somebody remind me?

A question popped up in my head and I couldn't find the answer, all I got was this "left my purse at home" kind of a feeling....

The ability to have a reciprocal relationship is damaged. I am happy to give, but it's so hard, if not impossible, to allow myself to accept from another.

The therapeutic relationship is the only one I know of in which you CAN NOT reciprocate - so someone remind me, how on earth is this supposed to be able to heal the ability to have relationships IRL ?

hmmm....good question. I am definitely the "giver" in all my relationships, so I understand the need. I have had really bad luck with T's so I am not so good at that relationship. But I always tried to put a kind word in here and there with a T just to have that "give need" taken care of. Things like always saying Thank You, and saying I appreciate you taking the time to call...etc. That's a "give" in my view.

I tried that yesterday, telling T that I am grateful for her help. I noted the human mind's ability to distill and simplify, as one becomes so very grounded in any knowledge base, and therapy is no different - she learns from each and every client, each one so different (she nodded), and now I come along, and I get the benefit of her learning.
I was truly sincere in what I was saying and I did hope to see at least a flash of acknowledgment in her eyes, but T immediately went into her blank screen face. made me feel like a suck-up.

some relationshp.

Good question, very good question.

I think there's a few things, it's not just learning how to have a reciprocal relationship by doing, by having one with a T. But also, there's (for instance) just becoming more aware of oneself and one's own less-than-constructive patterns in relationships. And thereby gaining the ability to form other, more constructive patterns, by making different choices.

(Like for me, I was about to make some choices that were likely to lead down a bad path, and yesterday we clarified that, and discussed some better choices.)

However, I am sorry that your T went into therapist mode when you were trying to reach out to her -- that must have felt hurtful and rejecting.

Maybe talk to her about it, if you feel like it?

-Far

Then, allowing yourself to accept from T is what will be healing for you, and what you can gain from therapy.

Regarding your T and her blank face....not all Ts are like that. Or, maybe you're misinterpreting her. She did nod in acknowledgement. Is it possible she has no idea what you wanted from her? Does she know you want more feedback from her and not so much "blank face?" Is it her orientation that she won't change, or doesn't she know?

My current T seems to be willing to express appreciation for what I give her. She told me that a recent email was "beautiful" and it made her smile. At my last session she told me I was "funny." She makes me feel like she's benefiting from our relationship. I think she even told me that once.

If T is truly a "blank screen" all the time, and you want someone different, then go for it! I can't say enough how I never thought I'd experience a different type of therapy, but here I am, doing it. It's always up to YOU to get the kind of help that you need.

SAWE >> The ability to have a reciprocal relationship is damaged. I am happy to give, but it's so hard, if not impossible, to allow myself to accept from another.
[quote=rainbow8;1459029]Then, allowing yourself to accept from T is what will be healing for you, and what you can gain from therapy.

No, precisely because I am prevented from reciprocating. IRL it's difficult to accept from another because I know the bill is coming someday, and eventually it does - or I run - with T I cannot run without quitting therapy, and there is No Reciprocation Allowed, and it's not healing me as far as I can tell. I still spiral out, as I would IRL, and then I also have to deal with the guilt of having accused T, internally or even verbally, of manipulation, etc.

No she is not at all a blank screen, she's (from what I hear on PC) unusually open. it did feel like a rejection. But did I bring it up in the monent, nooooooo of course not but I should have, you're right.

One more thing to talk about next time

[quote=sittingatwatersedge;1459057]SAWE >> The ability to have a reciprocal relationship is damaged. I am happy to give, but it's so hard, if not impossible, to allow myself to accept from another.
What would happen if you just relaxed and allowed yourself to accept something from T, without the need to reciprocate. I know this sounds risky at first but that's the way to break the cycle. Remember though, there is already a therapy bill you are paying. But other than that you will probably find that there isn't another 'bill' on top of that, and shouldn't be.

Sitting, perhaps this isnt the right T for you? I know when T offers to send postcards from her trips and I felt she was doing it because she feels she has too and she replied, I am doing it because I want too, that gives me a very warm feeling inside. I'm not sure I'm really understanding what your saying here, its true that this relationship isnt a friendship, there are boundaries around it, but none the less, a successful theraputic experience is most rewarding. Your fear of recieving is part of the work.

Oceanwave you come rather late to PC, others will be bored with this because they've already heard it.

what T has to give me is extra time, which is priceless to me (yesterday she had no appointments after me, and we were right in the middle of something important as the time ran out and I asked politely if I could please buy a half hour of her time, but she made a face and said no.

I experience it as follows: she knows how precious it is to me, and she wants to be the one to grant it to me - to bestow it on me - which slams me in the face with my need and with my powerlessness to do anything about it. She makes me dependent on her whim, and to me this is intolerable. It is not healing. She will not listen when I try to explain it, nothing changes.

So there is no such thing as "relax and allow her to give it to you", I spiral out.

In case you don't realize it, the theme of yesterday/s session was There Is No Such Thing as Failure in Therapy, SAWE. You Cannot Fail In Here.

Oh yeah????

and if we don't change,

THIS ^ is how we fail at therapy.

Pardon me, Tree, you know I love you but I am more than a little down right now.

SAWE, are you okay? I'm sending you lots of .
Sorry if I probed in the wrong direction.

((((((((((((((sawe))))))))))))))))

I'm sorry I deleted it.

I'm probably not the best one to ask because i'm feeling downright poopy about the whole t-client relationship.

just wanted you to know I hear you.

fins

I'm sorry, SAWE.

The therapeutic relationship is about learning to share one's Self. T is genuine, "there", listens, etc. and you learn it's okay to be who you are and share that with others of your choice.

Relax? That was the advice I received many years ago when trying to get pregnant with my first child. Almost everyone said, " Just REEEEEEEELAX, it will happen." The first year passed, then the second, and third, and so on...The truth is...that comment hurt. It implied, I was doing something wrong.

Therapy is a lot like "pregnancy". It may happen easily for some, less so for others. Some may have very healthy T's, others more complicated ones...Some make it to full term, others may not. Sometimes, the outcome is not always a happy one.

I do agree with a comment on another thread... It is difficult, for me, to read how great some T's are interacting with their clients, and knowing my experience(s) is/are different.

I am sorry your T disappointed you yesterday. I hope you find the courage to talk about it.

Let us all take a moment to remember, that Therapists are just people with jobs. They had to endure a lot of classroom time, with teachers that may or may not have been good at their jobs. In my experience, most of the people who attain Counseling Credentials began their education seeking answers for their own mental/emotional/social/family problems. I can honestly say that few found those solutions in college, and even fewer are skilled at guiding others (especially others with brain chemistry disorders which they can hardly imagine, let alone understand), into the "Pathways of Mental Health". It is a small miracle that Therapy ever works at all, particularly with adults, and especially with adults who have malfunctioning brains and a personal history of traumatic socialization. As with any other medical procedure, we are wise to assume responsibility for our own care and recovery; to monitor carefully the quality of services provided; to become wise and informed consumers of those services; and most of all, to take responsibility for our own mental health~! Anyone who cannot do this, or has no reliable, trustworthy protector is generally at risk in the Therapeutic relationship (in my opinion). Please take the time to ask yourself: What do I have to bring to this relationship? What can I NOT tolerate from someone offering Therapeutic Guidance? Who is responsible for how I feel? and not least: What am I doing to improve myself?

Oceanwave, don't get yer hair shirt on. nobody owes me any apologies but I owe one to Treehouse; what I wrote was inaccurately said and I'm worried that she thinks she said something hurtful (and of course did not!).

The whole issue of extra time is something that T and I are going to have to talk about over and over (I am already sick of it but the spirals continue so what can I do, just work on it). I only wish she could really understand from my point of view.

OR - maybe she does, and keeps doing it anyway through some therapist logic that through repeated incidents, eventually the spirals will lessen (not so far) or my feelings will change (not so far). sneeeeky therapists

((((((((((((SAWE)))))))))))

We are good. No worries!

This therapy stuff is hard to navigate.

at the moment.... you are.....

what I interpret from your goes something like, (a) my chances for success in therapy are small (i think you mentioned miracle) and (b) the kind of sharing and mutual encouragement and learning that is found on PC is of dubious value.

Sorry, I do not find either of these acceptable... I realize you are new to PC but it's probably not too good just to enter a serious discussion and tell people to step back and take a critical look at their support system here (which includes venting, "processing" in community, compassion, and collective sharing of experience and wisdom). It's not group therapy, but it is in a way. What PC offers is unique and IMO marvelous.

In other words, anyone who is damaged enough to need therapy should have his or her head examined, because the process may be dangerous/fatal to your health?

to return to the original question more or less: if the therapeutic relationship is not reciprocal, how can it heal a damaged capability for reciprocal relationship? Talking it through, exploring the subject and learning how reciprocity works is worth something, but will that be enough? has anyone finished this in therapy? if you don't mind my asking

Well, for me, I have always been comfortable GIVING, but not receiving. I couldn't admit even to myself that I had needs, and if I had been aware of a need, there was NO WAY I would let another person know that. I wanted to be completely independent and walled off. I really believed that my only value was in my ability to take care of other people - friends, family, even strangers. There was no way in the world I would let down my guard and let someone take care of me...as a child, my "caretakers" were anything but; any trust was met with pain.

In the therapy relationship, I have learned to receive. It's been scary and hard. For a long long long long time, I was waiting for the other shoe to drop, sure that it was all a ruse and in the end, T was sure to hurt me like the people did in my childhood. I still have a really hard time with it - I sent T an e-mail just last night and asked for a reply. He hasn't replied yet, and I'm worried I'm going to be "in trouble". Probably what will happen is T will give me what I need, I won't get in trouble, and my trust will grow just a little bit more.

That's been my experience. It's a process for sure, and I think it's going to take me a very very long time to unlearn the lessons from my childhood. For every two steps forward, there is at least one step back...it's just hard.

sitting what exactly is it that has brought this about? Was it you asking for more time and T saying no? Sorry I am reading but its not going in and I'm trying to understand.