Which comes first?

Which comes first, having good self-esteem or doing things to build your self-esteem? I guess they're both important, but I'm starting to think you can't do good unless you first believe that you are good.

We have a grand old tradition in my family of origin of withholding praise for fear of giving someone a big head. For most of my life, I think I internalized that behavior completely. After every achievement, I would say to myself, "Nope, not good enough yet."

After a while, I began to believe that no amount of good deeds would get me the pat on the head I was looking for. What's happened is that, instead of pursuing positive goals to win my own approval as well as that of others, I came to believe I was no good, and I went and did things to try to prove that instead.

Then, when I decided to change my ways, I really overcompensated and wore myself out trying to prove how good I was, hoping that I'd eventually believe it myself if I just worked hard enough. Just had a good chat with a guy at another site about all this, and now I'm going to try to operate from the premise that I'm good to begin with, and I don't need to pile on the accolades to prove to myself and others what I'm worth.

My fear for most of my life was that holding myself in high esteem would lead me to become lazy and complacent, and to not care much about others. I felt that I would work harder if I felt myself unworthy of the goals I was pursuing. I found instead that all my fears came true when I held myself in low regard, and then some. Not only did I become lazy, complacent, and uncaring, I did things to try to silence the voice in my head that said I was no good, the voice I felt I had to hear. The voice of my stern, disapproving ancestors. I think they were all in survival mode.

So, really, that approach didn't work at all. I don't know why anyone in my family ever thought it would. Maybe it did at one time. I'm trying something different now. Not an in-your-face, how-ya-like-me-now kind of confidence, more just like, whatever happens happens kind of thing, and I will be fine regardless. I am going to try not blaming myself for every bad thing that happens in this world. I did not start the Middle East conflict.

If I mess up, I'll try to make it right. The old me would have said I can only do bad things, so there's no way I can fix it, whatever it is. This new guy can say, "I'll do my best, we'll work it out, I'm sure we can come up with something."

Maybe there is a proper time for being self-critical, but I don't think it can go on forever. If it does, when someone gives you even the tiniest bit of praise, THAT'S when it goes to your head.

This new approach still feels a little weird, but good. Maybe there's a break-in period, like with new shoes.

It's a chicken-egg problem, Swede. Don't fool yourself. That's the kind of logical trap everyone's unconscious adores playing games with. What do you do? I'll tell you: You just hunker down and spend all your guts "doing good" without thinking about whether or not you first believe you're good. Your unconscious can play games. It's up to you to tell it to cut the crap and then do what you have to do.

Maybe. Maybe not. You know, everyone can construct good story lines. I mean, every single homo sapiens does cause and effect really beautifully. It's inherited. Even if it ain't so.

I don't buy it, Swede. It doesn't feel right. It feels too cut and dried, too Sunday School, too 19th Century. I'm not at all down on you in any way. My little binswanger just tells me that you're trying a bit too hard to be credible.

That sounds reasonable. I'm all for it. You probably ARE good to begin with, and do not need to pile on the accolades. Just be you and don't try too hard. Be the good guy you really are. You really DON'T have to finesse everything. You're a decent, intelligent, perhaps mildly but not terribly neurotic, educated guy from a good background who's very much up to doing pretty much anything he's tasked to do! No kidding!

It sure sounds like you're on the right track now! And yes, ALL of our families bring GENERATIONS of ethnic mental hangups to bear on every new baby. I'm sure you got the full dose, like almost all of us. Which is one of the truly great things about this country. Right now you have half Filipino (Americans)/half Jewish (Americans) marrying half Scots-Irish (Americans)/half Portuguese (Americans). And that's just in MY family. From the point of view of future mental health, I think it's great!

Lad, you ARE on the right track! My hat's off to you! You've got it now! My money says you and yours are going to be fine! Great to make your acquaintance! Take care!

Thanks, Y!

I guess I'll have to respectfully disagree with you on this for the time being. I've tried having an adversarial relationship with my unconscious for most of my life, and where has it gotten me? Two psych hospitalizations and years of therapy. Sometimes, the critical voices are so loud I think other people must be able to hear them (I'm actually not kidding on that one). I'm hoping that self-acceptance, among other things, will get me on the path out of this mess. If it doesn't, then it doesn't, and I'll try something else.


Well, when I wrote that, I had my born-at-the-turn-of-the-century, French (Canadian)/Scottish (Canadian) grandmother in mind. She seemed to think I was just the Devil's spawn for some reason. I was a messed-up kid, I'll grant you that, but that woman never had a single kind word to say about me. She never had much nice to say about anybody, really, but I was the only grandchild whose picture she took down off her wall. What the hell did I do to deserve that? After a while, I pretended like I didn't care whether she liked me or not, but I feel like I'm still trying to win her approval, even though she's been dead for 20 years.


Here I think we're in full agreement. The more viewpoints and approaches to communication the better, which is why I went and married an Italian-American!


Thanks, man. Good to meet you, too. Have a great weekend!
HS

Oh, my! I'm sorry, Swede. I hadn't realized at all that things had gotten that bad in the past. I apologize. I thought you were just dealing with normal moodiness. The bootstrap proposal I wrote about to you would only be for someone whose difficulties weren't as severe as yours. I'd agree with you that self-acceptance would be an approach that had to be checked out and tried.

Did your family live with your grandma so that she would have such a strong effect on you? Many of us never saw their grandparents that frequently, that their approval or disapproval could count very much. Is there a streak of depression or other illness in either side of your family? Do you think that your grandma herself was all there?

And thank you for the friendship request! Glad to be your friend! Take care.

It's okay, Y! The only way to find things out is through dialog, I believe. Sometimes what you find out can take you aback, but no one should shy away from the process because of that.

I also believe that a good chunk of anyone's recovery effort has to be achieved largely through his or her own steam, though there have been times when I have had to depend almost completely on other people. That right there is one of the things I have had to accept about myself. Lately, though, I have been much more able to give aid to others, so I'm glad about that.

I saw her and my grandfather at least as often as every summer and Christmas growing up, for several weeks at a time, and she was generally a major presence in our lives, always offering her unsolicited opinion on things. My sister's partner was the only one who ever stood up to her. It was quite gratifying to hear about it. I wish I had been there.

If I find a place that smells like the basement of my grandparents' house, it takes me back. My wife's aunt and uncle's front hallway in Boston smelled exactly like it. Uncanny. And there's a park not far from here where the field smells just like the fields around my grandparents' farm. It's a really powerful trigger.

There is definitely depression in my family, and just a general inability to identify, acknowledge, or discuss emotional states and interpersonal conflicts. I am s-l-o-w-l-y starting to be able to talk about these things with one of my sisters. Very late in the game, but I'll take what I can get.

My grandmother was definitely all there, very hardworking and capable, managing the home front while my grandfather was out canvassing the countryside selling tractors and things. However, she was utterly incapable of expressing what she was feeling in any sort of mature way. Her frustrations came out as sarcasm or just general condemnations of the state of things, and a lot of sniffing. She had absolutely no clue what to do with a sensitive kid like me. She had no words of encouragement to offer. I think she must have thought I wouldn't have lasted 10 minutes in the world she grew up in. Maybe she had a hard time believing that someone as strong as her could be related to someone as weak and lazy as me. Maybe she was just afraid for me.

On the other hand, she may also have been quite insecure. I could be pretty sarcastic, too, and she may have been afraid to talk about what she was actually feeling for fear of ridicule. I was also the city slicker and she was the country bumpkin. That dynamic got more pronounced as I got older.

I think the only time I remember her opening up was when my grandfather was dying of Parkinson's. Finally, under great duress, she did tell my mom that, yes, she was afraid.

Not the greatest situation, but it is what it is. I have to find a way to move on, forgive her, forgive myself, etc. A little progress every day, right?

Very glad to be yours, too, Y! All the best to you. HS