[ScientiaOmnisEst]

I'm not sure about the title, but it was the best I could think of for what's bothering me. Also, I apologize for making so many threads.

Some may know I've had a lifelong obsession with intelligence (I feel like I mention it constantly). I essentially have an entire network of thought and belief built around it, that I see no way of ever taking down. Intelligence is value, the gifted are the only people who matter, and average people are worthless wastes of space whose entire existence is totally futile; those are just facts as far as I can see, and some people have been scared by the details of my thoughts there.

The reason I'm writing, is that in some way I'm a little scared by my ability to dissociate from long tracts of thought about this topic. How I can entertain a massive inner monologue, sometimes going on for over an hour at a time, about how average people are worthless, can never meaningfully improve themselves, will never be anything but a waste of space and resources and a boon for the intelligent and should therefore kill themselves.... and feel nothing? I'm rambling internally as calmly, even happily, as though I were recounting details of that new show I watched.

Weirder still, it's so easy to just put it aside when I'm done, and go watch mindless videos online or laugh at an amusing article. Heck, I can even switch gears and just entertain myself. That shouldn't work though... I shouldn't be able to go from detailed self-condemnation to lighthearted entertainment. Especially not when I wholeheartedly believe that condemnation (though that does explain why I go for entertainment rather than self-improvement. There's no point. I'm average. You're born with your intelligence and its functions - creativity, problem-solving, critical thinking - and you can't do much to meaningfully improve it. Even if you do, hard work is embarrassing. It's basically announcing that you're one of the useless masses rather than gifted, otherwise you would have little trouble. You're normal, average, just like everyone else, and therefore dispensable, insignificant, useless, and boring. I've lost my ability to learn anyway).

What am I doing here, mentally? This detachment doesn't make sense to me. Surely I should have more emotions about something so personal? Or maybe I'm just desensitized?

Yes, these thoughts indeed are troubling. It is elitist thinking that has been around for centuries. I recommend you get therapy to find why you have Nordic thought of intellectualism. This type to say others of lesser intelligence have no value is the things that Stalin, Hitler and others killed for. And today it is in religious wars. I hope you get the counseling to help you analyze the root of this and be rid of it. tc

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Originally Posted by omegalamed

Yes, these thoughts indeed are troubling. It is elitist thinking that has been around for centuries. I recommend you get therapy to find why you have Nordic thought of intellectualism. This type to say others of lesser intelligence have no value is the things that Stalin, Hitler and others killed for. And today it is in religious wars. I hope you get the counseling to help you analyze the root of this and be rid of it. tc

To me it just seems obvious. Even though I'm the one who would be hurt by it.

I've been fixated on intelligence since childhood, but learning the truth about mine as a young adult kind of pushed me over the edge. I found out I had no chance of being even similar to the truly better kinds of people and I think it broke me.

Maybe that's why I take all of this so calmly.

[littleowl2006]

Good evening.
I liked your post because I think you are being honest and you reflect on your own internalized thinking patterns. You have to have some distance to do that - hence the missing feeling of guilt and shame?

Are you sure you aren't just repeating something old here? Something you have learned and got convinced was true, but now you know it doesn't make sense anymore and that it is useless to use these categories? Why not change your mind intentionally and not give these thoughts so much space? I do believe it is possible to change our ways of repeating the old patterns.

For example, in my family there is a slight racism internalized from which I clearly distance myself. But I have to live with the experience and the responsibility for my thoughts and actions, so I have to keep on thinking about it and be aware of what I learned when I was a kid, and which values are important to me as an adult. Weird thought pops into my head - I notice it and say "Hello. You are there. You are not what I believe to be true. You can go."

[Mr.Arch-Vile]

What exactly are you defining as intelligence?

I ask only because I see things all relatively.

Have you not considered that it is better to be practical than intelligent?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Originally Posted by littleowl2006

Good evening.
I liked your post because I think you are being honest and you reflect on your own internalized thinking patterns. You have to have some distance to do that - hence the missing feeling of guilt and shame?

True, I think about my thoughts a lot. I have nothing better to do. But there is guilt and shame attached, almost inherently. I have an entire belief system whose goal is to prove how worthless and undeserving I am. I might be thinking and mentally talk about average people in the third person... really, the only person I would or could ever apply these thoughts to is myself. I want to think in first person. I kind of got in the habit of it when I started letting these thoughts loose online - it seemed less narcissistic to talk about a group than just myself. The key being I never insult a group unless I'm part of it.

Are you sure you aren't just repeating something old here? Something you have learned and got convinced was true, but now you know it doesn't make sense anymore and that it is useless to use these categories? Why not change your mind intentionally and not give these thoughts so much space? I do believe it is possible to change our ways of repeating the old patterns.

I had a thought just a little bit ago about this, and what might lie at the base of it. It's pathetic: life is not worth living unless you are exceptional. I didn't have pushy parents, and I wasn't accomplished as a child. I was, however, lied to about being highly intelligent. I know I always thrived on praise and looking good intellectually for others, and I haven't so much as tasted that in a long time, and probably won't. Praise and attention are for exceptional people.

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Originally Posted by Mr.Arch-Vile

What exactly are you defining as intelligence?

I ask only because I see things all relatively.

Have you not considered that it is better to be practical than intelligent?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

Define intelligence? Intelligence just...is.

Giftedness. Extraordinary insight, learning speed, creativity, abstraction, and reasoning power, all inborn. People whose thoughts and thinking style differ wildly from the norm, who can't fit in because they're so far beyond everyone. People who must reign in their perfect knowledge, impeccable intellect, and drive for challenge so others don't feel too inferior. Admittedly, technical, logico-mathematical intelligence is the best and most recognized embodiment as opposed to say, verbal or artistically related displays.

Actually, the inborn aspects is one of the most painful. It occurred to me today that, considering my many past failures with regard to the fact that IQ is genetic (along, I assume, with functions of intelligence like creativity and problem-solving), most any "self-improvement" is futile. I can't learn anymore, I'm not sure I could ever learn. And given my age and the onset of cognitive pruning, I can only get worse. So no going back to school, definitely no self-ed, no learning new skills, etc. It's a waste of time. And it's killing me to think about this.

Whoa that was a tangent.

And no, practicality is not better. That's a copout and a fairy tale. Any stupid monkey can be practical. Human civilization is as advanced as it is because of intelligence.

[Thunder Bow]

It might be wise to get out of yourself, and find a job, or a social activity to do. Time to put away the device and stop typing so much. There is much you can do to break this pattern.

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Originally Posted by Thunder Bow

It might be wise to get out of yourself, and find a job, or a social activity to do. Time to put away the device and stop typing so much. There is much you can do to break this pattern.

It sounds so easy but seems so pointless in practice, if every attempt to "improve" just seems like another failure.

I get what you mean. Yet it feels wrong to accomplish something in my slow, average way and actually be proud of it, when there are people out there doing better, faster who would find what I did easy and boring.

There are loads of ways I'd like to improve, I just expect to fail at them.

[EnglishDave]

Originally Posted by ScientiaOmnisEst

Define intelligence? Intelligence just...is.

Giftedness. Extraordinary insight, learning speed, creativity, abstraction, and reasoning power, all inborn. People whose thoughts and thinking style differ wildly from the norm, who can't fit in because they're so far beyond everyone. People who must reign in their perfect knowledge, impeccable intellect, and drive for challenge so others don't feel too inferior. Admittedly, technical, logico-mathematical intelligence is the best and most recognized embodiment as opposed to say, verbal or artistically related displays.…

And no, practicality is not better. That's a copout and a fairy tale. Any stupid monkey can be practical. Human civilization is as advanced as it is because of intelligence.

Yet without the average, the normal, to carry out the tasks of providing for, and running, Human civilisation, The Gifted would be huddled in caves rapidly starving to death. The vast majority of those you describe as Gifted either do nothing to further the Human Condition with their intelligence, or they are an outright drain on resources. Average matters above all.

Dave.

[littleowl2006]

Originally Posted by ScientiaOmnisEst

It sounds so easy but seems so pointless in practice, if every attempt to "improve" just seems like another failure.

I get what you mean. Yet it feels wrong to accomplish something in my slow, average way and actually be proud of it, when there are people out there doing better, faster who would find what I did easy and boring.

There are loads of ways I'd like to improve, I just expect to fail at them.

It is hard sometimes to go out and start a new project. But why do you have to criticize yourself so much? Why not do something for different reasons? For fun, to feel companionship, do something for others or with others just for the sake of it? for example.
Thinking about and evaluating everything is unnerving, and it disconnects and blocks us.
Making mistakes is painful, but it is the only way to learn. There is nothing bad about not being good at something, and if you keep trying and see the result, it is a true experience of success.
I guess you have to take the risk, otherwise you stay stuck in your head and it goes nowhere. What option do you find more attractive?

[avlady]

little owl is right. we are all on different levels of intelligence, so you should do something you can do according to your own intelligence. if you get bored, do something else you are interested in and maybe try to do it faster to challenge yourself. just a thought

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

The same thoughts keep running in my head, the same self-destruction. The constant comparison that seems to make sense because that's how reality works - the world compares you, and as soon as you're not good enough, you're thrown aside like garbage, if not outright attacked and made into a joke. So why shouldn't I compare myself?

I asked once on another site what I could do about the hateful envy I have towards the highly intelligent (the subject of this morning's thoughts, actually emotional this time). One person said it won't be over until I "win", until I've achieved something brilliant, or have gotten myself on their level. As great as that sounds , I feel like a fraud just thinking about it. If I actually accomplished something on that level, or self-improved to that level, I'd likely end up rubbing elbows with geniuses. All of whom would know I'm not one of them, just a hardworking imitation. Someone who has to sprint to keep up with their walking speed, intellectually.

I'm digressing.

Effort is hard. Moreso, it's terrifying, because I know I'll fail. Why hurt myself anymore? Also, I've already demonstrated my level of intelligence - I dropped out of college after failing almost all my classes. That's what my intelligence is capable of. That's my limit. I don't really know what there is that I can do. I'm not really interested in anything, I don't care about much, so doing things "for fun" is harder than it sounds.

This whole business feels like a sickness. This belief system of mine makes me feel delusional (something I've been meaning to say since the OP but kept forgetting).

[Thunder Bow]

Originally Posted by ScientiaOmnisEst

It sounds so easy but seems so pointless in practice, if every attempt to "improve" just seems like another failure.

I get what you mean. Yet it feels wrong to accomplish something in my slow, average way and actually be proud of it, when there are people out there doing better, faster who would find what I did easy and boring.

There are loads of ways I'd like to improve, I just expect to fail at them.

You are setting yourself up for failure just by comparing yourself to others. Comparing yourself to others, is a direct short cut to feeling bad about yourself. Faster is not better. Go as slow as you like and you will have success. Going by how I see you write, you are not stupid. I sense you got much going for you.

[1976kitchenfloor]

Hello. I hear you saying you feel that your life and you yourself have no worth or meaning. I agree with the other posters here. You need to get out into the world and do something with your life. You and I and everyone else can always learn new things for us, get better at what we can do. push ourselves into enw things and as a result , the potentional to grow in always there. Maybe someone with an IQ of 120 cant educated himself into having an IQ of 180, but he can still improve his mind and feel better for it. And your idea that only the truly bright are worthy of living really limits things, doesnt it? That is one hard line you have there. Then theres the fact that most things are accomplished by basically average and ordinary people. Bright people have their own set of probelms, you know. Thers nothing 'less than' in living your life to the fullest no matter what your IQ. There is something 'less than' in writing off yourself and other people by sticking a label identifying them as 'worthless according to what you ahve decided is worthless. '

Enough intellectualism. I think. Time to start living in the real world and make something of yourself. Read books. Take walks. Visit museums. Learn how to dance. Maybe even meet and fall in love with a really nice average girl/guy and build a really nice ordinary life together in which you can live happily every after.

Sometimes I think all thoes reality TV programs that make people like Larry the Cable Guy and old farts in the woods millionaires has skewed our idea of what a sucessful meaning life really is.

Go for it. Make yourself a life of your own choosing and DO NOT LIMIT YOURSELF with preconceptions about what is / is not possible . You'd be surprised to learn what you can do and accomplish.

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Oh wow. Someone dug this up again just as I was experiencing the same thing, only about mental strength rather than intelligence. How strong people can be happy, usually are happy isolated, and how much better that makes them than someone like myself, who's regularly lonely, sees no point in doing something if it can't be shared or validated, and wants other people in her life. What to do.

BUT, I see I focused on the wrong things. The original point of this thread was wondering about the curious state being in this mindset gives me - if feels, almost, like I'm a different person. Or at least I'm not myself, not when I'm writing paragraphs condemning people I identify with as a weird public self-flagellation - hell, not even when I'm thinking those things. A person shouldn't be able to hold such conflicting thoughts and ideals.

[Artchic528]

The best advice I ever got regarding negative thoughts and avoiding them is to keep busy and focused on the here and now, essentially distracting the mind and keeping it from ruminating.

OCD? Try a Y-BOCS checklist:
https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&sourc...05sY9R0Vn_6stQ

[ScientiaOmnisEst]

Originally Posted by rcat

OCD? Try a Y-BOCS checklist:
https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&sourc...05sY9R0Vn_6stQ

It's not OCD. I looked into that in the past regarding thoughts I barely have now. I don't think OCD obsessions change rapidly or circumstantially.

It's most likely a kind of rumination.

EDIT: I just looked over that checklist. The majority do not apply to me at all, the few that do are either 1) very minor and occasional or 2) true in a painful sense, but only onset in the last 3-6 months (most notably a quasi-religious concern with right and wrong, and a frequent need to tell and confess). Also, there's nothing about obsessive thoughts or plans of punishment, or would that go under scrupulosity?