not sure I'd call it a developmental disorder as a whole. I know that AS is said to be, but I've never seen BPD called this. Not questioning that you've researched this adn found it yourself, I just can't find anything on that aspect of BPD.

Originally Posted by s4ndm4n2006

I'm curious about two things though. Being one that is actually very likely AS myself I'm wondering if you can clarify your meaning of "theory of mind deficits" What exactly is that referring to? Just curious.

ok found this on the internet about AS:

1. Theory of mind deficit: an inability to recognize that other people have thoughts, feelings and intentions that are different to one's own, and an inability to intuitively guess what these might be.

[The_little_didgee]

Originally Posted by s4ndm4n2006

Also can you cite where BPD it's been shown that it is a developmental disorder?

Are you looking for academic papers or other more approachable literature?

Originally Posted by s4ndm4n2006

I know there are things that are related to developmental issues with bpd people but I'm not sure I'd call it a developmental disorder as a whole. I know that AS is said to be, but I've never seen BPD called this. Not questioning that you've researched this and found it yourself, I just can't find anything on that aspect of BPD.

Not every clinician considers BPD a developmental disorder. I have only seen this in academic papers, where it is used to refer to the development of BPD.

I have heard professionals use developmental disorder to refer to emotional development. Perhaps, adding the word psychosocial to it would be more useful.

There is a average age range at which people meet emotional milestones. Like AS, people with BPD seem to meet these milestones later. Of course the two disorders have very different causes, but superficially they are similar in this way.

Originally Posted by The_little_didgee

Are you looking for academic papers or other more approachable literature?


Not every clinician considers BPD a developmental disorder. I have only seen this in academic papers, where it is used to refer to the development of BPD.

I have heard professionals use developmental disorder to refer to emotional development. Perhaps, adding the word psychosocial to it would be more useful.

There is a average age range at which people meet emotional milestones. Like AS, people with BPD seem to meet these milestones later. Of course the two disorders have very different causes, but superficially they are similar in this way.

I have noted myself the similarties between the two. Having also a son with very clear AS, I can see the traits that do differentiate it from bpd but the similarities are apparent.

As for the citations I was just curious as I had not heard it referred to that way before - would be interesting to read. I dont' find academic papers interesting though.

[littlebitlost]

@Phreak - Thankyou, I understand where you are coming from, however, as a person feeling unable to relate to anyone, and am often unsure how to behave, to simply conform mainly to what seems to be expected of me and my behaviour is just an easy way to kinda fit in, IYKWIM.

By NO stretch of the imagination, the people close to me know my opinions, feelings and thoughts, and I am very much my own person. I voice my opinions with others also, but for small talk, which I am CRAP at, I just try and say roughly what is expected of me since they lead it and I follow. I have no trouble standing up for myself and my beliefs if challenged or questioned. I'm no meek little girl in the corner generally speaking. But with others I don't know/understand, I just fill the expected gaps and try to be polite, tactful(hard for ME) and caring.

What does IYKWIM mean?

[The_little_didgee]

Originally Posted by s4ndm4n2006

What does IYKWIM mean?

According to internetslang.com, it means: If You Know What I Mean.

Originally Posted by The_little_didgee

According to internetslang.com, it means: If You Know What I Mean.

Ah interesting. Not one I've seen I guess i should RTFM or STFU hahahahhaa