[leomama]

I've been wondering about this for a long time. Can your own emotional stability stabilize an emotionally unstable person or is it a lost cause? What do you think about the position of emotional leadership in a personality disordered relationship? Is it a case of the blind leading the blind, or is it like sponsorship where any about of sober time counts? Has anybody else thought about these things? Tried to have a relationship with an emotionally "normal" person? (Whatever that is). Been able to relate to an "emotionally normal " or "non"? Is it worth it? Would love to know if anyone else thinks about these things or if this even makes sense to another person.

Also when did you start listening to and trusting your own emotions? I don't know about you but years of being told I was overreacting , was hypersensitive, taking things personally really messes with a person. My guess that every single time someone criticized me in that vein they were trying to manipulate me. I've been so through the ringer that sometimes I can't tell the difference anymore.

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[Robyn51]

I have bpd and am nearing 3 years with a "stable" person. Im not saying it's been easy. Before being with her I would have answered no to your question. But with a lot of work and some great ups and horrible horrible downs I can say it's possible. I'm at the point of learning to accept the Inbetween as good and not "the spark has gone" (which most of the time isn't hard to find". That quiet little place where you can sit opposite ends of the couch, whilst still understanding eachother and enjoying each others company. It takes work on your part and work on your partners side. You will not always understand eachother. Your partner will at times wonder why on earth they are doing this, you will at times wonder if they even care about you at all because they aren't as needy as you. My biggest help has been seeing her attention as more than just emotional. She might not always say how much she loves me, but she keeps food on the table and makes plans for us to do nice things together at the weekend and asks me how my day was. She holds my hand when we are out and about and it's me she falls asleep next to. She shows me respect. And in turn I try to cope with my disorders. It's about meeting in the middle even though us bpds can be known for hating grey areas x

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[leomama]

Originally Posted by Robyn51

I have bpd and am nearing 3 years with a "stable" person. Im not saying it's been easy. Before being with her I would have answered no to your question. But with a lot of work and some great ups and horrible horrible downs I can say it's possible. I'm at the point of learning to accept the Inbetween as good and not "the spark has gone" (which most of the time isn't hard to find". That quiet little place where you can sit opposite ends of the couch, whilst still understanding eachother and enjoying each others company. It takes work on your part and work on your partners side. You will not always understand eachother. Your partner will at times wonder why on earth they are doing this, you will at times wonder if they even care about you at all because they aren't as needy as you. My biggest help has been seeing her attention as more than just emotional. She might not always say how much she loves me, but she keeps food on the table and makes plans for us to do nice things together at the weekend and asks me how my day was. She holds my hand when we are out and about and it's me she falls asleep next to. She shows me respect. And in turn I try to cope with my disorders. It's about meeting in the middle even though us bpds can be known for hating grey areas x

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You see yourself as unstable and her as stable?

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[Robyn51]

I am without doubt the unstable one. :-(

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[Robyn51]

I used to be in a relationship with someone who had bpd also and he was much needier than me. That was like a hurricane meeting a tornado

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[leomama]

Originally Posted by Robyn51

I used to be in a relationship with someone who had bpd also and he was much needier than me. That was like a hurricane meeting a tornado

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That's more what I was wondering about, not a relationship with a "non". My question about the relationship with a "non" is what's in it for you? I know for myself both passive, passive-aggressive and depressed guys all turn me off. I tend to be attracted to aggression, and I'm pretty volatile myself although I can contain it now.
I guess what I'm asking is after everything I've been through what's the point of trying to get along with a "normal" person?

(I don't know what your recovery journey has been like but mines been tough )

I don't know if you've been reading my compassion for a sociopath thread or not but in my particular case I have to be extra careful because of my first marriage.
I feel like I'm kind of in this grey area now where normalcy does not interest me but I don't want my relationship to be one big brawl either, you know?
All the men in my life have been difficult or abusive: father, brother, ex and it's made me a very strong woman.
I guess my really question is: how do you define strength?

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[leomama]

Originally Posted by Robyn51

I am without doubt the unstable one. :-(

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May I ask why you say this about yourself? May I ask if you take medication, are in therapy, or done Dbt? I understand if you don't want to understand personal questions. My curiosity is a strength that also gets me in trouble.

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[Robyn51]

I think the only thing I can compare to strength is being able to stand on your own two feet and trust your own instincts in life. To be able to control your own life.

Being with my ex was hell in the end, it became very abusive. I would use his bpd as an excuse because having bpd myself I thought I understood.

But it got to the point I had no emotional strength left for myself as I was always pulling him up, then he would beat me down and before I had chance to recover from that I needed to help him up again.

So for me being with a non means being with someone who can teach me how to handle things a little more rationally, I can save my emotional strength for myself as she has enough of her own to keep herself going without me. (And yes that's an incredibly scary thought that she could survive without me)

The hardest part is trying to stay stable for her when I really don't have it in me. That's the point where I can see your question "what's in it for me?"


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[leomama]

Hmm. That's interesting. At this point there is nothing a non PD can teach me in a relationship . I don't have straight ahead BPD, I have a little bit of this and a little bit of that, if you've been following any of my posts on the forums but I've got a lot going on inside of me. The BPD stuff is the volatility and the reactivity but that's strictly internal now, but my soul feels like a combustion engine. I've got a therapist working with me on this stuff but I hate to say it, I probably find "nons" boring. I know that's not healthy for most people but when you've had a PD yourself, well what's healthy for everyone else doesn't really resonate.

I do believe it is possible to recover from a PD.

Sorry if I'm a mess.

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[Robyn51]

Originally Posted by leomama

Hmm. That's interesting. At this point there is nothing a non PD can teach me in a relationship . I don't have straight ahead BPD, I have a little bit of this and a little bit of that, if you've been following any of my posts on the forums but I've got a lot going on inside of me. The BPD stuff is the volatility and the reactivity but that's strictly internal now, but my soul feels like a combustion engine. I've got a therapist working with me on this stuff but I hate to say it, I probably find "nons" boring. I know that's not healthy for most people but when you've had a PD yourself, well what's healthy for everyone else doesn't really resonate.

I do believe it is possible to recover from a PD.

Sorry if I'm a mess.

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Funny thing is the only non i have in my life is my partner. Sometimes I wonder how I ended up with her when I struggle to understand "normal" and most of my friends all have similar issues to me. She's opened up a whole world that I'm not familiar with and I think I'm curious to see if It's possible to live a normal life. Sometimes it doesn't work so well as I compare myself too much to her. Maybe I was meant to meet her for a reason. The hardest thing about it is meeting her "normal" friends and family!!

I get what you mean about finding nons boring, normally I would end up with someone like me. I dunno maybe my ex scared me a bit too much. Maybe I don't want to be like my mum. I'm not sure if my sexuality plays into any of it.

I would like to think we can recover from personality disorders.

Just having a read through your posts, haven't been on very much recently.

Don't apologise for being a mess it's not like you can help it.

I'm probably waffling a bit right now, I've had my night time meds xx

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[leomama]

Originally Posted by Robyn51

Funny thing is the only non i have in my life is my partner. Sometimes I wonder how I ended up with her when I struggle to understand "normal" and most of my friends all have similar issues to me. She's opened up a whole world that I'm not familiar with and I think I'm curious to see if It's possible to live a normal life. Sometimes it doesn't work so well as I compare myself too much to her. Maybe I was meant to meet her for a reason. The hardest thing about it is meeting her "normal" friends and family!!

I get what you mean about finding nons boring, normally I would end up with someone like me. I dunno maybe my ex scared me a bit too much. Maybe I don't want to be like my mum. I'm not sure if my sexuality plays into any of it.

I would like to think we can recover from personality disorders.

Just having a read through your posts, haven't been on very much recently.

Don't apologise for being a mess it's not like you can help it.

I'm probably waffling a bit right now, I've had my night time meds xx

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I understand and thank you for replying. I think at this point in time I would only be interested in someone who has struggled with a personality disorder, PTSD or a similar condition, or someone who works in that profession but I think the latter would be a conflict of interests.

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[ImmerAllein]

leomama, if I may, ...

People love to invalidate our feelings because it makes them right and us wrong. It's a basic characteristic of the human ego - wanting to be right/superior.

My point is - yes, trust your emotions.

About being "normal" ... no such thing ! I also don't believe in "mental illness" for the same reason. Think about it - what is a "mentally ill" person really ? A person who belongs to the minority and has been labeled by the majority. The same majority that started two wars in the 1900s and killed 180 million people. Those people who started these wars or kept them going didn't see psychiatrists. They were labeled "highly respected" or "model citizen" or whatever. Were they really ?

You get what I'm saying. It's important not to take ***anyone's*** words/opinions too seriously. Take every piece of advice with a grain of salt.

Now, about the relationship with an "unstable" person. Again, what does that label really mean ? Nothing. What you're really asking is - can you have a stable relationship with a person. No labels here.

The answer, I think, is this -

From my life experience, I can only say that, your relationship in the early stages ("honeymoon phase") is probably the best time you are ever going to experience with that person. It generally goes downhill from there. It's a question of what you can live with and what you can't.

So, if things aren't very good in the beginning, forget it ! It's only going to get worse from there !

People will not change for your sake. They ... just ...will ... not ...change. So, can you live with who they are and let them be who they are ?

Sorry if I didn't answer your question, but I just don't value labels much.

[leomama]

Originally Posted by ImmerAllein

leomama, if I may, ...

People love to invalidate our feelings because it makes them right and us wrong. It's a basic characteristic of the human ego - wanting to be right/superior.

My point is - yes, trust your emotions.

About being "normal" ... no such thing ! I also don't believe in "mental illness" for the same reason. Think about it - what is a "mentally ill" person really ? A person who belongs to the minority and has been labeled by the majority. The same majority that started two wars in the 1900s and killed 180 million people. Those people who started these wars or kept them going didn't see psychiatrists. They were labeled "highly respected" or "model citizen" or whatever. Were they really ?

You get what I'm saying. It's important not to take ***anyone's*** words/opinions too seriously. Take every piece of advice with a grain of salt.

Now, about the relationship with an "unstable" person. Again, what does that label really mean ? Nothing. What you're really asking is - can you have a stable relationship with a person. No labels here.

The answer, I think, is this -

From my life experience, I can only say that, your relationship in the early stages ("honeymoon phase") is probably the best time you are ever going to experience with that person. It generally goes downhill from there. It's a question of what you can live with and what you can't.

So, if things aren't very good in the beginning, forget it ! It's only going to get worse from there !

People will not change for your sake. They ... just ...will ... not ...change. So, can you live with who they are and let them be who they are ?

Sorry if I didn't answer your question, but I just don't value labels much.

You did answer my question, can you accept the person as they are, I've heard that more then once before.

I was also curious what the forum thought about the concept of emotional leadership in a relationship with a person with BPD or bpd traits. Is that the proper role for the "non"?

I've also read other stuff, like a relationship with a person with BPD or BPD traits may look like abuse to an outsider. What do people think about this idea?

I've read a lot about this subject from the other side of the fence.

I know for myself I feel too emotionally intense for a "non".

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