Hello,

thought I'd throw this question out. How far do you go to avoid being abandoned by someone you respect? I mentioned in previous threads that while I was in hospital my doctor dumped me because I was in a crisis. Just after he dumped me they handed me a 5 hour pass whereby I went home and tried to commit suicide. The pain was overwhelming. However, I got so confused I ended up having him paged. This was during business hours. He was not happy about that at all. He convinced me to go back to hospital and the entire time I tried everything I could to keep him as my doctor. I negotiated with another doctor all these things so that I could continue to see him. Instead they offered 4 additional sessions so that I could get closure. On the last day after we met I was fine and felt great until I got home and realized my only support was gone. I freaked and phoned a help line and in the confusion she called the police and I was taken back to hospital. I just wanted to talk to someone. Anyways, the did not certify me and I went home. I begged the one nurse to make sure he never knew because our relationship was done and I didn't want him to know I freaked out after our last session. A month later I saw him on the street and he looked at me with knives coming from his eyes. It hurt because a simple smile or a wave would have been ample but that look he gave me said to me he hated me to the full extent and has killed me inside since. Any advise?

[optimize990h]

I understand the need to not feel left behind. That whatever I do won't make the loss feel any better. The ones who use my situation to take advantage of me just causes me more pain.

Although the details we have are different, the emotions and feelings we feel are similar.

Keep your boundaries intact to help you work on the difficult area of trying to change yourself. It is not the easiest thing to do, but it is necessary to heal the emotional wounds.

[shortandcute]

Now, I just pretty much avoid anything beyond a "civil" realtionship with anyone; I mean I will be polite and all, but I refuse to go much beyond that.

I'd rather not into what I used to do right now.

[HealingNSuffering]

As of late I go so far as to become reclusive and try to never let relationships become too serious or intimate, pretty much avoiding new relationships and keeping old relationships distant. As much as I love to be with people, I feel as though I need to be without them. Sometimes our wants and our needs are two completely different things, I want love and intimacy in my life, but I need to keep my sanity. Usually I tend to panic in the face of being left alone by a significant other, and would literally do anything to avoid it. With friends I would try to bribe them into staying, or suggest to them when I sense they want to leave, that we should go see a movie or go to a museum or something, just to spend more time with them. With intimate relationships at times, I have found myself begging, pleading and manipulating to try to get my way back into their life after they say its over. Sometimes I threaten to take my own life when faced with more abandonment trauma, sometimes I get really angry and point the blame back at the person who is trying to leave. They say they are leaving because of my neediness, I say they are leaving because of their selfishness. In hindsight I am the selfish one, all these examples are reasons why I avoid close relationships, to protect myself from getting hurt because my heart is fragile after being broken so many times, its being held together by scotch tape.

[poptart316]

I'm at a point now where I just get angry when people reject or abandon me, like it's just not acceptable for them to do that to me. Like sometimes I get that crazy "If I can't have you, no one else can" mentality.

A few weeks ago my not friend said he was coming to a venue kinda close to my house to see a band for his birthday and I was like "oh your in my area, come visit me" and then he was like "I don't think my girlfriend would like that" and I got mad and was questioning it.. like he has a ****ing female roommate, whats the big deal if he stops to visit a female friend? How is that any different? and we argued then he said he's sick of me getting aggressive with him because he doesn't want to be more than internet friends and that he didn't want to talk to me anymore and deleted me from facebook so I'm like "oh, you're going said venue you say? I'll show you aggressive" then he was like "blah blah you're threatening me" and then blocked me.. so I sent him texts wishing him a happy birthday and going on about how much we're going to have.. like being full on crazy and I did not give a ****. For days I fantasized about going up there and like kicking him in the balls or busting a beer bottle over his girlfriends head just so he'd blame himself for going there in the first place. I got over it in a few days though and never actually went to the venue.

My boyfriend broke up with me (which this forum knows ALL about) we're FWB now.. maybe it's stupid but I have like 2 friends that I rarely hang out with, I don't do anything.. I'm bored and lonely and hanging out with him alleviates some of that but I'm still upset that he broke up with me and feel rejected and fear that he'll reject me again and sometimes when I stay the night I'll fall asleep to thoughts of strangling him or suffocating him with the pillow.

I'm certain that these violent thoughts are not at all healthy but I'm not really sure what to do about them. I don't want to tell my therapist because they HAVE to report homicidal thoughts and I don't want to go to the hospital, like wtf is that going to do? I'll just sit there for a few days while they shovel pills down my throat only to go back to the same ******** that's making me angry.

I'm a terrible person, sorry.

[TheRealFDeal]

They do not have the right to report homicidal *thoughts*. They must actually believe you have a plan and will carry it out.

Dare, I'm so sorry this is all happening to you. I had a T who mistook a homicidal/suicidal FANTASY for a plan (I did not discuss a plan with him) and reported me. Next thing I know, he terminated me, but gave us a month for termination. That I continued to see him after what he did shows what I would do to avoid abandonment. I used that time to convince him to take me back, even after such a huge betrayal. (he even called the other person and told them they were in danger -- now I no longer have a relationship with that person because they are afraid of me.)

Now I avoid abandonment by avoiding all people and keeping to myself. It is excruciatingly lonely and I sometimes wonder about my hold on reality, being alone so much. I no longer even have a T because I cannot possibly take another chance on such a relationship.

[HealingNSuffering]

Originally Posted by TheRealFDeal

They do not have the right to report homicidal *thoughts*. They must actually believe you have a plan and will carry it out.

Dare, I'm so sorry this is all happening to you. I had a T who mistook a homicidal/suicidal FANTASY for a plan (I did not discuss a plan with him) and reported me. Next thing I know, he terminated me, but gave us a month for termination. That I continued to see him after what he did shows what I would do to avoid abandonment. I used that time to convince him to take me back, even after such a huge betrayal. (he even called the other person and told them they were in danger -- now I no longer have a relationship with that person because they are afraid of me.)

Now I avoid abandonment by avoiding all people and keeping to myself. It is excruciatingly lonely and I sometimes wonder about my hold on reality, being alone so much. I no longer even have a T because I cannot possibly take another chance on such a relationship.

Next time don't say no names. I never say names when I'm talking about my thought crimes, or real crimes that I've committed. Never say who they were against, not even a first name, I keep these references as vague as humanly possible. That way the therapist can't call them and tell them all about it. If I do ever mention who it is, I make it very clear that I have no intention of following through with any of these thoughts, although I do not object to the thoughts, I would never follow through with them because........... They are not going to help me in any way, they will only hold me back further and I risk going to prison over somebody who isn't worth sht to me anyways.

i am not certain of how far I would go.... But I can tell you this - just reading the title made my anxiety jump. i guess that tells me that i would probably do pretty much ANYTHING.

[technigal]

Originally Posted by HealingNSuffering

If I do ever mention who it is, I make it very clear that I have no intention of following through with any of these thoughts, although I do not object to the thoughts, I would never follow through with them because........... They are not going to help me in any way, they will only hold me back further and I risk going to prison over somebody who isn't worth sht to me anyways.

I have homicidal thoughts against one person. I would be the first suspect as it is my MIL and we hate each other. But I somewhat deal with her so that my husband does not leave.

[sheiba]

Originally Posted by dare

Hello,

thought I'd throw this question out. How far do you go to avoid being abandoned by someone you respect? I mentioned in previous threads that while I was in hospital my doctor dumped me because I was in a crisis. Just after he dumped me they handed me a 5 hour pass whereby I went home and tried to commit suicide. The pain was overwhelming. However, I got so confused I ended up having him paged. This was during business hours. He was not happy about that at all. He convinced me to go back to hospital and the entire time I tried everything I could to keep him as my doctor. I negotiated with another doctor all these things so that I could continue to see him. Instead they offered 4 additional sessions so that I could get closure. On the last day after we met I was fine and felt great until I got home and realized my only support was gone. I freaked and phoned a help line and in the confusion she called the police and I was taken back to hospital. I just wanted to talk to someone. Anyways, the did not certify me and I went home. I begged the one nurse to make sure he never knew because our relationship was done and I didn't want him to know I freaked out after our last session. A month later I saw him on the street and he looked at me with knives coming from his eyes. It hurt because a simple smile or a wave would have been ample but that look he gave me said to me he hated me to the full extent and has killed me inside since. Any advise?

Dare I am so sorry your heart is so sad...just know you are not alone I care and others here do also... I believe things happen for a reason , look at the positive side this therapist wasnt able to give you the help you needed, there is someone ut there that can dont give up

[thepoetishere]

I'm not going to say exactly what I did but it was far as I'd ever gone. And he was just leaving for maybe 6 hrs or so. But I mixed ambien and alcohol which didn't help anything. That $*** makes me crazy. Well, makes it worse I guess.

[Depression Beard]

In the past Ive threatened suicide, self harmed, got drunk, ****ed up on whatever drug was available, threatened, blamed, the works to avoid abandonment. However, what HealingNSuffering described is also where I am at with regard to people. I live in a "foreign" country and have no friends. I could have had some but not wanting to be rejected meant I rejected them first. In fact, one of the reasons I moved to a country where I don't know anyone was to get away from people and be somewhat alone.

I live with my long term gf who I feel hates me. I go through periods of lonliness but half the time I feel like Im just trying to keep my head down and pass time until I die from whatever illness will ultimately kill me. The rest of the time I suffer fluctuating moods. I become obsessively fantasise about becoming a hermit. I research forests where I could run away to and plan what equipment I would need to survive. I convince myself that would be the only way I could go on.

BPD is a living hell but I cling on to the few hours/days when its ok.

[HD7970GHZ]

Hey guys and gals,

This is a good thread, Dare. Thank you for pointing out these important things!

I think it is important to note what you had said in your first line...

You said, "How far do you go to avoid being abandoned by someone you respect?"

If you're wondering why I bolded, and underlined the word, "respect," it's because you pointed something out - that in my mind - is vitally important in answering your question.

Before I explain why, I think it's important to ask yourself, "why," you, "respect," your doctor so much. In asking you this - I don't expect you to reply on this forum and explain why it is that you feel so emotionally connected to him and why you respect him so much... However, I ask that you keep that in the back of your mind - because I know that for me - (given that I have been in a VERY similar situation) that it has helped me to get over previous therapists that I had learned to respect so deeply.

I must say that I am sorry that in passing your doctor - he did not acknowledge you in the way that you had envisioned. [[[[[In saying this - remember that we with BPD are extraordinarily sensitive to slights and facial expressions - and that we are constantly on the lookout for anything that says someone doesn't like us]]]]].

In saying that, remember that we with BPD have, "UNREALISTIC EXPECTATIONS," when interacting with others.

I must say - that in objectively hearing your story - I would have much rather had you see him after a long period of time. I think it would have been good for you to heal from the loss of such an important figure in your life before seeing him on the street. Just know that he is a professional - and that part of being a professional therapist / psychiatrist - includes doctor and patient privacy. Perhaps he felt that in avoiding you - it would help keep things private in respect for you. Perhaps he even felt - that (((given the amount of distress you were in upon learning he was no longer your doctor - and despite your best efforts to keep him as your doctor))) - the best thing he could do, [FOR YOU] was to distance himself.

I know it is extremely hard to look at things this way - but trust me - he cares about you, genuinely. And if there is any other reason as to why he may have reacted the way he did - just remind yourself that he is a deeply compassionate individual - in a very sensitive occupation - who helped you greatly, (Proof being the amount of respect you have for him) but who ultimately felt the need to distance himself - for YOUR well being. In saying this - I actually think he handled things as a professional therapist would. What I mean is: I don't think any other therapist would have acted any different given the circumstances.

One thing that I had a difficult time coming to terms with - was the idea that we with BPD can often idealize someone.

Of course you respect your therapist - he listened to your deepest and most personal issues. He helped you learn to deal with them. He gave you a safe place to learn from your mistakes and to foster your own growth. He gave you a place of trust and acceptance. He did not judge like most people do on the outside world - and he welcomed all of your negative thoughts and emotions...

In doing this - of course you will develop respect for him.

But it is NOT a mutual respect.

That is hard to hear. But it's true.

Because we have a deep respect for our therapists, and because we hold them on such a high pedestal - and tend to idealize people who we respect - we (CAN and often, DO) in turn: expect a mutual return of respect.

What I mean by this is: Because we view our therapists in such a high regard - we expect them to treat us - in a high regard. [[[To put it lightly: we expect our therapists to treat us the same way we would treat them]]]. But in all honesty - our therapists rarely, if ever: respect us in the same INTENSITY - that we respect them. How could they? They DO respect us: as people suffering with genuine issues - searching for answers that may help us find peace with it all... But we are patients. They are professionals. They see many patients a day. We only see them.

I think you had an idea of what would happen had you run into your therapist outside of therapy. I think this because I know that I would ruminate the event in my head time and time again - until I had come up with a realistic idea of what would happen. But really - I would ruminate the event in my head until I come up with the most, "desirable," possibility... Therefore, I would have expectations for things to go as I, "desire," them to go... But they never do.

You ran into your doctor / therapist - on the street, one month after you had seen him last. He reacted in a way that went against (YOUR) expectations. [[Against your most, "desirable," outcome in running into him]] His reaction went against all your own preconceived ideas of what would happen in the event that you should run into him...

To you - this could mean that he no longer likes you... That he hates you...

Despite not knowing, for a fact: what, or how he feels about you at this point in time - nor what he was thinking / feeling when you ran into him on the street - you can easily allow yourself to fall into a place of devaluing him, based on non other than assumptions fueled by BPD insecurities...

Assume: Makes an, "***," out of, "u," and, "me."

(Assumptions make an *** out of you and me)

Try to remember that with BPD - comes the fluctuation between idealization and devaluation. That you can love someone one moment - then hate them the next. Your negative thoughts are telling you that he hates you, that he never cared in the first place - and it is purely irrational in that it is based on BPD ways of thinking. Catch yourself thinking these things. Remind yourself that the pattern can sweep you up and take you away before you know it. It's not based on FACT. It is based on your own perceptions - limited entirely on your own subjective interpretation of the event - and therefore, is weighted towards a BPD way of thinking. Which - we all know - tends to make us think, feel and believe that others hate us, when really - they love us!

Thanks,
HD7970Ghz

[GeorgiaGirl413]

Originally Posted by dare

Hello,

thought I'd throw this question out. How far do you go to avoid being abandoned by someone you respect? I mentioned in previous threads that while I was in hospital my doctor dumped me because I was in a crisis. Just after he dumped me they handed me a 5 hour pass whereby I went home and tried to commit suicide. The pain was overwhelming. However, I got so confused I ended up having him paged. This was during business hours. He was not happy about that at all. He convinced me to go back to hospital and the entire time I tried everything I could to keep him as my doctor. I negotiated with another doctor all these things so that I could continue to see him. Instead they offered 4 additional sessions so that I could get closure. On the last day after we met I was fine and felt great until I got home and realized my only support was gone. I freaked and phoned a help line and in the confusion she called the police and I was taken back to hospital. I just wanted to talk to someone. Anyways, the did not certify me and I went home. I begged the one nurse to make sure he never knew because our relationship was done and I didn't want him to know I freaked out after our last session. A month later I saw him on the street and he looked at me with knives coming from his eyes. It hurt because a simple smile or a wave would have been ample but that look he gave me said to me he hated me to the full extent and has killed me inside since. Any advise?

I've attempted suicide to keep from being abandoned. Many times.

[technigal]

Originally Posted by HD7970GHZ

[[[[[In saying this - remember that we with BPD are extraordinarily sensitive to slights and facial expressions - and that we are constantly on the lookout for anything that says someone doesn't like us]]]]].

my husband needs to read this! I need to understand it too.