[drunksunflower]

How do you stay on meds when you don't really wanna be on them?

I don't want to be "dependent" on Celexa. I want to take nothing. Yet when I take nothing I crash badly, which isn't a good look when you have a busy job.

I have a lovely doctor. He is South African and soooo nice. But he told me I needed meds for six months and he would be grumpy if I did not take them. I *should* go back n see him, or call him as he requested. But I am super scared to do so cos he might pick up how much I am trying to do without them.

Any advice?

[sujunew]

Hey there!
I don't have much advice for you sorry, but I know how you feel. I have been trying to reduce my meds since last year, but each time my appt comes up with the doc something else has happened in my life that has set me back, and I have not been able to reduce them. I have been on the same meds (dose-wise) since about Dec/2004 Jan/2005 and I am sick of not only taking such high doses, but of taking so many tablets. I do know that if I stop my meds for any reason, I come crashing down so have learnt the hard way to do as the doc says. I guess that in the long run it will be for the best- if everything can get sorted 'inside' me it will make for a 'better' me. Right????!!!!
All the best with this. See your doc, and let him know how you feel. I know my doc would be really happy if I wasn't on the meds I am now but she just wants to make sure that I stay 'in the right place'. I'm sure that talking it over with him will help, and that if he sees how hard you are trying to do without them he will agree with you. I hope this kinda makes sense. Take care of yourself, and keep smiling

[drunksunflower]

thank u sweets ... i learnt the hard way a lot ... but each time i feel better I just decide to quit.

Logically I know what I *should* do. Rationally I understand the biology. Emotionaly I hate to be "dependent".

Therein lies the problem

[Maven]

Part of the problem is that you're talking of skipping doses. If you're on meds and want to go off them, you have to do it very slowly. You should do it under a doctor's care. I am going to go off my meds eventually. I have reduced the dosage a lot over time, but only a little bit at a time. A doctor took me off one of the meds I'm on several years ago (and I was only on that one med at that time) to switch me to another, but he did so too quickly. It was like three months. I had a major setback because of the withdrawal symptoms--I didn't have them at first...things started happening over a few weeks, and then one day, after my boyfriend had gone on a business trip, BAM! I got right back on those meds (got a doctor's prescription) and very quickly started getting better. But this time, I'm probably doing it much more slowly than I need to. I've been doing it around a year. Believe me, it's better to do it slowly. I'm doing much better this time.

I wasn't mentally addicted, but I was physically addicted. In other words, I could miss three or four days of meds, and I wouldn't be thinking, I gotta have my meds! I need my drugs! I didn't feel the need for a "fix," in other words, but my body would feel it.

[darkeyes]

You really shouldn't feel you'd be hooked on Celexa or any of the SSRI's. Many people,including myself have taken,or are taking, Celexa, for the recommended period, and follow ups with their pdocs, it can help many.
I do not think many of us like to take meds,preferring everything to be "the natural way", but weigh the alternative, why deny yourself of possibly feeling better?
Life is too short to be miserable, and this is coming from a lady, that a few years ago was furious to have to take anything besides my vitamins,etc.
I tried resisting such meds., long story short,found out the hard way,wasting precious time, only to find that becoming compliant,take the damn meds, I felt better.
It's your choice, if something works, go with it and don't tamper with it.
Sort of like a machine,if it's running well, let it be,if not have it looked at, and take it from there.
Take care now,
DE

[drunksunflower]

You all make such good sense. It's just my whole stupid 'i don't want to do this' mindset.

[Maven]

It's not stupid to wonder if meds are right for you. Even if they help the problem they're meant to treat, they may cause side effects that give you other problems. Only you can decide which is better to live with. It's sad that we often have to choose between the mental illness symptoms (which usually don't completely go away) and the side effects, but that's the way it is with medication.

You may feel more comfortable trying an alternative treatment first. Maybe an herbal remedy, or even acupuncture. Some people claim to be helped by them.

[crazymusiclvr]

Some may say i'm too blunt but here's my view. Bipolar disorder is an illness. It's not like a headache. When we have a headache, we have the choice to dull the pain with perhaps tylenol or to stick it out. You can't stick it out with a mood disorder. Yes, it is so hard to accept that you have a mood disorder, to get help and stick to your meds, suffering from side effects. Think of it this way. Thing of how much damaged you are doing to yourself by not taking your medicine. It gets easier. I promise.

[drunksunflower]

I dont have bipolar.

[darkeyes]

Doesn't matter if it's Bipolar, or a Depressive disorder, it's still not good to just stop meds. without talking with your pdoc.
I really do not understand why, you just won't give meds a try, it's no sin, or sign of weakness.
Do not deny yourself from opportunities to feel better,in time you may be gradually taken off of them, but it must be done gradually, and if it turns out you need med(s). again, it is not a bad thing.
Six years ago, I felt the way you do about meds. but I learned the hard way, and then learned to accept the fact, that following pdoc's treatment plan, improved the quality of my life, and now when I look back at how I balked about treatment (meds) and therapy, it was so foolish and imature, wasted time, I could of not wasted if I only had not been so bull headed.
Well, I guess some people have to find out the hard way,wasting precious time, till they accept the reality of having a disorder and how they can do something to improve their well being.
After being one of those, I wish I was able to help save those at that point of denial,resentment, and plain old bull headedness, from wasting time and just get help and stick with whatever plan the pdoc suggests.
I regret the time I had wasted, refusing help and meds.
But glad I got into a plan,which helped greatly, had I not, chances are I wouldn't be on this earth, typing this.
I wish you luck with whatever you choose, take care now.

DE

[Maven]

Speaking on my experience, I've been on medications since I was 10. That's over 28 years. I'm basing my opinions on that.

Meds are right for some people, wrong for others. I agree, it is not a sign of weakness to go on meds. Again, it might fix your problem without causing significant other problems. I decided the side effects were too much, and the fact is, doctors don't know for sure what these meds will do in the long term. You have to decide what's right for you.

[drunksunflower]

Maven could you explain your 'long term' comment a lil more please?

DE ... I know and appreciate what you are saying ... i haven't stopped taking them yet but i want to and it just seems to be really hard to accept the situation (immature and silly as you say)

[darkeyes]

((((((((( DSF ))))))))))
I hear you, and understand this struggle you are having.
I wish I could make you understand the meaning behind my replies, to help save you wasted time, like I have wasted in the past.
I guess it is something you'll need to find out/learn on your own personal experience(s).
Which ever way, I wish you lots of luck with this.
DE

[drunksunflower]

i think its making me more looopy i get better then i still have awful crying fits

so im giving up on it all.

[Maven]

I'm just saying, they don't know what effect these drugs will have on us as we get much older. The drugs have been around for a while now, so they might have more info, but they still don't know how 40 or 50 years of taking them will affect a person.

I had what I term "breakdowns" on an almost monthly basis for years. I never attributed them to the psych meds I was on. But I haven't had a breakdown in several months, since reducing my meds significantly over those months. I have much less depression. Those breakdowns made me feel hopeless and I'd wail--not just cry, WAIL. I realized after a few months of med reduction, that I hadn't been going through that anymore. I am much happier now.

[drunksunflower]

Maven would you be able to tell me what you were on?

I am only taking 20mg of Celexa.

In the past 30-40mg has worked for me well.

But nothing has sent me into a spin.

im sorry to ask personal questions

[Larry_Hoover]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
Maven said:
I'm just saying, they don't know what effect these drugs will have on us as we get much older. The drugs have been around for a while now, so they might have more info, but they still don't know how 40 or 50 years of taking them will affect a person.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

That is indeed true. But, prior to the introduction of antidepressants, morbidity was at least 15% for depression. That's the life-time risk of death directly attributed to depression. Moreover, that completely fails to account for other known health effects of depression, which include higher rates of heart disease, stroke, and cancer.

The unfortunate truth is that there is no "untreated" control version of ourselves, experiencing life alongside the "treated" version, for easy comparisons. A living version of ourselves, aging alongside of us. Depression is a serious illness, in its own right, and it does have clearly measurable progressions.

There was a study of brain function that showed that a subject in remission, but using antidepressants, had normalized some areas of brain function (compared to what they believe healthy normal brain function is), but that other areas of brain function still looked "depressed". In other words, even when a person is in remission while on an antidepressant, the disease we call depression is still active. Antidepressants are an incomplete treatment.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
Maven said:
I had what I term "breakdowns" on an almost monthly basis for years. I never attributed them to the psych meds I was on. But I haven't had a breakdown in several months, since reducing my meds significantly over those months. I have much less depression. Those breakdowns made me feel hopeless and I'd wail--not just cry, WAIL. I realized after a few months of med reduction, that I hadn't been going through that anymore. I am much happier now.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Not to be any way critical, Maven, but that is a different concern entirely......dose. I have never seen any justification for how they determine what is an effective dose for an antidepressant medication....what the "therapeutic dose" is. For example, when they studied Prozac, 5, 10, and 20 mg doses had almost identical efficacy. As you can imagine, though, fewer severe adverse effects were noted at the lower doses. Yet, when the drug was approved by the FDA, the "therapeutic starting dose" was set at 20 mg/day.

In my body, 20 mg is a severe overdose of the drug. Yet, when they found I was having such a hard time at 20 mg, guess what they did......they doubled the dose to 40 mg.

In any population of people, no matter what criterion is being selected, there is a middle ground where most people are found.....the normal curve, the bell curve, is exactly that. The further you get from the middle of the group, the fewer people you find with that particular amount of whatever is being measured. That "distance from the average" concept is called the standard deviation. One standard deviation out from the center only includes 68% of all people. 2 standard deviations includes 95%. That's the basis of the standard for significance, by the way......less than 5% chance that the result is outside two standard deviations....

But, 95% includes 19 people out of 20. One out of 20 people is not going to get the normal drug reaction. The effects could be severe. The required dose could be a tiny fraction of the "standard dose".

It behooves us to determine if we're one of those sensitive people. And then, we must insist that our doctors listen to us. And if that fails, don't ever forget that you are the gatekeeper of your own mouth. Just because your doctor will only prescribe 20 mg tablets doesn't mean you have to take a whole tablet, ya know?

Lar

[Rapunzel]

DSF, I've been following this thread and I'm not sure if this is helpful or not, but I'll offer it and you can decide. I've never been on prescription meds for depression, because nobody offered them to me back when I would have trusted the experts and done what they told me to do. I had dysthymia and periodic major depressive episodes for at least 25-30 years before really losing it and deciding something had to change. By that time I wanted to have control, and not depend on someone else to regulate meds for me. Making changes in my life was a big part of it too, and three years later I'm still in therapy and not close to being done. But I haven't been significantly depressed now for 2 1/2 years.

I don't think I could have done it without some chemical assistance in addition to the rest. Since I didn't want meds, I started taking St. John's Wort. It worked. (In fact, when I overdosed I got hypomanic). I like that I can control it myself, and there aren't withdrawal effects. I can go off of it for the summer with no trouble, and pick it back up when I notice that the weather is affecting me.

I just wonder if your doctor might help you switch over to SJW if that would be something you would like to try. I'm assuming that the medical community where you are is probably somewhat knowlegeable about SJW, since the best book that I read about it was by a doctor in New Zealand. I haven't been able to find that book again in a while though.

Rap

[drunksunflower]

Rap ... i used to take it and it was WONDERFUL .... then lost its effectiveness .... but maybe i should try it again?????

What milligrams of it were/do you take?

Larry ... are you saying cutting down would be a good idea to try?

thank you everyone .... this is helping a great deal just getting some other perspectives.

[Rapunzel]

900 mg was the right dosage at first. 4000 mg was the overdose that made me hypomanic (I did that for a week, figuring that it probably wasn't really having an effect anyway - that was right after going off the deep end so I still wasn't so much in control as I thought I was). Eventually I could go down to 300 mg, but I use a tea that has about 850 mg in a cup, so sometimes it was a bit more, and that didn't seem to matter. It's summer here now and I went to a cup of tea every other day and stopped. I've been off of it for about a month now. I'm sure I'll need it again when winter comes around, probably at 900 mg from September or October through February or March.

Good luck - I hope it works for you again if you decide to try that.

Rap

[drunksunflower]

wow ... i like the tea thing ...

so so confused is me AARRRGHHHHH heh.

[Maven]

drunksunflower, no need to apologize. I don't mind answering personal questions about this. I don't remember the exact dosages for both, but I was on 150mg of Anafranil, and I think 75 or 100 mg of Paxil CR. Over the years, I've been on both Anafranil and Paxil (not CR) separately. The highest I've been on Anafranil was 225 mg.

Larry, I agree with what you're saying. I needed the higher dosages to control my OCD, but the cost was the breakdowns, even though I didn't know it at the time. I am going off the meds because of other side effects and other reasons.

As for St. John's Wort, be very, very careful about that. Educate yourself and speak to your doctor. SJW can interfere with certain medications, and can have some negative consequences. One woman I read about saw her doctor for some problem, and was told to go off it immediately. The SJW made her extremely light-sensitive, and several months later, she was still wearing sunglasses.

[drunksunflower]

heh everything seems to have risks and side effects ... whether 'natural' or not ...

[Rhapsody]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
drunksunflower said:
heh everything seems to have risks and side effects ... whether 'natural' or not ...



</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">


That is so TRUE................. guess we need to either go Rx (or) Natural...... but not both.


LoVe,
Rhapsody -

P.S.
I use VALERIAN and it goes well with my Rx..... ask your doctor about it....YOU can read about it in the Rate & Review section on here.

[drunksunflower]

i am starting to think au naturale ... absolutely nothing ... is the best option ... no side effects on that!!!!