another schiz

Oh! well I'm relieved at that, and thanks for you apology.
I did understand what your dad said, and I had meant what I said fully respectfully of it, but with a touch of humour as well, ( Like, yeah, having a pd isnt the greatest echievement a person can have I know, but there you go!)

all best for now.

River.

<font color="#000088">Thanks for excepting my apology. I really didn't mean to hurt you. I'm not too bad if you really get a chance to get to know me. I was really close to my Dad before he died, he was also my best friend. So I'm pretty sensitive about anything that involves my Dad.I still haven't been able to deal with his passing away in 2005! I really don't think I ever will be able to!He mean't too much to me to let go of!
But I'm glad at least I was able to let you know that I wasn't trying to harm you,and that you feel better about it!
J</font>

Thats great, thanks Justice.
Its been a trip discovering this place, and I'm curious, about you, about everyone here.

I understand feelings about your dad. Fathers have a particular place in my heart. I have similar feelings about mine, only I'm talking a lot longer ago. Its so good that you had that close relationship with him, do you find that having had that fulfilment helps in your loss?
I was 21 when my dad died, and at the time I was fairly crazy, unavailable to communicate with him as I would have loved to when I came more to my sesnses. That has been one of my greatest sadnesses in life too.

I think, some things, some people, we carry cradled in our heart, for our life.

Got to go, try to discipline myself tonight to get to bed ontime!
Maybe talk later.

RiverX

<font color="#000088">Being so close to him,made it much harder on me when he passed away.Because the rest of my family wasn't as close to him,except for one of my little brothers,and he couldn't even speak for about a week after his death,another little brother that did love my dad a lot turned to heroine to try to get through the loss,and his twin brother just went on a drinking and prescription drug binge over it. It was me and those youngest 3 brothers that were the closest to my Dad. The rest were upset naturally,but got over it very quickly,and were more interested in his life insurance,than missing him! And that really upsets me about my family,their greed just tears me up inside,because I know that it's hurting my Dad. </font>

mmmmm

my comp not working, cant repply ,, want to..
aaaarrhgh!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<font color="#000088">I'm sorry your computer is having problems,but at least you were able to reply to some extent,instead of not at all. So at least your computer is working,and not completely down,just to look at the bright side of things. </font>

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
Justice said:
<font color="#000088"> The rest were upset naturally,but got over it very quickly,and were more interested in his life insurance,than missing him! And that really upsets me about my family,their greed just tears me up inside,because I know that it's hurting my Dad. </font>

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

I think comp. working again now.
Yes, I wanted to say something because what you had said I think was sensitive and important and I didnt want you to feel unresponded to.

Some things you said resonated with me.

Do you have the feeling that your dad was like a lone voice of decency, that was unheard in the deluge of a sort of selfishness on the rampage?
Well, that would describe how I see the dynamics in my family. I'm in my 50s now, so I was a teenager in the 60s. Me and my sisters did the maddest sort of 'rebellion', which was no rebellion at all but following a cult, we had had an expensive education, but threw it all up and even incliding any ability to think for ourselves during that time.
I believe we were mostly in reaction to my mother, but he was the one who got hurt.

I was 21 when he died, still so immature and not in tune with reality.
'Inconsolable' is how I would describe my feelings of loss when I 'woke up' and began to realise what had happened, what I had lost.

Now I am sort of attempting to negotiating a kind of peace with my family, my sisters, I do care about them, but I see things very differently to them, and I do also have that same feeling, that what they do hurts my dad.
These days I feel I want to keep away from them, but then I also feel some obligation to stay in contact. I feel I need to get in and get out quickly without having betrayed my values as far as possible.

Looking at how I have lived up to now, I can see the extent to which the famly dynamics have affected the course of my life and caused me an accumulation of failures in love and in work. I think maybe I am breaking through some things now with having finally understood so much more.
Yes, inconsolable is what I have been. Now, it feels like I have to do what I can to collect what motivation and energy I can gather to now move forward for the rest of my life.
It helps so much though, to talk to others who have some kinds of similar situations. Thanks for listening, and how is your life these days? I remember what you said about your expereinces over christmas!

warm wishes,

River.x

<font color="#000088">My Dad was a very decent, and one of the most generous people I've ever known,and my brothers were always taking advantage of him,plus my only sister was to! I'm the only person in my family that didn't owe him money when he died! I mean at least over $1,000.00 from each family member. It was dispicable, my Dad was getting really upset by them during the last year of his life,because of one incident of a brother ripping him off. I tried to take care of it for him. But he ended up losing a lot, and I could'nt afford to replace the amount that was owed,or I would have,just to make him happy! </font>

Hi Justice,
Sounds like you were powerless in the situation?

Do you think tho, that for him knowing that you understood his position must have made a lot of difference to him? Were you able to speak to him about it?
I know you would have liked to have done more.
If I were in his position, I think I would have been deeply helped by having a daughter who cared and could see what was happening as you did.

river.

<font color="#000088">He knew I was doing everything I could to make sure he was okay,and to try to make him as comfortable as possible for the remainder of his life. He didn't have much time left,and he knew that. I came all the way up to Utah just to take care of him, so my family wouldn't dump him in some cheap nursing home. He was afraid of that,and that's what they were about to do, that's why I came up here, to help him avoid that! And he loved me for everything I did,he loved me regardless of what I did. He knew I was trying to take care of the situation he was upset about, and he told me just not to worry about it, that it wasn't my fault. That he shouldn't have been so trusting with my brother. I just told him that he was just being a Dad, and giving him the opportunity to do the right thing,and he chose not to, so not to blame himself either. </font>

That sounds wonderful. Thank God you had that beautiful conversation!

River.

<font color="#000088">He was a wonderful father, and we had many conversations, we used to sit and talk for hours. Sometimes he didn't make a lot of sense,and just went on and on about things that weren't real, because as he was getting sicker,his dementia was worsening. But I still just sat and listened to what he had to say, that's all he wanted,was someone to talk to and listen to him. He got really sick soon after he retired as a Psychologist Ph.D., he was also a Licesed Clinical Social Worker,he just worked his way up to the top,and still went to school and got his Ph.D, he had his Masters in Psychology to! I didn't even know he went to San Diego State University until after he died! I was born in Southern California,but not in San Diego,pretty close though! So it was pretty cool that I have always been drawn to San Diego,moved there when I grew up, then found out my Dad went to School there,and used to live there. What a coincidence!</font>

I can hear and feel how much you value him and his memory. I imagine you would be pleased at how you spent time with him as he got ill?

Something else I wanted to say to you, the other night I was glancing through what we said to eachother on the way to the present bit, and I realised that when you originally got upset with me, I had misquoted your father, I said 'do what you want' and the original qutoe was 'do anything you put your mind to', important difference in quality, I can see now, to you it would have been like down grading what he said!! that was careless of me. ...You never mention your mum at all??!
Do you feel any relief knowing how you cared for your dad whilst he was still alive?

River.

<font color="#000088">Yeah, because my Mom didn't really care about him, she just wanted his money. They had divorced when I was in my early to mid twenties, that was probably the best thing he had ever done for the families sake,at least for the youngest kids. Other than all his hard work and supporting our family all those years growing up,ofcourse! And being such a great father to us! But finally getting rid of such an abusive mother was such a big step for him to take for the family. It was hard for him when he found out all the horrible things that she had done to us while he had been working to support us! But when he realized what she had done to his children, he did what a good father would do,and got rid of the *****! He said he wouldn't tolerate having such an abusive woman under his roof. So She tried to sue him for as much alimony as she could get, even though he was paying for her apartment, and her car, even though she was working,and had her own income! She didn't get as much as she sued for,and that really pissed her off. So when he died,she took $50,000.00 from his life insurance,even though she wasn't in his "Will"! My older brother was power of attorney,and fired the real attorney,and ignored his "Will",and my older brothers and my Mom took about $80,000.00 of his life insurance for themselves,and gave me and my little brothers about $4,500.00, which was not what my Dad wanted! He wanted us to get $10,000.00 each, and my Mom was not included! Like I said,she just wanted his money,and she ended up getting it! </font>

My comps been down, just got back from being away. Computer is still unreliable, sorry to cut off for now.

River.

Justice,
My comp. seems to be holding up for now. It has had so many little things go wrong with it, that I dont trust anymore.
I read your post in another place here, and I wondered.................., wether you were talking about this.
I was concerned about suddenly cutting off this conversation and what that might be like for you, but I couldnt help it at that time.
I was wondering about this communication, if it is important for you, it would help me to know, and I will try to keep open communication about whats happening with me too. I am interested and feel involved in this too.
I would like to ask your opinion about a few things as well.

warm regards,

Riverx

<font color="#000088">I don't think whatever post you read in another forum had anything to do with this forum. But it was nice of you to check with me about it, and show concern. So, what did you want to get my opinion about?
*Justice* </font>

Oh.
I feel uncertain of my ground with this now. My question can wait.
I'm feeling uneasy and not sure how to proceed.

The things you were talking about seemed like they were very important things, and yes I do care.
At the same time, now I feel blocked and I'm losing confidence.

Maybe it will be sorted out in its own time.

River

<font color="#000088">I believe that you have good intentions, and that you really care about what you say. I'm sorry your losing confidence for some reason. Is there anything I can do to help you gain your confidence back? I'm here if you need any help with anything!
J</font>

Thank you so much. I'm going away for a few days and just wanted to reply quickly and say that rather than leave it. Ill see you when I get back. Hope Your time is ok, and you stay well.

warm regards,
river.

<font color="#000088">Oh, you're welcome. And have a safe trip, and well see you in a few days. I hope you get to feeling better! </font>

<font color="#000088">So how was your trip RiverX? I see you made it back okay. But I haven't seen any new replies here. </font>

Hi Justice,
Got back, then comp crashed again. Now got it sorted again.

But, I had stalled our conversation because I got caught up in fear. I guess this is the internet, so if one cant experiment with being honest here then where??

But I'm back now, and we can continue talking.
If you like I can tell you what was creating the fear reaction in me, but should that maybe be by a pm?

My time away was very interesting. It was with family, and I handled it better than I have ever before I think. At least I was able to be more truthful with others, not vulnerable, so much as truthful, I challenged my cousinn on what he used to call my family, I let him know |I didnt want to hear him say it, - he used to call us mad. What he missed was sensitivity to that it was a tragedy of the disfunction that was going on in my family.

I dont find it easy to be with family, but I feel now that I have some recovery in my behaviour. But in myself I feel weak, specially at nights I feel out of myself, bad dreams, like I am so empty inside, like I have lost everything that I once had inside.

How are you??

riverx

<font color="#000088">I was able to get the BPD diagnoses off my chart,since I don't have it, and it was the mistake of a PDoc that was "Mad" that put it there in the first place. You can PM me about what made you experience fear, I don't mind. My dog bit me the other day, I think it's his hormones,I don't know? I didn't even do anything to hurt him. I was just helping him get something that was stuck in his hair out! I've done that several times before, and he didn't bite me any of the other times. But this time he did, it even broke the skin. Luckily I've kept him updated on all his shots! Now he can't go outside, until I know forsure that he won't be biting anybody else! That's the first time he's ever biten anyone! I don't know what got into him!
J</font>

<font color="#000088">Oh, and I'll keep my eye out for the PM about your fear issues. Maybe I can even help you out with them, you never know? Talk to you soon! </font>