My dad :(

LMo, I'm not sure what to say. That's really rotten timing, isn't it? I'm sure that you are doing the best that you can all around.

Sending love and support for you and your family,
Rap

(((((((( LMo )))))))))))

I'm so sorry to hear of all that is happening, I wish I had some words that could bring you comfort.
You'll be in my thoughts and prayers.

(((((((((((((LMO)))))))))))))))))))

i really dont know what to say...but im sorry and i care about you alot alot and hope that things will work out for the best

i know this sounds corny and alot of people hate this saying but things always work out in the end....things happen for a reason...and while you may not understand the big picture....and you may not exactly know what to expect (as in how he is acting or how long he will exactly live) but it will work out....and at the very end you will have an...ahhh ok ....moment....i give you my sympathies.....and my love

((((((((((((((LMo))))))))))))))))))))),

My heart goes out to you, knowing the stress of watching what cancer does to loved ones. I lost my Mother to cancer almost 3 years ago now.

When it effects the brain, it's important to realize that the thought process isn't what it normally was. The best thing you can do is to experience every moment as is comes. Do what you feel is right for the moment....the squeeze of the hand, but hug, the kiss. It isn't something that can be anticipated....it just happens with the love that is there. Sometimes we can't express our feelings the way we would actually want to, but all we can do it the best we can for the moment.

It is sad when we know that we want them to see our future child.....their future...I don't know the beliefs that are held, but I always knew that they would look down on us & see from their safe place in heaven all that is going on & happening, so that helped ease those thoughts (maybe it was just my interpretation so I would feel better, but it did help).

I know with my grandmother & the alzheimers she had, one couldn't get close to her without getting hit, but I knew the love was there anyway....even though the mind made it impossible to show physically....that is when the words we say become so important & even then, there is always the question as to whether they hear what we are really saying.....but it's important to believe that deep inside they are understanding what is truely going on. That is sometimes the only thing that can give us the comfort we need at this time & not to feel guilty that we can't do more.

It sounds like you are realizing things that come out only when we go through emotional times like this....& it's great that you are able to put them into words & get them out....it is a help in understanding outselves & a necessary thing to do when we really get to know ourselves.

I pray that you will have some peace during this time & that your family will come together with strength for each other to help get through this rough time. Sometimes, it helps to have the hospice care help with the care. They have so much experience with cancer & terminal illness & not only help the patient, but the families to deal with all they are experiencing.

You, your family, & your Dad are in my prayers,
Debbie

I apologize - I lost track of this thread and am now reading the rest of the replies. Thanks Inny, Roe, Debbie, Rap, others.

I'm at my parents' house again this weekend. It is heartbreaking. My dad is one neuron short of being a vegetable. He has barely acknowledged my presence and is in bed all day, every day, with the exception of about 20 minutes every few hours to eat, then back to bed. I think a lot of it is depression, and who can blame him, but both he and my stepmom are completely against anti-depressants, despite my pleas. She is frazzled and exhausted, but continues to clean, scrub, cook, tidy... I guess it's her way of coping, but she gets so upset if my dad spills something or leaves his clothes on the floor. I sang the praises of how meds can help with anxiety but it's just out of the question. She doesn't "need" meds. Ok. Fine. She's not letting me help much either, so I'm sitting here trying to figure out what I can do to be helpful instead of flying out here 9 hours each way to sit around with my teeth in my head.

My dad's behavior is mortally saddening. He is incontinent now and can't talk. As I said, he has barely acknowledged that I'm here and all he wants to do is eat and sleep. Every attempt I've made to engage him in conversation results in either grunts or one-word answers. During meals, his hands are shaking so badly that he gets more food on him than in him, but he refuses to let anyone help. And the anti-inflammatory steroids that he is taking are making him ravenous, so he's gaining a lot of weight, which in turn makes it harder for my stepmom to help him in and out of the bathtub, etc. Nor will he use any of the medical equipment she got him (cane, walker, commode, bathtub seat, etc). She has had to hide his medication from him because she caught him taking pills outside of his schedule, and my brother caught him drinking liquor straight out of the bottle in the middle of the night the other night (so they hid that too). He has also taken to walking through the house without clothes on, regardless of whether other people are in the house. He doesn't seem to recognize whether it is inappropriate or not.

My brother was here this week and although he is normally a very level-headed guy, he's turned quite irrational over this situation. He's been accusing my stepmom of just wanting my dad to die so that he's no longer a burden, but this week he got to experience first-hand my dad's refusal to consider cancer treatment. He thought she was lying to him before. I, in turn, have been defending her, because she is dealing with this essentially alone, and it is very, very stressful for her. Hopefully now my brother will start to accept what we can't control, seeing how my dad is not even open to seeing an oncologist.

We are flying my aunt here in the next week or two. She is 86 and lives in Hungary. She has health problems of her own, but when we told her about my dad, she didn't hesitate to say that she is coming out to be with him. It's very sweet. However, it also means that my stepmom will be taking care of an 84 and an 86 year old, and I know she is going to go bizerk. I talked to her about getting home health care but she isn't feeling like it's going to help.

Today my stepmom and I dealt with the legal stuff. I am quite irritated because a few years ago, I nagged my parents to get their estate plans documented, because my stepmom had no will, and my dad's will was written when I was 3 and my mom was still alive. He has always been very adamant that my brother and I are to receive the vast majority of his estate out of respect for our mother, and although it seems contrary to my own best interest, I felt it was unfair to my stepmom who has put up with so much for the last 20 years, so I had been trying to convince him to give her more support than what he had been planning. But my dad wanted such a complicated series of small divided trusts that the lawyer they were seeing just couldn't finalize it - it wasn't making legal or tax sense to go to the level of complexity that my dad was asking. My parents live comfortably, but they aren't rich by any means. Anyway, I flew out here in April to meet with them and the lawyer to nail it down, which didn't happen. Or rather, it did, but my dad never gave the final ok to write up the wills and so it was left hanging, again. It turns out that my stepmom took them to a new attorney this week and had identical wills drawn. I question my dad's mental state to be making decisions like this, but then again I really can't blame her for not wanting to be screwed over completely. I called the original attorney and asked him to send the final invoice, stating that my parents weren't going to finish it with him, and it ended up being almost $3,000, which I am now stuck with. The new wills specify that my dad's entire estate goes into a trust to be used solely for my stepmom's support until she dies, then it is to be divided evenly between me and my brother. It's his estate and his decision, obviously, but I'm really uncomfortable with the trust arrangement. Basically, she can live in the residence of her choosing, and my brother and I are responsible for paying for all of the furnishings, repairs, maintenance, taxes, improvements. If she decides she wants to move, his will states that we must sell that residence and buy her a new one. I wish he would have just figured out some percentage split and we all could have gone our happy way. As it stands now, it's just going to be a logistical hassle for the next 20 or so years (she's 20 years younger than he is), and then we get whatever she hasn't spent.

The last part that hurt is that my stepmom said that my dad really wants my brother to inherit his Bosendorfer grand piano. That was new information for me. I don't care about it from an inheritance/monetary standpoint (although it's worth about $85k), but my brother never took piano lessons, yet I was forced to take them until I was 15. My dad always said that he wanted me to be a professional pianist (despite the fact that my musical skills are more mechanical than talent). Now, I've mentioned here before that I don't have a terrific relationship with my dad, but symbolically, it hurt to hear that. Playing piano was probably the only memory I have of my dad trying to be close to me when I was growing up.

Neither of them have expressed any interest in my pregnancy. Actually, the only thing either of them said was last night. My stepmom said "you're going to look cute once you start showing". Um, I *am* showing - I'm not normally this big. I know that she meant it in a nice way, but it still hurt. I know that I'm being overly sensitive, though, so I'm trying not to react.

Wow - reading over this post, I guess I can conclude that I'm hurting right now. Ouch. Ugh.

Anyway, thanks again for all of your kind words, and mostly for just letting me write this. It's helping me process my feelings to get it on ?paper? ?screen?. My T's billing rate just went up to $150/hour and my insurance doesn't cover it, so I've stopped going for now. I don't have time anyway - I'm stretched so thin

oh LMo,

wow, you are sure dealing with a lot and sounding very sane and logical despite the emotions you have to be experiencing. don't think i could do what you are doing. i believe God will protet and provide. but still, God helps those who help themselves. it sounds that even though there are many complicated complex and at times opposing issues to sort thru that you have kept a level head through it all.

i never cared to think on financial issues during a time like this, no training, no desire so i can't help. is there a lawyer to represent your concerns?

above all, i feel that your baby could sense your stress, so i hope you are doing things to keep yourself calm and composed (just like it sounds you are doing).

but understanding all that must be going through your mind, maybe a good scream session outdoors in a isolated place would help relieve the built up pressures. i don't know.

i know i'm not alone wishing you the best.

if it helps organize, relax, then keep posting and keep us updated and please let us know what we can do to help.

don't forget to take care of #1. take some time out. maybe allow others to deal the way they know best as much as there's no harm done. i am very sorry to hear about your dad. it's very clear he is not himself these days.

lots of prayers...

Lmo, what a difficult and sad time for you.

What if you sit beside his bed and read to him? Listen to music with him? Or just sit and be with him while you read. It is so comforting for someone to just be there. Waking up and having someone there feels so good.

hon if she had this will done this week in his state of mind I would contest it. what she is doing is not fair and he is not in his right mind at the moment. I am very sorry you are hurting right now. it is a very hard place to be. remember contest it. you and your brother should not have to take care of her. it has to go to probate as well. contest contest contest.

Thanks Run, Echoes, Bebop... I find it astounding that anyone is taking the time to read my huge long posts. Sorry about that. Feeling verbose, I guess.

I decided to stay a few more days, despite the fact that it's a terrible time to be away from my client this week. My stepmom is so frazzled. We bought diapers (aka "special pants") for my dad this evening. I am wondering if his kidneys are having problems - he peed himself 3 times today, and actually made it to the bathroom about 4 other times. He's peeing more than I am, and I'm pregnant...

Thanks for your kind words, Run. I don't know if I'm being sane and logical. Or maybe I am... one part of me that's very confused about myself is that I'm still having a hard time softening up around him. I'm helping him as much as he'll let me, but my actions feel robotic. My nurture supply is completely cut off when I'm with him. I'd probably be more nurturing with a complete stranger. I am confused about why that is.

Echoes, I tried your suggestion of reading to him - that was a good idea. Unfortunately, especially with me, he never understands a word I say. This has been a problem ever since I was able to talk - English is not his first language and for whatever reason - my pitch? don't know - he always has a difficult time understanding me when I speak, and now it's almost impossible. I read about 2 paragraphs of greek mythology to him and then he told me it was enough.

Bebop - I don't know what to contest. We need to make some provisions for my stepmom. She's put up with so much - he's not an easy man to be in a relationship with. She's taking good care of him now. I agree that it was wrong of her to get him to sign something in his limited intellectual state, but on the other hand, what else could she do? On her own, she has absolutely nothing. I can't imagine being in her shoes. I don't know what her alternative would be if we contested it. We can't get a new will written, because he's not in any better intellectual state now than he was a week ago. I suppose it's as fair as it can be without starting the whole process from scratch, which also would be difficult to uphold because then SHE could contest that we got him to sign something when he wasn't competent to make decisions. And since I appreciate what she's doing for him since I can't do anywhere close to as much, I wouldn't contest it; not now.

Ugh.

I was thinking more on the lines that you and your brother will be ordered to pay her expenses. this is a very rough time for all of you and I am so sorry this is happening. such a sad time. maybe too call in hospice to help her out when you go home. she will need all the help she can get.

i don't know LMo if you're comfortable getting hugs.. seems like i remember that conversation once a long time ago but maybe it involved someone else... anyway, my heart really goes out to you... you sound so brave despite everything...

my only thoughts re the softening is that now is the time you have with him... whatever the past has been, the present is now, and the future will be something else... if it were me i would try, not saying i could, i don't understand the whole nature of your relationship, but i would try to have as much love now between yourself and him.. if nothing else, you can say in the hour, at the time, your heart was in the right place and in future days, should the regrets or doubts form, in your heart you would be able to forgive at least yourself... physically, mentally, he is limited now... but you are not as much and i just worry about your future emotions relative to this... and even if you aren't the perfect daughter, and who here always is, at least you can say that at the time, considering all that is happening, in your heart was a pure seed of compassion... to the best you could at the time... robotic or not... you are there, you are doing what you can.. you've even sacrificed professionally... i think you are there all the way right now LMo... with everything going on there is possibly some understandable detachment... life may not ever be harder than this... give yourself some hugs and appreciation... you're doing all you can...

you're wonderful Run. I'm glad that you're back. Thank you so much...

LMo, always you and your dad in my thoughts and in my heart...

LMO, sweetie,
I empathize with your situation. I'm currently caring for my mom who has terminal cancer. She is in my home and I do all I can to make her comfortable. My thoughts are with you.
Love,
Patty

Thanks so much, Clyde and Patty. My thoughts are with you all as well. Patty, your mom is lucky to have a daughter like you.

LMo

Today wasn't as bad, sort of. We had a rough night because he kept getting up and eating anything he could get his hands on in the kitchen. Not a terrible thing, but since we caught him drinking hard liquor straight out of the bottle a few nights ago, I didn't know what he would try to eat or do if left unattended. I slept with my secret baby monitor in my room so I could get up when he did. It worked pretty well, until he yelled at me to stop watching him while he ate. Then I just waited in the living room until he went back to bed. One time when he got up, he ate 3 bananas in a row before I took the rest of the bunch. The next time, he ate 3 tomatoes, as if they were apples. The next time, he ate the remaining 2 tomatoes. Very bizarre.

He was in better spirits today and talking and smiling a little more. He also didn't seem to have as much trouble getting out of a chair. I did, however, start limiting how much we were feeding him by watering down his soup and adding milk to his eggs so that they looked like more food than it really was. I also tried to talk to him today about getting some exercise, because it's going to be harder for my stepmom to help him if he gets both weaker and heavier at the same time. He said he understood, but also refused to exercise or go for a short walk in the driveway with me. Sigh.

I arranged for a hospice referral and they're coming tomorrow at 11. My stepmom is heartbroken - she didn't realize it would come down to this so quickly. We warned the hospice coordinator that my dad is very resistant to outside (or inside, for that matter) help and they said they would send someone with experience with people like him. I hope this works out well...

One thing I'm puzzled about... so, I was able to engage him in short conversations this evening, which is nice. He seemed to be willing to answer questions but... I don't have any. I can imagine that after he is gone, I will think of a ton of things that I will have wished I had asked him, but at the moment, I am drawing a blank. I mean, I do wish I knew more about my mom and my childhood, but his memory of those days has been questionable over the last few years. And his version of history can be quite hurtful, so I'm almost afraid to hear what he remembers.

For my 35th birthday, for example, he wrote me a very long letter. It started out sweet enough - congratulating me for hitting a milestone like that, etc, then turned to a recount of my life from the day I was born. On the first page, I thought, "huh, maybe this won't be so bad after all!" and I kept reading. I was sorry by the middle of page 2. It turned into how stubborn I was as a child, and how much I hurt my mom by being so difficult. He had plenty of stories concocted about how I did certain "bad" things, but as far as I recall, some of those things were my brother's actions, not mine. The worst is when he got to the part about when my mom died. His facts were completely twisted around, and he spent a page and a half describing how I was out on a date when she died and all she wanted was to see me one last time. Now, she died a few days after my 15th birthday, at 5am on a Tuesday, and I certainly was not out on a date at that age or at that time. I don't know why he is remembering it like that. It really, really hurt that his memory of me is one that is so far from the truth. I confirmed it with my brother in case my own mind had played tricks on me, and although he is 2 years younger, he also remembers my version of her death.

So I don't know what to ask him. I do have questions, but I'm afraid to hear the answers because they are very likely to reinforce his negative opinion of me and it just seems pointless if it's not the truth anyway. Not to mention that he doesn't seem to want to talk much these days.

It's a strange conundrum. My stepmom and I watched a movie last night that hit very close to home. I don't recall the name of it, but the story was about a woman on her deathbed and two sisters trying to interpret her stories told while she was dreaming out loud. It seemed so similar to what I'm going through, but at the same time, I don't see it possible to get that kind of closure the way the two daughters did in the movie. And even more strangely is that I'm basically ok with that -- I'm just worried about possibly regretting it later.

maybe ask him funny things about his childhood. in his current state though things may well not be remembered correctly. good luck with the hospice. I am thinking about you and your family.

That is a GREAT idea, Bebop! Can't go wrong with that, even if the stories aren't accurate! THANK YOU!

Hey - for those of you who have actually stuck with this thread, even if you didn't reply, thank you. I'm sorry that my posts are so long. You're the only ones I'm talking about this with in such detail, and it's cathartic for me. Thanks again,
LMo

You talk as much as you need when you need

((((( LMo )))))

I wish you didn't have to go through such hardship during this time in your life that is supposed to be so happy. Try not to let your dad's sordid memories upset you; you know the truth. I'm sure he's hurting, knowing he's dying and is lashing out. My mom was the same way; she even threw her beloved cat across the room. I can't imagine what that must be like, to slowly slip away mentally.

Take care of you and poppy seed and post often. This too shall pass.

make sure you write down the stories or better yet if you have a small tape recorder turn it on while he talks. my hubby's dad has done that and let me tell you it is fun to sit and listen to them.

LMO said, "it's cathartic for me. "....I know exactly what you mean, LMO...I find myself coming here to PC just to relate to people.
My mom is doing okay for now, sipping on some broth, but also asking for pain medication. I just hope I can keep her comfortable. My sis is helping during the day while I go to work and I come home tired during the weekdays.
I'm thinking of you, dear one!
Love,
Patty

Thanks Clyde, Rayna, Bebop, Patty:
Oh what a day. We had our first hospice worker meeting, and my dad absolutely flipped out. He was furious, despite the fact that we prefaced it by saying that the worker was there to help the FAMILY, not just him. He was incredibly rude to her (which is NOT out of character for him -- you should have seen him with my boyfriends.. ugh) and kept telling us to get 'that woman' out of his house. I took him into another room and gave him a stern talk about how this situation is extremely stressful for my stepmom, upon whom he relies extensively even if he won't admit it. If he has an ounce of love for her, then he needs to put his pride aside and be a little bit flexible for her sake. She is totally tethered to the house because of him - the hospice care will give her the respite to go get her hair cut and go run errands... things she can't do now with the condition he's in...

You know, I was thinking about her stress levels, and I realize that it's bringing back memories... not so much of me caring for my mom (my dad traveled for work M-F so I was her primary caregiver the summer before she died), but when my husband was severely depressed for 3 years. I was also afraid to leave the house because I feared that he was suicidal. He also refused to get out of bed or eat or shower - I had to beg him to do all of that. It was hard to even change the sheets and the house always stunk of sick people. I was under a tremendous amount of stress over it (which is how I found PC), and I guess I'm feeling SO MUCH compassion for my stepmom because I really can relate to what she is going through. My husband's disease was not guaranteed to be terminal, but every day I feared that it might turn out that way.

Patty, I'm glad that your sister is helping during the day so that you can work. That must feel like a big relief in so many ways. Please take care of yourself and know that by helping yourself, you're also helping your mom. She's so lucky to have you...

LMO...What you are going thru sounds so much like what we experienced with my dad who died at age 62 of colon cancer. He would absolutely NOT acknowledged his condition and refused any contact with Hospice. As a result, the family, my mom, my sister, and I, had to deal with the consequences of his deterioration without any help. The hospital and his doctors pretty much washed their hands of it, so we were on our own.
Hospice is a Godsend and I think of the workers/nursers as angels.
I don't know why my dad refused them, but it was so hard because of his mindset. I hope your dad will be more receptive.
Love,
Patty