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  #26  
Old Feb 23, 2012, 02:50 PM
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healed84 healed84 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcl6136 View Post
I'm going to ask again....why would any thoughts be unwanted? I mean...they might not be liked; they might be frightening, but couldn't they be transformed into something intriguing, useful, even illuminating in the end?

Simply banishing them strikes me as the most unproductive approach of all!

I'm simply asking here.....

Someone told me once: the facts are always friendly. I remembered that once when at a doctor's office receivinig a bad diagnosis. Isn't it better to know? I didn't like what I heard but stopping that unwanted piece of information wasn't an option.

I'll stop now. I'm having a nervous ridiculous day but I do wonder....

I can tell you that my irrational thoughts of worst case scenarios always happening to me and my family are very unwanted. Who, wants to think about stuff like that? I don't see a problem with not wanting to have those thoughts. As a matter of fact that are cripplying my life and my thearpy. So, to get rid of those thoughts are going to be what helps me. Now, I can see where we want to explore the roots of those thoughts, but to keep having them seems more harmful than helpful.

I think facts are different... having a bad dagnosis you don't want to hear, but it is a fact. The unwanted thoughts of, you won't' survive, or you can't handle this are the thoughts you don't want. Of course this is all imo.
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  #27  
Old Feb 23, 2012, 03:32 PM
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SoupDragon SoupDragon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcl6136 View Post
I'm going to ask again....why would any thoughts be unwanted? I mean...they might not be liked; they might be frightening, but couldn't they be transformed into something intriguing, useful, even illuminating in the end?

Simply banishing them strikes me as the most unproductive approach of all!

I'm simply asking here.....

Someone told me once: the facts are always friendly. I remembered that once when at a doctor's office receivinig a bad diagnosis. Isn't it better to know? I didn't like what I heard but stopping that unwanted piece of information wasn't an option.

I'll stop now. I'm having a nervous ridiculous day but I do wonder....
I think generally avoidance strategies do not work and maybe this is the same for thoughts. If we try to avoid them, where does that leave us?

Mindfulness to me is just letting the thoughts do their thing, in the same way my heart does it thing by beating, my lungs through breathing - my brain by thinking. I do not have to be those thoughts in the same way as I do not have to be that lung rising and falling - I may become aware of it, but then I can choose to let the focus relax.

I think this is different from DBT, although I acknowledge that DBT may use similar techniques - my understanding is that we have old Buddha to thank for mindfulness...oh and Jon KZ.
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  #28  
Old Feb 23, 2012, 10:48 PM
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CantExplain CantExplain is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFrank View Post
The first step is the hardest.You must monitor ALL of your thoughts and then silently label EVERY one of them either positive or negative.Negative thoughts include ALL depressing,anxiety or self-criticism words that occur to you.
I don't think my T would approve of this at all!

"Don't judge your feelings, just be with them," is a likely response.
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  #29  
Old Feb 24, 2012, 01:55 AM
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FooZe FooZe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcl6136 View Post
...why would any thoughts be unwanted? I mean...they might not be liked; they might be frightening, but couldn't they be transformed into something intriguing, useful, even illuminating in the end?
You happened to remind me of a (rather trivial) example. Some years ago I had a job where I worked with wood a lot. My pockets would regularly fill up with chips and sawdust so I'd leave my checkbook in the glove compartment of my car where it would stay cleaner. One evening I was driving to the bank after work. I parked the car, turned off the engine and thought, "Oh, almost forgot my checkbook!"

Normally I would have taken that as just more proof that I was as absent-minded and unreliable as I'd always thought, and looked for ways to "supervise" myself so I wouldn't forget again next time. Tape a note to the dash... tie a string around my finger... go back to carrying the checkbook in my pocket, wood chips or no. This time, though, I suddenly noticed what I was saying to myself. "Forgot, heck! I remembered the checkbook exactly when I needed to. It wouldn't have done me any good to remember it a block earlier while I was still driving and couldn't do anything about it."

In my experience, struggling to make sure I don't think "negative" thoughts works about the same way as struggling to make sure I don't forget my checkbook.

Quote:
Someone told me once: the facts are always friendly.
That's from Carl Rogers, one of my favorite psychologists ever. I'm sure he must've said it more than once. I first read it in On Becoming A Person but the same essay also appears in The Carl Rogers Reader. There's a Google Books copy of the latter here.

In another essay, Rogers identifies seven stages that clients appear to move through in the course of therapy. Here's a snippet from his description of the third stage:
Quote:
Personal choices are often seen as ineffective.
The client "chooses" to do something, but finds that his behaviors do not fall in line with this choice.

I believe it will be evident that many people who seek psychological help are approximately at the point of stage three. They may stay at roughly this point for a considerable time describing non-present feelings and exploring the self as an object, before being ready to move to the next stage.
Two things that that reminds me of, are making New Year's resolutions and -- deciding not to think any more negative thoughts.
  #30  
Old Feb 24, 2012, 03:19 PM
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CantExplain CantExplain is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melissa.recovering View Post
I have just thought...what if I tried to use this technique on a friend or family member's thoughts? For example...

Friend: Melissa, I've been thinking of cutting myself...I don't know what to do.
My Response: SHUT UP. Enough of that, think of something better. NOW!

Seems harsh to do it to someone else, why should we be that harsh on ourselves?
Perhaps it's the words that are wrong. I tell my paranoid fantasies: "Don't be silly!"

Actually I did that for only a week, and that was after the hard work had already been done in therapy. But "don't be silly" was the phrase that finally dispelled them.
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  #31  
Old Mar 01, 2012, 11:51 AM
sittingatwatersedge sittingatwatersedge is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFrank View Post
The third step needs to be implemented as soon as you finish yelling at yourself..
if that time ever comes, that is
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