[cab0ad]

Hi. I'm new here but not new to dealing with depression. My son, now 14, has been dealing with depression since he was in the 2nd grade on and off. Now as an 8th grader he is struggling so severely that I feel like the entire family is spiralling out of control. His psychiatrist for the last 3 years claims he's in a "severe deep depression" that he is now on 2 antidepressents for. Major doses of them too. Still he is depressed. he has a history of self harming that I thought was under control but I think has come back in the last week. In elementary school he was depressed and anxious all the time but he was still able to live a somewhat normal life. He went on vacations happily, went to family dinners and get togethers, had a lot of friends at school (none close friends but people thought he was likeable and stood up for him if he was being bullied). Once he hit middle school our lives spiraled out of control with his depression. It started out mildly but has now taken over our whole lives. he started out by wanting to stay home from going out for dinners or movies with us. No big deal, we thought. He was a teenager now and wanted some privacy and time alone. We noticed he learned about the birds and the bees and he started seeking out stimulation on the internet (pictures/videos). my husband had a talk with him about how those feelings were normal but how he didn't feel the videos he was choosing to watch were totally appropriate. Then my son isolated himself more and more. Over the last 3 years (even with counseling and psychiatric care) he has now turned into a teen who rarely leaves the house for anything. He refuses to go out to family get togethers, or eat at restraunts with us. The last 3 family vacations we went on with him were disasters. He refused to leave the hotel rooms, opting to stay in and surf porn (we found out later) rather than go out to enjoy activities with us. When we force him to accompany us somewhere he acts out like an angry baby. He acts paranoid glaring at people or constantly looks at his watch. Last week we forced him to go to his nephews birthday party and he got so mad at us that he went, went outside to the backyard, and put himself to sleep in a chair for the whole party! It is so embarrasing taking him places because of the way he acts out that sometimes we just give in and let him stay home. I know that is probably making the problem worse but sometimes I feel so trapped that I need to get away from him to just keep my sanity. I feel sorry for my daughter, who just turned 7. She does not understand why her brother acts this way. She has grown to accept that he does not like her or anyone really in life since he is always so grouchy. She never expects him to spend time with us or anyone else. She is genuinly surprised when he even comes out of his room to watch a show with us anymore. I feel like such a failure. I have gotten an appointment with a new psychiatrist that is not until May. I feel like the psychiatrist he sees now keeps telling me that he is majorly depressed and that the meds he has prescribed are what he needs, but nothing ever changes. he's never happy. Something has to change. I am so scared for his future. He only has 1 friend that I'm aware of. He has a reputation of being angry, depressed, and wierd. Even our family members who used to spend time playing games with him as a child now see him and sometimes talk about how negative he is and how he is a party pooper that noone wants to be around. I don't have a support system. My mom and dad care much more about their travels and themselves than my family. my husband is enstranged from much of his family. we are utterly alone. the walls are closing in and I feel like a prisoner in my home. I spend most days trying to shelter my daughter from my son's mood changes. Either my husband or I take her on a vacation every summer (we try to coax our son to go but he refuses and we know what it is like when we force him...EVERYONE has a bad time then). We are even afraid to have our daughter have friends over. What if he is having a bad day (and most are bad days) and her opportunities for friends coming over get lesser and lesser? Like it or not we are all judged by his actions and attitude.

He does not care about his grades but we have always told him "C"s and above or no wifi. Well, he has an "F" in math and has not had wifi for a month now. at first it hurt him but he is used to it now and he does not even care enough to try to get his grade up. We took his phone away because I checked his messages and he was texting kids inappropriatly (cussing out a boy because he was dating a girl that my son likes. lying about ridiculous things like buying expensive jewelry and limo rides for the formal dance for this girl and claiming he's lost all of this nonrefundable money now that she is going out with this other boy. The girl in question does not like my son. He has asked her several times the past few years to date and she always says no. It is almost like stalking. very scary!) So no phone and no internet. I would think that without his only source of interaction (internet) he would try to get his grades up. Nope. He just simply does not care.

I am at the end of my rope. I feel like such a failure. I feel alone. I feel desperate for change. I feel like a prisoner in my own home. I am a good person. My husband is a good person. My daughter is a good person. yet we are all being judged by our community and family in response to my son's uncontrolled depression and eternal moodiness. I need some hope. I need something to hold onto.

[Sophie0126]

Is there a support group for parents/families with a severely depressed child? Perhaps they could be helpful to you since you mentioned you don't have a support system. Sounds like the 3 of you (other than your son), need some help as well. I can't imagine the level of stress and pressure you are feeling.
You are a good person.
I pray that some relief will come to your family soon.

[yumi]

Your son is blessed to have parents who are helping him get help from an early age.
I was not lucky with that blessing. Nobody did a thing to help me. I don't understand that it likely would have made a difference.
I would find a support group for parents. I think that would really help you.
Stay strong and don't give up on your baby. You are making more of a difference than you realize.

First off, I am so sorry that this has happened to you but I would also like to mention that a lot of his behavior is definitely not particularly a symptom of depression but being a brat and incredibly inappropriate. Even at my worst state of depression I would never harass anyone and I would very rarely even have the energy to get angry. It seems like you're taking a lot of steps to try and instill some sort of social functioning and discipline in his life but unfortunately it doesn't seem to be working. The above people are correct in how lovely you guys are to try so hard and you most definitely need to look for more support. Support groups are a great idea but I would also suggest talking to friends, family, and even some teachers. Great ideas can come from unexpected places

And last but not least, it's also important to realize that even though you all want to help so much, sometimes you can't. You aren't the right person or it's just not the right time, whatever the reason, a lot of the time, family can't fix the problem for a person. It comes from the outside. Through experiencing the world in a different way and then feeling the change in yourself. I would actually suggest sending him to a camp of some sort? Get him out of his normal environment and it gives everyone, including him, a break from stressors. Send him to a home stay in a different country or let him live with relatives. Something that forces him to stay busy and moving with a firm hand and a gentle heart. Maybe he can be a farm hand for a while? A lot of the time when you are forced to open your eyes, that is the only way to realize your eyes were closed in the first place.

I can tell you all really care for him and that's so great. Don't loose hope, there are still many ways to help him

[Altered Moment]

I really feel for you. Often our depressions are much harder on those that love us then on ourselves. I agree you need to find support for yourselves. I think there is a section in this forum for care givers. Also read a lot of posts in this depression section to get a better understanding of it. We have teenagers who post in here.

Depression is a very debilitating and serious disease. I am 50. When I am in a severe depression I can barely get out of bed. When it is at it's worst I am suicidal, I can sleep 16 hours a day and I don't care about anything. I don't shower for long periods. I don't want to see anyone. I will not leave the house. Even when things are somewhat better and I am up and about the house and eating better and not sleeping so much I still will not leave the house. I have a very loving and close family but I will not go to any family events. I have had it since 7th grade. Started getting treated for it when I was 32. I cycle in and out of them. They vary in length and severity. You could take my computer and phone and I wouldn't care. I don't care about living why would I care about that. With me I snap out of them like a switch went off.

What he needs is very good treatment. Not to be sent off to some boot camp. If the meds are not working try different meds. Some of us go through many meds and combinations of meds to find something that works. The sad truth is for some there are no meds that work. It is tough for a psychiatrist to put a teenager on meds. Find a psychiatrist who works with teens and will try new things until something works.

Then there is therapy. Someone who can work with him on social skills, dealing with that anger, cognitive behavior therapy, finding something he cares about he can latch onto.

The normal rules of parenting kind of go out the window. I managed with the help of drugs and alcohol to do good in high school and play sports and such. After that I hit a deep depression and didn't car at all about my college classes or grades. My parents tried all the normal tactics. Nothing worked. They had no idea how depressed I was or that I had become an alcoholic.

I am sorry for going on so long and being blunt but your post struck a chord in me. I very much wish I had been diagnosed in 7th grade when it all started. Maybe things would be much different for me. I don't know. It is a complex disease. We didn't really have a clue in the late 70's.

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[Rohag]

Hello & Welcome, Cab0ad. I regret the severe strains your son's illness imposes on your family.

Originally Posted by zinco14532323

The normal rules of parenting kind of go out the window.

How true this is! Your son is not a simple "troubled teen"; he's a person with a highly disruptive illness.

Please feel free to ignore the question: When your son was playing online games, which did he play the most?

For reference: Partners of People & Caregivers Support Forum

[ImNotHere]

Originally Posted by keeprolling

First off, I am so sorry that this has happened to you but I would also like to mention that a lot of his behavior is definitely not particularly a symptom of depression but being a brat and incredibly inappropriate. Even at my worst state of depression I would never harass anyone and I would very rarely even have the energy to get angry. It seems like you're taking a lot of steps to try and instill some sort of social functioning and discipline in his life but unfortunately it doesn't seem to be working. The above people are correct in how lovely you guys are to try so hard and you most definitely need to look for more support. Support groups are a great idea but I would also suggest talking to friends, family, and even some teachers. Great ideas can come from unexpected places

And last but not least, it's also important to realize that even though you all want to help so much, sometimes you can't. You aren't the right person or it's just not the right time, whatever the reason, a lot of the time, family can't fix the problem for a person. It comes from the outside. Through experiencing the world in a different way and then feeling the change in yourself. I would actually suggest sending him to a camp of some sort? Get him out of his normal environment and it gives everyone, including him, a break from stressors. Send him to a home stay in a different country or let him live with relatives. Something that forces him to stay busy and moving with a firm hand and a gentle heart. Maybe he can be a farm hand for a while? A lot of the time when you are forced to open your eyes, that is the only way to realize your eyes were closed in the first place.

I can tell you all really care for him and that's so great. Don't loose hope, there are still many ways to help him

When I was depressed I got angry all the time and I often lashed out as a teen at the people who cared about me at the most, you could label me as a "brat" but you would be incredibly wrong. I would say that is an incredibly ignorant thing to say about someone dealing with a serious mental illness. I did not need discipline, believe me that was the last thing I needed. I wanted to die every day, I needed help, not punishment. Sending him away seems a bit harsh, like he needs to be fixed, when in reality the entire family needs to work together to do this. Don't give up on him, my parents never gave up on me and now we have an amazing relationship. Believe me if you send him away to be 'fixed" he will resent you more in the future, your whole family needs help, not just him. He is going through something and needs a serious amount of help. Above posters are right, normal parenting tactics wont work, normal punishments/parenting wont work for someone who is depressed, normal expectations well you can get rid of those right now, you have to understand this is not a "normal" teen so throw that vocab word out the window and realize that this is your one and only son and start loving him for him, which I know can be frustrating but this is your child you have no right to give up on him.

Whatever you do, please do not take the above posters advice and send him away, that is the dumbest thing in the world. You do not send a troubled depressed child away to be "fixed" and then expect him to come back and your life be all better, that is not how families work. No, you all work together, everyone gets help together to create a healthier life. He needs to receive treatment, if you are all feeling this bad can you imagine how he is feeling inside? Can you imagine what he is feeling on a daily basis?

My honest suggestion? A complete psychological evaluation. Which can cost a lot of money, but well worth it in the end, a second opinion by one or more psychiatrists, perhaps new medications that can help, family therapy, more intense therapy, stop pushing him to do things he is not ready for. His therapist should have given him coping skills for cutting and social situations. If he has been with the same therapists for 3 years and still seems to be getting no where well it is time for someone new.

You throw are words like grouchy and party pooper, believe me when your heading for much worse if you don't start becoming more understanding of the pain your child if feeling. Have you lost your empathy for him? I get that over time it wears you down but you absolutely cannot lose this because he is on a downward spiral and your his mom, you need to catch him because you are all he has.

[Altered Moment]

I know how you must be very frustrated. ImNotHere is giving you the hard reality. I am sure you want nothing more than to have a happy, healthy, "normal" family. My Mom drove herself nuts trying to deal with my brother and I in our teenage years. She was at her wits end many times. I remember her saying "We are going to have a happy normal family if it kills me."

Depression is a very difficult disease for people to understand and deal with. If you have never had a real serious clinical depression then you have no idea. I would say educate your self as much as possible about the disease. Read a bunch of threads in this forum for a better understanding of what it is like for us. Research the genetic and biological causes of depression. Utilize all the resources you can find for support for you and all your family.

It is hard to accept, hard to deal with and it is not fair. It may be embarassing. I agree. But life is not fair. You will have to accept it and fight for the help your son needs and your family needs. You will have to fight the embarassment and the stigma that goes with it. It is a process.

It is going to take a lot of patience, persistance, and compassion. He can and will get better.

My parents kids are all adults in our 40's and 50's with kids of our own. Our family has been through hell and back with alcoholism, addiction, depression, attempted suicides, etc. etc. I just spent two days with all of them. We have never been closer and healthier as a family ever. We all had to individually do alot of work over the years.

Originally Posted by ImNotHere

When I was depressed I got angry all the time and I often lashed out as a teen at the people who cared about me at the most, you could label me as a "brat" but you would be incredibly wrong. I would say that is an incredibly ignorant thing to say about someone dealing with a serious mental illness. I did not need discipline, believe me that was the last thing I needed. I wanted to die every day, I needed help, not punishment. Sending him away seems a bit harsh, like he needs to be fixed, when in reality the entire family needs to work together to do this. Don't give up on him, my parents never gave up on me and now we have an amazing relationship. Believe me if you send him away to be 'fixed" he will resent you more in the future, your whole family needs help, not just him. He is going through something and needs a serious amount of help. Above posters are right, normal parenting tactics wont work, normal punishments/parenting wont work for someone who is depressed, normal expectations well you can get rid of those right now, you have to understand this is not a "normal" teen so throw that vocab word out the window and realize that this is your one and only son and start loving him for him, which I know can be frustrating but this is your child you have no right to give up on him.

Whatever you do, please do not take the above posters advice and send him away, that is the dumbest thing in the world. You do not send a troubled depressed child away to be "fixed" and then expect him to come back and your life be all better, that is not how families work. No, you all work together, everyone gets help together to create a healthier life. He needs to receive treatment, if you are all feeling this bad can you imagine how he is feeling inside? Can you imagine what he is feeling on a daily basis?

My honest suggestion? A complete psychological evaluation. Which can cost a lot of money, but well worth it in the end, a second opinion by one or more psychiatrists, perhaps new medications that can help, family therapy, more intense therapy, stop pushing him to do things he is not ready for. His therapist should have given him coping skills for cutting and social situations. If he has been with the same therapists for 3 years and still seems to be getting no where well it is time for someone new.

You throw are words like grouchy and party pooper, believe me when your heading for much worse if you don't start becoming more understanding of the pain your child if feeling. Have you lost your empathy for him? I get that over time it wears you down but you absolutely cannot lose this because he is on a downward spiral and your his mom, you need to catch him because you are all he has.

Okay so obviously my words didn't seem to come out right in my post before so I am very sorry about that. But I also speak from my own personal experience about movement and depression so I don't appreciate being called ignorant. Of course depression affects us all in different ways but before you continue to say I'm obviously stupid about this sort of issue I'm going to share a little bit more about me and hopefully this will make what I was trying to say clearer.

When I was in junior high I literally felt like chewed gum stuck to the bottom of someone's shoe. I hated myself, I hated my friends, and a lot of the time I hated my parents and the rest of my family. Sure, I lashed out verbally and embarrassed my family in plenty of situations but I was also still bound in place by the basic rules my family had set before. Because I knew if I didn't comply with the basics I would receive hell for it. It was a guilt trip up situation because even if I didn't feel like going anywhere, if I didn't, neither would they and instead of being harassed and misunderstood, I would drag my feet to every event I was forced to go to. My situation was very precarious but the enforced rules at least kept me moving. Discipline and love went hand in hand when I was growing up and even though I hated it at the time it kept me from drowning out for quite a while. If I had the audacity to kick and scream harder than I did I would have been beaten within one inch of my life. And in a way it was good for me. I learned manners, how to deal with people even when I hate them, how to control my outward emotions until no one could tell anything was wrong. But in a way it was also setting me up for failure later on (but that is for another time).

But you know what really saved me? Going abroad. I got a chance to travel with a group of other students without any of my family around. It was a growing experience in a way that I can't really explain because it differs between everyone but it taught me about different cultures, different types of people, and most importantly, what it's like to be alone with people you don't really know well. When you're not with people you trust and who love you, the world is a very different place as I'm sure you're aware. It cleared my head in ways you can't even imagine and I came home much more... settled? I don't know how to describe it. But regardless it did help me and I was hoping that a basic structure and a break from the norm would be a good idea (at least it was for me). But I think the most important thing I want to emphasize is the fact that, while my parents helped fix the problem, they were definitely a bigger part of the problem and to start the healing and growing up process I needed to start fresh. It gave me a different outlook on life. It showed me what the future might look like. Depression is an angry curse that dissolves you from the inside out and the worst thing for me is to let it idle. The more things I have to do, the less time I have to hate myself alone in my room listening to angsty music with thoughts of cutting and suicide in my head. And eventually, with such a huge list of things you've done, you start to value yourself in other ways. For me keeping busy, especially when I didn't want to do anything except wait for death, being forced to go to things and experience it anyway was the best thing. And that holds true even now. Your family cannot always fix you. The people that love you cannot always fix you. And in growing in new and different ways I have really learned the value of breaks away from people and environments that have a lot of negative emotions attached (even if there is a lot of positive).

I'm not telling them to send him to bootcamp--in fact that is a terrible idea. What I was aiming more for was a summer camp where there are lots of people and a set schedule. Perhaps something he was/is particularly interested in. Music camps are always cool and drama camps are great too. Of course, it would probably be good to just get him to go to a depression support group for kids his age as well. Anywhere that can keep him actively engaged in a positive way is great. And what I meant by the farm hand thing was more about exercise--sorry if that came across the wrong way (I've always wanted to try helping out on a farm which is why it ended up being mentioned). And of course it won't fix him, because in the end it's he himself that needs to grow but it doesn't look like home is working either and now everyone has ended up stressed out. Fixing him isn't the issue--there isn't anything crazy wrong with him (asides from the potential stalking of a girl), but he's in a mental rut and sometimes a change of view and pace can help.

Staying at home isn't a bad thing but I was just giving them an option. And believe me, if she's posting on this forum this mother definitely cares for her son but she's so emotionally drained from trying and failing and trying and failing it's even bringing down her own self-worth. This lady is trying her best and is at her wits end because I don't know about you but the worst thing for a mother is watching her kid suffer and not being able to help/not knowing how to help. She may be able to catch him from falling but she may not be the one to lift him up in the end.

And also, how dare you say that she has no right to give up on him. People are people. My father gave up on my entire family. My uncle had his kids backstab him and leave with their mother. My friend's mom doesn't even talk to her daughter anymore because she didn't agree with who she married. There are plenty of families, including mine, who have been broken due to lesser things because it is their choice in the end and instead of pushing her upward with encouragement to support him you are tearing her down by showing her that she doesn't care enough to what? be able to fix him? It's like a slap in the face. Just because people need a break doesn't mean they're giving up. It's the same with depression. Just because I'm exhausted and can barely leave my room on some days after 3pm does not mean I'm giving up.

I am not trying to invalidate your experiences with depression because everyone is different and their family situations are as well but I was just trying to bring a my viewpoint to the table. Which isn't dumb at all.

[ImNotHere]

That may have worked for you but for most kids who are depressed the last thing I would recommend would be to send them to some camp or to some foreign country, it just will not work. They need medical care, therapy, and their family is usually a huge contributing factor to their depression and also needs to be included in family therapy. They don't need harsh discipline, rather the opposite, they don't need typical discipline, rather something worked out between the family, the therapist, and the child.

Parents should never give up on a child. Ever, especially when they are under the age of 18. They have no right. That should not even be considered an option. Oh I get being exhausted and having the feeling of wanting to give up, but actually giving up, well that should never happen.

A lot of the times in situations like these families try to focus on fixing the bad depressed child in the family when truthfully the entire family could use some work, and there is nothing wrong with suggesting the mother become more educated on depression or getting her child psychologically evaluated, getting second or third opinions by psychologists, new medications, family therapy, new therapists, new medications, a better understanding, more empathy, instead of referring to her severely mentally ill depressed child as a grouchy party pooper who is clearly headed for much worse in the future. I would rather the mother do the things I suggest than do what you said which were to send the child to camp (when the child is clearly uncomfortable in social situations, you don't force kids like this into these things) or to use harsh discipline on depressed kids like this.

[yumi]

I , too have to agree that punishment won't be the answer, not for mental illness. It needs to be treated properly or it is just going to make things worse and even more out of control. I really hope your son will be OK and for you all as well.

[Altered Moment]

My nephew at 16 went to an alcohol/addiction treatment center in the high Colorado Rockies. It was all outdoors. He has been clean and sober ever since.

I went to an alcohol/addiction treatment center in the Santa Cruz Mountains. It was beautiful. It was the best thing for me to get away. I have been clean and sober ever since.

These were treatment centers though. Not summer camp.

Maybe a depression treatment center is a good idea. Expensive, but maybe a good idea. There are not that many of them but they do exist.