My dad :(

my mom would not allow us to bring in hospice either. not til she could no longer talk and that was 2 days before she passed. she was too weak to argue.
hon how long are they saying for your dad? I am assuming they have given a time frame with hospice coming in. (((lmo))) (((patty)))

LMo,

you're doing an incredible job given the difficult circumstances involved. there's much to negotiate w/ the brother, stepmother and your father, hospice workers and such.

you show much strength in how you're handling this. write a novel if you need to as this appears to be a valuable outlet for you at this time.

we're in own world of grief due to our situation so we've been barely able to remember our password let alone sign in.

you're wise to recognize the feelings of past memories being brought to the front due to similarities of helpless feelings or the fears you dealt w/ both your mother's passing and your husband's disease.

keep letting out as you're able. ppl do read. hard to reply in the best state of mind in the best of times....and we're certainly not in good shape w/ our full plate of life's unexpected passings.

LMo,

I want you to know that I have been keeping you in my prayers but haven't had as much time to spend here as I would like to have.

It's important for you to be able to express all your thoughts, feelings, & emotions that you are experiencing throughout this time. No matter how long the posts or how involved they are, it's important for you to be able to get them down in writing.

Looking back, it is exactly 3 years ago that I was going through similar experience with my Mother who was dying of vulvar cancer. My father had died 13 years before & I was an only child. I had no support or anyone to lean on during the time I was going through the experience. I was new here at PC & not able to open up very well at that point. I was also going through some issues with the ID theft that had me so scared & confused, I didn't know where to turn. My Mother didn't know that she was dying from the cancer because she believed that "her Dr's would tell her everything she needed to know ". They told her they got everything when they did the surgery, so how could she possibly be dying of the cancer that they got????

I was watching all of this going on around me & my head was spinning. Fighging with my Mother to get her the help she refused. Realizing that she didn't want anyone around her to see how bad she was really doing when I finally got a chance to see her for myself.

Sadly, I had my own responsibilities with my new born filly that was got a leg injury 3 weeks after birth & required daily care for that. I lived over 1 hour away from my Mother, so her Dr's were all around her house, so having her stay at my house wouldn't have solved any of the problems.

The worry & caring exists no matter how the relationship is. Your posts bring up so many points I want to comment on, but don't want to make a lengthy reply.

One important issue is about the will/trust. Even though it seems petty at this time, it's important to get it cleared up now & not later because hard feelings will come from letting issues like that slide. You might want to talk with the previous lawyer you had working on the will/trust & get he might provide you with thoughts on a more equitable set up. I know you want your step-mother to be provided for, but not at the cost of loosing everything between your brother & you. Also, just a thought, but you might just mention to your brother how much sentiment there is for you with the piano & he might be very understanding about that. It's sad that your Father didn't recognize that aspect in the piano, but when the mind goes, so does any thought processes that might consider things like that.

I know what a difficult time you are going through right now....watching everything that is happening & trying to make sense out of it....it is almost impossible to do in the best cases, so you are doing very well in trying to sort it all out. That is why it's so important to be able to express everything that you are writing here. It will help you put your thoughts together later & remember important things that were thoughts in passing. It also helps to know that others have had the same feelings & emotions. I know that going through everything I went through without any support of any kind & trying to figure out what has happening all around me let alone what was happening to my Mother was like living through a nightmare.

Your posts bring up so many points I would like to comment on, but don't want to make a reply that is a mile long, so just responded to a few of the issues, But I wanted you mostly to know that you are in my thoughts & prayers.

The important thing also is to take care of yourself. It's hard when stressed & pregnant because the baby experiences all the stress you are going through. I know it's tough because this is a situation that the stress can't be avoided...but maybe your Dr can give you some ideas on how to lessen it's effect on the baby...(just a thought),

Know that my prayers & thoughts are with you & glad that PC is here for the support that is desperately needed during this time,
Debbie

Thanks Patty, Bebop, _zh and Debbie:
First of all, I'm sorry for all of the grieving you've all had to go through as well; some of you are doing so in the present. That said, I can't believe you're taking the time to support me - I appreciate that so much - I feel so self-absorbed right now that the best I have been able to do is tackle some of the easier posts here on PC. You are all so kind....

I didn't know what kind of support I was looking for when I started this thread, yet it turns out that the posts you have made have really helped me a lot. I am touched that you're taking the time to support me like this, and are sharing your own stories. I feel closer to you all because of your sharing and care. It helps a lot. Thank you.

Bebop - my dad'd prognosis at this point is 6 weeks. He seems to be deteriorating quickly, so I don't know if it will be less, in reality.

You know, Debbie... strangely I'm not particularly stressed, despite it all. I mean, this is no walk in the park, but when it comes to how this is affecting the baby, I don't know - maybe I'm in denial about this - but since I became pregnant I have been calmer than I have ever been in my life. I understood that my surging hormones would likely cause mood swings, but I have felt really, really centered the whole time, even despite the curve ball with my dad. It also could be that I started taking meditation classes this summer, but I haven't been practicing in the last few weeks and I still feel relaxed. I don't know - it's odd, indeed. I need support, but I don't feel anxious and churned up as I did when taking care of my husband when he was sick. Or maybe it's because I see my stepmom and brother being all churned up - it wouldn't do the family much good if all three of us were on the edge. I don't know...

The night was quiet. My stepmom has slipped Tylenol PM into his nightly meds for the past two nights, and although I really didn't mind getting up to check on him during his nightly snacking sessions, I know that it was keeping HER up with worry and I have to say that I think all of us are better off with her new plan. There is no need for him to be eating in the middle of the night, anyway, and it's really dangerous. I'm glad that she has found a way to ensure that she gets enough rest and can keep him safe while she's sleeping.

One thing that saddened me this morning - after breakfast, he was walking back to the bedroom and passed the side table where my stepmom had placed all of his get-well and birthday cards. On the table was the letter I wrote him to show appreciation for all he taught me growing up (which was not an easy letter to write - I have more resentment than appreciation for my relationship with him, but I did my best to put all that aside for his peace). We thought he was collecting them to read in his room - I'm not sure that he even read my letter because he didn't acknowledge it - but instead he walked over to the trash and threw them all away

I have to get some work done but thank you again for all of your kind words. Your posts mean a lot to me

{{{{{{{{{{{{{LMo}}}}}}}}}}}}}}} This surely is a difficult time for all of your family, not to mention your dad. Maybe all those well wishes just served as a reminder that he won't be around for much longer and he didn't want to see it, ya know?

Who knows how he's really feeling deep down. All you can do it your part. Sounds like you're not letting him go without doing your best to give him peace of mind. At the same time, you're making sure that your conscience is clear. You can only do so much.

When you meditate, make sure to search your heart and mind so that you aren't repressing feelings. They'll affect you seriously when your dad passes.

Love you, Sweety!

I agree with tomi on that one! hon sit with him and let him know how you feel. even though there may be resentments from the past there is still love there.

you were asking about "should he do treatment" my answer to that one is no. not at this point. if they are only giving him 6 weeks make it as easy as possible. the treatment would make him too sick to have any quality.

((((( LMo ))))))

I hadn't wanted to share my story about all this since this is about your difficulties but you said that everyone's sharing has helped you and I know that when I find people who understand, it helps me too.

When I was 18 my mom was diagnosed with cancer. For awhile she was ok, doing chemo treatments and stuff but then all the meds made her start to deteriorate. I've shared that she through her cat across the room. That was when we were trying to care for her at home. Had a hospital bed set up in the living room and we gave her meds every 4 hours. We had a buzzer system rigged so that she could buz us back in the bedrooms. On the weekends my dad went and did his thing in the band and I was left at home to care for her. Waking up every four hours to give meds etc. I don't remember why we didn't have a hospice nurse stay with us.

She did the same kind of things, getting up to eat etc. She didn't get as mean, but she wasn't herself. One night she fell and my dad and I made the decision to put her back in the nursing home. That was the hardest thing ever, to load her in the van and when she stepped out, she saw where she was and this look of pain came across her face. She died there. I still hate driving by that horrid place.

Its taken me years to even start to get passed it. I drank away a lot of those years, resentment at my dad and even at her for having to leave college.....its only been within in the last year that I've started to feel the feelings and have periods of deep grieving and regret.

I'm so glad you're getting through all that resentment now, so that it doesn't eat you up years later. I'm so glad your stepmom is a good help with this. I felt very alone with my parents, my dad only did it out of obligation. He took his new girlfriend to my mom's wake.....ahhhh anyway I could go on and on.

I just wanted to let you know that I've been through something similar, I understand.

Thanks Tomi and Bebop...

Oh, treatment is out of the question. He won't even consider it. Everyone involved except my brother is in agreement about it.

I'm still having a very hard time with the "letting him know how I feel" conversation. Since I arrived on Saturday, I can't get any conversation out of him whatsoever. He can't hear me when I talk, and even when he does hear me, he doesn't understand what I'm saying. I asked him if he could tell me funny stories about his childhood and he said he doesn't have any. I tried to indirectly engage him in a conversation about his grandchild, because in the 10 weeks that he has known about my pregnancy, he has never once shown interest in it. So, last night at dinner, I asked him if my mom had particularly liked or disliked any foods when she had been pregnant with me/my brother. He got annoyed and said "why do you think I'd remember that?". Oops. Sore subject, I guess. I know that he had been a very involved and excited dad, so I'm sure he used to know. Maybe it's hard for him to accept that his memory is shot. Or maybe he doesn't want to think about a grandchild that he'll never know. I don't know. At this point, I think I've given up the utopian concept of doing any bonding with him from this point forward. I hope I'm not being premature or lazy by doing that. It just seems to hurt me more than it helps me, and my attempts seem to irritate him. He seems to appreciate being fed more than talking to me.

That doesn't bother me, to be truthful - the pressure of feeling like I'm supposed to have some kind of emotional relationship breakthrough feels worse, right now. Am I going to later regret feeling this way right now? Am I just being lazy?

oh Rayna... that's more than you've ever told me about your past... ((( Rayna ))) how hard at 18. I'm so sorry

at his age and with what is going on right now I am sure he probably does not remember things. I don't think you will regret what you are doing right now though hon. you are doing all you can. I tried with my mom too but she died mad at me because I could not afford to quit my job at that time. she had sisters and nieces that lived right beside her and my daughter that lived with her to take care of her. the one time she saw me crying she told me if I was going to do that to just leave. fun huh? anyway hon keep doing what you are. we will be here for you

oh Bebop... I'm so sorry... that must have hurt terribly. That's pretty much where my dad is too, mood-wise.

(((( bebop ))))

((((lmo))))) just wanted to let you know i've been reading this thread. sorry for not replying sooner. but, you've been in my thoughts the whole time. some things that you wrote reminded me of when i helped my mom and grandma take care of my grandpa before he passed away from alzhiemer's disease over 4 years ago. like not being able to understand what we're saying, especially. i understand what it's like with your dad. take care of yourself (and your babe).

it was hard at first. she abused me as a child and then when I got to be an adult it went to mental abuse. she is the one that lost out. I pity her now. she died a mean woman. I am not sorry really now except for the fact she hated me so much. I am ok with it now. I did all I could for her but it was never enough and never would have been enough. I was with her when she died. sitting right by her side.

it is a shame parents treat their children so bad.

again hon we are and will be here for you anytime!

I'm sorry about that, bebop. That was good of you to be there despite it all. I kind of feel like I'm in the same situation.

My dad wasn't a bad guy - he just wasn't anywhere close to being the kind of dad I needed. My younger brother thinks my dad should win an award for Best Father in the World. I'm a little tired of feeling guilty because I don't feel the same way about him. I appreciate some of the things he has done for us, and he has had a huge influence on my life, some of which has been very positive. But we've never been on the same page and I spent most of my life being hurt that he couldn't or wouldn't understand that I had my own opinions, beliefs, ideas, and plans for my life. I suppose he was hurt in the same way, because he really wanted me to be someone that I am not. But I don't have any regrets for how I turned out, so I guess it's just a matter of different personalities, different generations, and different cultures.

I just wanted to add my support to everyone else's. It is a blessing to me that you are sharing what you are going through. It is so real.

Sounds like your dad had a very hard life. May he be at peace soon.

Your child sounds like he's/she's full of Grace. How precious. Bless you both.

yes hon our parents do tend to want us to be something THEY want for us not what we want for ourselves. I do understand hon.

dear LMO!

I am sorry for you going through all of this. I feel sort of a kindred spirit with you, with both of us dealing with our pregnancies just a few weeks apart. Im sure it must be that much more stressful for you dealing with both things at once.

LMo,

Thinking of you and your family.

((((((((((( LMo ))))))))))))))

You couldn't be lazy if you tried.

When a person's memory goes, they either become very child like or very mean. Your father is probably angry that he can't remember things and is taking it out on you.

I wish I had wonderful words to soothe you, but I don't. All I can offer is: "I am here."

Thanks Doh (I love that name!), Rainbowzz, bebop, Echoes, HP Jan...

I'm back at home after spending 5 days with my parents. I have to say that I was relieved to leave, but within seconds of feeling relief, I felt a ton of guilt because it's out of sight, out of mind (sort of) for me, but neither of my parents have that option. Part of me feels strongly that the right thing to do would be to quit my job and relocate there until it's ... um, over, but there would be so many negative ramifications to my life if I were to do so, and honestly, I don't think my dad is enjoying or appreciating my company anyway. It would really mostly be to support my stepmom.

I made two decisions on the flight home:
1) I'm not going to feel pressured to have the emotional breakthrough with my dad. He doesn't seem to want it and it's almost impossible to get any conversation out of him. I tried just sitting in the same room while he slept, and he told me to leave because he doesn't want someone hovering over him while he's sleeping. He even started pushing my brother away, and the two of them have been very close for the last 10 years. I could keep trying and trying and trying, but I think all that would happen is that he would die irritated at me and I would say goodbye to him feeling very rejected. So, I'm going to follow his cue and not anything more.
2) I'm not going to feel guilty because I'm not devastated by this. My brother is angry with me because I'm not crying and freaking out over my dad's illness. I'm upset, sure, but it's not tearing me apart, to be truthful. At first, I felt as though I should lie to my brother and make something up about how I just don't like showing it in front of others, but that's not really true. I'm sad for my dad because it's not how I'd wish anyone to die. I'm sad for my relationship with him, because this means we'll never have the chance to grow close. But he's 84, and while I love him as his daughter, I don't particularly like him very much. I've always felt uncomfortable in his company and he's never been the kind of supportive parent that I hoped for. So I have to be truthful - this isn't the worst thing that has ever happened in my life. Going through a divorce was far, far worse than the inevitable end of life of a parent that I'm not close to.

My dad called his handyman (who is my dad's only 'friend', even though their relationship has been purely a business one) over the weekend and asked him to come over to help with something in the house. It turns out he just talked to him for an hour, more than he has talked to any of us lately. The handyman said that my dad is very suspicious of my stepmom, brother and I because we're making him do things he doesn't want to do and we're not letting him be in charge. Interesting. And true - we've taken over his care because we are concerned about his safety and ability to take care of himself. He can't walk well, he is almost blind, pretty much deaf, and can't get himself out of the bathtub and often not out of a chair, either. If he fell in the hallway, I don't think he'd be able to get up on his own. So yes, it's true - we supervise him when and what he eats, and we watch him whenever he gets out of bed. He peed himself (and worse, unfortunately) several times in a single day and after the last time, we got him "special underwear", which he was furious about. But what were we supposed to do? He can't clean himself and the bed/couch/chair/rug/car himself, so how is it fair to let him just continue doing it? And the hospice thing - he sees that as the ultimate betrayal, but I feel that my stepmom deserves as much support as he is getting, and it's unfair to HER if we don't pursue assistance. So I don't know how to respond to my dad's concern - I have been trying to think of ways we can behave differently to respect his desire to maintain some dignity, but I honestly can't think of anything we could do differently. And many of the things he got mad at me about when I was there were because he misunderstood something I said. So I don't know what to do differently, although I'd be happy to try as long as it doesn't compromise his safety or my stepmom's sanity.

Sigh.

I'm supposed to go back next Monday but I'm thinking of going earlier, maybe Thursday or Friday depending upon how my stepmom is holding up.

Anyway, thanks for your thoughts and positive words, and as always, I appreciate your support.

hon all I can tell you is at this point let him do whatever he is able to do. losing dignity is such a big thing as we all know. I do agree if he is messing up his clothes and stuff to keep him in the diapers. it sounds like he is a very proud man and it gets to him. as far as feeling guilty? don't. you are doing what you can. and hon they all push away the ones they love the most. I am sure he talked to his handyman about how he is feeling knowing he is dying. my mom never talked to me about how she was feeling but did my cousin. hang in there hon.