Trying to get out

T2 knows all about it and is trying to get me to report T1 to the licensing board. I've been writing T2 emails all week about how bad things are--the hysterical crying and panic attacks and wishes for death. I see him tomorrow night. I hope there's something he can do to help me. I just want to go back to see T1 again. I am not strong enough to deal with this level of pain. I'm just too worn down.

I wish pain "wore off" for me like it seems to for other people. For me, things never seem to get better. I never got over that rejection from the job 4 years ago. I NEVER got over it. It never got better. Four years and it never got better. I'm afraid this will be the same. My friends who know the story--even my husband who DOESN'T know the whole story--says it's very much like any relationship breakup--it hurts badly for a while and then eventually gets better. But things don't seem to get better for me. I don't seem to be able to pick myself up off the ground when I get knocked down anymore. I just stay stuck on the ground, flailing.

Normal people seem to recover from much greater traumas than mine. I don't know why I can't do it. There is something missing in me.

What If he won't take you back?

It really hasn't been that long since you stopped seeing him

I'm sorry you're struggling so much, Ramona. But I second what JD says--it hasn't been that long since you ended things with him. It's normal to still be grieving at this point. Don't assume because you feel bad now that it's always going to be this way. Hope that seeing T2 will help you a little. For now, take care of yourself...

But thats what the serenity prayer is about. Accept what CANT be changed, change what can, and the wisdom to know the difference. Its not trivial.

At least I'll know I did everything I could.

Sorry to hear about how things have gone Ramona. I was hoping you wouldn't end up feeling like this.

I just miss him SO much.

im still thinking about you ramona and rooting for you

I'm sorry this is so difficult right now. I would ask myself a questions though...

You miss HIM or the illusion and feelings you had in response to him? Because if it's the feelings, you could probably experience that in another, healthy relationship that nourishes you instead of this destructive one.

On the persistent pain and grief, I believe that time heals many things but for some, we need to make hard efforts to change our lives and perspective in order to recover and move on.

I think I honestly miss both. The amazing sexual feelings I had with him were very intermittent and unreliable. They were only present during a handful of sessions over three and a half years. I do miss those, but more than anything I miss his presence--having him in my life, having another appointment to look forward to--another chance to be close to him. I'm already grieving so much of my future that I won't get to share with him. I'm definitely upset I won't get to share the sexual feelings I have for him with him anymore. If I'd just kept my mouth shut none of this would ever have happened and I could still be seeing him.

There has to be a way for me to go back. I am wiling to sacrifice a lot just to be in his presence. He doesn't have to reciprocate anything anymore. I just want to be close to him again, and not be shut out. I need him in my life.

Seeing T2 tonight for the first time in 9 days tonight. Praying that he can help me find some relief.

Yeah clearly you do.


You know, I don't know if this is helpful or if you want to read this kind of thing right now but.

Some personal stuff--even when I left my therapy, I still had this fantasy we would be together...

I mean, there's this thought process that goes like, somehow it could work.

Like, because it felt that way, because there was never any malice, because, desire aside, we both cared so much for each other and wanted so much for each other... it should have a way to work.

Then over time, once I recognized that without her I was even weaker than I thought I would be, and how much that separation had devastated me on purely just a physical and chemical level, that thought of "it could work" eventually changed to "I just want to see her again. I don't care how. I just don't think it should have gone this way and she wouldn't have wanted this for me."

I don't know, I just wanted closure at that point, wanted to be free of this wound in me that apparently would never stop bleeding, it was too real and I was too alone with it.

Maybe I could get closure by growing to resent her, nullifying what I felt for her, or forcing some other kind of concrete conclusion, like reporting her, or whatever. Because sure, she wasn't a fully competent therapist, that much was true.

But, I ultimately realized that it was something I just couldn't touch. It existed in too deep a place in me. She became a part of me, attached to something at my core, and that was a place that I didn't even have control of.

It's just a truth. Everything I felt was true, at least at the time when I first felt it. At one point, it was true.

It's not far, it's not close, it's just there as a reflection of who I am. It will be there no matter what I do or don't do about it. She didn't create it in me, it's just there.

The problem is, I get addicted to when it felt good, even though those things aren't happening anymore. I try to bring her closer to me, I want her back, I want more. The harder it is to make that happen, the more I hurt myself by longing for it to happen, because I become detached from the life that exists around me which I can actually do something about.

In that way, it's really like an addiction to a drug, even if it's one that your body produces in response to your thoughts. And that's what was so damaging, I didn't need her to be there or to do anything to fuel this addiction anymore, I could keep reliving the past without her there, and keep getting worse by doing that. Without expressing this inner reality to someone, or doing anything about it in my life, then it just became a collection of stale and repetitive and increasingly harmful memories.

You have to treat it like a drug addiction. And like with all addictions, the more you indulge the addiction, the more addicted you become, and the harder it is to live without it.

How it felt isn't wrong, but running away from your life back into that feeling is wrong. It's the same choice as it would be to take another hit or down another bottle, eat another meal, whatever. It's literally indulging a chemical addiction that you're suffering from. It's not supposed to be substituted as a solution to the real problems you are facing.

On the other hand, that feeling, if you learn to just let it be, is a pretty good compass for the changes you want in your life. You can't go from the feeling, back to your life. You can't escape reality or impose a fantasy upon reality. You just have to recognize what real elements of your life can or cannot give you some percentage of that feeling. That way, you know more what would make you happy, so you can see what you will need to change in order to be happier.

What you think about is powerful. You have tapped into a drug that you can produce in your body, by going "away" from the present moment. It doesn't really say much, either way, about your relationship with your T, it's just plainly a chemical dependency to this behavior of going into fantasy. It's so much context that is so far removed from what is really happening around you. And also, you have built up what it means, what it looks like, what it might be or could be, which even gradually made it removed from your therapy itself and your T himself.

How you feel about your T--that may not change, it's hard to say. But you can get over the addiction to feeling that way.

Right now, you just need to recognize that what you are going through is a withdrawal phase and you need to do anything you can to keep yourself focused on your real surroundings in the present. I know it hurts. But the level of pain is temporary and every time you work on being here and now, it gets a tiny bit easier. You need to accept that what you felt for your T is fine, and you need to just let it be. You need to stop wishing it would solve your problems for you, or that he would solve them. You will find a way to the people and things that are meant to be a part of your life, as long as you are actually paying attention and participating in your life.

It's really a choice that you have to keep making. But, at least it helps to be making it consciously.

I dunno, hope that helps. It's just some of what I've figured out for myself.

You can't go back. Too much water under the bridge. The relationship is not healthy. Look at the damage it has left you with. Look at your mental state. That should have NEVER happened with an ethical professional. Going back will only lead to more hurt and grief. It will not fix things; it will only create more drama and more wounds that at some point, you are going to have to heal from.

Any closeness with him was an illusion that he allowed to be created; there was no reality in that closeness. You idealized him and created a fantasy world around him, and he encouraged it when he shouldn't have. That was unethical and unprofessional.

You can't continue to live in a fantasy world. You have a very real life: a husband who seems to be very supportive of you and a dear son. They are your reality, and somehow with the help of your new therapist and with lots of time, you will hopefully be able to come back to that reality and appreciate it. This is a grieving process and it will take much more time than this short amount of time it has been.

Have patience with yourself, and do not return to that very unethical and emotionally manipulative situation.

Please please please don't go back to him, Ramona! It won't make anything better, it will just prolong your pain.

Was going to suggest rereading your own post Ramona but there it is!

It's easy to look back (especially at first) and romanticize.the whole thing. Ignoring the bad parts, longing for the good again... it's what kept you in that cycle of wanting him, going to see him, and leaving angry and distressed

Thank you for this. It was very kind of you to take the time to do this and put all of my own words right there for me to see. Truly. Thank you.

I just got back from T2. He says I need to tell my husband. Not every gory detail, but I need to tell him these things:

-that I developed an attraction to T1 and had sexual fantasies about him after our hands brushed once; that I told T1 about it and that at first it was fine and actually made me feel relieved and feel less shame about my sexuality, but that then T1 started acting very strangely, saying very inappropriate and acting inconsistently--warm and kind and encouraging me to talk about my fantasies sometimes and cold as stone at other times; that it really ****ed me up; that I'm sorry I didn't tell him about it earlier but I was scared.

He told me to tell him first thing when I got home tonight and not to let it fester a second longer. He said that the lying to my husband and best friend is what's making me sick--that I'll still feel sad about T1 but I won't have this sickness and panic in my heart and churning in my stomach--that that's from not being truthful with my husband.

And here I am not telling him. He's in the kitchen cooking dinner and I'm here on this message board hiding from him. I am so afraid he will leave me. Even if he doesn't he will definitely be angry with me. I am a coward.

I really appreciate you sharing this. It very much rings true for me. Maybe it's because I just came from T2 a couple hours ago and am feeling more normal and grounded right now, but I'm actually able to take this in at this moment. I'm glad to hear that you're feeling better. I'm going to read this again in the morning. That's when things are hardest for me.

I wonder if it might be a good idea to have your husband come to a session with T2 so that T2 can help explain things like transference for him.

T2 specifically offered to do this last night but I'm worried that my husband will feel ganged up on. It sure would be a lot easier for me to have some backup in this situation, but I also feel like I don't deserve to make it easier on myself. I should be doing whatever I can to make it easier on my husband, not myself.

I told T2 I'm full on ready to go back to T1, to which he replied: "You ain't going back there...EVER."

Then he reminded me of my last session with T1 and asked me "Were you impressed with his work during that session?"

To which I said: "No. He was mean."

To which to T2 replied. "He was an ASSHOLE."

Now, I'm planning on spending the next week writing out what I'm going to say to my husband, and then practicing it with T2 next week, and telling him next Wednesday night. My husband has therapy the following night, so I'm thinking that will give him a chance to have support right away after I drop this bomb.

I feel like a real asshole. T2 kept repeating that the one and only thing I've done "wrong" in this whole thing is keep it from my husband--that the rest is all on T1. T2 also says he doesn't believe I ever would have actually submitted to a physical relationship with T1 and that if T1 had offered it I would have panicked and run. i wish I had the confidence in myself to say that was true, but I think I would have gone for it. I think I would have cheated.

The interesting this is that I'm actually feeling better this morning--physically and mentally. I don't feel FANTASTIC but I'm not feeling the horrific panic I've been feeling for three weeks and the choking and squeezing. I know that they will return but this is the first few hours of relief I've felt in three weeks.

I am SO scared to tell my husband.

Glad for you.

Having a PLAN is so helpful when I am panicked about something.

You're doing amazingly, Ramona

It is such a relief to have a few hours where I'm not having explosive diarrhea and feeling like I can't breathe. I don't know how long it will last. That's the hardest part.

In case it helps at all, I've told 2 long-term partners that I liked my T. In both cases it opened up the conversation about issues in these relationships. I'm not saying it wasn't hard. But it was very much needed. Frankly, I think every married/long-term couple needs to have a conversation about being attracted to other people in general. It's a separate topic, but I think assumed/enforced monogamy is the root of a lot of heartache.