Rozerem/Ramelteon

I guess this is a new sleep med. I took it for the very first and last time last night. WHOA! Supposedly it comes out of your system pretty quick but the way it hit me. I kept waking up with the feeling I had stopped breathing.

Really? I just asked if anyone knew about it. I am going to begin it Monday, if they've approved it. It is melatonin... in prescription form. I am most worried about the bad dreams that melatonin causes. What dose did you try? How long did you "sleep" totally?

Evening Sky! I took 8mg. My pdoc thinks I am side effect sensitive to some meds. I slept about 6 hours but it took me a couple of hours to actually stay asleep. It almost relaxed me too much. I woke up prett groggy this morning. I personally want to stick to my Restoril.

"side effect sensitive" is a new term to me hehehe The drug makers admit that the majority of the population will receive NO benefit from any one drug, and that a certain percentage will also have terrible side effects.

I don't know... if I should begin this med "all by myself" hmmmm oh well.

I thought it was funny when my doc told me I was too...lol....I hope this med works for you Sky! Let me know what you think.

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_Sky said:
Really? I just asked if anyone knew about it. I am going to begin it Monday, if they've approved it. It is melatonin... in prescription form. I am most worried about the bad dreams that melatonin causes. What dose did you try? How long did you "sleep" totally?

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HI Sky!

Just wanted to post some information about Rozerem and how it works - because it's not just like melatonin. ROZEREM (ramelteon) is a melatonin receptor agonist - which means it attaches to specific melatonin receptor sites in the brain - "acting" like melatonin in a way. Specifically it targets M1 and M2 receptor sites. It's supposed to be taked on an empty stomach because food greatly interferes with its absorbtion - so it takes longer to work basically.

Also I've read that it should NOT be taking in combination with fluvoxamine (LUVOX) - because doing so impairs the elimination of Rozerem and greatly increases blood levels. It does not effect serotonin, norepinephrine, dopamine or GABA receptors, and it works in a part of the brain NOT associated with dependency & addiction. Apparently it's not supposed to produce any "hang-over" effects the next day and you can stop it without worry of rebound insomnia or withdrawal.

They have a great website that has a lot of useful information:

http://www.rozerem.com/

I haven't heard of anyone using this med yet - so I'm eager to hear from those who have tried it (I've got terrible insomnia).

Hope this helps!!

Jerry :-)

Thanks pharm. Yes, I had read all that and am eager to see how well they can isolate the areas of the brain for medicine interaction. I think you can take it with or without food, but if you have a HIGH FAT meal/food, then that does block it's absorption. Doesn't matter I can't eat a meal that close to sleep anyway.

Now, for my update on this. The insurance company just approved this. I took it for the first time last night. Due to my allergic history I came here to see who was around to be 'around.' (Thanks EJ)

I did have some respiratory reactions... airway tightened but not overly (I had taken my daily inhaler dose before taking rozerem.) I began yawning considerable before falling asleep (another indicator of allergy, for me.) I was eating rolaids due to stomach upset...while I was falling asleep...

While I had been very fearful of bad dreams/night terrors, I don't recall any of that.

I took the med at 11:35 pm. I don't recall seeing 12:15. My dog forced me to get up at 10:30 am...but I went right back to sleep after a struggle to take my pain med. Finally, at about 1:30pm ( 14 hours!) I dragged out of bed. My sinuses were remarkably stuffy and 'eyes' puffy. Brain fog was severe. By 4 pm I was still groggy with a productive cough. I went to pool to read and ended up swimming (not a good decision) I still felt drugged. It's not 8 pm and I haven't recouped to a normal speed yet.

When I react severely to a drug, it's not usually the first time I take it, but the second. This doesn't look good for me... and I 'm not feeling good about trying it again tonight. I don't know yet.

I need restorative sleep, not reactions, fog and grog.

Since it didn't kill me I tried it again. (Most life threatening reactions occur the first or second time I take a med, IF.) I wasn't going to take it till tonight, but took it last night... and still got a tight chest but not terrible. I was pretty wired last night after having to present at a meeting ( I give out awards)...that was normal... the way the rozerem responded wasn't... I tossed and turned all night but couldn't rouse enough to do anything about it. I clenched..teeth, hands and feet severely... and even now ..22 hours later I'm groggy some.

One more night, tonight I think..hopefully it will work like the first time, without the allergic stuff? IDK.

Well... guess I'm going to stay on it a bit... though it isn't really good...

I take it at night sometime between 9:30 and 11:30 pm. Today was my "day off" and I didn't feel like getting up but finally dragged out about 3 pm... I was back in bed by 6 pm and still am... foggy, groggy, fuzzy whatever... and I'm going to take another pill tonight.

Tomorrow is an early therapy day (physical and psycho) so I don't know how well I'll be driving. That is the kicker I think will decide changes for me... have to see what T sees/says tomorrow in session. If I keep on this med I will need to increase my pain med and then just plain not drive...but ins co will have to provide driver. nothing's easy.

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_Sky said:
Well... guess I'm going to stay on it a bit... though it isn't really good...

I take it at night sometime between 9:30 and 11:30 pm. Today was my "day off" and I didn't feel like getting up but finally dragged out about 3 pm... I was back in bed by 6 pm and still am... foggy, groggy, fuzzy whatever... and I'm going to take another pill tonight.

Tomorrow is an early therapy day (physical and psycho) so I don't know how well I'll be driving. That is the kicker I think will decide changes for me... have to see what T sees/says tomorrow in session. If I keep on this med I will need to increase my pain med and then just plain not drive...but ins co will have to provide driver. nothing's easy.

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I'd be interested if you kept us imformed of your continued use (if you decide to stay on it). Unfortunately - I don't know of anyone that I knwo who is taking this med for insomnia and it intrigues me that you are having such a sedating effect from it. Have you ever tried Ambien? If so - how would you compare the two?

Please keep us updated! I hope you are doing better!

Jerry

Thanks, I was wondering if anyone wanted me to post. I did try Ambien and Ambien CR.

The regular ambien didn't work... not in the ten minutes it said. If I didn't take it ...I just didn't sleep (reason why I need sleep med) if I took it, I did finally fall asleep around 3am or so usually by 5 am.

The ambien CR was impossible! Still didn't fall asleep soon after taking it...took hours... and then... I wasn't asleep. I found receipts for 24 hour restaurants..and I gained 8 or 9 pounds a month ? I tried it... I would even call T during the middle of the night... AND I REMEMBER NONE OF IT! Driving and eating while sleeping grrr. I never felt rested... plus I had terrible sinus from it and other problems (which led to aspiration pneumonia.)

I am having some stomach upset with the Rozerem. I have to sleep with upper body elevated. It put me to sleep within 30 min the first time I took it, but not since... I am still seeing 4 or 5 am... but then I think I am sleeping a few hours. It might not be restful... I am clenching. Jaw, fists, feet spasming. Right now it's 11:35pm and I am just waking from LAST night's dose. I ate late so I can't take the Rozerem yet.

I've become disgusted with life T says. Wonder if it's the med...and the grog? Who cares? Oh, I've been yawning often...the whole time now...days... since taking Rozerem each night. I still have tightness in chest/airway...but using inhaler keeps it from closing. (Though I hope it closes off while I'm sleeping.) I am too drugged while I'm sleeping to do anything... even take needed pain med... so my body toughs it out. I can barely move when I do get up (thanks to dog.) I'm driving while yawning and not giving a hoot about it all... eager to return to home and bed.

Today I did just that... after therapies (physical therapy and psychotherapy) I went home, ate, and went to bed and sleep till 8pm I think... (yawn)

I don't think I like this, but I am worthless anyway, so why bother with changing things... I don't need to function till Monday when I have therapies again... drag out for that and come home and sleep some more. big deal.

(Oh, I had this when I tried... what was it? um... Flexeril? slept 16 hours at a pill.)

I guess this is yet another med that just isn't going to work for me. I ate late so I didn't take the med at a normal sleep time... and before I knew it, it was 3 am...so I took it then.

I didn't sleep at all. It's 8:30pm now... and I haven't sleep yet. Miserable night, feeling, bothersome physical aspects...like when your foot "goes to sleep" and then begins to wake..that horrible pins'needles ugh feeling... grrrr but it didn't last but a few hours.

I had hopes for this one (well, all of them or I wouldn't try them!) but with the specificity of action this one exclaims... I really thought it wouldn't bother the rest of my mind/body and would actually let me sleep.

bummer. now what do I do.

I took the rozerem at 12:30 am I think... and no sleep..in fact, I felt wide awake but fatigued. I finally took an Ambien CR (and suffer the effects) but at least I did sleep some! Won't try the rozerem tonight, but Sunday night. If it doesn't work correctly -meaning give sleep without side effects of sinus and grog- then I will chalk it up.

I took rozerem at the prodding of my doc. It did absolutely nothing for me. I'd lay there in bed going sleep now ok sleep now and get up lay on the couch and stay wide awake. I take trazadone now and we just had to up the dose on that and I'm starting to stay up all night again. Oh well here the cycle of meds goes again.

jbug

Yeah... agree...it has stopped working for me. I took it again Sunday night and did not sleep at all, again! T wants me back on the Ambien CR, as at least I did get some sleep that way (inspite of driving and eating while sleeping?)

I'm sure the added weight from the CR also added to my current pain flare.

I'm scared to think that My Pdoc was gonna try this on me I think I will stick with My Restoril. I have Respitory problems and Asthma I also take a whole lot of pain meds (Mscontin,and Methedone)I get seraqual at bed time to(for the dreams) singulair and combivent ant oxegen when sleeping there is also a suction machine in my room I live in a nursing home I'm monitered while I sleep too which helps does anyone know of any sleep meds that could help me Restoril don't work more,I have been on most even ambian. thanks
Tia

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_Sky said:
I guess this is yet another med that just isn't going to work for me. I ate late so I didn't take the med at a normal sleep time... and before I knew it, it was 3 am...so I took it then.

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Sky, you can't use the drug like that, and expect it to work. It is not magic.

The first thing you need to do is to establish a rigid sleep routine. Sleep hygiene, it's called. Cleaning up your bedtime routine is essential. You just about made it impossible for the drug to do what it can do for you. You failed the drug. It didn't fail you.

Rozerem acts by supplementing your own melatonin production. The diurnal cycle that is regulated by sunshine controls the release of melatonin by the pineal gland. The cycle regulates the pineal. The pineal regulates the cycle.

Your cycles are all a mess. Your stress, the general state of your health, may perhaps completely block your body's ability to even synthesize melatonin. You have to really look after yourself. I know you're really unwell. I know that. I came back from that. I came back, slowly but surely, inch by inch. By taking responsibility.

You need to set a regular sleep time. And don't eat late. You need to take the drug precisely as prescribed, timing the dose to supplement your own body's sleep signal. If you take it at the wrong time, you destroy your body's sleep signal.

If all you want is a drug that will help you to sleep no matter what, get a benzo. Or better yet, a barbiturate.

Rozerem can't work, unless you let it. The great thing about this drug is that they claim there is no rebound insomnia. They claim you can literally use it as needed. But it won't fix bad unhealthy habits. It just can't do *that*.

I came back, from a place very similar to yours. A place where I couldn't sleep, got no restoration, and I dreaded waking again.

You didn't get sick like that, in one day. You are not going to come back, from there, in one day, either. You need to adjust your expectations.

Lar

not sure you understand me on this one, yet Larry.

I did take it... and it either drugged me so bad that I couldn't manage to find my pain med (which increased pain and muscle spasms) and grogged me so I shouldn't have driven for the much needed therapies... or it didn't help me sleep at all... for all night, or two! I think a 3 hour sleep window is as good as it gets with me.. .and would not bother me a bit if it would have worked even consistently (rather than the 30 min time limit it says, but even if it were 2 or 3 hour affect time) I would still adjust.

Chronic pain can't work like you and I would wish You make it sound like I wasn't trying to sleep. I'm talking about BEING in bed... mostly with NO TV or radio...but using the CD for sleep like I always do... no lights on... etc...

I think my doctors would agree that a week's worth of what I experienced is good enough to determine this drug is not going to work for me. The complications of too much and then no sleep aggravated my chronic pain and fatigue and assisted putting me into a pain flare (since last Sat)...

I can't take benzo's I can't take most drugs, as I have sensitivity to them... such as too much response and then none..hmmmm go figure.

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_Sky said:
not sure you understand me on this one, yet Larry.

I did take it... and it either drugged me so bad that I couldn't manage to find my pain med (which increased pain and muscle spasms) and grogged me so I shouldn't have driven for the much needed therapies... or it didn't help me sleep at all... for all night, or two! I think a 3 hour sleep window is as good as it gets with me.. .and would not bother me a bit if it would have worked even consistently (rather than the 30 min time limit it says, but even if it were 2 or 3 hour affect time) I would still adjust.

Chronic pain can't work like you and I would wish You make it sound like I wasn't trying to sleep. I'm talking about BEING in bed... mostly with NO TV or radio...but using the CD for sleep like I always do... no lights on... etc...

I think my doctors would agree that a week's worth of what I experienced is good enough to determine this drug is not going to work for me. The complications of too much and then no sleep aggravated my chronic pain and fatigue and assisted putting me into a pain flare (since last Sat)...

I can't take benzo's I can't take most drugs, as I have sensitivity to them... such as too much response and then none..hmmmm go figure.

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Hi sky!

Sorry to hear you're having so many troubles with meds and sleep. I can empathize with you as I have bad insomnia as well. May I ask what your pain medication is? Do you think that your pain med may be making you groggy during the day?

Jerry

I am sorry, sky.

Now I know things I didn't know, when I drafted my response to you. I'm sorry to know the rock and the hard place in your life.

I have been in similar situations, and only six months ago. It was a drug that turned me around, unexpectedly. A drug I actually didn't even expect to work.

I was hoping I could talk you through a rough time. I was hoping to shape it until it worked for you.

Again, I'm sorry. I did not yet understand. You are correct in that.

Lar

Sky, how much magnesium do you take? It could serve as an excellent augmentative sleep agent. Alone, it's not going to do much for most people, but alongside a sleep drug, it can ease you into sleep mode.

I take 300-400 mg of magnesium salts a night, alongside a tricyclic that is known to induce sleep, trimipramine. Doxepin works better for some people, but they don't make a dose small enough for me, and I just hate mussing around with those itty bitty capsules, to dump some out. Never know exactly how much I dumped out, either.

Both of these tricyclics really hit the sleep-inducing histamine receptor. Hard. For antidepressant purposes, these drugs are considered to be too "dirty" for common use, because they are so stunningly sleep-inducing. Maybe you're looking for that side effect? And, along with the third member of this group, amitriptyline, there may be pain suppressant properties that are yet another "side effect".

If Benadryl makes you drowsy, then you know that histaminic drugs that cross the blood/brain barrier are a good choice for sleep induction.

I really don't know your story, if you've been there and done that, but if not......you still have untried options.

The magnesium and the tricyclic make it so I almost can't not got to bed. I can't fight that. And I've had pain and insomnia ruling my life for years.

Lar

Tis ok. I have a full typed page of medicines that are allergic to me. Histamine/antihistamin... noreprenephrine/eprenephrine.... and I have paradoxical reactions to the older type antidepressants... and muscle relaxants are overpowering even at children's dosage

I'm using the CR again though it's irking me... another thing I forgot about (and must remind T tomorrow) it causes me to aspirate more often than usual. \

I have real reactions to supplements. I think I was wired backwards

It failed to put me to sleep.

I saw my MD today (for a pain shot ..) and we discussed this med and also the ambien CR... she has removed Ambien, Ambien CR, and Rozerem from my use, due to the negative reactions. I'm without anything, good or bad now.

What is your response to magnesium? Epsom salts baths are a good way to get a little magnesium going on. It literally dissolves into your blood, right through the skin. A little bit of magnesium can really calm things down.

What is your response to melatonin supplements? The dose usually supplied is huge! though. 3 mg is far above what the pineal gland produces over the course of 24 hours. I have no idea where they came up with the "standard dose" of melatonin, but it's way too much for many people.

The melatonin receptor is very sensitive. It has an inverted U dose response curve. It looks like a bell curve. We're accustomed to that straight line dose response curve. Low dose, low effect. Medium dose, medium effect. High dose, high effect. But that isn't true for melatonin. It's low dose, low effect. Medium dose, huge effect. High dose, low or no effect.

I only use about 0.3 or 0.4 mg of melatonin. I just break up those tablets, and take a chunk that's round about 1/8 of a pill. It sure makes one bottle of melatonin go a long way. And I don't use it very often. I still haven't used up my first bottle of it.

Maybe you would benefit from simply giving your body a little nudge, with magnesium and melatonin. Stress (you're under huge stress, for a long time) depletes magnesium in your body. Stress can totally block melatonin synthesis, if the stress goes on long enough.

Lar