Okay. My T has gotten on a mindfulness kick and is trying to convince me to work on this. He's been explaining it and has taken me through some exercises, etc.

Here's my problem. Despite all our talk about this, for some reason it is just not computing with me. Part of the problem, I think, is that I am very good at actively blocking out my thinking about myself. T says I learned to do that many years ago as self protection but it serves no positive purpose for me now. I realize that, but breaking that habit is easier said than done. So, I am not really mindful; I'm mindless. At least that's how I feel.

I guess I'm just not buying into it at this point. I'm stubborn that way. T has a book he wants me to read about this concept, and I have absolutely no desire to pick it up.

Your task is to explain in laymen's terms your understanding of what mindfulness is and how it is supposed to help. I need some convincing to get through my stubborn brain.

Hi ((((((Chris))))))

Mindfulness has been really helpful for me.

When I'm spiraling out - worrying about the past, the future, something I said, what's going to happen next - or when I've been triggered - finding myself in this moment helps bring me back to where I am supposed to be, which is right here, right now.

I've practiced mindfulness for many years, and different things work for different people. For me, the best way to find myself in this moment is to listen for six sounds. It makes me stop, get quiet, and pay attention to what's actually happening in the world around me, instead of in my head.

I've practiced meditation for quite a few years (meditation is what led me to therapy, actually), but for me, it helps to have ways to be mindful as I'm going about my day and things come up. Meditation is good practice, but real tools (like listening for six sounds) are what help me the most.

For me, mindfulness isn't thinking about myself...it's more about finding myself on solid ground where I am, in any given moment.

I don't know if that helps, but that's my experience.

[stopdog]

I have always sort of thought of it along with breathing - like focusing on my breathing while doing the exercises. I also meditate daily so I have not really tried to separate them a lot.

[rainbow8]

I never knew anything about mindfulness before I started with my current T. This concept, as well as meditation and encouraging me to take yoga are the best things she's done for me!

I've read a few books about it, so could you please post the one your T recommended?

To me, mindfulness means that I am aware of the beauty around me. I am doing that more and more. I notice the colors in nature: the brown bark of the trees, the green leaves, the blue sky, the clouds, if any, and the green grass. I pay attention to sounds that I enjoy, smiles of my family, and anything I'm doing. The idea is to focus on the present, not the past or future. To be totally in the "now". Then you can't worry about the past or the future. I go to a lake and really take in everything I love about it.

You can be mindful with anything to make it more pleasurable, even doing dishes or laundry! It has nothing to do with thinking about yourself; in fact, when I'm being mindful, I DON'T think about myself. It's a way to go beyond thinking of yourself.

Nightsky. I like the 6 sounds idea. That I can see myself doing. Those kinds of solid ideas may be what I need to hear most. I'm not one to meditate or do relaxation exercises which is probably why I have such a block about this.

[Nightlight]

I've found mindfulness really helpful too. I'm no expert, but I'd say the great thing about it is that you don't have to be brilliant at it right from the start. If you notice the moment when you block something, that's a good start. You don't even need to be aware of what you're blocking at first, perhaps just being mindful of the blocked feeling. When first starting, my T taught me a few different techniques. This can include mindfully eating, or doing a chore like washing the dishes, being aware of all of the sensations (the feel of the warm water) and when your mind wanders, bringing it back again.

[crazylife]

I have been told mindfulness is a difficult skill to master and for it to become second nature, I've been trying for a few weeks now and getting no where i just can't seem to grasp it enough, my CO always keeps pushing it but there we go maybe in time, these responses are useful, nice post.

Crazylife, I think you and I are right in the same spot with this. Maybe my issue is that this all feels so nebulous and abstract, and to my logical, rational, concrete mind, it just isn't connecting.

Rainbow, I almost forgot. The book is The Mindful Way Through Depression. The authors escape me but the title should get you there. It comes with a CD of meditation exercises. I got to looking for my copy of the book last night and I can't find it anywhere. I'm beginning to think I may have actually thrown it away in frustration at some point in the last few months. Hmm. I think that may say something about my openness to this whole concept. Ya think? Can't wait to tell T that.

I think part of my problems prevent me from being very good or even ok with this. When I can manage it, it's normally when I'm feeling manic when I'm feeling crazy it just doesn't happen.

Originally Posted by earthmamma

I think part of my problems prevent me from being very good or even ok with this. When I can manage it, it's normally when I'm feeling manic when I'm feeling crazy it just doesn't happen.

That actually completely makes sense. Last week in session I became really upset and agitated about something and my T launched into a mindfulness exercise. It completely pissed me off and he became well aware of my anger and frustration with it and him. I was too "crazy" at that moment for that to work. When I'm that far gone, telling me to use those kinds of techniques does not reach me AT ALL.

[unaluna]

mindfulness. idk. it's like a 3 stooges fight going on up there all the time, people poking each other in the eye. I just try to stay out of it, under the radar, and sneak out for a shower and a healthy meal once in a whild, slip in a chore or some exercise without anyone noticing and getting excited and interfering. This weekend (defined as between T sessions) I feel I was actually able to stay calm the whole time thru. I didn't have my usual dip, then anxiety, then relief. I also got a really cute haircut thursday with a new hairdresser, just walked in and viola. c'est-à-dire, voilà! altho she burned my hair a little flat-ironing it, it still smells when I wash it, I feel like a horse. a mindful horse.

[critterlady]

I find mindfulness much more effective for me than mediation. I struggle quite a lot with quieting my mind with nothing, but quieting it with active attention to things around me seems much more doable.

For me, it's just reminding myself to be present, whatever I'm doing. If I'm stuck in traffic, I notice what's around me. If I'm in class, it's bringing my focus back on the instructor. If I'm working with animals, I almost have to be mindful, or someone's going to get hurt.

I really like the idea of noticing 6 sounds. It's amazing how many individual sounds you hear when you really start listening for them.

[BlessedRhiannon]

My therapist is very big on mindfulness, and it's HARD!!!

She encourages mindfulness to help me deal with anxiety, because I tend to get lost in worrying and dissociate. She also thinks it will help with my OCD.

For me, it's very difficult, because I'm never really in the moment. I'm always trying to be 10 steps ahead, figuring out what needs to be done, who I need to be, how I need to act, to get things just right. 'Cuz, when I screw things up, people get mad and "bad things" happen (and, yes, I realize this is a defense from my childhood, and it's no longer a necessary one, but it's very hard to let go of).

Mindfulness seems to me to be about just experiencing a single moment fully, and letting yourself be completely aware of that moment and nothing else. In that moment, there is no past or future, there's only right now, and it completely surrounds you. Then, you experience the next moment fully, and so on.

The way that I've finally figured out how to practice mindfulness is to focus on one single physical thing, and let everything else in my brain be still, just for that moment. If I start slipping back in to my worrying thoughts, I simply notice those thoughts and then bring my attention back to that physical thing I'm focusing on. So, I'll make a cup of hot tea (or any hot beverage) and sit down to drink it...then, I wrap my hands around the cup and focus on how that feels; then bring the cup up to take a sip and focus on the smell; then how the hot cup feels against my lips; then take a sip and focus on the taste, warmth, etc, then swallow and focus on feeling that heat as it travels down my throat...repeat. Another one that works well is when taking a shower, I tilt my head back, and focus just on the water traveling down through my hair, to my scalp, and then all the way down the back of my head, down my back, etc. Another is petting the dog - I'll focus all my concentration on the sensations of their fur or something.

For me, focusing on breathing is kind of a last resort. I do better with mindfulness when I have a physical sensation to focus on. My brain is always so busy, and I'm always thinking so far ahead that if I don't have an outside physical sensation to focus on, I tend to slip back in to my thoughts.

Hey farmergirl I think I sorta get where you're coming from so lemme see if this makes sense to you. While I wasn't opposed to the idea when it was suggested to me I was skeptical because I'm not very spiritual and I don't really like feel-good woo-woo crap as I call it. But I pride myself on always being open-minded AND I was in so much pain I was willing to try anything.

Being very science-minded, the book on mindfulness that worked for me is Buddha's Brain, about the actual neuroscience behind meditation and mindfulness.

From my understanding the basic science behind it is (very roughly) that when you're anxious or upset your amygdala, the part of your limbic system that controls fear and anxiety and tells your body to panic (fight or flight), is over-reacting. When your amygdala is excited your prefrontal cortex (PFC), the conscious thinking part of your brain is not engaged (ergo the thoughtless, irrational rage/anxiety etc.) so what mindfulness does is get you to actively engage the PFC in order to reduce the stimulation of the amygdala because your brain physically cannot do both at the same time.

The book goes into much more detail but I think that's a fairly good summary there (I've been reading about this stuff for weeks now).

Mindfulness is NOT thinking about yourself exactly. Mindfulness is sort of an intensified focus on ONE thing, whatever it is that you're doing. It's the opposite of distractedness and multi-tasking. As Thich Naht Hahn says if you are washing the tea cup, just wash the tea cup. Let that be the only thing you are doing and thinking about at that moment.

Practicing mindfulness right now might look something like this: you are sitting with your computer looking at the screen reading this paragraph. Feel the seat you are sitting on. Feel your fingers on the keyboard. Think about all the other things you can feel or see or smell right now.

Now feel your breathing. (Don't worry about changing your breathing or practicing deep breathing or anything like that, just notice your natural breathing).

Now notice your emotions at this moment. Right now I am feeling nervous and shaken because I had a bit of a bad experience last night. I feel tired because I didn't get a good night's sleep. I feel a bit hungover because I drank alcohol. I feel nervous because I'm worried about some things.

All mindfulness is, is deep awareness of what's going on right here, right now. It's being completely and fully present.

It's not trying to avoid thinking (that's meditation). It's being AWARE of the thinking. It's not trying to avoid feeling, it's being AWARE of the feeling.

As you begin to practice mindfulness you start living more and more in the present. Not in past pain (trauma/depression). Not in the future (anxiety/worry). Just in the now. Right here. Right now. That's all that exists.

Give it a try. Why not? Work with your therapist. If that's not the right book for you, find another one. Tara Brach's Radical Acceptance is a good one. Anything by Thich Naht Hahn is also good. It could be spiritual or scientific. The particular explanation or approach to mindfulness doesn't matter, as long as you do it.

I say humor your therapist on this and try it for a few weeks. Doesn't have to be for long. Do it in the shower. Every time you take a shower try doing it mindfully. Let yourself become fully conscious of all the sensations of showering, inward and outward, how the hot water feels hitting your skin, how you are feeling inside at that particular moment. Notice how you are breathing. Notice if you're feeling anxious or sad; optimistic or nervous. Notice all the muscles in your body. Notice your breath.

Honestly, I've been through so much pain in the past six months and I thought nothing would help. Not drugs, not therapy, nothing. Drugs can numb you. Talk therapy can help a little. But nothing has turned things around for me like meditation and mindfulness. NOTHING.

Try it. You've got nothing to lose.

Lilly, thanks for the great information. My T had gone over the brain theory about this yesterday. It was good to read it again.

I'll keep working on this. All of you have really been helpful.

[SpiritRunner]

T1 talked to me about mindfulness a LOT - I read Thich Nhat Han's (Buddhist monk, probably didn't spell name properly) books, Peace is Every Step, and, the Miracle of Mindfulness. I enjoyed them, understood and accepted the concept intellectually, but did not really believe it was possible for me, did not believe I could discipline my mind in that way (eh, I really wasn't willing to do it, either, the unbelief was really unwillingness, an excuse! ). It sounded simple, and yet in its simplicity was such a HARD thing to do. But then, I also did not understand how to really practice it either -

But I don't know how it's happened ... but I seem to have experienced a shift in my mind, I don't know how else to explain, but a whole paradigm shift in my mind to where I found it both believable and possible. That I, with my supposedly undisciplined mind that loved to take multiple flight patterns and that often seemed to be 10 steps ahead of my feet (never now, always thinking about the moment ahead), could stop, slow down, be mindful, be in the moment, be disciplined and controlled in a good, healthy way ....

There are 2 sorts of things I do. One I suppose is like nightsky's 6 things .... only I try not to count the things or focus on too many at once, too stimulating to think of too many sensations. Better to just notice and feel than to think, anyway .... mindfulness is more about the noticing/feeling of sensation rather than the thinking about it, if that makes sense.
Say I am outside, on the deck. I let myself notice the blueness of the sky, the quality of the blueness, the greenness of the grass, the leaves of the trees glinting with sunlight ..... or I close my eyes and allow myself to feel the softness of the breeze sliding like silk over my skin and the heat of the sun sinking into me.
It's like opening yourself to the environment around you, letting yourself into it and it into you. Just being. Just being in that moment and that moment alone.
Sometimes I also sit in a quiet place and just notice my breaths, my heartbeat, the aliveness of my body, and love and appreciate and respect the aliveness of my body in that moment.
Perhaps one is a more external mindfulness and the other more internal.
And maybe it sounds odd. But it does work for me now in a very good way.
Not always easy, not always natural. But it does help me maintain a better balance, even in the days I struggle a LOT more with my emotions.

[KazzaX]

You are just supposed to observe yourself. And if you observe yourself and are thinking about it, you observe yourself thinking about observing yourself. And then if you start thinking about THAT...... you observe yourself thinking about observing yourself thinking about observing yourself.

And on and on it goes.

Needless to say I felt like I was on drugs whenever I did mindfulness and it did not help me at all, lol. But I have read a lottttt of stuff about people who have said it changed their life. So there you go. Lots of different results for everyone - everyone is different.

[Perna]

Chris, see if this site might help you:

http://www.todoinstitute.com/mindfulness-attention.html

A long time ago I read 2-3 of David K. Reynolds books, like Playing Ball on Running Water, http://www.amazon.com/Playing-Ball-R...dp/0688039138/ and they helped me understand a great deal about mindfulness in a more fun, comfortable way. The library might have some of his books; they're very 80's.

Originally Posted by Perna

Chris, see if this site might help you:

http://www.todoinstitute.com/mindfulness-attention.html

A long time ago I read 2-3 of David K. Reynolds books, like Playing Ball on Running Water, http://www.amazon.com/Playing-Ball-R...dp/0688039138/ and they helped me understand a great deal about mindfulness in a more fun, comfortable way. The library might have some of his books; they're very 80's.

This made me chuckle because my immediate thought was "So am I; we might get along!" Thanks for the recommendations. I check them out.

[Perna]

I found this "shortcut" that explains what David Reynolds teaches:

http://broken-bokken.blogspot.com/20...ing-water.html

[Sannah]

Mindfulness is probably one of the biggest reasons that I have been able to heal as much as I have.

I think a question for yourself is what benefits do you get from not being mindful. If there is a big payoff, no wonder you don't want to budge on this.

Life really is sweeter when you are aware of every passing moment. (But this is also why people avoid mindfulness when they are still working through the difficult stuff. Who wants to experience that stuff. But it is required for moving past it.).

[WikidPissah]

I just realized I never posted on this thread. Probably because I don't have a single mindful thing to say. It isn't a skill I have learned yet. But just wanted to say, you are a smart woman, and you will get it.

[Inedible]

Mindfulness is a very general term. It helps to have specific activities and just pay extra attention to doing them, while you are doing them. That's why you hear about the Zen people doing specific things like sweeping floors, shooting arrows, carrying water, and so on. Personally I'm not very athletic and I don't like to clean so I prefer just going for walks. It helps to look ahead in the distance and to look a little bit above normal eye level. Watching the ground right in front of me was a difficult habit to break.

my gf was cleaning last weekend and knows i like to read depression books in hopes of curing myself LOL, and the one she gave me was
"the mindful way through depression" with a cd
the authors Mark Williams, John Teasdale, Zindel Segal and Jon Kabut-Zinn...

would be curious to hear how this all works out for you? if you don't mind sharing later on?

[Perna]

Originally Posted by Inedible

Watching the ground right in front of me was a difficult habit to break.

What helped me with this is I saw a show on TV that explained how we walk and that older people often fall because they are looking down, watching the ground instead of looking out, forward so are not balanced right and can't correct fast enough if there's a "problem". It's an ergonomic sort of thing (why one's neck can ache from looking up/down at a computer screen instead of straight out, etc.).

Thinking about alignment and how one is standing/walking is a great focus and mindful activity.