[littlethistle]

So when I talked more about Jo and Odd she said that sounds like dissociation. I'm not even sure I understand what dissociation is. They have been my friends through life. I know they are pretend and not real. I'm not crazy. I'm not sure why I have to have something wrong with me part from being a very immature adult with imaginary friends.

I feel like I should have never told her. Odd is very mad because I told. Jo says it is allright. What made her pay attention was that I said sometimes they use my body to do things. What does it even matter since I know they are pretend and if they are pretend their thoughs really come from me. If I know this how can I be dissociated?

Jostein started to exist when I was really young and was left alone much too long for my age.

[Luce]

Dissociation in itself doesn't mean that something is wrong. It only becomes a disorder when it interferes with life to an extent that causes suffering. People can have full on dissociation with alters that take over and not be considered to have a 'disorder'. So even if your people-friends really were true alters, you wouldn't necessarily have anything 'wrong' with you.

[elevatedsoul]

Dissociation is weird...

Why is Odd mad about you talking about them? does he/she not trust the therapist?

[littlethistle]

It's his nature. Ever seen those dark Kermit memes? He is like that. If me or Jostein say lets go for a walk he would say things like yes lets go but lets go scare the sheep or lets go out and burn something down or equally stupid. I think he says no just because he can. And is mad because he is anti people anti therapy. And yes he gets on my nerves and if it wasn't for Jo who can like us both I would have tried to evict him long ago. Jo claims Odd is needed as much as himself which I don't understand. But I also really trust Jo because he has access to parts of my mind that I can't reach myself. Those parts which have wisdom and reason. Odd if you wonder is a normal name here and he got that name before I learned any English so he is not named Odd for being odd.

[littlethistle]

I had another chat with therapist. I'm getting a little pressured because I almost went all the times I can go. Then I can apply for 8 more sessions. Then it is over. But after last time even if I mostly talked about other things Odd got madder and said he heard me say I wanted to get rid of him so he brought a wolf. He says it is his friend. So now my pretend friend got a pretend friend. Made me so frustrated I told them both to leave. He wanted back but I did not let him. Just me and Jo now. Therapist says part of me lives in Jo because my mind created him to keep me company. Sounds like a good explanation to me because it really feels like he took part of me to come into being. Is is strange to think about if my mum had gotten a babysitter instead of leaving me alone all the time she worked for 4 years then he would not be. I do not sweat it much she calls it dissociation. It is just a name.

[elevatedsoul]

why you can only apply for 8 more?
i dont know much about places outside the usa...

[littlethistle]

Therapy is goal oriented here. So it shouldn't take years. And it is paid by the state and they do not have unlimited therapists. Other people stand in line also to get therapy. I got in almost at once because cancellations but usually you wait years for therapy. Most people cannot have therapy so they ate told no. I was already given more than most. If I want more I need a private therapist and they cost too much. I cannot afford that. It is for the rich. Psychiatry here is mostly medication and I do not take medicine. So after a while I have no help but if I can make the most of the sessions I should be OK when they are over.

[littlethistle]

My therapy goal is to grow up and take responsibility. To look for jobs. To practice adult skills. So my therapist is nice to even let me talk about this. She said we are not meant to speak about childhood. Just what to do here and now. But she says I must learn where my reactions come from so she makes exceptions. She is friendly. I did not expect that because the woman who decided if I was worth therapy was so rude.

[littlethistle]

I had the last session quite a bit ago now. I was in bored and aloof mode then and had been for a long time. Almost as I stepped out of the office the happy childlike me took over. I do not prefer one over the other because when I am inside the ego state it always feels like the real me. But this time was different it was a relief to change. It is like I do not have all those responsibilities anymore. First thing I did was go play on the ice. The bored aloof mode was gone.

I am not sure what happens now. I went to therapy and none of my ego states became more responsible and adult. I think I tried. I had homework and did it all. I am unsure what my next move should be. Right now I just want to play in the snow.

Jo is sort of fading in and out of me like some kind of ghost. He cannot be seen because he is pretend but it is like he became more transparent. Odd is gone. I think it has been months. I do not want to call on him but also I feel even if I did he would not come. Jostein helped me cook a proper meal yesterday and I have leftovers. That is really nice. Part from therapy homework I ate instant noodles the most and fruit.

I have nothing to say because nothing is happening. But I am still reading hete sometimes.

Hi littlethistle....welcome to PC!

It took me awhile to figure out that the Others actually had their own thing going on....because their thoughts are not anything that I'm intentionally thinking about. Alters (if they be alters) don't just go away...they go silent.

The taking over the body for their personal use is kind of the biggest clue to me about alters because everyone looks at me weird when I tell them that because evidently singletons don't experience such things.

As far as working.....most everyone in our system understands the importance of working because it keeps us safe, housed, and fed. Our workers go to work doing whatever and the house mates do the home life.

Not being able to hold a job would then lend to this being a disorder because it's holding you back from a quality of living of self-sufficiency. I guess it can be considered a limitation to us because we can work....after all that's what is important to society is can you work...not draw or paint, read books.....can you work. I learned that one when denied for disability.

Anyways....I hope things get better for you, please tell us more.

[littlethistle]

Thank you kindly. Maybe I just barged in? It feels like that now.
Sorry. I don't post much but there are snippets from my life in other
parts of the forum if anyone is wondering. I have 17 posts here it is
more than anywhere else I think. I do not stay often. Surprised I am
still here.

I feel like the long version of everything is coming up. I'm not sure
what is important. It is new to me I look and wow people know so much
about their psychological states and for me that vocabulary has just
started to mean something to me. At first I did not like it at all.
Because I think nothing should box me in and I should be free. One
word can never describe me. I was thinking a diagnosis of any kind
will just push me into a slot and I can make better slots, if any at
all are needed. My middle name is Freedom.

But things get complicated. I am not used to talk to others about
anything and just putting myself in a situation where feedback is
possible is really strange to me. But I realize if I am going to
communicate maybe I need some kind of common language, also there is a
part of me that is dead curious of things like diagnoses but I try to
not feel that.

I was almost forced to be diagnosed. See I live in assisted living and
they give me welfare money to stay afloat. At first I did not even pay
them, yes irresponsible and defiant, so they gave me an assistant that
gives the papers to welfare that they need and he pays the rent or
what to call it, and then he ditches out pocket money on my bank
account. In the beginning he talked to them and said I cannot work
right now and they were OK with that. But after a while they wanted me
either apply for jobs or go to a doctor to get a paper of why I cannot
work.

I almost told my therapist that I can just pretend I look for work and
fake applications the welfare office will never check. Actually I did
that for a while. But then she made it my homework I think she was
suspicious to actually get the doctor's notice instead. Because she
said that I cannot work now I am allowed money just I get this paper,
I can work on working in the future. Because it is hard to get
appointments it was very formal and just fishing for information and
also he had read the therapist's files they are in the same system so
it is allowed. Based on that he wrote the reason of my sick leave.

I thought I will just give this paper to the guy that will give it to
welfare without looking. But I got too curious and at the beginning
there was a long line describing why I cannot work and most I think is
correct. There was also a short line for diagnoses. Here is what it
says:

(F60.1) Schizoid personality disorder
(F60.8) Immature personality disorder
(F90.0) Strong suspicion of Attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder
(F44.9) Some suspicion of Dissociative disorder, unspecified

Firstly I did not expect to be slammed with four things. But he hinted
to me that the more the better but to my knowledge any doctor's notice
will be accepted by welfare. But it makes me feel that I should not
take the number so seriously. Of course I went to read up on them at
once. Schizoid I think describes only part of me but that is OK,
Immature personality disorder does not even exist on the list so I
don't know what it is, doctor was old so maybe it was something they
used to diagnose more with in the past. ADHD I just cannot see but I
am glad he saw my impulsiveness and lack of morals not as being
antisocial. For the dissociation I was surprised he even bothered to
put it in.

When I heard the word alters in my thread I was going to say no I have
none. Jo is my childhood pretend friend that I grew up with. Then I
thought maybe an alter does not need to be you, or in your head. Jo is
almost always outside just like another person would be. Even if I
can't see him he has a physical body and he sits on the floor right
now. I could tell you what he says but I myself could never be him. I
am always me. I know he is my imagination but in a way he is like a
real person. It is hard to explain. I know this is not DID but I
understand it might be some form of dissociation. So no alters, but
something out of the norm. The reason I think he is part of
dissociation is that he knows some things I do not. He knows how to
make pancakes, I don't know that. For example. He does not have other
memories than I do I think, but he has other knowledge.

But when I think of it I think the reason for the suspicion of
dissociation more comes from things I told my therapist that I thought
were quirky but normal. I did not know it is unusual to have different
versions of yourself. My two are very different from each other. I
thought it is not anything with a name because I never lose time, I am
always present, it is not I who change but my set of traits. I did not
think that was a big deal but seems like it was kind of.

Right now I am just longing for summer. It is so cold out and there is
not much to do outside in the town. I hope that if I ever grow up I
will still be dancing in the fields when spring comes.

[littlethistle]

Originally Posted by littlethistle

(F60.1) Schizoid personality disorder
(F60.8) Immature personality disorder
(F90.0) Strong suspicion of Attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder
(F44.9) Some suspicion of Dissociative disorder, unspecified

Hallo again.

I haven't had that much contact with psychiatry, just those times I had to go to get labelled because the work practice they offer to me has to fit me. I haven't gone to any work practice yet and lost out on some welfare money but that didn't matter much to me.

Anyway, they changed my diagnoses. I know I should look inside and see if those are somehow correct but I don't have that kind of insight in my own behaviour. I try but I cannot see myself from the outside.

My current diagnoses are

F44.89 Other dissociative disorder
F941 Reactive attachment disorder

I had no idea an adult can be diagnosed with RAD, but they say it explains both the schizoid traits and the ADHD traits, that it makes people not care so much about others and act impulsive. Fine. I can live with that.

I don't so much like the dissociation stuff. I look at others with dissociation and they have a different childhood and also very different symptoms. I have found about none which has my stuff. It doesn't follow how others experience dissociation. I have never been anyone but myself. I have not zoned out or looked at my situation from afar or felt numb about it. Isn't that what dissociation is? Feeling numb and distant?

[amandalouise]

Originally Posted by littlethistle

Hallo again.

I haven't had that much contact with psychiatry, just those times I had to go to get labelled because the work practice they offer to me has to fit me. I haven't gone to any work practice yet and lost out on some welfare money but that didn't matter much to me.

Anyway, they changed my diagnoses. I know I should look inside and see if those are somehow correct but I don't have that kind of insight in my own behaviour. I try but I cannot see myself from the outside.

My current diagnoses are

F44.89 Other dissociative disorder
F941 Reactive attachment disorder

I had no idea an adult can be diagnosed with RAD, but they say it explains both the schizoid traits and the ADHD traits, that it makes people not care so much about others and act impulsive. Fine. I can live with that.

I don't so much like the dissociation stuff. I look at others with dissociation and they have a different childhood and also very different symptoms. I have found about none which has my stuff. It doesn't follow how others experience dissociation. I have never been anyone but myself. I have not zoned out or looked at my situation from afar or felt numb about it. Isn't that what dissociation is? Feeling numb and distant?

glad you have your mental disorders sorted out. by the way did they tell you which of the other dissociative disorders you have. example I have the other dissociative disorder called macropsia. its wrote on my file as ...

300.15/F44.89 Other Specified Dissociative disorder - Macropsia.

the other dissociative disorders come with a list of mental disorders that treatment providers have. when they diagnose any "Other" disorders they have to tell you which one of the other disorders you have.

my point if you dont know yet which one of the "other" dissociative disorders you have it may help you to know what that is. knowing what my "othe" dissociative disorder is has helped me to understand myself my problems and why I was diagnosed with what I have.

its not necessary that you know what your "other" dissociative disorder is, its more a personal choice and here in the states (USA) treatment providers are required to disclose to you, this info when they are diagnosing someone.

[littlethistle]

Other specific dissociative disorder is meant to be everything dissociative that is not covered under the other headlines. But in reality it is usually one of those, but only by partial diagnosis they aim for, plus added on symptoms that do not fit under a headline.

Also here where I live they rarely diagnose multiple personality disorder (yes, we still use that name), because it is controversial and instead they diagnose with other specific dissociative disorder.

And very common to use this diagnosis to describe something that looks just a little like multiple personalities, but is different from it in several aspects.

I don't have anything specifying what type of dissociation they think it is. But then again this paper is just meant to be a valid number for the employment services. It is not really meant for me to read at all because over here they don't tell people what they are diagnosed with.

I finished therapy long ago and I cannot say it gave me much answers. I think they got tired of me because I just did the homework but did not change inside. I did what was asked of me and I don't understand what else I could have done. Also I got weird comments, of the sort that I don't remember things from when I was little, and I remember everything. It is like they got mad that I did not fit in how they thought I should be.

I do question the diagnosis of dissociation because it seems so severe and many people suffer with theirs. I cannot say I suffered. I don't have parts like some people, I just have two different ego states, and I think one is winning out because I haven't been like the other in ages. Also I have no sensation I share a mind with others, my so called parts if it is what they are, are projected into reality and they live in the same world as I do. Sometimes I wonder why they don't think I am schizophrenic but they are somehow sure I am not.

The others living around me are Skygge who is a wolf, he is now the number one invisible friend, and Odd and Jostein who are slipping more into the background.

My therapist once asked me if it is possible to talk to my invisible friends but of course it is impossible. They only exist for me. Jostein was created when I was very little and very lonely because my mum worked long hours and then went to the pub while I was inside in the attic room. I don't think I can compare an invisible playmate with other people's parts that had a purpose of taking abuse. My situation was much more benign.

Also if someone feels I just made these people up, yes I guess in a way I did but not consciously and also I cannot delete them.

I still lead the same type of life as before, it dawned on me they don't have the right to change me. They tried to teach me like a dog to function superficially in social contexts. A lot of homework in therapy was aimed at learning to bond with others and empathise but they were happy if I just pretended. I still don't know why I need to change.

I don't feel I am ill. Maybe one day it would be nice to have lasting friends but right now I am happy with what I have. I'm quite disconnected from humankind and I think I need to decide for myself if that is an illness that needs to be fixed.

Sorry for rambling.

[littlethistle]

I know animals often can sense things. I particularly like dogs, especially medium to bigger size dogs, I do like small dogs as well. I know they see things we don't, and they can smell us and what we feel.

I was in the forest, walking with Skygge, he was off the path more around the trees. I was just taking in the landscape as a person showed up, at first I did not even notice him, Skygge saw him first I think because he looked at the man. Then I see the man is walking a dog, looks like a hunting type of dog, seems like a nice dog although he was pulling the lead a lot. And then the dog sees Skygge and pulls his owner in that direction. He barks quietly. The owner tells him no and that he should not run after prey, well to my knowledge there was no other animal there. And I usually have a very good eye for all animals around me.

So yes, it actually much looked like the dog pulled to come near my wolf and even barked at him. How is that even possible when the wolf is supposed to be a part of me, a sort of "alter" or whatever I should call him, although he has his own body and is projected from me to a spot in the real world?

To me this should not happen because it is impossible. Similar things have happened in the past but I have never seen them as anything but coincidences. Now I am not so sure. What if Skygge is not really a part of me? What if he is a multi dimensional creature that dogs actually can see?