So no dating for "socially awkward" guys?

For the record, this has almost nothing to do with "finding love". At this point I actually have no desire to be in a committed relationship. Maybe that will change, maybe it won't, but as of now I feel like I would be ok as a lifelong bachelor.

However, what I am NOT ok with is feeling ashamed of myself for liking women because society has deemed them "out of my league" or "too young for me" or some other BS like that. I am basically a guy who "likes" women. And when I see a girl who I decide is "my type", I have this feeling like I am missing out on something, because I know other guys are enjoying the company and attention of girls like her. And when I see other "cuter" guys chatting up these girls, it practically drives me up the wall.

You say "when you were younger". Well how long ago are we talking about? Because by modern feminist standards, this guy's behavior would be labeled as "creepy" and "disrespectful to women". That is probably why I almost never see this happening. At the gym, for example, I almost never see guys chatting up girls, but when I do, it's always gorgeous guys under 25. This is probably because these guys have had so much success and gotten so much attention from women, that they developed a sense of confidence. But the rest of us average guys are instilled with a sense of shame about approaching women because society has socialized us to believe we aren't good enough for them. And it's funny, even the gorgeous young guys, from what I've seen they mostly tend to approach the girls who aren't "too beautiful" but instead just "kind of cute", probably because even THEY think they aren't good enough for the "too beautiful" ones. This of course gives those more "average" girls a sense that they are too good for us average guys. This is of course no equivalent tendency for beautiful women to prefer more "average" guys, they will pretty much all go for the pretty boy with the cool hair. Only real difference is that some want the pretty boy with the cool hair to also have muscles, while others are ok with him just being slim.

Nope. Men of all kinds approach women all the time.

Nope they don't think they aren't good enough as men of all kinds date all the time including gorgeous women.

Nope they have no sense of Shame. Sure everyone at times feel insecure but if you feel Shame doesn't mean others do too

Nope. Girls who are above average don't think they are too good. I am above average. Especially was when I was young emoji12]. Never in my life thought I am too good.

Nope. Society never conditioned anyone for anything and never deemed anyone out of your league or too young ( unless minors). It isn't real

Nope most women of any looks: gorgeous or attractive or average etc don't go for pretty boys with cool hair. Most people aren't obsessed with looks. I never thought I have to particularly like pretty boys let alone with cool hair ( how cool hair even look like? What if he shaved?? Lol)

Shadix until you stop living in fantasy land and actually start living in this world things won't improve. Go to therapy stop obsessing about looks move out of moms house and get your own age roommates sign up to meetups and dating sites get hobbies stop being negative and angry and start socializing. Whatever you describe isn't real. Start living



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Shadix, see if you can bring up some video of a TV show hosted by "Flavor Flav." He had hot young girls trippin over each other to win his attention. He was getting on in years and he was no matinee idol in the looks department. But he was warm. Check him out.

Hire a escort, She will teach you ways to build your self esteem and what will and will not attract women that you are hoping to have some fun with. You have allowed so much UN true things to enter your brain its a swirling mass of nonsense at this point.

You aren't looking for a love, romance and long term relationship ,You want to play , and there is nothing wrong with that, Nothing at all.

Since being in Therapy isn't helping you at all in this specific part of your life then pay someone that can help you .

When I said I was "younger," I meant about 25 years ago. And this guy was NOT creepy (the one asking the girls to dance). He was fun loving and the life of the party. If he was creepy, NONE of the girls would have danced with him! The point I was trying to make was, he made the best of what he had, and that was personality. I've seen it happen so many times that a girl (myself included) would go for the less attractive guy. The quiet one, or the bookworm, or the one who had that fabulous personality over the best looking man in the world. I rather like the shy type. Everyone is different, that's why there is someone for everyone, but you have to TRY! Love isn't going to come knocking at your door--you have to go out and look for it!

i can't get my life together enough to be considered a reasonable dating option. I have been unemployed for 4 years and I live with my parents and I am on the pension.

Obsession with looks yours or others really needs to be explored in therapy. It might be something to do with how you were brought up. My family tends to focus on superficial. Including looks.
Neither my brother or I got effected by that and we never went for looks but our parents sure made comments. Do your parents expect you date gorgeous girls?

i know many people of your age as that's exactly how old are my daughter and son in law and older nephew and their friends. None obsessed with looks. Please ask your t where is this coming from?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm 30. I've been in multiple relationships, but I'm currently single. I'm not "super gorgeous" or anything like that.... and my relationships have ranged from really hot body-builder, a successful lawyer, musician, shy poet, average 9-5er, high-school laborer........ see the range?

The range is varied in both "experience", education, appearances, success... Some of those guys could easily be as shallow as you seem to be.... but they weren't. They liked me, both for my appearance and my personality. Then again - some of the men I've dated? I'm more successful than they are.

I've never had to feel like some guy just "settled" on me because they felt I was more approachable. Every single guy who has been like that? Well, it comes across in how they behave when first talking to you. And I have turned all of them down - I'm NOT worth less because I'm not gorgeous, and I don't consider guys who are "too hot" to be beyond my league... nor guys who are less attractive than me to be below me.

I judge purely on personality and behaviour. This goes for relationships, and one-night stands. Some of the relationships I've had I would have never given the guy a second chance as their appearance wasn't what would draw me in. But they went for it, I liked their personality, and was like "sure let's give this a go".

I don't actually have much confidence in myself - I don't think I'm worth the time of day. But, I set standards for myself. I set standards for who I will get involved with. I base those standards on what I would tell other people - I deserve to be respected, treated like an equal, and accepted as I am.

I also remind myself of some more shallow things too - I've seen people in relationships who I definitely view as unattractive. Yet they're in happy, loving relationships or have no trouble attracting dates. I've also seen people who I thought were totally a**holes in happy relationships!

It's all possible if you put yourself out there. Pessimism and negative/shallow judgements of others will be the biggest thing preventing you from finding what you want - and you're creating that atmosphere allllll on your own.

Excellent post red panda. As always you nailed it

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yahoo answers? Really? No. No no nope. You are likely reading advice from an 11 year old. or a cat.

source: I married a socially awkward nerd. And I'm a good catch. ;-D

So... I'm 30 years old and have never been in a relationship with a woman... what, because of negativity and/or pessimism? So all those times that I asked women out in high school and college, they sensed some aura of negativity or shallowness around me and that caused the rejections?

I'll just bow out of this entirely. I apologize for my negative comments. I just... really don't understand relationships at all. I don't "get" people. I never have and it feels like I never will. And I guess those who are actually lucky enough to find people to be with can't understand how draining that loneliness can be.

Good luck Shadix. I really hope you're one of the lucky ones.

This thread is about shadix as it is his thread. He is very concerned about looks his own and others and never asked anyone out but is angry and pessimistic no one goes out with him. Responses apply to him, not you. So his situation is a bit different. What does your therapist say on this subject?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Oh no sweetie! You deserve to have a girlfriend!! Just not one that is a self-centered arrogant little b****! You need a good hearted, compassionate woman! Not some judgemental, Barbie doll want to be! You'll find someone. Don't give up hope.

Using the internet as a window to the world is dangerous. Take it from a total recluse.

You can find something to support whatever thought or position you take up and if you keep visiting those places, it will only fester and grow. It's not a great way to remain or become well-rounded. I'm alone because I myself can't overlook my flaws and quirks long enough to let people close - not because there's nobody else out there in the world who could overlook them because a few yahoo answers said so. Dating sites are often an awful experience for even the most beautiful and well-adjusted.

I have social phobia, very awkward socially and a Proud GEEK.

When I was younger dating was so difficult, eventually go married to the wrong girl she had issues and really only was with me because I seemed "safe" (HUGE mistake on my part)

So fast forward a few years, made several friends at a local DBSA support group. When my wife and I split up I was a bit shocked to find that at least four of my female friends were waiting/hoping my marriage would implode. These are women if I met when single would have probably not given me a second look if I tried to date them. But being friends with them first gave them an opportunity to see past my flaws and see the good person underneath

So my suggestion is to make friends, of both genders, let people get to know you, and see past the awkward exterior.

Then you could try what I was planning, join a church, not that I thought I would meet a woman there, but I would meet a lot of women with daughters, nieces, sisters ect that once they figured out you were a good person would want to fix you up with.

My advice - stop reading that stuff immediately!!!

I went down the same road - it's all rubbish! You are sampling about 10% of the world female's population about dating and relationships, and the young, inexperienced, judgemental portion who has access to the internet at that.

Avoid dating guru sites, advice sites, love sites, all of it, they are misleading and constructed by hurtful, narcissistic, horrible people.

Think about this - would you like to date women who have this opinion about men? I sure wouldn't. I would go for someone who is understanding, loves the individuality of the individual and who can see past faults.

It's ironic how they say - awkward people usually have mental issues which then affects them in turn - huge red flag right there!!! That individual is a narcissist - if they can take YOUR problem and make it affect them. Stay away brother, seriously, no matter how beautiful she is.

Find someone with a true heart, not a lump of stone. I feel so much for you having been scathed by this online trash that you have accidentally read.

Forget about women who go for alpha males and trying to follow a dating guide on how to become one to attract them. These women are going to hurt you for sure if they get their hands on you. I've met women who have dated "alpha" males who are full-blown drug addicts, alcoholics and are covered in bruises. So much for their good eye for good men that they claim to possess.

These people are extremely judgemental. Save yourself the misery of ever being in a relationship with someone like that. Just imagine, if they could hurt you without even meeting you, just imagine how they would be if together with you!

All the best brother! Don't be discouraged. Diamonds in the rough are hard to find in the beginning, but they are worth searching for. Just keep looking, and you will find.

Don't be tricked into thinking that these women you have read about are the ones you search for. I believed it too, and then there comes an automatic sense in me of having to "improve" myself to reach their level. Can you see how their words automatically make you feel lower than them? These "judges" are the lowest common denominator of human society, I'm not joking. Their riches and beauty covers up their flaws. Their gifts have gone to their heads and they've forgotten who brought them to the dance, stay away brother! You don't want a woman like that!

I think your assessment of Asperger's might very well be true, so I think social anxiety comes into it automatically, I probably have it too without even realizing it.

You are a great man already. Although I don't admit it, I'm pretty sure I have social anxiety too. It takes the right person to bring out your confident side. I know in my own life, there are just certain people who I feel comfortable with, and when I'm with them I verbalize a lot more automatically and "perform" normally a lot more. It's a feeling I get when I'm around someone - "this person expects nothing from me" feeling. When that is there, I open up automatically.

Half the time, you can't choose who you spend time with, and that's the problem. So, if you can find more people like the one's I described above (who have no expectations from you), then it'll be easier. You can't choose classmates, colleagues, associates, etc. nowadays because our situations force us together with people we normally wouldn't associate with. We then see how they do things and realize we don't fit in and what we immediately then think is, we need to change to fit in with them. Not true. We simply need to take more control of who we let into our lives. If you can cut out toxic people in your life or people who make you feel anxious or are highly expectant - do it! I wish I did earlier. I now sit in traps that were created by these people in my life because I didn't notice the kind of people they were. But, I am slowly recovering and finding exit strategies, but it's all hard work that could've been avoided had I seen things earlier.

All the best man!

I wouldn't say that guys are "settling" if they choose girls who are not "conventionally hot". The thing is, guys usually find more "average" looking girls just as attractive if not more attractive. But guys have this preconceived notion that those "conventionally hot" girls are more choosy and harder to impress. This isn't really true, but this is what most guys think, so many of them don't even bother with those girls. However, my observations have shown that this doesn't work the same way with girls. The vast majority of girls seem to not be attracted to a guy physically unless he has those "pretty boy" looks that very few guys actually have. So unlike guys, it seems very uncommon for girls to actually choose a more "average" looking guy over a "pretty boy" based on physical attraction alone.

I am not saying girls are more shallow than guys. Shallow means you care mostly about looks and ignore other qualities. I think girls do care about other qualities probably more than guys do. All I am saying is that it is much harder for a guy to be physically attractive to girls than for a girl to be physically attractive to guys. Basically girls are much more particular about what looks they find physically attractive.

Okay, I've read through this thread and think you have some pretty good advice from both sexes, but for what it's worth want to throw my own perspective in.

You remind me very much of a good friend of mine, he's quite a bit older than you (by 20 years or so) but is single and has said some of the things to me that you have said in your posts. I was shocked when he told me he has not once asked a woman out, he's had girlfriends but they all made the first move. He has said similar things to you in that he believes women are looking for a different type of man, better looking namely, he then goes on to list his deficits (perceived and otherwise). He also tells me he is not looking for a relationship but it would be nice to feel it was a possible option.

The thing is it's his own self-esteem issues which make him feel this way. The reality is that he's a lovely guy, lots of women would be interested in him if he put himself out there.

Addressing women and physical attraction - even when I was younger (and was told I was attractive, had my offers etc) I never went for traditional handsome guys, I always liked guys who were a little unusual looking, a little wonky (LOL), a little geeky - it was always their personality that really made me flip. Even now a guy who can make me laugh has my attention - my husband still makes me laugh, that is the glue that holds us together. Honestly, handsome guys have never and still don't do anything to me I'm just not traditional looks driven (although still love my husbands blue eyes and cheeky smile), IDK why but know I'm not alone in that.

Shadix, I hope you won't shrug off what I've written, there's a whole world out there waiting for you - do what you need to believe in yourself and go get it!

[QUOTE=Shadix;4579269Basically girls are much more particular about what looks they find physically attractive.[/QUOTE]

No they are not. (My phone won't let me do quotes today replying about girls are more particular about guys looks than guys are. Nonsense)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Your observations are biased Shadix - you look for "evidence" to support your insecurities, and of course you find them. But you also ignore all the evidence that proves you wrong. Your original post in this thread is proof of that - you did a search on yahoo and ONLY posted/believed the ones that already confirmed your worries.

My observations would show the opposite of yours, if that was all I was to go by. In fact, my use of the word "settling" on less attractive girls demonstrates my own bias from my own observations! My observed bias would be "Traditionally fit/hot men go for traditionally thin/modelesque women. The further from that, the more likely the male is to go for a less attractive woman as he will 'settle' and think that the less attractive woman is more desperate for attention and thus more likely to respond to his advances."

That would be my observed bias. But, by this point in my life? I can counter it, and I recognize that my bias is bulls*** no matter how much real-life experience I've observed (if we want to get into that... I'm often in male-centric groups while out drinking. I hear the guys plans on who they're attracted to, who they'd still hit on anyway, etc.). But I know that it's NOT representative of everyone, because not everyone is like that.

I know very few women who are particular about the appearance of a man. More so than looks, women that I know care waaayyyy more about hygiene. Does he take care of himself? That doesn't mean fit. That means clean. That they care about how they dress. That they aren't sloppy. They care more about manners. That can make a man attractive physically, not their actual body appearance. Then it's someone's personality - how does the guy interact with you? Is he respectful? Is he charming? Can he carry a conversation? Does he actually seem to listen to you? Does he seem intelligent? Is he arrogant? etc etc.... add and remove various criteria for different woman's tastes, just like men have their difference preferences.

Actually saying that someone is "settling" if they are in a relationship with less physically attractive person is very offensive.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, this actually follows through nicely with what I was saying too. You see, those people with the websites and things they know what you're thinking and it just so happens that the posts on there were supporting what you already believed, hence it seems like "evidence" that what you believe must be true.

It's extremely distressing, but I found that whenever you believe negative things about yourself, there will always be people who seem to agree, even non-verbally, yet when you believe positive stuff about yourself, nobody seems to agree (maybe again non-verbally). The key is not to assume you know what the non-verbal response is likely to be inside the person's head, because we simply assume if they say nothing it must be something bad they are thinking. You need to break away from that. I had that drilled into my head as a child by constantly being criticized by being ignored whenever I did something wrong, and that has carried over into my adult life. It takes hard work to try and not think like that anymore. Silence doesn't equal a negative feeling from someone.

Something "interesting" happened at the gym today which is pretty relevant to this post.

There is this guy I know vaguely whom I see at the gym, who basically looks like a model. A while back I noticed he seemed to be chatting up this girl. They might have known each other from elsewhere but I'm not sure, it definitely did not seem like they were together though. A few days ago I noticed him kind of chatting up this same girl, it still did not seem like they were together, but I did notice him eying her very intently at one point, as if he was stalking her or something. I have also noticed another guy talking to this girl a couple times. She was chatting with him and it seemed like they were friends. Well, today I noticed model guy interacting with this girl in a way which made it seem like they are dating or something. So at one point, I noticed the other guy come over and start talking to the girl. Model guy immediately got off his machine, came over and kind of put his hand on the guy, saying something like "hey don't talk to her". It immediately escalated into a shoving match and model guy's 3 friends rushed to his aid, basically ganging up on the guy who talked to the girl. One of them even lifted a heavy weight, threatening to bring it down on the guy's head.

So at worst, model guy is just a douchebag who thinks this girl is his property and he can't stand to see other guys talking to her. At best, the girl was annoyed by this guy and she had told model guy this, and he was trying to be play the heroic white knight by protecting the girl from this "big bad guy". It could also be about age. The guy looked like he could have been in his 30s I suppose, and the girl along with model guy and his friends look around 22-23. Who knows. But either way, it did not seem like the guy was harassing her or threatening her in any way, I heard them talking like they were friends just a couple days ago.

Moral of the story?

1. Approaching girls is dangerous. The world is full of white knight douchebags who are just waiting for their opprtunity to do violence on behalf of a woman. All they need is a pretext. Anything will do for some of these wackjobs.

2. When people say that approaching girls at the gym is rude and disrespectful, they mean only if the guy is not attractive. The rule doesn't apply to good looking young guys. This is why most good looking young guys have no problem meeting all sorts of girls even outside of college and never need to resort to online dating sites. It is obvious the rule is just a way to discriminate against less attractive men and older men.

Actually, that girl I had my eye on previously, the one I posted about on here before, douchebag model looking guy used to talk to her also.