[MissCharlotte]

After I read the article Echoes posted in her thread i found myself thinking about T and how annoyed at him I am. I feel as though he thinks I've had enough coddling; enough moaning about my childhood; enough acting like a baby and it's time to get on with it. But then I wondered whose voice I really hear. Is it T or is it me? T would never say something like that but I would; it's negative self talk that I internalized from my parents. But then again, I do know that he wants things for me; adult things, fulfillment, happiness, satisfaction, a sense of agency; and I feel quite unable to reach those charms for myself. So maybe I take his wishes and hopes and turn them into demands and ultimatums. Hmmmm. Why do I do that (aside from habit)? Maybe it's like Tree said, creating conflict, or protecting myself from the responsibility of growing up. But even that sounds harsh right now.

It's like the sharing of dreams (also in Echoes' thread). Early on in therapy I would tell T a dream and he would interpret for me. Now I tell him a dream and he asks me what I think. Then he tells me what he thinks and I let him know if he's on target or not. Sometimes I find myself so annoyed that he doesn't just TELL ME FIRST WHAT HE THINKS.

I feel twisted and struggling and full of shoulds. WHY CAN'T HE JUST FIX EVERYTHING? PUT A DAMNED BANDAID ON ME ALREADY.

[Melbadaze]

Miss c, Are you saying T puts into words what he wishes for you? I've not had that experience, we dont talk about wishes, we just keep picking at what presents, I think perhaps I'd feel that way too if T were to verbalise wishes for me, they can work against you. Perhaps the "blank screen" is "blank" for a reason?

[ECHOES]

MissC, perhaps T is encouraging your wishes and hopes and that is scary, the idea of making them become reality. Or maybe it feels lonely on some level, that you aren't feeling that you can fully trust him to be with you as you go about attempting to make them reality? It sounds like he is helping you find your own voice because that is the voice that matters the most

I do love dreams and many different interpretations can come to me; it is interesting to explore them all. But sometimes, I feel as if my unconcious has "ratted me out" by revealing things that I haven't put into words yet.

(((((((Miss)))))))

I have those thoughts: T is tired of hearing about this, I should move on, He wishes I would just be quiet, etc. Whenever I tell T, he helps me see those thoughts are coming from ME, not from him. It's hard for me to believe someone would sit there with me, week in and week out, and really WANT to be with me while I struggle with the same things over and over and over again. But T wants to help me HEAL, and he's not going to do that by telling me to "be quiet" or "grow up" or "move on". He's going to do that by being there, and being consistent, and being patient and caring and supportive and curious and open. Just like your T.

I was just thinking this morning about the desire to have T "fix" everything. It's just so painful that he can't, you know? It's such an young feeling. Like "somebody SAVE ME, already!". One of the most painful thing about therapy for me is that no matter what, even if he wanted to T couldn't fix everything for me. He can give me a boost, but I'm the one who has to crawl out of the pit.

to you. It's just so stupidly hard sometimes, isn't it??

[chaotic13]

I have thoses thoughts a lot too. For some reason, they have been really bad lately. When I analyze them I know the voice is me not my T.

[WePow]

Can you bring up your fears and just ask T if that is what is being said?
Sometimes it pays off to articulate what we think we hear.
It allows T the chance to clarify and correct any misconceptions.

It can be a scary thing to do - I had to do it recently when I thought I heard T say something about "making up" things. For me, that is a big trigger because when I told teachers and other adults about the abuse happening to me, I was told that I was making up stories. It made me hypersensitive to being called a liar or being told I was making things up. So when I heard that phrase in therapy, my guard walls shot up and I shut down. I did not even remember the rest of the session. But the very next session, I did get up the guts to bring it up first thing. That was one of the most difficult things I have ever had to do in my life. I was risking T confirming what I heard as correct - which would have devistated me. But I had to know... so I asked.

Boy was I glad I did! I was completly off base. He was talking about some type of thing the mind does with relationships in seeing what we think is real rather than what is fact about the other person. Which was totally not close to what I thought he meant! He then took the time to sit back and clearly tell me for a fact that he did believe what I was telling him about my past and there was no question at all about that in his mind.

Bottom line was that asking for clarification might be risky, but it sure does clear the air!

[skeksi]

WHY CAN'T HE JUST FIX EVERYTHING? PUT A DAMNED BANDAID ON ME ALREADY

Oh boy, do I feel this way sometimes, too! And when I tell T I just want him to fix me, he says I'm not broken. Which drives me up a wall, because I feel so obviously broken.

T can be okay with us going over and over the same stuff, and not think "get over it and grow up," but at the same time desire us to feel less tormented and more whole. That's the whole point, I think: we are okay no matter what, but if we can do something to help us feel okay more often, then that's what T is there for.

I struggle with understanding how talking about this old stuff over and over changes any of it. But I do feel changed. T works in mysterious ways.

[Perna]

Originally Posted by MissCharlotte

After I read the article Echoes posted in her thread i found myself thinking about T and how annoyed at him I am.

I find it interesting that you started thinking about him, rather than your own issues. You can't fix him so he's not annoying to you, you can only fix you so you don't find what he does annoying. Likewise, he can't fix you so you're happy with yourself, he can only be happy at the progress you've made.

At first you could not interpret dreams, you hadn't learned how yet. Now you know yourself well enough and through T's example/teaching, you can interpret your own dreams and, since they're your dreams, you know if what he says "rings a bell" or not and adds anything meaningful to the interpretation.

But you are becoming yourself so the voices are separating out; remember this, wondering whose voice you hear -- in a few months or a year or so you won't wonder anymore, you'll know and you'll be wholly you and T will be T and even more wonderful conversations will begin.

[MissCharlotte]

Hi everybody,

First of all Ill tell you what triggered this whole thing is that my 24 y o son is growing up at the same time I am in many ways. We are both searching for ourselves, and I was talking to T about it and it was tooooooooo obvious that some of the things I was saying about my S were also applicable to me. So as I am telling T my frustrations about DS I can't help but wonder if T is similarly frustrated with me. It felt like the same thing. Yes, the wishes and hopes Echoes are mine. But they are VERY SCARY because I have so many fears and so much has happened over the past few years that I cannot go backward, only forward and I am so afraid crummy things will happen again. It is SOOOO hard Tree, yes I want someone to just lift me out of the pit. I don't want to crawl out myself because it feels lonely. Chaotic, do you think that the voices become louder when we are on the precipice of change or about to "be" something new? Do they grow out of psychological stress? Yes, Skeksi sometimes the talking feels redundant but we move on don't we?

Perna, thank you. I keep thinking that I want to experience the wonderful things that people talk about as a result of therapy and I feel stuck. Thanks for letting me know it's out there! So I guess the voice IS mine. I need to tone that baby down a notch.

Thanks everyone!





So, to answer your question Melba, no T didn't articulate his desires for me. I just know he wants good things for me that are appropriate developmentally. Echoes,

[chaotic13]

Miss C Yes in my case the voices get louder when I am approaching a change in being. I this this is true for both the side of me that is resisting the change as well as the aspect of me that is wanting the change. In my case often the debating sides get very vocal as I approach my leap point.

I found Perna's comment interesting. When I first stated therapy I remember a lot of white noise in my head. It was like a radio playing on search mode. I'd hear a few bit of what an aspect of myself was thinking but then I'd jump to another station. I think some of this "station changing" was my way of blocking out thoughts that were unacceptable to me. Now, I can stay on one station (listen to what the small child is saying/feeling)long enough to get her message. But also like Perna mentioned I can tell which aspect is creating the chatter. There are times when I hear chatter that SOUNDS like its my T in my head but when I really stop and challenge it...its usually one of my own ego states "playing" my T. Not sure if that makes sense or not.

My problem at the moment is..accepting and acknowledging how some of my inner states feel and think. I don't like some of my inner people and even after all this time in therapy, I am resistant to discuss some of these thoughts and feelings with my T. I'm ashamed of them for thinking and wanting the things they do.