[DechanDawa]

Why is therapy listed second after medications as the main treatment for mental illness? In the past, therapy was always my "go to" solution and yet, dear friends, I have to say it became less and less effective.

[iheartjacques]

Because we're supposed to change how we think about ourselves, others and problems?

[DechanDawa]

Originally Posted by iheartjacques

Because we're supposed to change how we think about ourselves, others and problems?

Talk therapy isn't always the best way to help us reframe, just sayin...

[stopdog]

I have found meditation to help me more than therapy - meditation is both calming and energizing for me. Meditation has never mocked me, blamed me for its mistakes, or intentionally messed with me like therapists do. It is in my control, does not involve another human, and I don't have to pay for it. Those would all put it ahead of therapy for me. As I would never subjugate myself to pharmaceutical companies and mds - drugs don't even make my list.

Originally Posted by DechanDawa

Why is therapy listed second after medications as the main treatment for mental illness? In the past, therapy was always my "go to" solution and yet, dear friends, I have to say it became less and less effective.

So it sounds like you need to seek out other avenues for solutions. What do you have in mind to try? What might work for you?

Therapy and meds were a starting place for me and absolutely necessary for a while there, but as I've progressed, they've become less needed or helpful and I've moved on to other methods of maintaining balance in my life: music, church, simple relaxation methods.

I think it is probably pretty normal and probably healthy to realize the need to change and move forward over time.

[Victoria'smom]

For me both were started at the same time.

[x123]

I'm thinking about this issue too. I tried to cancel my therapy, but my therapist convinced me to come in tomorrow and talk to her about why I want to cancel and what could be improved.

I can't think of anything to say to her. So I would be curious about what others have found beneficial in therapy.

[x123]

Looking back, therapy has only helped me in one way. Sometimes I have been able to discuss concerns that are too embarrassing to discuss with people who know me. In a few cases, the therapist has given me useful information about my concerns that helped me feel better.

As an example, I had a psychotic episode several years ago, but I didn't know it was a psychotic episode. I was really stressed about what God was trying to tell me and whether God might actually be Satan and so forth. This was several years after the episode, but it was still bothering me. I couldn't talk about these things with people who knew me, because I knew that they sounded crazy. So I was able to talk to a therapist, and she told me about psychosis.

That's the only way therapy has been helpful to me.

[vonmoxie]

Since I decided not too long ago that even in the midst of the biggest depressive episode of my life I'm still the only person suitably positioned to direct the management of my own mental health concerns, I've started considering therapist visits to merely be consultation meetings. I'm sure he has his own ideas about what they really are, or what he thinks he's surreptitiously providing to me, and that's fine. I ask him questions about the things I'm looking at, about various intersections of sociology and psychiatry and philosophy that I find helpful and enlightening, and when there are topics he doesn't know so much about I share the fine points I've discovered and ask his opinion. He tries to poke holes in the nature of my interests and also tries to insert his more psychiatric-industrial-complex hypotheses in their place, and in responding I get the opportunity to re-consider and re-confirm what I believe to be true, a more expansive and less industrial knowledge base that speaks to my intellect. I'm now at least moderately empowered by the same meetings I once found almost wholly depleting.

It's much better than whatever it was we were doing before. Talk therapy. I think he was even trying to do some re-parenting, which was really not up my alley, along with many other standardly accepted varieties of what is perceived to be helpful therapeutic methodology.

But that's just me, folks! If you're a fan of things that don't work for me don't bite my head off for finding my own variety of success. I only talk about it because there might actually be a population of others on this planet who feel the way I do and could be benefited by the solidarity of my expression.

I guess therapy is also feedback on your medications, if they are working for you or not, so they can adjust them. Also to see if you are stable so that you don't need monitoring anymore? That is the rational i come up with. I don't care for drudging up old crap to review over again with a new person after it had been long and buried. I think make peace with it, bury it and forget it. Then move forward. I tend to agree with it, it seems less effective. Perhaps because therapy is a bridge for people who are not there yet, able to move forward and need guidance to do so. tc

[DechanDawa]

Originally Posted by omegalamed

I guess therapy is also feedback on your medications, if they are working for you or not, so they can adjust them. Also to see if you are stable so that you don't need monitoring anymore? That is the rational i come up with. I don't care for drudging up old crap to review over again with a new person after it had been long and buried. I think make peace with it, bury it and forget it. Then move forward. I tend to agree with it, it seems less effective. Perhaps because therapy is a bridge for people who are not there yet, able to move forward and need guidance to do so. tc

This makes sense.

[DechanDawa]

Originally Posted by lolagrace

So it sounds like you need to seek out other avenues for solutions. What do you have in mind to try? What might work for you?

Therapy and meds were a starting place for me and absolutely necessary for a while there, but as I've progressed, they've become less needed or helpful and I've moved on to other methods of maintaining balance in my life: music, church, simple relaxation methods.

I think it is probably pretty normal and probably healthy to realize the need to change and move forward over time.

This makes perfect sense, so thank you. I listed all the holistic modalities I am presently using in the biography section on my profile page. It's a pretty long list so I won't duplicate it here. But I like your explanation.

[Mygrandjourney]

Originally Posted by DechanDawa

Why is therapy listed second after medications as the main treatment for mental illness? In the past, therapy was always my "go to" solution and yet, dear friends, I have to say it became less and less effective.

Maybe there is less of a need for therapy as you recover? In the past there were limited options regarding medications and therapy was thought of as the treatment of first resort. In the past 20-30 years, more medications have become available. That being said, people often need help and support from an objective party. Others, such as yourself, have come up with a solution that works outside of therapy. For those considering therapy, what is really important is to have some idea of what it is you want to work on and then collaborate with the therapist on the best approach to deal with the issue. The therapist should be able to tell you whether or not s/he is able to help you with the treatment issue and what approaches might be helpful.

[DechanDawa]

Originally Posted by Mygrandjourney

Maybe there is less of a need for therapy as you recover? In the past there were limited options regarding medications and therapy was thought of as the treatment of first resort. In the past 20-30 years, more medications have become available. That being said, people often need help and support from an objective party. Others, such as yourself, have come up with a solution that works outside of therapy. For those considering therapy, what is really important is to have some idea of what it is you want to work on and then collaborate with the therapist on the best approach to deal with the issue. The therapist should be able to tell you whether or not s/he is able to help you with the treatment issue and what approaches might be helpful.

Very clear, thank you. The last time I went into therapy I knew I wanted a therapist who was well acquainted with Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. Although the therapist I found said she was an expert in CBT all she did was give me copies of the worksheets. Before that I went to a psychiatrist who said he was well acquainted with spiritual and ethical issues as related to psychological health. I also found his so called expertise in this field sorely lacking. I really like what you had to say. However, I had some problems with management of medications by both a GP and a psychiatrist. I am happy the holistic field is opening up, and this is where I am now focusing. There are great workbooks out there now, which many members here have pointed out. This is a really great place with all the sharing of information. Thank you!

[BudFox]

Originally Posted by stopdog

I have found meditation to help me more than therapy - meditation is both calming and energizing for me. Meditation has never mocked me, blamed me for its mistakes, or intentionally messed with me like therapists do. It is in my control, does not involve another human, and I don't have to pay for it. Those would all put it ahead of therapy for me. As I would never subjugate myself to pharmaceutical companies and mds - drugs don't even make my list.

Amen to ALL of that. I read a book by a prominent psychiatrist and buddhist author (Mark Epstein) wherein he compares meditation to therapy in terms of potential for healing trauma. Use of one's "witnessing presence" during meditation can function to a degree like your own built in caretaker and healer.

I also do not consider drugs to be on the list, unless I found myself in an emergency situation.

[DechanDawa]

I think meditation can be therapeutic but should not really be seen as the same as therapy. I respect Mark Epstein's work but I think he should be a bit more conservative in his claims that medication can heal trauma. At first this seemed true, then it was found (in a program in Boston with veterans) that meditation often agitated symptoms of severe PTSD. I am a certified meditation instructor. I often advise students to seek out therapy if they have personal issues with extremely intense emotions that meditation highlights. This often happens with younger people who are first away at college and who are experiencing a lot of new stress. Sitting meditation practice might also not be good for someone with severe dissociative disorder symptoms.

[Mygrandjourney]

I guess the bottom line is, there is no "one size fits all" when getting help for mental illness. We are all individuals in that regard.

[DechanDawa]

Originally Posted by Mygrandjourney

I guess the bottom line is, there is no "one size fits all" when getting help for mental illness. We are all individuals in that regard.

Yes, I am beginning to realize this. I wanted a "quick fix" and now see it is smarter to create a program that will serve me long-term. I was having some mental health issues and let them go on without attending to them. We all have particularly stressful periods in life when things get off balance before we realize it. I am so grateful I found Psych Central. There is so much wisdom here and endless offerings from the good people here. I will never again take my mental health for granted, and hope what I put into practice will serve me long-term. Thank you.

[Cinnamon_Stick]

I think therapy is good for making changes to make your life better. I wish it wasn't so hard though.

[DechanDawa]

Originally Posted by Cinnamon_Stick

I think therapy is good for making changes to make your life better. I wish it wasn't so hard though.

It is soooooooooo hard. I'm with you there!

[BudFox]

Originally Posted by DechanDawa

I think meditation can be therapeutic but should not really be seen as the same as therapy. I respect Mark Epstein's work but I think he should be a bit more conservative in his claims that medication can heal trauma.

My take on the book is that he is arguing for both meditation and therapy, based on his experience as a both a therapist and practicing Buddhist. And he's comparing the similarities in the mechanism of healing. You would know more than I though. Interesting that the Buddha himself apparently healed his own very serious trauma (mother died when he was an infant) via spiritual practice.

I can say that my own personal experience is that formal meditation did not trigger any unbearable or overwhelming emotions or sensations (though some strong stuff did come up), whereas therapy traumatized me and re-traumatized me like nothing ever has. I get that the brain is a social organ and needs other brains to heal, but therapy clearly can be very dangerous.

[DechanDawa]

Originally Posted by BudFox

My take on the book is that he is arguing for both meditation and therapy, based on his experience as a both a therapist and practicing Buddhist. And he's comparing the similarities in the mechanism of healing. You would know more than I though. Interesting that the Buddha himself apparently healed his own very serious trauma (mother died when he was an infant) via spiritual practice.

I can say that my own personal experience is that formal meditation did not trigger any unbearable or overwhelming emotions or sensations (though some strong stuff did come up), whereas therapy traumatized me and re-traumatized me like nothing ever has. I get that the brain is a social organ and needs other brains to heal, but therapy clearly can be very dangerous.

I am sorry that therapy traumatized you to such an extent. That's really terrible. I have found that rehashing stuff in "talk mode" can be hurtful, yes. It definitely has become my least preferred form of healing these days.

As far as brains being social organs and needing other brains to heal...when I read this comment of yours a really bright light bulb went off in my head. This is why group meditation feels so good~! I haven't done much group meditation recently but your insight inspires me to dive back in. Thanks.

[AncientMelody]

Originally Posted by DechanDawa

Why is therapy listed second after medications as the main treatment for mental illness? In the past, therapy was always my "go to" solution and yet, dear friends, I have to say it became less and less effective.

What do you mean "listed second"? Some studies recommend therapy as the most effective treatment for generalized anxiety disorder. There are any different conditions for which medication and therapy are used, I've not seen a "meds always first" discussion here or elsewhere recently

[DechanDawa]

Originally Posted by AncientMelody

What do you mean "listed second"? Some studies recommend therapy as the most effective treatment for generalized anxiety disorder. There are any different conditions for which medication and therapy are used, I've not seen a "meds always first" discussion here or elsewhere recently

I guess I was saying that loosely. The last few times I asked for help medication was discussed first. Also, the last time I saw a therapist medications were discussed in the first session. My primary care physician recommended medication/exercise/therapy in that order. Medication and therapy haven't been working well for me and I suppose I am a little fixated on the "why" of various treatment methods.

[BudFox]

Originally Posted by DechanDawa

I am sorry that therapy traumatized you to such an extent. That's really terrible. I have found that rehashing stuff in "talk mode" can be hurtful, yes. It definitely has become my least preferred form of healing these days.

As far as brains being social organs and needing other brains to heal...when I read this comment of yours a really bright light bulb went off in my head. This is why group meditation feels so good~! I haven't done much group meditation recently but your insight inspires me to dive back in. Thanks.

Thanks. We didnt rehash all that much really. What was traumatizing was the nature of the relationship itself: Having an intimate relationship with an idealized caretaker who seemed to represent fulfillment of every need and desire, but who in reality could satisfy none of them, developing terrible dependency, and then having termination imposed on me.

I can't take credit for the brain as social organ thing. It;s from a book I'm reading. Glad it helped though. I also find it a helpful concept.