[beauflow]

SO-- I am a leery one with meds, I just started Lamictal last December, and with this refill I told them I did not think it was doing much BUT i wanted to stay at the low dose for a while to give it some time-- sort of right thinking right? They said that was ok- but that usually the higher dosage is what helps with mood disorders....

Now at one point, some wanted to put me on antipsychotic which I said no- have my own reasons, but here lately I have been thinking on something

My boyfriend (he is smart but I know he is not a doctor) but keeps wondering why I don't go on Anti-Anxiety meds to help, and that he thinks that the anxiety meds would help more than a mood stabilizer even though for about 2 years he kept talking about how meds may help my mood swings.

He uses the example of : When someone has high anxiety and they go on anti-anxiety medications, it really helps them with coping with their anxiety and not be so bad (this also with coping skills from therapy too).

NOW- We have talked about antipsychotics- and even though he agrees that I am bipolar as the docs do--- he thinks I don't need them.

But the other day, I realized that at times I go on tangents of people doing things against me, being against me, being mean in ways and out of things that NO ONE really understands how I see they are being mean.... I think this could do a lot with some other things as well, but the "everyone against me" thing I guess can occur with some bipolar people... IDK i think everyone can get this way, but I have a "habit" or more so "pattern" with it.

There are other things too-- with thinking the world is an illusion, things are illusion and so forth-- thinking frogs are signs with things or other things that pop up (the other day the radio was talking about statistics and men and women cheating and of course I took this as a sign as my boyfriend is cheating on me- we talked about this topic again) I think that can intertwine with trust issues as well...
Or Rocks are signs (secret messages) I had that about 3 years ago and again at the beginning of the year when i saw rocks. realize with me this was around the same time about 3 years ago ....

Any ways--- IDK- I WAS THINKING.... I took his train of thought with anxiety and medication.
I told him: Well would that not be the same for the whole bipolar thing and anti-psychotics?
He sort of said yes
The thing is --- I have already done enough damage to my brain with illegal drugs. I have read some things that anti-psychotics are really bad for your brain (esp. if you don't need them)..
I guess this is me just wondering-- would it work for some of the stress that I create with how I think at times with people out to get me, signs, secret messages and all-- I don't do this all the time by the way-

And yes I told this to my Therapist and the one Pdoc. Well wait- One thing I did not tell them was the illusion of the world -- but I have told them of things being illusions as in not real in my life-

arg-- hard decisions..

Harder when you get to a point of "IM FINE- nothing is wrong with me right " I tend to do that too....

it so difficult. I guess any thoughts from you lovely PC peoples

[AniManiac]

Well, for me, mood stabilizers for bipolar actually kicked the anxiety out. Much of the anxiety was from bipolar symptoms. I do have an anxiety med PRN but I don't use it now that my mood stabilizers and antidepressants are at the "right" levels. And yeah, Lamictal takes awhile to get to the right dosage - if you can wait it out long enough, it may pleasantly surprise you. I'm amazed at how well it works for me.

The psychotic symptoms might also get better with mood stabilizers, hard to tell. The antipsychotics seem like a real mess as far as meds go, but they really seem to help a lot of people. And you are talking about psychotic symptoms (delusions), so an antipsychotic med might help reduce the stress - maybe you can wait until the mood stabilizers are at a workable level first, though?

Staying on meds is tough once they make you feel like you're fine. It's a big, big problem for bipolar people. Symptoms tend to return with a vengeance if you stop the meds, though - the meds are the reason you feel fine, if the dx was wrong, the meds wouldn't be helping you! Tough to accept, but so many of us do the on-off-on-off thing with meds and nearly every time it seems to go badly when we're off meds.

[FuriousGeorge]

Talk to your Dr. Only he is qualified to make med recommendations and prescribe them.

[Trippin2.0]

I also used to see 'signs', since I was a teenager and even on the AAP's.

I enquired about the validity of my 'signs' in a biblical sense, and scripture says it's not real.

So now when I see a 'sign', I just remind myself that it means nothing, it's part imagination.

Delusions? A tricky 1 yes, my secret weapon? cold hard FACTS.

I have them written down, and when I'm doubting it, I read over it. If that doesn't help, I ask an 'anchor'. Someone who knows me and is actively part of my life. Usually my younger sister. She'll stop at N0THING to convince me my bf doesn't want to leave and all that jazz.

My point? Sometimes we just need to learn counter attacks for what our disorders do to us. I understand that everybody functions at a different level,and some can handle more than others, but I believe in trying.

I'm not an AAP fan, but they did help with my rage issues and voices. Neither problems have returned since quitting tho...

Sorry if this was a waste of your time, just wanted to add a different approach good luck with the way forward.

[beauflow]

Originally Posted by FuriousGeorge

Talk to your Dr. Only he is qualified to make med recommendations and prescribe them.

Just FYI I have and they wanted to put me on anti-psychotics then I switched doctors (now one more with PTSD and a female - sorry it is hard for me to explain and too much right now) but right now they are like whatever I want to do and or try- they suggest things, and let me go look them up and then talk about it.


Also Ani-- I get the Feeling Fine and nothing is wrong with me before meds; and before therapy but then I always pit fall again or go "nuts" as some say :-|
I can see how it is going to be hard already with me if I do find that the meds work and after a while-- and staying on them that sort of sucks. But since I can see that- It is something to watch for.

Trippin- Yes Counter Attacks- Always have the counter thinking BUT i am a little off wired when that comes about for even I can think I am tricking myself which then makes things worse some times-- counter thinking is great I agree with you there- Find the facts- I a person that does that always, but when there are no cold hard facts, when you don't trust- when it is humans we are dealing with-- in reality there are no cold hard facts that can be found-- it is the lending of the ear and faith that create that "cold hard fact"..... what about actions? I think at times those too can be facts- especially if not explained or disregarded on what was the after math.

I am sorry for rambling.

I know partially I am upset with my boyfriend (he told me for about 2 years, meds may help with your mood swings) and now I go on meds for mood stabilizing and now he is like why are you taking that and not these??
He is not a doctor but he did go to school for psychology and finished 3 yars of it- so it is not like he is a numb nut- but I think part of him denies at the same time that I am messed up and he tries like any human with this issue, maybe minimize it a little.... But all I can say is that i did not want to be guinnie pig and trying all different types of meds, but that maybe what will end up happening for I am still having trouble keeping my composure and it is getting worse at work-- I do think it is a matter of time if i don't get better, I will be going off on a customer which then is auto- termination, or it is just going to get worse with co-workers that they will push me out.... and i can not do that lose my job.. I try so hard, I even go out side and scream some times... but try to keep composure...

Thank you all-- I will stick out this Lamictal see what happens I just don't want to be a zombie walking around (dull and all)....

Meds don't necessarily make you like "a zombie walking around". I've never had that problem anyway. I've always been able to really stay "me", and the effect of the meds has generally been to slow down my racing thoughts to a more normal level, stabilize my mood so I don't cycle in and out of depression quite so often, and lift the depression enough to make therapy more effective because I can actually think and reason (something that tends to be lacking for me when I'm depressed).

Yes, I've had to switch meds over the years, not so much because of side effects (that's usually not an issue for me) or because they didn't work, but because I have this strange problem of meds just pooping out after a certain amount of time. Very frustrating and doctors don't really have an explanation for this. I'm just one of the unlucky ones that happens too.

Anyway, I don't think most people find meds "cure" anything, but they can improve and stabilize some of our symptoms somewhat so that functioning in life becomes a bit more manageable.

[dragonfly2]

Originally Posted by beauflow

But all I can say is that i did not want to be guinnie pig and trying all different types of meds, but that maybe what will end up happening for I am still having trouble keeping my composure and it is getting worse at work-- I do think it is a matter of time if i don't get better, I will be going off on a customer which then is auto- termination, or it is just going to get worse with co-workers that they will push me out.... and i can not do that lose my job.. I try so hard, I even go out side and scream some times... but try to keep composure...

It may be worth considering some time off under a medical leave. If you've been with your company for at least 12 months, you are eligible for job protection under FMLA. It would give you some breathing space so you can allow the meds some more time to work and avoid doing something you may regret. You are allowed to take up to 12 weeks a year. Just an option to consider...

[AniManiac]

Originally Posted by beauflow

Thank you all-- I will stick out this Lamictal see what happens I just don't want to be a zombie walking around (dull and all)....

No zombie stuff here, nor for most people. If meds do that, then it's the wrong thing for you and you should try something else. I've only had that happen on one antidepressant - not really zombie, but emotionally flat - and from what I've seen people say on PC, it's really not all that common (except for Topamax, that one's apparently stupid-in-a-pill).

I can understand not wanting to feel like a guinea pig, for sure. It's impossible to predict how quick or long the process of finding something that works for you will take. I feel lucky that I hit the jackpot with the right mood stabilizer on the first try, and I'm really not alone in that, but others aren't so fortunate.

With bipolar, the general consensus of professionals seems to be that the longer you go untreated, the worse symptoms tend to get. Research has shown that this is linked to neural degradation, which we all get over time, but which is believed to be faster/different with untreated bipolar. Not everyone accepts this explanation, but there's a lot of scientific evidence that bipolar is primarily organic, meaning it's in your brain, not so much your behavior/thinking. The other way around is more likely the case, behavior/thinking are affected by brain chemistry, so therapy is helpful for that but meds are usually considered the first line treatment.

Some people manage OK without meds (Trippin seems to be doing pretty well with that!) but most of us don't. Some of us don't need anything else once we do have the right meds - my therapist says I don't need therapy as long as my moods stay fairly stable. So really, we all need something a little different, and it's pretty normal to resist meds. I'm just used to it because I get pretty whacked out if I don't take them, which has been true for 20 years, and I can't manage my life very well if I'm basically off my rocker all the time.

Anyway, the more you can keep yourself open to options, trust that your docs are trying to help, and become well informed about the illness and the meds, the more likely you are to figure out the tools that will help you keep your composure without losing what makes you you. Read up - knowing what you're dealing with will be one of your best assets moving forward, and lets you take a greater part in the conversation with your docs.

[beauflow]

, I don't think most people find meds "cure" anything, but they can improve and stabilize some of our symptoms somewhat so that functioning in life becomes a bit more manageable.

i don't think there is a cure for some things that are "wrong" with me besides keep trying, not making the same mistakes as others, and keep trying good coping skills and hopefully that will spread to the rest of my life-- I understand meds are just to "help" with symptoms. Thanks FarmGirl though for what you say- i just wanted to clear that up.

i will have to look into that Dragonfly the FMLA; i work for a contractor and have been for 4 years- but they don't even give sick days.

Some people manage OK without meds (Trippin seems to be doing pretty well with that!) but most of us don't. Some of us don't need anything else once we do have the right meds - my therapist says I don't need therapy as long as my moods stay fairly stable. So really, we all need something a little different, and it's pretty normal to resist meds

thanks Ani-- that I hope for some day- I don't like how I am and have been; But hopefully I am being unlike my family members and catching it in my mid twenties to try to do something-- though, My one sister tried therapy and meds herself in her mid twenties and ended up saying F this and then tried to get back on but did not want to go through therapy-- I think she is doing ok though, she keeps a job, a house, and she raises her kids with her husband... I only talk to her some times.

Thanks everyone for your support...

Last night was rather hard but I am still here--- I hate that I hurt my boyfriend in the process of this all-- and the sadder part -- in my heart I know with out the meds I have been worse than this last week--- i know they said to give them a call if unusual thoughts or actions came about--- but in my heart I know this not that unusual and I have been worse-- I am just getting more fed with myself as time goes by; that is the real issue -- being fed up with myself, over years realizing what people I have hurt and so forth- and my emotions being a ping pong everywhere to which side does not help this. Almost break points

But i have said, to day is a new day even though my head hurts so bad..

thanks agian

[dragonfly2]

Originally Posted by beauflow

i will have to look into that Dragonfly the FMLA; i work for a contractor and have been for 4 years- but they don't even give sick days.

If your company has at least 50 people employed within a 75 mile radius (can be multiple work locations), then by law they have to give you FMLA protection. They don't have to pay you for the time you take off, but they have to save your job or an equivalent one.

Last night was rather hard but I am still here--- I hate that I hurt my boyfriend in the process of this all-- and the sadder part -- in my heart I know with out the meds I have been worse than this last week--- i know they said to give them a call if unusual thoughts or actions came about--- but in my heart I know this not that unusual and I have been worse-- I am just getting more fed with myself as time goes by; that is the real issue -- being fed up with myself, over years realizing what people I have hurt and so forth- and my emotions being a ping pong everywhere to which side does not help this. Almost break points

I know that feeling of guilt. It's so easy to get trapped in it sometimes. Some things I still can't quite forgive myself for, even though I know I did the best I could at the time. All we can do is make things better from here.

[kmtree]

I had the zombie thing with Prozac and another SSRI. Seen others react the same. Resisted getting off it though for some strange reason - an escape from reality. Almost lost my job cause of how i acted on it. I'm dumber than I used to be now - couldn't do math when I was on it - now math is confusing, used to be my strength. Also had hallucinations and throught I could read minds, like ESP, when I was taking it. Other times was lethargic or couldn't speak, like my body woudn't react to my mind.

[beauflow]

Originally Posted by kmtree

I had the zombie thing with Prozac and another SSRI. Seen others react the same. Resisted getting off it though for some strange reason - an escape from reality. Almost lost my job cause of how i acted on it. I'm dumber than I used to be now - couldn't do math when I was on it - now math is confusing, used to be my strength. Also had hallucinations and throught I could read minds, like ESP, when I was taking it. Other times was lethargic or couldn't speak, like my body woudn't react to my mind.

that is horrible and one of my fears with all of this----

KmTree I hope that you got the help and right med combo for you now

[beauflow]

so.... lamictal is not for me I guess... I have been rapid cycling with worse downs for the past 3 weeks or so--(well IDK cuz my Therapist said I sounded manic with some things- but I bipolar2) but like since they upped it-- even when I posted this... Like the following Saturday I was doing some "bad things" in the bath room.. I told my Therapist about it today, and of the other things prior to this post.. she said that since seeing me since August 11 she had not seen this side of me and that it was not idealization that i was doing.. I told her I was not sure for I have done this in the past with out drugs.

I do find this scary for -- I kept saying I have been worse and I am not sure if it is the drug, but my therapist thinks it is, and had me talk to the nurse, who discussed some things with the pdoc; and they want me to stop it. So will do---

I am glad it works for some...

The nurse was humorous for me-- she mentioned "yeah you may feel like Guinea-pig but just some drugs don't work with some people. and we don't know till we try".. she also suggested some vitamins to take either with or with out medication that may help... she also said if I find my whole "dealing with Bipolar with no meds and all" to let her know for she too has some stuff to sort out

I guess to be honest, this conversation is like why my Therapist talks about being stable. and like I think she wonders about me some times with that..... Like I was about balling in her office telling her stuff, that I did not want to talk about, and that I did not like sharing, but felt it was the right thing to do per my gut feeling... then I go and talk to a stranger about similar topics- or the same topic-- but I act like no problem, I am not that bad, that I am ok and joke around with it all.....

but will see... I see pdoc in mid Feb. dunno if she will try something else.

thanks all again just thought I would give an update