On communication: how much should I explain?

Hello, I posted something similar in the school and study forum but this one is much busier, and I need some advice.

When dealing with professors how much should I explain? I am trying to improve my communication with my thesis advisor, so I am drafting a semester timeline with goals and a general outline of what I have now, what I need to do, etc. I am wondering if it is wise to let him know that I really need some form of acknowledgement/communication from him, whether it's just taking an interest in my work, even if I am aware it is not his specialty.

When he doesn't take an interest in my work and spends the time talking about his hobbies, I just let him talk because I don't want to force my thesis on him. And yes, maybe I am jumping from "he talks about his hobbies" to "he doesn't care about me," but this combined with some drama and gossiping over me in the department makes me feel very unsafe, like I am back at home dealing with parents and father. The professors had been showing a very rough draft of my proposal around and saying that this was why I should not do a thesis. It was really a brainstorming email to my advisor. Incidentally, my 'rents also have had me "sectioned" twice. As such, I don't feel safe showing my work to my thesis advisor, but will try to this semester.

These things combined are hindering my work to the extent that the biggest challenge is not academic, but doing the work in this department.


I am wondering if I should let him know I feel this way (unsafe, reminds me of the past, frozen). If I do, he would listen to me more instead of shrugging. But he might just say, as he has before, that "everyone has problems."

Or, should I simply give him the semester outline and say I will communicate with him weekly over weekly goals and accomplishments and ask that we both have scheduled days where we will email each other? I really don't feel comfortable in this situation, but it would be stupid if I had to give up due to personal, not academic, issues.

How should I approach this? If I should not tell my thesis advisor about my bad feelings, how can I get over them?

Thanks.

Do you have a therapist to run this by first? When I was having a tough time in my MBA program due to severe depression, I communicated this to my professors (one time in tears to my great embarrassment). They all fortunately understood and worked with me and I graduated with a 4.0. I'm conflicted about whether you should tell him because he seems self-absorbed (talking about his hobbies). In my situation, I did. Him having additional information to work with (including your request for acknowledgement) could be beneficial to you. What harm could it potentially do? Just my thoughts. I hope you come to a decision that brings you peace.

No therapist, so I'm asking here. Will try to stop by the counseling center, but I might not get an appointment for a week or two.

I worry that talking about my feelings of distrust and discomfort will make the department hate me even more.

The pros of talking about this would be that it might shed some light on what happened when I was proposing my thesis. I'm not going to say I don't see things clearly, but my past has made me sensitive to being sectioned, having people conspiring about me, having people out for me.

Thanks for your answer and glad you got through your MBA program successfully!

I am not a pro at human behavior, but the environment you describe sounds rather toxic. Even if they believe you lack at something, proper teachers should help you become better instead of simply making negative comments. Also, if your advisor prefers talking about his hobbies over giving you advice, talking to him about your feelings probably won't change much. But you can still try, I don't see it doing any harm. Have you considered getting a different thesis advisor? Sometimes, it is better to choose someone who is willing to help, even if his/her subject that is less interesting. Especially if not having enough attention hurts your feelings so much. I chose my thesis advisor almost purely about his helpful character, and it was the best decision ever.
Finally, do keep in mind that the teachers aren't your parents. They may act this way at younger ages, but in university many of them aren't like this. Some are more concerned about their research instead of their students, some take up teaching only because they can't find another job as scientists, some aren't indifferent but simply have zero skills in communicating with their students or helping them. Of course there are also some who are great for the job. Don't get all broken-hearted over it, it's their problem and not yours. Everyone does have their own problems, the trick is to find someone willing to care about yours too, at least in an academic level.
If you are to work with that advisor establishing a program from the beginning sounds like a good idea. It is good to be clear from the very beginning how you will work and how is he going to supervise you.

I can't get another thesis advisor because the department is small and I'm convinced I don't have a good reputation.

I would be very happy doing this on my own, away from any kind of institution. The toxic environment is why I want to have better communication with my thesis advisor. The toxic environment reminds me of my childhood, and is making me freeze up in my academic pursuits, so if I can communicate with my advisor more, I might be able to see that the environment is not so toxic. I'm just not sure how much I should tell him.

I don't know that I've gotten any advice from my teachers that I ignored. I don't typically ask for help, and people don't typically give me advice because I'm weird and they see something they cannot understand when they look at me. When I try to make myself a bit more approachable, they just look at me like I'm weird.


I don't think I will tell him anything about my childhood or why I am uncomfortable. I don't think I should bring up the past at all. I might just say I would like to work on being comfortable with sharing my work with him, because I value his advice, and so have structured our time together.

Whether he follows my schedule is up to him, but just pretending to work with him will make me feel a lot better, even if never responds. It would be better than what is happening now, which is an exact replica of my relationship with my father.

That being said, I don't expect him to be my parent. I don't expect him to help me. I just don't want to feel scared and unsafe around him, like I'm not allowed to talk to him. I want to be able to talk to him, even if this is not his area of specialty. I think that is reasonable.

Also, being open about my ideas will help me cultivate them, even if he's not directly helping me. It will also help me feel freer, and less like I'm being persecuted. That would help get rid of the bad feelings.

That sounds really nice! I hope he becomes more approachable over time. Another suggestion, if he's the type who likes to feel in control he might like it if you suggest he'd construct the program and hand it to you - pointing out you already made one in case he prefers that (and of course you'll have to make clear if there are some things you cannot have in the program.
By the way, is there a particular reason they think you're strange? (if you want to say)

Do you communicate with other science-oriented people outside that environment? Maybe even a simple participation in relevant online forums could help you build up your self-confidence and endurance.

My advice is to keep this relationship professional as best you can. That would mean no discussion of feelings or parents with him. I think that it would be good to say that you will communicate weekly and ask if he could give you feedback on what you write each week.

I agree that the counseling center might be helpful in addressing the feelings that he is eliciting.

Him talking about his hobbies is unprofessional so it would be good to think of ways to avoid this if possible as it is a waste of your time. But I recognize that it might be a challenge to avoid it. Maybe keeping the relationship by email as much as you can is worth considering? Perhaps he would not email you about his hobbies.

Im sorry that he is acting the way that he is.

So, all the communication issues I talked about in various threads here are going well. I decided not to tell him about anything, and sent him the outline with some sentiment that I am looking forward to working with him, and invited him to suggest other communication strategies if he wanted.

I think that on some level I am feeling guilty over doing the thesis and don't feel that I deserve to do it, especially because I "defied" what feels like the entire department in doing so. I guess I am very scared of authority. I'm still waiting to be punished. This is exacerbating my issues with communicating with male professors. I am realizing I've never done well with them. Also, I'm just very self conscious over things I should be over already, such as my male professor having a perpetual quizzical/awkward gaze, when he looks at people. When he looked at me it reminded me of being yelled at for making a face at my mother. I wasn't making a face, so this taught me I have a scary face. So I felt like I was being mean to my professor and I didn't know how to fix that.

It's not that my thesis advisor is mean, he's actually a very nice person, which is why I want to communicate with him more so that I can feel less afraid of this environment.

Also, I don't know why "I can't speak about my thesis" translates to "I can't think freely about my thesis".

Also, I feel weird about going to the counseling center to discuss something like this because it's an actual problem. But I will.

The fact is that my thesis advisor said my proposal was the best in years and was more well developed than any other ones. I don't think he would lie. Maybe he would exaggerate. But that still means he thought it was good and worthwhile.

That is great A good start for sure. Good luck!

Congratulations!

Well, the counseling center or a therapist had better be able to help me. Imagine, the rest of my life will be like this. Why do I bother?

Advisor sent a response that sent me dovetailing. Taking some time to stop and think. I can't tell if he's saying no? Why can't people just be blunt? Why am I so scared of him anyway? Usually detaching and avoiding works, but in this case it just makes me more scared.

I thought about discussing whether it is actually wise to do a thesis with a counselor or my academic advisor, but so much as a sneeze, my academic advisor thinks I'm suicidal. How can I discuss whether it's wise or not to commit time to doing a thesis, when I have mental health considerations? Right, I can't.

Similarly, counselors don't help. I have to water down the problem for them, and how can I do that when it's a real problem, and I don't know how to deal with it since I'm confused? It took me two posts to get to the real issue on this thread, so that means it will take two sessions with a therapist--enough time for them to get exasperated and drop me. "You don't want to get better.../why are you even here?" I'm not sure I can deal with this.

I have too many commitments, but who cares? I might as well just continue. There's no point either way. My life doesn't mean a thing to me.

Well I believe that it won't be like this, because through counseling, reflection, speaking here, time being used constructively, you getting more and more experiences with people other than your parents, making friends, and so on, I believe that you can heal and grow and your life will get better. That is my belief.

I would hope that you could discuss that with your counselor, that is a task for a counselor. Your academic advisor (most likely not trained in counseling) might not be the best candidate if those are his/her reactions.

Well I am sorry if this is how counselors react where you are. From what you said, it sounds to me as though the process of putting your thoughts together--on paper/screen or in spoken words--helps you think things through. That is a perfectly reasonable thing for a counselor to be expected to help you with. It may or may not take two sessions. But even if it takes two or more, I would be very disappointed if they gave you the invalidating comment you stated. A good counselor would not say that...but it sounds like you have experience of counselors saying that to you. Did they actually say that to you at college? I'm so sorry if they did. Perhaps you could try a different counselor in that event.

It doesn't matter. None of it matters--whether I'm insane, or stupid, or a liar, or who can help me. I'll just write my thesis.

I did not know this. I don't know how to use my resources, apparently. I don't know what questions I'm allowed to ask in each circumstance. I am very confused at everything to the point where I'm dumb and senseless. I'll try again.

Hi Emptynightmare. I just wanted to extend my support. I noticed you said you feel like you should be over certain stuff, like how your advisor makes you uncomfortable. You also asked why, in a way that led me to think again, you feel you shouldn't be uncomfortable / anxious about him. The truth / reality is, he makes you uncomfortable. Plain and simple, and that ok. Doesn't matter how old you are or young you are. there's probably a good reason for it, even if it's just the way he looks awkwardly and quizzically at you. I myself am uncomfortable with certain personalities and behaviors in people. Who knows, could be your intuition. I really liked the advice Bill gave you on keeping it professional. Especially if you do not trust him.

So it sounds like there was some drama with the other professors because of your mental health, like they were talking about you. And questioning your ability to write a thesis. I'm really sorry that happened. It sounds very uncomfortable and I don't blame you for feeling unsafe.

Why do you feel you have to water down your problem for the counselors? Some of what you said I'm confused about. Do you want to do a thesis? And they don't want you to? Do you have to do a thesis to graduate? You may have written this somewhere and I didn't see it.

Sorry if I am not up to speed with this. Just wanted to be supportive.

I think you would be allowed to ask your academic advisor about writing a thesis when you have mental health considerations, I just am skeptical that an academic advisor is in a position to advise you helpfully. This one in particular sounds extremely skittish, overly so. Excessive fear of mental health considerations comes from unfamiliarity with them, and is not helpful.

My advice, as a general plan, is to confine discussions of mental health to those trained in such: mainly, counselors, social workers, psychiatrists, psychologists. So if you were still thinking about whether or not to write a thesis, your academic advisor and thesis advisor can help you on how long it might take, whether or not you have a good topic, how long it should be, etc. But they will not be able, in my opinion, to help you decide whether or not your mental health permits you to write a thesis.

Okay! You can do it!

Okay. Good to know, because I'm not experienced in asking for/receiving help, and drama occured, so no one helped me with my topic, etc.

Obviously. I never quit. I was upset for a short amount of time, but it's fine. I'm rarely upset. Anyway, my mental health is technically fine. I have no diagnosis. I wouldn't know if it were bad, either. So it's fine.