I am new here. I will try hard to follow all the rules but I have never participated in an online forum before. Please be gentle with me if I make a mistake or you don't like what I say. Also please recognize that I have a desperate need for attention . Just kidding. Mostly.

I'd like to bring something up with my T at next session about the previous one, but I feel nervous about it, as if I will be violating some boundary if I do. This is my third round in therapy, and my last one was 15 years ago. I had thought that I was "all done" with processing my traumatic past, have been mostly happily married with a fantastic kid in the intervening time, and my work is fulfilling to me (I'm a lawyer who works almost exclusively with traumatized people, and I have for about 20 years). So I have 5 years of therapy with two different therapists behind me and I've been seeing my current T for about 5 months.

I have attached easily to T (attachment is not one of my current issues, but PTSD symptoms are). I have recently told him about some of the flashbacks and intrusive memories that have revealed more of the details of my traumatic past. He has been wonderful, supportive, insightful, thoughtful, just fantastic. I really trust him and he has really skillfully guided me and I feel like I've made a lot of progress.

He has been very open about his traumatic past in a very appropriate and vague way. He uses it to let me know that he does have a personal, not just generic understanding, or he uses it to let me know how he experiences whatever I'm talking about or things that have helped him when he has felt whatever it is I'm feeling. I have never felt that he has made my therapy about him or has expected me to take care of him when he has disclosed something.

This last session wasn't really any different, with the except that I think I triggered him to disappear for a few minutes and I think I saw him struggling to return to the present. In the meantime, I was feeling confused about what was happening and wasn't feeling well understood by him, because I think he was having trouble being present with me.

What he told me was that he had watched his Dad get hauled out of the house in handcuffs after beating his Mom. Then his face got some look on it that I haven't ever seen before. At first I thought he was mad at me, but that wasn't really it. It looked like there were bits and pieces of different, maybe conflicting emotions, sort of like a jigsaw puzzle where the pieces don't fit together right. It really seemed like he was pulled back into a memory of his traumatic past.

You know, it really makes sense to me that a T could be triggered in this kind of way. How awful and confusing that would be to a kid to witness domestic violence and see your father arrested. I don't think it matters how evolved you are as a person and how much you've worked on your stuff or how good your shrink training is and how much experience you have setting it aside in the therapy room, I would expect that you'd still get triggered sometimes.

Even though I was confused at the time that it happened, as I realized that we just didn't seem to be connecting-- in retrospect it seems to me that I was watching T's process for something I've done myself many, many times-- "falling" into that hole, that place of traumatic memories, but then coming out of it. It was like watching him swim towards the surface after jumping into a lake, where he bursts through the surface the then returns to me on land, the here and now. He really wasn't gone very long and it was kind of inspiring to witness it. I took some comfort from the fact that he still has an imprint from the trauma, and by watching him pull himself out of it helps me feel safe that he can help me when I fall into that hole.

If you're still reading this book (thank you!), you might be wondering what the heck my problem actually is, and here it is. I am afraid to raise this with him, because what if I'm actually wrong about what was going on with him? I don't want to imply that he did anything wrong . Also, one of the things that I am working on right now is figuring out whether something (or someone) is bothering me by what they are saying/doing in the present or whether it's triggering something from my past (or both). I really need to trust my perceptions in therapy or I am going to lose . . . my @#$%.

I don't know. I'd really love to hear some similar experiences, or any thoughts at all.

Anne

[SoupDragon]

HI and welcome to PC - this is a great supportive place to be.

It seems to me that regardless of what was going on for your T then, it has impacted on you and created obstacles?

So in order to get rid of any blocks, sounds like you have to tell T how you are feeling - you don't know for sure what was going on for T, it may be that T was triggered, may be something completely different?

I am still getting my head round the process of therapy - but isn't it partly about practising being authentic, saying what is bothering us and then learning to deal with others reactions?

My T tells me not to worry about him - they get close supervision don't they?. So anything that may have bothered him he has a place to go to talk about it. I also think the only way T's develop and get experienced is by working with us and accepting feedback - it may be very useful for him to hear your experience of him.

[Ygrec23]

Dear Anne,

I think you do need to tell him, be up front with him, accurately, about the feelings he elicited in you by what he did. And I'll bet you know this yourself. You've been through therapy. I'm sure you've read some things about therapy. So you know that the key to the success of the process is complete candor. You're a sophisticated, educated, experienced person. So the therapist you chose and whom you're with now is probably the same. Which means that he won't have any negative reaction at all to your being completely honest with him.

Including telling him all about your hesitation. Since you're very intelligent and I'm sure already know everything I'm writing here, your hesitation and your fears about his potential reaction to your feelings must be significant. They're probably almost as good as bringing him a dream, which, of course, you should try very hard to do for your next session. I think you can look forward to making some interesting progress next time, with all this spread out on the table between you and he. Take care.

[Butterflies Are Free]

Welcome - so glad you posted! I think it is important to share this with your T.
You could try posing it as a question or as a "I was wondering if..." and check out what happened. He sounds like a great T and it might help your theraputic relationship.

[laceylu]

Ok here goes. I was triggered badly by a group of professional social workers during mandatory pre adoption classes with no trigger warnings posted . No detailed class outline or support was provided. Real video was used on all forms of " bad stuff". The only thing I was told was that I needed to complete these classes before anyone would talk to me about adoption. I went in blindly without support of a T. My T says that she believes that it was very irresponsible to have such classes without warnings and available support. T went on to say that when she attends trauma workshops to keep her license active, there are trained T's available to help the "T's" in case they are triggered. They are instructed to get help immediately if they are triggered. Wow T's are trained to go to a T during a workshop if they are triggered. She said she can be triggered. She is trying to be real with me since I am really afraid of T's. She says she has a T for trauma work and not to worry about triggering her or breaking boundaries. So it made me think yeah that was irresponsible and good I am not a freak for thinking the classes were horrible. T's are human and social workers do make bad choices esp if they are not well trained. Then I thought I could never be a T because I would disassociate with the client and it would be a big mess. What responsibility they have. It has caused me to stop and make sure I am not crossing any boundaries with my patients. JUST ASK.

Originally Posted by SoupDragon

I am still getting my head round the process of therapy - but isn't it partly about practising being authentic, saying what is bothering us and then learning to deal with others reactions?

My T tells me not to worry about him - they get close supervision don't they?. So anything that may have bothered him he has a place to go to talk about it. I also think the only way T's develop and get experienced is by working with us and accepting feedback - it may be very useful for him to hear your experience of him.

Thank you very much for your thoughts and I think you are exactly right, it is pretty much the only thing that matters in therapy, to be authentic. And thanks for reminding me that my experience of him, right or wrong, is useful to him and it's useful to our relationship.

Anne

[unaluna]

I would say, this T is not your responsibility. If you are already worrying about his $#!+ to the extent that you are already posting about it, go with your gut and get the heck out. I think he disclosed WAY too much, and I assume that disclosure was more or less planned, not in the heat of the moment, as this incident was. (obviously I am confused here, but still think it's too much!)

You SAY he doesn't expect you to take care of him, but methinks the lady doth protest too much.

And no, T's are NOT necessarily "well supervised" - they may be entirely on their own, answering to no one. (again, this was specific to a T, but my stmt stands.)

I know something about my T's personal history, so I am not one who believes in absolute strict boundaries, but this situation would make me uncomfortable, is all I'm sayin'. Best wishes which ever way you decide to go.

P.s. I think we're discovering a pattern of me being very cranky on Sunday nights...

[Omers]

I would print out your post. you explain it very well and clearly. Yes, I think this should be talked about. It is a wonderful opportunity for insight for both of you.

Originally Posted by Ygrec23

I think you can look forward to making some interesting progress next time, with all this spread out on the table between you and he. Take care.

Dear Ygrec, I appreciate the nice things you said about me, first of all. I will try to live up to them.

I really like the way you put this, about it spread out on the table between us, kind of like smorgasboard (sp?), where I'd be able to sample it from different perspectives.

Thanks,
Anne

Originally Posted by Butterflies Are Free

You could try posing it as a question or as a "I was wondering if..." and check out what happened.

Yes! I've been struggling with a way to start the conversation, and this is just really perfect. Thank you,

Anne

Originally Posted by laceylu

JUST ASK.

laceylu, I am so sorry that you had that horrible experience with the adoption "education" or whatever they called it. Professionals should know that video in particular can be very triggering for those with a trauma history.

But thank you for sharing the experience, as it helped me realize that my T is human and that T's being triggered is a normal thing.

Anne

Originally Posted by hankster

I would say, this T is not your responsibility. If you are already worrying about his $#!+ to the extent that you are already posting about it, go with your gut and get the heck out. I think he disclosed WAY too much, and I assume that disclosure was more or less planned, not in the heat of the moment, as this incident was. (obviously I am confused here, but still think it's too much!).

Hankster, I'm not trying to be rude or confrontational, but you've just totally lost me. I don't feel that I was communicating that I'm worried about T's trauma history. In fact, watching him get triggered and then pull himself out of it a few minutes later made me feel much less worried about where he is in his process.

I can't say that my instinctual response to your belief that the disclosure was planned supports that. T's trauma history is different than mine, and the context in which he disclosed it was only loosely connected to experiencing the trauma directly-- it was about what he, as a child, promised himself he would never do (beat a woman). It wasn't the situation where he said essentially, oh poor little me, my dad beat my mom. take care of ME. But maybe I am "protesting too much" or resisting another possible interpretation. I do appreciate you being willing to put your thoughts out there, though.

But, honestly, I find that by operating on an assumption that someone's behavior is benign (even if misguided) a better way to approach interpersonal relationships than assuming that there are hidden motives everywhere. I think that you're suggesting that perhaps he's trying to get me to take care of him as a prelude to initiating some kind of inappropriate relationship. Given the way that he talks about his wife occasionally in a completely devoted and loving way, I don't really see that as a motive.

I think I'm also feeling not particularly heard by you. My T and whether or not he was triggered and my responsibility for that was not the issue. It isn't really about him, it's about me and my desire to be sure that I am "reading" him right and that I am accurate about what I perceive about him as he relates to me. The issue there, I think, is that because of my history I only feel safe if I can "read" people. So this is raising in me my issues around safety (particularly around men). I feel as if I am in danger if I can't read what's going on with someone; I feel desperate to get the information I need to make a correct assessment.

That's the problem. I should be able to feel safe even if I can't know what's going on with the other person. I suspect that most of my life when I've felt safe, that I haven't really known what was going on, but I *thought* I knew. It's being confused about what might be going on that's the kicker.

Anne

[Butterflies Are Free]

I was in a session once where my T got a little bit triggered and I was later able to ask her about it. I think you are very wise to know that you feel safe if you can read people, especially men. Would you feel comfortable asking your T the next time you see him?

Originally Posted by Butterflies Are Free

I was in a session once where my T got a little bit triggered and I was later able to ask her about it. I think you are very wise to know that you feel safe if you can read people, especially men. Would you feel comfortable asking your T the next time you see him?

I WILL ask him about it. I also wrote a journal entry based on my post here that I will hand him if I can't get out the words. I don't see him for almost two weeks, but I will report back on how it goes.

Thank you for telling me about your own experience. It really helps to know that this is not such a far-out experience.

Anne

I definitely think it's ok to point out the observation that you didn't feel he was present in the room during the session, so that he is aware that his 'floating away' was obvious. It can be something he just flags in his mind and works through whatever he needs to with whomever he needs to. It almost sounds like a positive experience, to witness him be able to ground himself and come back out, in ways you too have done. It doesn't sound like it would be a poor discussion at all, but rathen enlightening maybe for both of you.

I'm always for talking about it.

[unaluna]

Hi Anne.
Thank you for your excellent response. I don't feel you're being rude or confrontational at all, and I hope you won't interpret my somewhat "clipped" style that way either.

I did notice I wasn't directly answering your question, but I felt others had addressed it, I couldn't really relate to it, so I went with what your posting stirred up in me, with what I read between the lines.

I THOUGHT I meant "heat of the moment" in terms of trauma, but you saw in it a more romantic slant; whether that originated from me or you, probably doesn't matter.

So where you say you are desperate for info and need to be accurate -
I am hearing that as you are expending too much energy in extra-therapy activity.

Maybe it IS therapy activity, maybe these ARE the issues you need to work on and he is a good person to work them out with.

I would suggest you re-read your response to me. I think it was very honest, and really really excellent, but a little scary. If I were a therapist, I would have been proud to elicit such a thoughtful and insightful response. As a client, I wish I could see myself that well!

Originally Posted by stormyangels

It almost sounds like a positive experience, to witness him be able to ground himself and come back out, in ways you too have done. It doesn't sound like it would be a poor discussion at all, but rathen enlightening maybe for both of you. .

Yes, that it is exactly. It was positive, a little bit kind of awesome to realize that he'd returned to me.

thank you for your thoughts.

Anne

Originally Posted by hankster

I THOUGHT I meant "heat of the moment" in terms of trauma, but you saw in it a more romantic slant; whether that originated from me or you, probably doesn't matter.

So where you say you are desperate for info and need to be accurate -
I am hearing that as you are expending too much energy in extra-therapy activity.

Maybe it IS therapy activity, maybe these ARE the issues you need to work on and he is a good person to work them out with.

Hi Hankster, I really like the way your quirky mind works and I really appreciate the time you took to respond to me.

You gave me plenty of food for thought, especially in your interpretation of the main trauma issue.

I'm pretty sure this is a therapeutic issue. I think it's kind of messed up that I walk around in the world trying to "read" men as a way to feel safe. There ought to be a better way to spend my time.

Anne