[lil_rebbitzen]

Hey, all! I know it's been awhile since I posted...

Over the past 4 years, my mom and I have seen a lot of each other while I have been homeschooled. We each have been suffering from depression for some time (I've been suffering since 15), and as I come closer to being a psychologist, I've been trying to help my mom, who's been helping me a bit as well.

Well, being in a spiritual leadership position (Messianic Rabbi's wife = Rabbinit), she obviously has had to deal with stuff a lot, including losing several friends. (The following is crucial to understanding the situation):
<ul type="square">
[*]The first friend (we shall refer to her as Alpha), had another friend, Beta, who never really liked my mom, and has always been condescending. Well, Beta told Alpha that my Mom didn't like Alpha, so Alpha left, which hurt both Mom and I.
[*]The next one, Gamma, became a close friend to both Mom and I, and her husband basically became my Father's best friend. Well, my mom had a migraine one day, and my friend Mike went to pray over her (these were really nasty ones, BTW). Gamma and her husband then decided to accuse my mom and Mike of adultery. Needless to say, it was extremely painful for all of us, and we finally had to remove them (Gamma and her husband) from the congregation. This seems to have been one of the things that still messes with my mom to this day.
[*]Also, there have been several friends since that ended up leaving, each time leaving mom a bit more bitter. I eventually have learned to accept it as G-d's will and move on, but my mom has a bit more trouble.[/list]
Anyway, a couple of weeks ago, my parents let my brother and I stay alone at the house alone for the weekend while they went up to Helen for their anniversary. Well, a friend got us home late (as in past dawn) after Friday, and my brother (8 years) ended up telling both my mom and my Mimi. So the next Thursday, my mom hears about it, and when she asks about it, I made a bad judgement call and told her I didn't remember when we got in, maybe 2 or 3. She said she had heard it was dawn, and so she started distrusting me, despite the fact that I try very hard NOT to act like most teenagers and lie and do stuff behind my parents' backs.

This last Sunday, I was getting ready to go out with my adoptive brothers (Mike and Steve) for Mike's birthday. My mom asked me about it right before I went out, and got upset because I hadn't asked her. I replied that I had thought that Mike had mentioned it to Dad, (but, being him, he had forgotten about it, and promptly left the room to hang with Mike) and it escalated into a huge fight. Basically, she thought I was trying to go behind her back (which I wasn't. I figure it causes more trouble then it's worth), and threatened to throw me out (according to Mike, a common parent's response to older teens), and we basically had huge fight. She even tried to say I couldn't celebrate Dad's birthday with them the next night.
She was a bit better after I got back later that night (she and I finally stopped fighting, and she gave me permission to go and stuff), but she and I have been at odds a good bit this week. Part of it could be that my grandparents (her parents) were coming up, and she got stressed about the clean-up, but dear 'eavens...

She's also seems to have some issues with some stuff about me. Like, it seems to me that she thinks I exagerate my depression (I try very hard not to), that I overreact (which she does herself to the nth power), and she just has a tendency to take things out on me. She did it when I was a child, and stopped a bit, but now does it again. She also expects me to do many things that I can't/shouldn't do (like do my brother's book report for him), and gets p*ssed when I tell her that HE should do it. I've spent these past 3 years trying to build up my self-esteem so I wouldn't let myself get pushed around so much, and I'm so frustrated that it feels like she's trying to make me subservient again...
She also gets mad when I try to raise my brother Andy, but she won't do anything to punish him except yell at him, and won't teach him to take responsibility (which she accuses me of not having [!]). I'm already seeing him being a lot of the same way I became a few years older than him, and I'm trying to make sure he doesn't end up with many of my problems growing up, but she won't listen.

Also, regarding the fight, she said a lot of things that hurt me quite a bit, making me feel like I wasn't a good daughter and that she was embarassed to have me as one, especially with my depression and stuff. I've never felt that way before, and I actually found myself asking G-d to take my soul afterwards, so I wouldn't feel this pain. (At least I thought about that instead of hurting myself.) I ended up crying- no, wailing- for a bit afterwards, including during talking to Mike about it. Understand, she made me feel like I had betrayed her, which I hadn't. I have a very strong sense of ethics for friends and family, and I would literally die before I intentionally betrayed one of them.
I ended up apologizing for not being a good daughter to her, and she told me stop it. I don't know if she has realized that I actually felt like that afterwards, or she thinks I was being manipulative.

I don't know what to say to her. She tends to react very strongly to things, usually in a bad way. When I tried to tell her about me almost attempting to take my life when I was 15, it took 3 tries to sink in. The first time, she said she understood, the second time, she acted a bit shocked, and the third time, we had just gotten out of IHOP with friends, and she ended up flipping out in front of a couple of my friends.

I'm just really frustrated now. I want to have a good relationship with her, but she acts like this, and I don't know what to do. I'm going to see if my psychiatrist can recommend a psych to talk to, but...

Any opinions would be wonderful.

Thanks all!

Luv,
Cass

[AAAAA]

lil,

You sound like an intelligent, insightful, responsible young woman! Mother-daughter relationships are very hard. My mother and I are both bipolar and I think that has contributed to our problems in our relationship. Growing up I was never close to my mother, my dad's sister was my maternal figure and I thank God for her every day! She kept me grounded and let me know I was loved. My mother and I are close now, we lost my father three years ago unexpectedly and circumstances threw us together. My brother, her self proclaimed favorite is on the West Coast and is not very good about calling her.

Because of all of this history I have made a conscience effort to create a good relationship with my own daughter now 18. Here's the problem, we're both human and have completely different perspectives on everything.

For example when my daughter was about 14, her father, three brothers and I were going somewhere. She did not want to come, she'd made plans with her friend. When I was growing up, those things did not matter and created problems with my friends. I came up with this "great" idea, I left her money to treat her friend to dinner at a little cafe next to our house. This allowed her to go to whatever function she would have had to miss to go with us and to have some fun as well. I thought to myself "I would have loved to do this when I was her age." She views this situation as us abandoning her.

She is a beautiful, bright, mature and responsible young woman. She has been for as long as I can remember, so when she does something childish I forgot sometimes that she WAS a child.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that even with the best of intensions we can all offend someone we love. I've always been open with my kids. I tell them that I've spent my life trying to avoid them mistakes my parents made but I've made my own in the process. I love them more than anything else but I am human.

This open dialog between us is a wonderful thing, but it does have its down side too. She sometimes says things, without meaning to I'm sure, that are hurtful and disrespectful; at which point I snap into "mom-mode" and say "I love you, your opinion is important to me, but I will not be spoken to in that manner."

Sorry to be so wordy, but what it all boils down to is this: you can love and support your loved ones, but the only person that you can "fix" is yourself. No matter how much you love your mom, her issues are HERS, she has to deal with them.

Several comments that you've made give me the impression that you are attempting to step into the parent mode, I'm sure that she finds this insulting although I'm sure that you have the very best of intensions. Getting your T's advice is an excellent idea!

One more thing I'd like to mention is that when I am scared as a parent, this comes off as anger. Her response at IHOP sounds very much like fear and frustration. Until you have a child you'll never understand how very much you can love another person, with that love comes such a feeling of helplessness; the fact that we can't "fix" everything does not compute.

Good luck!

[Perna]

I think it is very hard being with anyone that much, what with your home schooling and all? The boundaries get a bit blurred, you're daughter then you're independent young woman; she's friend and confidant, she's mother. Lots of roles, not all of them very distinct.

Conflicts happen and negotiations have to be made in any relationship. If you come in at dawn, your own woman and then turn around expecting your mother to pick up and comfort you on your mentioning suicide attempts, especially when you don't think where and how you are discussing the subject (with friends/other people, out, at IHOP?) you and she end up on different pages it sounds like.

I would try to be more consistent in my own behavior and accept what criticism, comfort or response comes my way. Try hard to keep your own counsel and not retaliate. Just stick with the 5th Commandment as much as possible and your own actions should help smooth things over a lot so your mother quits driving you nuts?

[lil_rebbitzen]

huh? Oh no, the talk about the attempts was MUCH earlier this year. Sorry for not clarifying.

Yeah, I know I probably try to parent my brother. I'm trying to stop.

Hopefully, I'll be able to get a part-time job soon, so I'm not around her so much...

I think part of it is the different ways we think. I was around males a lot growing up, since I have more "masculine" interests (computers, video games, etc.), I had a lot more male best friends, and I started thinking more like them. She thinks like a woman ("spaghetti", basically meaning everything touches everything else in her mind.), while I'm more of a waffle-spaghetti mix ("waffle", being compartmentalizing).
I also have an IQ high enough (140+) that it is hard for me to do some things that normal IQ people find simple, which she has a difficult time understanding (not that she isn't smart, she has a fairly high IQ, I think. My dad, however, doesn't have the problem I do, and he's got a very high IQ, so long as it's one of the things he's good at). I try to do the stuff, but it can be frustrating for both of us when I'm trying to do something that most people find simple. Building things? I can do that. Computers? You bet. But stuff with my fingers (I tend to suck at crafts, for example) and things like checks? Have to ask how to do it every time.

[lil_rebbitzen]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
lil_rebbitzen said:
huh? Oh no, the talk about the attempts was MUCH earlier this year. Sorry for not clarifying.

Yeah, I know I probably try to parent my brother. I'm trying to stop.

Hopefully, I'll be able to get a part-time job soon, so I'm not around her so much...

I think part of it is the different ways we think. I was around males a lot growing up, since I have more "masculine" interests (computers, video games, etc.), I had a lot more male best friends, and I started thinking more like them. She thinks like a woman ("spaghetti", basically meaning everything touches everything else in her mind.), while I'm more of a waffle-spaghetti mix ("waffle", being compartmentalizing).
I also have an IQ high enough (140+) that it is hard for me to do some things that normal IQ people find simple, which she has a difficult time understanding (not that she isn't smart, she has a fairly high IQ, I think. My dad, however, doesn't have the problem I do, and he's got a very high IQ, so long as it's one of the things he's good at). I try to do the stuff, but it can be frustrating for both of us when I'm trying to do something that most people find simple. Building things? I can do that. Computers? You bet. But stuff with my fingers (I tend to suck at crafts, for example) and things like checks? Have to ask how to do it every time.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Alright, I talked to Dad about it, and he's going to talk to her after I go to bed. Here's praying I'm still alive in the morning. :P

[Junerain]

for lil rebbitzen,

I had a similiar experience with being betrayed by something my mother told me......when I was eight, I asked, ..'..Mom, do you ever wish you had a different daughter?..' Her reply was, "I DO wish I had a daughter more like, she named a girl in my class, a friend of mine, she said she wished she had a daughter that loved to read and was shy and quiet"

I feel the betrayal to this day.

I tried reaching out to teachers, camp counselors, friend's mothers, and aunts and uncles....I grew from these other adults seeing me for who I was, someone who had a lot of promise with the right environment in which to grow..

and I do believe you have a lot of promise, to become someone, well, to keep becoming more and more YOU..............

How did it go last night?

[lil_rebbitzen]

Sorry to hear about that, Junerain. But I'm glad you've grown in spite of it. It takes a strong person to do that.

No real idea about how the talk went. Asked Dad, and he did talk to her. I guess I'll have to wait and see...

[lil_rebbitzen]

Alright, a little bit of an update.

My mom seems to have calmed down a little since my grandparents left, which makes me feel better. She's helping me with getting stuff ready for school registration, so I'm making sure she knows I'm thankful for that.

She and I have psych appointments on Feb. 14th, so I'm going to ask if she can refer us to a psychologist. I think that will help us both out tremendously.

We're also supposed to start walking together in the morning and/or afternoon, and exercise is supposed to relieve stress, so...

Alright. I've got to get some stuff done before Sabbath service. Have a wonderful weekend!

[AlteredState01]

Just a quick note (and nothing to do with your thread, of course), but I'm pretty sure it's OK to spell out the word God, unless of course, it is against your beliefs to do so.

Don't know why, but I felt compelled to say...

[lil_rebbitzen]

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
AlteredState01 said:
Just a quick note (and nothing to do with your thread, of course), but I'm pretty sure it's OK to spell out the word God, unless of course, it is against your beliefs to do so.

Don't know why, but I felt compelled to say...



</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

Yeah, I know, but I'm a Jewish believer in Yeshua (most of you know him as Jesus; I prefer NOT to be considered a Christian because of the negative conotations it can have to my bretheren. Plus, growing up 'Christian' for part of my life, then converting early on [12-13-ish], it reminds me a bit too much of some of the beliefs I used to have :P Nothing against Christians, I just like embracing my bloodline and lineage), and I keep a lot of Jewish practices, one of which is using "G-d", or "L-rd". Just a respect thing.

My parents and brother are also the same, so thankfully that's not a contention point.

,
L_R