So no dating for "socially awkward" guys?

I just saw a question on yahoo answers asking women if they would date a guy who is "nerdy and socially awkward." Here are two of the answers:

"'Nerdy and socially awkward'

That's not a beta male. A beta male is the average guy. A nerdy, socially awkward guy is at the bottom of the totem pole. He's not a beta, he's an omega.

No, I would probably not date an omega male. There's usually a reason why guys like that don't score with women. Many of them have emotional or mental issues."


"Nope.

Socially awkward people tend to have other personal and emotional issues that they need to deal with before they are ready to enter relationships and drag others into misery with them.

And I say this after having tried to help more than a few socially awkward people by trying to befriend them. It simply doesn't work. All it does is bring you closer to depression yourself by trying to deal with such people. They're called "socially awkward" for a reason, they are not capable of forming healthy relationships, even if they want to. They need professional help, not a friend or a girlfriend/boyfriend.

I'd totally date a nerd though."

Well I am socially awkward and have been in therapy for years now, and I am still socially awkward. Most likely I have sone issue like Aspergers or something like that. So then what about me? I don't deserve to have a girlfriend ever? If that's how it is then I wish I could stop EVERYBODY from dating so that I can make things fair and even. If I can't enjoy it then why should anybody else?

What were you in therapy for? The social anxiety or other things?
Why do you think you are socially anxious? What happens when your outside in a social setting? Are there certain people who you feel more anxious over or is it pretty much most people in general?

Unfortunately, when it comes to meeting women you have ... what is it? ... 7 seconds to make a good impression. (Others can correct me, but that's the number I remember.)

Which means you have to convey what they're looking for. In general, women are looking for confidence and health (traits common to an "alpha" male). Those of us who are socially awkward don't tend to exhibit these traits so before you even open your mouth to talk to them, most women have already decided that the socially awkward aren't worth their time.

That said, since we've brought up the whole alpha, beta nonsense, let those alphas and betas struggle. Alphas don't, in general, form lasting relationships and betas are too busy trying to on-up the alphas to take over their position. Instead, strive to be a gamma, these are the unique individuals that don't play the game and are genuinely nice people. Then the issue is finding a woman who is done playing the games, tired of getting cheated on by alphas and betas and sick of not being treated well. That's where you'll step in and form a long and fulfilling relationship.

Hang in there, women usually come around after time.

So.... you went to yahoo, and selected a few answers that reinforce your beliefs.

Other comments from the same site, when putting "nerdy socially awkward man" into the search came up with these (amongst others):

"First of all, don't generalize women based on some dumb show. I, and a lot of my friends, prefer nerdy guys for a few reasons:

1) They make the BEST lovers (maybe because they've had years to fantasize about sex, so when it happens--YOWZA!!

2) They are usually mature and not emotionally retarded like the pretty boys, and are great conversationalists.

3) Because they are not conventionally handsome, they make up for it with advanced education, successful careers, etc (paging Bill Gates!!)"

"It all depends.I don't think anyone wants a relationship with a "stupid person". I personally kinda like shy and nerdy guys, but I also like a guy who is confident. Really, it's all different, and I definetly don't really think about the genes"

"I have found that most women will give nerdy men the chance if they have sex appeal, attractiveness and confidence. Some women actually prefer nerdy men, but as you can tell, these women aren't too common or found almost everywhere.

Unfortunately, most nerds are introverted, socially awkward, unattractive, dislike partying or going out, which puts many young and hot women off.

Party girls are usually airheads that are extremely shallow and care very little about intelligence or substance in a man. They only care about attractiveness, and the stereotypical nerd isn't dubbed as the most attractive man on earth.

My boyfriend is extremely nerdy, introverted and shy. Despite being extremely nerdy by his likes and interests, he is very attractive and sexy."

"L, I am afraid that there is a lot for you to learn about women.

A beautiful woman who has class might actually, surprise surprise, want to date a man with brains. This might come as a shock to you, but there are some attractive women who actually enjoy the company of men who have an interesting world view and professional success.

Yes, they might have a bald spot, or say, thick glasses. They might also not have ripped pectoral muscles. But you know what? They have something interesting to say, and something worthwhile to contribute to the world.

They also, God forbid, might be men who are ethical and God-fearing, and loyal to their wives and mothers.

That is why you see attractive women with dorks. Trust me, it is not about the money."

"Haha I find the nerdy type attractive. But that's just me."

"Everyone will have their own opinion and nerdy isn't a bad thing. To me nerdy is smart and shy. I am not interested in star wars, but I play games on nintendo and the internet. My husband likes star wars. Every female will have their likes dislikes but it doesn't mean you have to have the same interests as they do and you can still be compatible."

"There are many women who do like nerdy men. I actually prefer them as a matter of fact! As long as you take care of yourself so that you look and smell good to a women, there is no reason for them not to like you. Nerdy men are usually very good and faithful in relationships, which tends to make women feel secure."

"My boyfriend reads big books and plays video games, and I like him way more than my ex who didn't read in his free time (and was also pretty dumb. Haha)
Just depends on your personality really."

....................

etc, etc, etc. You can find plenty on there to either work against, or for, your own prejudices and assumptions.

All of your posts treat women all the same - we're individuals, just like men. Each person has different criteria for what they find attractive. There are also plenty of socially awkward women who have the same frustrations that you do.

I don't think anyone considers bitterness to be an attractive trait though.

Well, one thing I should point out is that there is a huge difference between nerdy and socially awkward. There are lots of nerdy guys who are cool and charismatic. What is being talked about here though is guys who are just not good at social interaction, like guys with social anxiety or Aspergers.

I am not saying that all women think this way, I am sure many don't. But I think it is common for women to not be attracted to socially awkward guys. And really, there is nothing wrong with that. People can have whatever preferences they want. What I have a problem with is how they are basically suggesting that socially awkward men don't deserve to get a girlfriend and that girls are right to avoid them. It is as if they are equating socially awkward men with psychopaths or something. For some reason I don't imagine socially awkward women being stigmatized in the same way. I think there is a gender bias where society is really concerned about protecting women from men to the point where there is often an irrational paranoia.

Bitterness isn't an attractive trait, but neither is dishonesty. I am saying how I really feel, and if I said I wasn't bitter, I would be lying.

My boyfriend is on the Autism spectrum (Aspergers I'm sure if he had a diagnosis). While I wouldn't consider him socially awkward (he has developed a lot of good social skills), I would consider him awkward in general. And oh my gosh is he a nerd and a dork. But I love him and want to marry him someday. There, I've just proved that people with Aspergers can find love.

You might just be looking in the wrong place. I'm socially awkward myself (worse than him even) and am not the sort of girl that gets the attention for a lot of guys. Basically, all he had to do was treat me like I was important and treat me with respect. I never really got that from a man before. Basically, look for people like yourself. Then you can understand each other.

No offense, but you're sort of proving their point. Out of the billions of women on earth, you find two negative comments on Yahoo answers of all places, and then you make a ragey post here saying that you wish you could "stop EVERYBODY from dating so that I can make things fair and even."

In my honest opinion, being as gentle as I can here, you do have some stuff you still need to sort out. You are expressing a bitter and vindictive attitude, against billions of innocent people no less, over 2 Yahoo answer posts.

I am as awkward, cross-grained, nerdy (I go tractor spotting) and I have a had a few dates, not all of which have ended in disaster.

Women are unfathomable, and as an experienced if jaundiced observer of life I have noted that there seems to be a, possibly misguided, woman for the most unpromising men, you just have to give it a go.

And since when has Yahoo been a reliable source of information?

I've been "sorting out stuff" for long enough. My "stuff" is will get sorted out when I have a normal amount of dating experience for someone my age. I am 27 now and have never dated anyone. Am I supposed to wait till I'm 35 and 80% of the girls I am interested in dating consider me too old? It's now or never.

I find it odd that the same qualities that might see me get along with most women in general might make me undateable as well. Granted I don't get along with anyone enough to be friends or more than a casual acquaintance so maybe that's the reason I am unable to date also. But it still seems weird to me that women will be all nice to me but not one of them will date.

I didn't know that tractor spotting was a "thing". Fascinating! I like looking at antique ones, but they're generally parked and not in action.

There are lonely young women out there who would love to receive some male attention. Some of them are socially awkward. Some are nerdy. Find a young woman with a need that you can fill.

Will a girl who was captain of the cheerleading squad want to date you? Probably not. Will a girl who was home coming queen want to date you? Probably not. So adjust your expectations. That, by the way, is what most people have to do.

I'll have to delete later as not to be identified

This guy I am dating is as nerdy and dorky as one can be lol he also has OCD ( bad enough to have to be medicated in order to function), he also has Tourette's, it is profound but not debilitating . He is RN and in spare time he has " unmanly" hobbies. He Knits and he is good. And does some other cool but not typical guy stuff. Dorky is understatement. But He is just incredible.

I myself am not nerdy or dorky or awkward lol yet we connect on many levels. We aren't intimate yet but he is very affectionate and is a great kisser so I bet you he is good in everything else lol

So nothing wrong with dorky or awkward or whatever. Just because two random women post something on yahoo you now decide you are doomed? Please


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I hope what I am about to tell you is helpful. You've been writing about this same issue for quite awhile in various other posts. Since you have been in therapy for quite a while as well, if I understood you correctly in this thread, I question whether you have discussed this with your therapist and if you have, what her or his take has been on this subject?

If you have not discussed this with your therapist, I encourage you to do so.

If you have, and are still not satisfied with your situation, it is time to tell that to the therapist and to discuss whether finding another therapist or form of therapy for this specific issue might be a good idea.

When you do this, you will want to make sure to include the information about your obsession with youth, as that is very relevant.

Many skills dealing with the world--whether it be groups of people, or one-on-one, can be learned, and with practice, comes a lessening of anxiety.

How many girls have you asked to go out with you?

Also, what do you have to offer? Do you have an income? Are you someone who would treat a girl well? Do you like to have fun? Have you ever had a relationship with anyone that required you to put their interest ahead if your own?

What are your hobbies, interests, how do you interact with women, how many women have you ever asked out, what qualities do you look for in a woman, do you only want to date "hot" women or are you someone who can see the beauty in many others? All of those things will contribute to who you date.

Your "stuff" will NEVER be sorted or solved through another person. That is your job. Dating someone will NOT fix your problems - in fact, when it goes sour either from natural causes or from you somehow expecting them to fix you... you'll just reinforce all of your negative beliefs.

I think therapy situation is relatively new as we were suggesting therapy for a long time. I sure hope therapy will be helpful in sorting it social awkwardness and anxiety. Also as I suggested earlier since you have college degree and full time job at 27 is time to move out of moms house and live either by yourself or with roommates your age

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Well i think nerdy guys to me are attractive if they are respectful. usually they are more than a great good looking man. i don't care about muscle men, i fear them and think they have no brains. not all of them, but i find unattractive men more nicer as they are.

Yes I have told my therapist about my obsession with youth, but I don't think there is really anything she can do about that. In what way do you think it would be helpful to include it?

My therapist seems to be more understanding of my aspirations than most people I encounter online. She seems to think it is justified that I still want to enjoy casual dating experiences and potentially date younger girls. She says that trying to help me to have dating experiences is a good course of action. Most people, however, don't seem to understand that it isn't normal for a guy who is 27 and hasn't dated anyone to start seeking a committed relationship with someone his own age.

Yes I have an income, but I am not looking to settle down and be a provider so that shouldn't be an issue. Yes I think I would treat a girl well. Fun, it depends. I don't drink or dance, and I realize this could be a problem. My idea of fun isn't what most people would consider fun. I have never been in any sort of relationship, but again I am looking for a more casual college type relationship, not something where we will be living together. I am not looking to be tied down yet. I don't think I should be expected to just because of my age.

Don't want to share my hobbies and interests here because it can be identifying, never asked a woman out, not sure what I look for in a woman really, people find that out after they have had experiences.

As far as the last question, I find many different kinds of women attractive, but so does the general male population. It is a myth that only the women who look like Victoria's Secret models are "hot". But either way, I would never want to be with a woman who is only dating me because she can't attract anyone better.

Where you get all this from? Very many men of different ages do not drink or dance, you are the first person who says its a problem. My 25 year old nephew doesn't drink and has two left feet lol and he has wonderful gf. And by the way she is way younger than him

It's never a problem

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You keep making excuses to try to make it the women's fault that you're single....

Not all women want to have a serious, living together relationship. Even women older than 30! There are also many women who are just barely 20 who are hoping to be married and settled down.

How it saying what your hobbies and interests are too identifying?

And no, people don't just find out what they want AFTER dating around.

For example, we already know that you want: young women who don't want anything serious. What ELSE do you want? Sometimes having a clearer idea of what you are looking for can help you find out if what you're even wanting is realistic.

For example (using myself).... sometimes I think I'd want the sort of guy who would sweep me off my feet with classic chivalry. But then when I think about it more.... it would drive me insane: I don't like a lot of "classic" presents, and most of the men I've met who seem to try to be chivalrous are well.... sexist to some degree. Or at least much more traditional than I am! So something that I sometimes think I'd like? It really just wouldn't be compatible to me.

On the other hand - travel is very important to me. I love to travel. I would not be able to be with a man who didn't like the idea of me still travelling as frequently as I could - with or without him. Will I know what someone's stance on that is at the beginning? No, not likely.

I think you are just making life much harder than it really needs to be. You find fault in almost every ones advice. Life isn't always fair its not always going to give you what you desire on a silver platter with a pretty red bow... Its life, it is what YOU make it.

You can sit around and play the blame game, its your inability to dance, you dont like to drink , you have a mole, Im 27 it's unacceptable for me to date younger woman, I don't like bars, etc etc

The fact is you have never been in a relationship,you have nothing to base your beliefs on besides inaccurate data that makes no sense that you seem lap up around the internet on yahoo and whatever, even here... and it doesn't even apply. Maybe you sent off bad vibes, maybe you act strangely or make them uncomfortable or hell maybe you smell bad..

For goodness sake.... people are dating that have lost limbs , Blind, deaf, in wheelchairs and have life altering illness... Sure you want a hot gorgeous girlfriend, you want to play the field and have fun.. Then drop all the bullshyt reasons that you "cant" and go do ! Just go start talking to women, asking them out , you have NOTHING to lose, nothing , Your not going out on dates now , so suck it up and go DO instead of bellyache.

What Christina said! Plus: Your therapist can explore the whys and wherefores of your obsession with youth (I'd start with the sex aspect and the power aspect) and if you haven't gotten out of the starting gate yet after all this time with whoever you are seeing now, I think it is time to find a healthy heterosexual male therapist and tell him that you want specific help in developing fun relationships with gals.

And there are tons of places to meet women! Do you live near a beach? Wonderful place to soak up some sun, sightsee, and have pleasant conversations with pretty gals.

Get your hair cut at a salon that caters to men and women.

Go grocery shopping at a local market that advertises healthy stuff. Lots of gals are into healthy living.

Visit a no kill cat shelter. Gals love kittens. Go often. Volunteer.

Volunteer at an organization --the Red Cross, Habitat for Humanity, your local symphony orchestra, Special Olympics.

Get a dog and go to a dog park. A lovely friend of mine just got a dog and she is interested in the idea of meeting a nice man. See?

Attend local cooking classes, wine tastings, festivals. I know you said you don't drink. A wine tasting isn't the same thing as going to a bar and doing shots until you're under the table.

Join a dating service and state you are looking for a friend who would enjoy movies and dining at casual restaurants.

Go to the public library. You can walk around and see where the pretty gals are, and check out a book or cd and ask about book discussion groups.

If you don't have religious objections to dance, take dance lessons. You can also take fitness classes.

The key is to put yourself where young women are; to have fun or meet your own objective (a hair cut, a cd, getting your groceries) while you are looking for someone to meet.