[CantExplain]

Where does self-worth come from?

[leejosepho]

Affirmations and confirmations from others can certainly help make a difference, but maintaining a clear conscience before our Maker is the biggest thing that makes the biggest difference for me.

may trigger-- religious

my worth and value comes from what God says about me in the Bible. He says I am fearfully and wonderfully made,that I was put hee for a reason. that He loves me, that He made me, that He thinks about me. i dont compare myself to others, nor do i worry about what other people think lf me.
People can think whatever they want. I know what God says about me. Thats where my worth and value comes from.

[childofchaos831]

As a non-religious person, this question is a little difficult for me to answer.

Some people do get the sense of worth from whatever religion they subscribe to, and I respect that.

I, however, don't believe in a traditional God. I am not atheist or agnostic. I am spiritual and have a belief of my own that I do adhere to, but I don't gather my worth as a person from that belief.

I hold to the fact that every person is born with the same amount of worth as any other person. Our actions as human beings do not add to or take away from that worth.

I am no more worthy than a drug addiction begging for money on the corner and no less worthy than the billionaire donating millions to feed the hungry. We are all worthy.

Put a man in front of me, and tell me he seriously hurt someone. Does he deserve to be punished? Yes. Does it make him any less worthy of life? No.

I do, still, have days where I feel less than other people, less worthy... even though I feel less worthy, my worth has not changed. My perception of it has.

[TrailRunner14]

To me, I believe it comes from where the desire of your true heart is rooted in.

Sometimes, maybe, it's not understood until a shattering is realized and you understand what your self worth really is to you.

[Rose76]

Originally Posted by leejosepho

Affirmations and confirmations from others can certainly help make a difference, but maintaining a clear conscience before our Maker is the biggest thing that makes the biggest difference for me.

What man has a clear conscience before his Maker?

[Onward2wards]

Good question. My thoughts on what increases self-worth:

* Living up to your own values
* Managing yourself well - not too impulsive, not too inhibited
* Quality connections with other people (i.e., you are not socially isolated, you treat them well, and they are supportive and friendly)
* Encouraging feedback from other people (frequent criticism, rejection, being "micromanaged", or outright ostracism feels terrible for anyone and seems to be a major component in low self-worth)
* Being assertive (rather than passive, passive-aggressive, or aggressive)
* Having control over your life
* Learning and using skills that you intrinsically enjoy - that builds a sense of competency

I think that if we have gone through too many periods where we don't have enough of these things in place, it can leave a long term mark on us. I suspect that self-worth and self-confidence are somehow connected in ways I can't fully define (this is because I have tried working on one, and find to my surprise the other can also be affected).

A nasty problem is, when self-worth is low we tend to NOT do all the things necessary to increase self-worth. Same problem exists with self-confidence. I have no idea why this is so.

Referring to a post above, religion has absolutely no part in it. I am responsible for my own sense of self. It doesn't just happen.

My self worth has grown stronger through my CBT. I have learnt to challenge those negative automatic thoughts that tended to berate myself relentlessly. It has been a lot of hard work but it has paid off.

[leejosepho]

Originally Posted by Rose76

What man has a clear conscience before his Maker?

The one who does not claim righteousness either of or from within himself.

"God often goes to the gutter to find the recipient for His grace. He lifts him out, washes him and transforms him - making him into a child of God fit for His kingdom. That is God's grace." --Chuck Smith

[Patagonia]

I have no idea where my self worth comes from, but I know it has fluctuated in value thru my entire life.
I know I use a mirror & try to see my worth in others & how I'm reflected....then sorely disappointed.
Some find it in religion, but mine keeps changing. Some find it in values & mine keep changing too. Everything in my life now seems very fluid & constantly evolving as I guess my worth is too. It can change daily.

[Eclecticist]

I believe having a sense of self-worth comes from having some set of standards (or principles, or goals, or moral beliefs) for yourself, and then also meeting those same standards.

What those standards are and where they are derived from can vary. But I think, in general, people who feel they have met their own set of standards feel happier about themselves than those who feel that they haven't.

[Ohxpoorxme]

I recently discovered my self esteem issues are related to my feelings of abandonment when I was a child

[leejosepho]

My esteem of myself -- my so-called 'self-esteem' -- and my sense of worth, worthiness and/or so-called 'self-worth' are not all the same, and I might never get those things completely sorted!

First from Webster:

Esteem, verb
1. To set a value on, whether high or low; to estimate; to value.
2. To prize; to set a high value on; to regard with reverence, respect or friendship.
e.g. When our minds are not biased, we always esteem the industrious, the generous, the brave, the virtuous, and the learned.
3. To hold in opinion; to repute; to think.
4. To compare in value; to estimate by proportion.

Esteem, noun
Estimation; opinion or judgment of merit or demerit.

Webster's Dictionary 1828 - Online Edition

As has been mentioned, the first issue has to do with what standard is to be used as a base line...and then we ultimately deal with the matter of who or what is to be our actual judge.

My mother and her two sisters were "abandoned" to an uncle and aunt while their parents were out of the country for extended periods of time, and I believe that definitely affected my mother's feelings about where she stood in the world. My own parents never abandoned me in that kind of way, and yet for whatever reason I have spent my entire life feeling like an adopted orphan.

People can make us feel esteemed or worthy in various ways, but those judgements often have strings attached. I have tried being my own judge for deciding values and status in relation to myself, but then again the strings typically show up whenever I expect other people to agree.

I do understand many of us have had experiences either with or within religions that have proved or turned sour in relation to all of this, but there again we have people and their strings.

There is the person I believe myself to be or should be or whatever;
There is the person other people believe me to be or should be or whatever;
Leaving all such things for supernatural judgement has resolved those matters for me.

[yagr]

Originally Posted by Rose76

What man has a clear conscience before his Maker?

Raises hand!!!!

[Rose76]

We start off in this world completely dependent on others to meet our needs. Eventually, if we grow up well-adjusted, we learn that we have the ability to take care of ourselves. I think self-worth can come from the experience of being able to cope with the challenges of life with a reasonable degree of independence and self-reliance.

That thought leads me to wonder about the predicament of a person who must always depend extensively on others due to chronic disability. Perhaps a person is born with a medical condition that makes physical independence impossible. Then, I think, the source of a sense of self-worth is not so easy to trace. Then it may reflect a faith in the intrinsic dignity of the human person. I suppose, when such a person is a child, they internalize how their parents feel about them. A child who's treated with respect, I believe, comes to respect himself.

Unfortunately, some parents treat a child as a burden or as a possession. Those attitudes undermine a child developing a sense of self-worth.

Eventally, everyone stops being a child and decides some things for themself. I think the best case scenario is that a person realizes that he belongs to himself, is not an apendage of mother or father, takes responsibility to make his own decisions and comes to like the way that turns out, despite having to learn from mistakes.

[leejosepho]

I believe we essentially agree, Rose76, and then concerning this:

Originally Posted by Rose76

...the predicament of a person who must always depend extensively on others due to chronic disability. Perhaps a person is born with a medical condition that makes physical independence impossible. Then, I think, the source of a sense of self-worth is not so easy to trace.

It is not oneself that gives worth to oneself (although many people surely do try to proclaim their own worth on their own terms), and this kind of case or scenario shows how one's sense of worth comes from outside oneself such as from the attentions, affections and/or care freely given by others.

Self worth usually comes from how you are treated as a child by parents, friends, strangers and authority figures. If these people fail you, you will suffer but all is not lost. You can learn to rebuild your self worth by understanding how you lost it in the first place and gaining your power back. Once broken, a crack will always exsist and depending upon what information you feed to your self worth, that crack can get wider or smaller.

Speaking of religion and as a girl who grew up in the US unable to buy into it, I can fully attest that the way I was bullied and treated for not being religious had an extremely negative impact on my self worth.

[Entity06]

I think that, as with most things, self-esteem and self-worth don't happen in a vacuum and they are a combined result of our personal image and assessment of ourselves (based less on quantifiable "data" and more in spiritual, philosophical, moral beliefs regarding our human condition) and our assessment of external factors such as the way we fare in society, the way society perceives us, the way people treat us, etc.

In my opinion, the whole self help/inspirational quotes fad of "You only need love from yourself" or "No one can love you before you love yourself"(which I always found not only proven to be untrue but also highly insulting and insensitive because a lot of people, like those with mental health issues, will never be able to "love" themselves as society asks of them and don't we deserve love too?) and other things like that, are incomplete and incorrect.

Why? Well, I agree that you need to also work hard with yourself in order to understand yourself and accept yourself just as you are and realize that, yes, as a living creature on this Earth, you have an intrinsic worth and are worthy of being loved, accepted, treated kindly, by yourself and others.

But there's more than intrinsic worth and we are social beings living in a socially connected world where even the water we drink was made available because there are people who take care of that. We exist and thrive and advance because we are programed to live together, to cooperate, to need eachother, to fulfill each other's needs for all sorts of things including the emotional.

So of course it's normal for self esteem and self worth, your general self image to be based in that too, in how you are treated, how you're seen, the boxes you're put into, the worth others and society as a whole seem to ascribe to you. That's ok, it's good for calibration too, just like every scientific theory has to be tested multiple times to be proven true.

The problem appears not from needing that bit of validation and to be able to fulfill your emotional and practical needs, which others have a role in too, but from whether or not you can use it as you should.

It's a bit strange to ask someone to just completely have no issue with themselves and not suffer from loneliness or from feeling hurt and ostracized, to have no self esteem issues when they're always bullied, they've been abandoned or abused or ostracized, etc. When there's too much of the bad stuff and too little or no positive experiences, even if you are aware of your intrinsic worth, even if you know you're not wrong for being how you are, it doesn't change the fact that it seems the rest of the world doesn't see that. And it is a problem, as a social being, you do need to connect, you need affection, you need to belong, you're wired for it.

Now, when you have someone who has had some negative experiences but you can also see they've had positive ones, that they've had good opportunities, that they have some people around them trying to show their love and appreciation of them and yet they have no affect on that person...that's when there's indeed a problem that is more focused inside at that point and that requires more work with the self. It's not knowing or not being able to absorb or see the positive messages presented, to accept the love, accept the acceptance, that signals a issue separate from your current environment.

I think our true worth, external worth ,has to do with love, all kinds of love, all degrees of love...because love involves need too and it involves fulfilling someone's emotional needs and if you can be kind and helpful and compassionate ,to the best of your ability, if you are loved...that is worth, not how much money you earn, how many hours u can spend at work and so on.

Originally Posted by Entity06

I think that, as with most things, self-esteem and self-worth don't happen in a vacuum and they are a combined result of our personal image and assessment of ourselves (based less on quantifiable "data" and more in spiritual, philosophical, moral beliefs regarding our human condition) and our assessment of external factors such as the way we fare in society, the way society perceives us, the way people treat us, etc.

In my opinion, the whole self help/inspirational quotes fad of "You only need love from yourself" or "No one can love you before you love yourself"(which I always found not only proven to be untrue but also highly insulting and insensitive because a lot of people, like those with mental health issues, will never be able to "love" themselves as society asks of them and don't we deserve love too?) and other things like that, are incomplete and incorrect.

Why? Well, I agree that you need to also work hard with yourself in order to understand yourself and accept yourself just as you are and realize that, yes, as a living creature on this Earth, you have an intrinsic worth and are worthy of being loved, accepted, treated kindly, by yourself and others.

But there's more than intrinsic worth and we are social beings living in a socially connected world where even the water we drink was made available because there are people who take care of that. We exist and thrive and advance because we are programed to live together, to cooperate, to need eachother, to fulfill each other's needs for all sorts of things including the emotional.

So of course it's normal for self esteem and self worth, your general self image to be based in that too, in how you are treated, how you're seen, the boxes you're put into, the worth others and society as a whole seem to ascribe to you. That's ok, it's good for calibration too, just like every scientific theory has to be tested multiple times to be proven true.

The problem appears not from needing that bit of validation and to be able to fulfill your emotional and practical needs, which others have a role in too, but from whether or not you can use it as you should.

It's a bit strange to ask someone to just completely have no issue with themselves and not suffer from loneliness or from feeling hurt and ostracized, to have no self esteem issues when they're always bullied, they've been abandoned or abused or ostracized, etc. When there's too much of the bad stuff and too little or no positive experiences, even if you are aware of your intrinsic worth, even if you know you're not wrong for being how you are, it doesn't change the fact that it seems the rest of the world doesn't see that. And it is a problem, as a social being, you do need to connect, you need affection, you need to belong, you're wired for it.

Now, when you have someone who has had some negative experiences but you can also see they've had positive ones, that they've had good opportunities, that they have some people around them trying to show their love and appreciation of them and yet they have no affect on that person...that's when there's indeed a problem that is more focused inside at that point and that requires more work with the self. It's not knowing or not being able to absorb or see the positive messages presented, to accept the love, accept the acceptance, that signals a issue separate from your current environment.

I think our true worth, external worth ,has to do with love, all kinds of love, all degrees of love...because love involves need too and it involves fulfilling someone's emotional needs and if you can be kind and helpful and compassionate ,to the best of your ability, if you are loved...that is worth, not how much money you earn, how many hours u can spend at work and so on.

Wow...this is wonderfully written and I can't disagree with a word you've said. Thoughtful and thorough posting.

[lizardlady]

For those who say you get your self-worth from your religion, I had a totally different experience. I was raised in a faith that told me that all humans were born bad. I can tell you that did NOTHING to build my self-worth. It helped tear if down. If religion gives you the support you need, good for you, but please recognize that is not everyone's experience.

To answer the OP's question, my sense of self-worth was hard won and comes from inside me. Life experiences tore me down to the point I thought I was worthless and deserved the abuse I received. It literally shattered me. I developed DID. One of my alters is/was a terrified little girl who was afraid of everything. It took a lot of hard work and therapy for me to integrate and come to believe that I have worth. So, the short answer is that my self-worth comes from within.

not sure why, but I feel the need to say this... during the darkest period while I was seeking help through therapy my T wanted me to say "I deserve to be treated with love and respect." out loud. I absolutely could NOT make the words come out. My throat seized up and I couldn't make a sound. At the same time I was terrified he was going to be angry with me because I didn't do what he told me to do. (did I mention I was in bad shape?) What I was able to do was repeat the line in my head. There were times I'd be in bed wrapped in the blankets, shaking out of fear what was about to happen and I'd be repeating over and over and over again in my head. Eventually I started to sort of believe it. Today I accept it as a true statement.

[Rose76]

Despite what we may rightly value in ourselves, we are all in need of the forebearance, tolerance and forgiveness of those who have to put up with us. We can all - each of us - be a bit much at times. I have known a few individuals who need to imagine that they are utterly above reproach . . . that it is unthinkable for anyone to find them to be at fault. Those persons, I believe, are actually very insecure and have a false sense of self-worth. They live in fear. Honest self-reflection is abhorrent to them. They are extra tough to put up with.

Secure self-worth means that a person can regularly take responsibility for failing to meet even their own standards, but have faith in their ability to keep trying . . . to make ammends . . . to correct mistakes. I think it rests on a wise appreciation of how frail human nature can be, along with recognizing the heroic effort that living decently requires of all of us in our daily affairs. We are endlessly trying to get things right and often not succeeding. So we forgive ourselves for our failures, as we forgive the failures of those around us. Our consciences may pain us, and they should, if we are honest. If we come from a faith tradition, we trust in the mercy of God . . . while not presuming upon it. If I know myself, then I know I have much reason to be grateful for the forgiveness of others . . . and for divine mercy.

[leejosepho]

Originally Posted by Entity06

I think that, as with most things, self-esteem and self-worth don't happen in a vacuum...

I have been told there is no vacuum anywhere in the natural world...and so, yes, self-esteem and self-worth are...

Originally Posted by Entity06

...a combined result of our personal image and assessment of ourselves (based less on quantifiable "data" and more in spiritual, philosophical, moral beliefs regarding our human condition) and our assessment of external factors such as the way we fare in society, the way society perceives us, the way people treat us, etc...

...and realize that, yes, as a living creature on this Earth, you have an intrinsic worth and are worthy of being loved, accepted, treated kindly, by yourself and others.

Definitely, and therein lies the rub when so many of us are surrounded by others who do not treat all human beings as having that intrinsic worth you have mentioned...and then some of us wittingly or otherwise help keep things all messed up for everyone by spewing nastiness and even hatred in return...but I digress...

Good stuff there, Entity06!

[Entity06]

Originally Posted by ElsaMars

Wow...this is wonderfully written and I can't disagree with a word you've said. Thoughtful and thorough posting.

Thanks, I was worried because it's a long rant and it goes against a lot of things people like to profess nowadays.

I've spent a lot of time thinking about self-esteem and self-worth and about how society decides to treat this matter.

I think that, just as mental health issues(especially high functioning ones that are easily dismissed) are still understated, overlooked and treated in an insensitive way as opposed to something like a physical illness you can "see", this whole self-esteem thing is simplified.

I mean, you know that probably most obvious comparison of how we treat mental health/emotional related suffering vs overt physical suffering? If someone has a broken leg you don't tell them to just think happy thoughts or to pick themselves up and just walk on the leg, it will heal. No, you help that person walk, you agree they need physical therapy and a good doctor to help the leg heal itself(because ultimately it's still the body healing itself). If you have a bad infection, they're not going to tell you to will it away, you'll get the antibiotic the body needs to fight it.

But with mental/emotional suffering, it's still possible for people to convince themselves that no one but the one suffering has any role in recovery, in feeling better. By that logic, why do therapists even exist since their main contribution is, at its foundation, simply being there for the person in a non judgemental manner, trying to help the person feel less alone and misunderstood and helping in identifying the cause and assist/advise on whatever can be done to overcome it. It's still the one suffering who is ultimately doing the work but we all sometimes need to be given the tools.

That's how I see all the self esteem talk popular nowadays, especially among people who have been fortunate not to grow up unknowingly deprived of their emotional needs, who didn't go through any more serious trauma, depression, anxiety, etc.

It's, in my opinion, insensitive and detrimental to keep preaching this idea that absolutely no one can influence or should influence your life in any way, especially mentally. It's also insensitive and detrimental to basically indirectly or directly say no one needs help, that even if you're in the darkest pits and you've been essentially put down and hit in the gut multiple times by society, family, friends, without you even "asking" for it, you're 100% responsible of getting out of that dark pit the world did help push you into, with zero help; that even with zero support, severely unmet needs for affection, for validation, connection, you're still supposed to find the resources within yourself exclusively, and if you don't then it means you failed.

Truth is that, just as the body needs some help to heal itself depending on what's ailing it, the mind and the soul do too. We all need love, loneliness and lack of touch are scientifically proven to be super unhealthy, we all need some support but in a selfish society, the message often put out is one that ultimately serves as a scapegoat for everyone, a way to make everyone feel better about not lifting a finger, about being intolerant, about hurting someone.

This is very true especially when society has to "deal" with people who have mental health/emotional problems that may make them "high maintenance", who may need extra reassurance and patience sometimes, who might need loved ones to make a bit of an effort to help them feel more comfortable. No one chooses to be anxious or depressive, no one chooses to fear abandonment and loss, no one chooses to be traumatized by something, no one chooses to be bipolar or chronically depressed. It's like telling someone with mobility issues or chronic migraines or another chronic illness, to just quit whining and stop asking for society to accommodate to their needs as well.

By saying self esteem and self worth are things that come only from inside, we're also taking responsibility away from society. For ex, we recognize that ethnic minorities subjected to racism aren't solely or even primarily responsible for the way society treats them and that the harmful, negative affects that come from racism and that result, among other things, in self esteem and self worth issues are a problem that society too has to resolve, that society, people as a whole need to change their attitudes, their behavior and challenge old, racist mentalities. You're not going to say to an African-American who is subjected to racism, that people are only racist towards him because he allows it.

Of course self esteem and self worth have to also be built from the inside, that you need to work on taking the good, affirming, supportive actions of people around you and use them as tools to work with yourself. Of course you have to also be aware that, as long as you're decent with people, you're intrinsically just as worthy as everyone to have respect, to be accepted and appreciated and loved for who you are, just as you are. But at the same time, if the only thing you have are those thoughts and you keep being rejected and hurt for no good reason...

We all need others to accept and love us and be there for us sometimes and we need society as a whole to be inclusive, because we are social beings, we're wired for that. As a society we recognize this when it comes to physical abuse/harm and clear, institutionalized discrimination(such as that against women, minorities, LGBTQ people), but we seem to do it less when it comes to how we treat eachother in other ways.

And it's very hurtful when you have someone with anxiety for ex, or depression, who already live in fear they'll be perceived as a burden, who already feel they are hard to love and put up with because the truth is they do need a bit more patience and understanding in some instances, to be told that basically no one should put up with anything, that it's their fault and they first need to become perfectly adjusted people with no problems, if they want to be loved and accepted. It doesn't work that way and no matter how much you tell yourself you're just as worthy as everyone else, you can and will be made to feel like this is something only you think, that everyone else doesn't see it that way.

It's alright that there's needs, including emotional and self esteem ones, that we can't fulfill without some help from other people. How can you meet your needs for touch, for ex, for intimacy(emotional and physical) without another person?

Oh and I for one think religion in general kinda' tends to be detrimental to self esteem and self worth if you're not a heterosexual, white man. Why? Simply because all religion is is a collection of beliefs, mentalities and understanding of the world a bunch of people had thousands of years ago. It's very narrow and not particularly tolerant or even peaceful and it reflects those times. Would anyone, for ex, want to go back in time and live in the eras those religions were born in? I think not, they were times when conflicts, even small ones, were often solved by violent means, when violence was a big tool in general, when most people were oppressed for different reasons(gender, class, ethnicity, etc), when people had little understanding of scientific principles that explain anything from what life is to why it rains. They weren't pleasant, peaceful, tolerant times and neither is religion originated there, because religion(not spirituality) is a philosophy.

[Perna]

My self worth comes from talking to myself making friends with the quirky, shy, struggling me and really getting to know and like her as if she were a friend. Cheering for her when she tries something and it works :-) comforting her when there's bad news or painful feelings. I stand up for her when she puts herself down, argue with the putter-downers; they're usually inexact and sloppy and it's easy, once you start looking at what they're saying, to make fun of them and run them off. "You're stupid" and comments like are so lame! What does that even mean? If you are going to insult me, insulting self part :-) at least give me examples with details! I can't be stupid, I graduated college! I can't be stupid, I'm arguing with you (the insulting self part) and you aren't bright enough to answer back so I'm certainly less stupid than you are!

I'm unique, and that's worth feeling good about; there isn't another with my sense of humor, honor, grit (okay, stubborness :-) and willingness to keep trying/get knocked down and get back up. We're polite and humble too!