[tealBumblebee]

I told T something peculiar I did as a child. She asked me if I knew anyone else who did that. Then she went on to point out that that common thing I did as a child was actually uncommon and evident of 'deeper insecurities'.

Was watching Dr. Phil (not necessarily a fan of him but I did watch some of his show today) and the woman spoke about her fears of being kidnapped/harmed, etc. The first thing he asked her was did she think the behavior was normal.

So I was wondering - do your T's ask you that when you tell them something you do? And what does answering yes/no do? Like if you think it's normal is it no longer an issue? Or does your answer determine how they approach the subject? Or what?

[HazelGirl]

Mine doesn't, or at least hasn't yet. Maybe she wanted to know your opinion of it, like whether you felt ashamed or embarrassed by it?

[tealBumblebee]

Originally Posted by HazelGirl

Mine doesn't, or at least hasn't yet. Maybe she wanted to know your opinion of it, like whether you felt ashamed or embarrassed by it?

Hmm...possibly. It wasn't anything bad (i'd share it but it's pretty unique and identifying) but it was something very small (but important) that I did as a child to prepare for like a "natural disaster". She said she'd never even thought of it in terms of how I had.

[Wysteria]

I don't think my T much thinks about "NORMAL" and would only look at things as to whether or not I was able to soothe or control or deal with something happening or inside of me....
What may be okay and normal for me....being from the deep south and an older woman...may not be so appropriate for someone from Italy and in her 20's....
I hear what you are saying..but for me it just leads to more "shoulds" or "should have's" etc....
For me that means lots more shame which is a huge issue for me and he helps me to look for ways to avoid some of my own self-censure.

That's just my way of looking at it...don't know if it makes sense or not..???

Hugs,
WB

[junkDNA]

my T has asked me things like this. like he said do you think its normal to not remember most of your childhood before you were 10? or something like him saying when i told him i used to shower with my clothes on cuz i thought there were cameras in the shower when i was 11 or 12..he said it was a sign of sexual abuse. the thing is i did think those things were normal until i mentioned them to him. i also had an intense fear of being murdered or kidnapped when i was young. i didnt recognize it as abnormal until recently

[tealBumblebee]

Originally Posted by junkDNA

my T has asked me things like this. like he said do you think its normal to not remember most of your childhood before you were 10? or something like him saying when i told him i used to shower with my clothes on cuz i thought there were cameras in the shower when i was 11 or 12..he said it was a sign of sexual abuse. the thing is i did think those things were normal until i mentioned them to him. i also had an intense fear of being murdered or kidnapped when i was young. i didnt recognize it as abnormal until recently

I can relate to some of that; especially the memory thing! Thing is, while I don't find what I told her I did to be "normal"... I still think it was a good idea lol. So I guess I missed the point of knowing whether it was normal or not haha.

[OneWorld]

I'm often in the other side of this - where I tell t something that I'm sure is abnormal and she tried to assure me that it is normal. I don't always believe her though. lol

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[lostwonder]

I have the opposite experience. I realize that the way I handle things can be abnormal, and then he attempts to normalize them.

[Freewilled]

I might be totally off base here, but is this something they do to distinguish between ego-dystonic and ego-syntonic thought processes? I was just reading about that....

[tealBumblebee]

Originally Posted by Freewilled

I might be totally off base here, but is this something they do to distinguish between ego-dystonic and ego-syntonic thought processes? I was just reading about that....

Oooh I never heard of this. Interesting to google about. I have no idea the answer to my question at all so this could very well be a good suggestion as to why they ask that.

[growlycat]

My main T has heard many of my quirks, some stranger than others. Even if something I do is rare or weird he would say that it isn't so weird, that it makes sense given my background/history. He tends to normalize what I do.

[kororain]

Originally Posted by tealBumblebee

I told T something peculiar I did as a child. She asked me if I knew anyone else who did that. Then she went on to point out that that common thing I did as a child was actually uncommon and evident of 'deeper insecurities'.

Was watching Dr. Phil (not necessarily a fan of him but I did watch some of his show today) and the woman spoke about her fears of being kidnapped/harmed, etc. The first thing he asked her was did she think the behavior was normal.

So I was wondering - do your T's ask you that when you tell them something you do? And what does answering yes/no do? Like if you think it's normal is it no longer an issue? Or does your answer determine how they approach the subject? Or what?

Kind of but no. She mostly repeats what I say back to me if she thinks it's off. Like she's giving me a second chance to rephrase it or realize I'm "off". Make sense?

Like... I told her I HADN'T had any thoughts about hurting myself lately. I referred to it as "weird". She was like, "Uh huh." And I'm like, "Yep." And she's like, "It's WEIRD to NOT want to hurt yourself." Yep.

Clearly, she was trying to get me to see my train of thought is WEIRD and abnormal. And I'm not an idiot. Obviously, I know that. By me saying "weird" I just meant it was different for ME. Neither good nor bad. Weird, meaning different or out of the ordinary.

One thing I hate about therapy is they really like to de-escalate language. And I love dramatic language. I love fun and exciting words. I love describing things in unique ways. So I hope she figures out that I'm not an idiot, I just like colorful language.

Anyway...

Originally Posted by junkDNA

my T has asked me things like this. like he said do you think its normal to not remember most of your childhood before you were 10? or something like him saying when i told him i used to shower with my clothes on cuz i thought there were cameras in the shower when i was 11 or 12..he said it was a sign of sexual abuse. the thing is i did think those things were normal until i mentioned them to him. i also had an intense fear of being murdered or kidnapped when i was young. i didnt recognize it as abnormal until recently

Wait, what? Fear of being kidnapped is abnormal? I thought everyone was terrified of robbers and kidnappers when they were little. No?

[growlycat]

I think everyone has had strange thoughts as a kid.

Whenever I would go to a store with my little friends, I always worried that the parent of my friend was really trying to ditch us at the local Kmart or whatever it was. Like getting rid of a box of kittens….abandonment issues much , right?

[ThisWayOut]

I think maybe some of it is also done to gauge how in tune we may be (or not be) with cultural and societal norms.

[Teacake]

I tell my therapist about my weird family and ask, "is that normal?"..she shrugs and asked "whats normal?"

I think its creepy for a therapist to want to bring you in line with "normal". (also, Dr Phil is a destructive quack).

But OP, I'm really curious to know what you did as a child that was abnormal but still a really good idea.
. I might want to try it, just for fun.

[Teacake]

Originally Posted by kororain

Kind of but no. She mostly repeats what I say back to me if she thinks it's off. Like she's giving me a second chance to rephrase it or realize I'm "off". Make sense?

Like... I told her I HADN'T had any thoughts about hurting myself lately. I referred to it as "weird". She was like, "Uh huh." And I'm like, "Yep." And she's like, "It's WEIRD to NOT want to hurt yourself." Yep.

Clearly, she was trying to get me to see my train of thought is WEIRD and abnormal. And I'm not an idiot. Obviously, I know that. By me saying "weird" I just meant it was different for ME. Neither good nor bad. Weird, meaning different or out of the ordinary.

One thing I hate about therapy is they really like to de-escalate language. And I love dramatic language. I love fun and exciting words. I love describing things in unique ways. So I hope she figures out that I'm not an idiot, I just like colorful language.

Anyway...


Wait, what? Fear of being kidnapped is abnormal? I thought everyone was terrified of robbers and kidnappers when they were little. No?

Yeah, I know. I wasn't equanimous about the idea of being murdered or kidnapped as a child and I haven't grown into equanimity about it yet. If it happened I suspect I'd shriek like a little girl.

I also.wonder why showering in clothing is indicative of sexual abuse. Being afraid of being photographed nude or in a scanner is practically a meme...we l have anxiety about cameras. I'm just not seeing molestation in every person who has paranoid thoughts before undressing in the shower.

[NoddaProbBob]

Ick. I've kind of had this experience, however slightly different.

When I was self-harming, my very sarcastic T would say "And how's that working for ya?" or something along those lines to try and get me to think differently about it.

I eventually had to ask her to stop saying that because it was making me feel incredibly ashamed, adding to my already shameful mindset about it, and thus perpetuating the self-harm.

Would you prefer your T not say those things to you or use phrases like that?

My T does not use the word "normal" very often, and when he does, it's usually in the context of "what is normal anyway?" This works well for me, since "normal" is something I have never been or particularly wanted to be. When I grow up, I want to be eccentric.

However, T has described some features of my upbringing, and some things that my H does, as "bizarre" or similar. A couple of times he's told me that things I relate to him are things he's never heard of anybody doing, in his 30 years as a therapist. It surprised me very much to hear that, since to me, those things are "normal" and I am ornery for not liking them. It just goes to show that I truly have no idea.

I don't think there is a "normal." I would feel very ashamed if my therapist pointed out that I was doing or thinking something abnormal. I have six kids and one thing I have learned about kids is that they get some really, for lack of a better word, weird ideas about stuff. I would say that is more normal than abnormal. It's just part of growing up and figuring life out.

[junkDNA]

Originally Posted by kororain

Kind of but no. She mostly repeats what I say back to me if she thinks it's off. Like she's giving me a second chance to rephrase it or realize I'm "off". Make sense?

Like... I told her I HADN'T had any thoughts about hurting myself lately. I referred to it as "weird". She was like, "Uh huh." And I'm like, "Yep." And she's like, "It's WEIRD to NOT want to hurt yourself." Yep.

Clearly, she was trying to get me to see my train of thought is WEIRD and abnormal. And I'm not an idiot. Obviously, I know that. By me saying "weird" I just meant it was different for ME. Neither good nor bad. Weird, meaning different or out of the ordinary.

One thing I hate about therapy is they really like to de-escalate language. And I love dramatic language. I love fun and exciting words. I love describing things in unique ways. So I hope she figures out that I'm not an idiot, I just like colorful language.

Anyway...


Wait, what? Fear of being kidnapped is abnormal? I thought everyone was terrified of robbers and kidnappers when they were little. No?

im sure a lot of people and kids were / are afraid of that. but mine was kind of severe. i wouldnt sleep at night. i was panicked all night. i slept in my moms bed up until middle school

[junkDNA]

Originally Posted by Teacake

Yeah, I know. I wasn't equanimous about the idea of being murdered or kidnapped as a child and I haven't grown into equanimity about it yet. If it happened I suspect I'd shriek like a little girl.

I also.wonder why showering in clothing is indicative of sexual abuse. Being afraid of being photographed nude or in a scanner is practically a meme...we l have anxiety about cameras. I'm just not seeing molestation in every person who has paranoid thoughts before undressing in the shower.

well you all dont have the context of what we were talking about. or know anything about my history. it was just something that related to OPs question. dont judge me or my therapist. i feel like u are trying to invalidate me

[Lauliza]

Originally Posted by ThisWayOut

I think maybe some of it is also done to gauge how in tune we may be (or not be) with cultural and societal norms.

I agree with this. 30 years ago you didn't hear about child abductions or other crimes as much and it wasn't a topic of conversation, ever. Now it's just the opposite. From what I've seen with my own three kids and their friends, from a young age they are made aware of the risk of violent crime and so are definitely more fearful than kids were years ago.

Given that, I think there is still an extreme that even by these standards would not be considered "normal". I am and always have been very fearful in nature, so I go to extremes and check (and re-check) the locks, closets, showers, under beds, cover all the windows at night, etc. When I asked if this was normal, I got a straight up "No, that is not normal"

[tealBumblebee]

To everyone who says their T says "what is normal?" How does that make you all feel? I don't think I would appreciate that answer honestly. Because I need boundaries and not someone to 'normalize' everything I do. I'd probably thank them but I wouldn't trust their opinions much if they suggested everything I did was "ok" or "normal".

Originally Posted by growlycat

...Even if something I do is rare or weird he would say that it isn't so weird, that it makes sense given my background/history...

This is more or less what she said word for word.

Originally Posted by kororain

...By me saying "weird" I just meant it was different for ME. Neither good nor bad. Weird, meaning different or out of the ordinary...

I always say weird lol. We're learning "new words" though to replace that with.

Originally Posted by growlycat

...Whenever I would go to a store with my little friends, I always worried that the parent of my friend was really trying to ditch us at the local Kmart or whatever it was. Like getting rid of a box of kittens…

Originally Posted by Teacake

...But OP, I'm really curious to know what you did as a child that was abnormal but still a really good idea. . I might want to try it, just for fun.

Lol, now that i've told you - you said it's not weird at all. Haha. *shrug* It's not a "for fun" thing as much as a 'preparation for disaster' lol. She still asked me about that though and said it's not common. Maybe she's the abnormal one for being unprepared. haha.

Originally Posted by NoddaProbBob

When I was self-harming, my very sarcastic T would say "And how's that working for ya?" ... I eventually had to ask her to stop saying that because it was making me feel incredibly ashamed...Would you prefer your T not say those things to you or use phrases like that?

I can see why that would make you feel ashamed. I'm glad you were able to stand up for yourself and address the issue.

No it doesn't bother me at all. In fact it didn't really 'stand out' to me until I heard Dr. Phil ask the lady that question. Then I started to wonder the significance of the questions thats all.

Originally Posted by Mastodon

...When I grow up, I want to be eccentric...

Me too I've already told T I embrace my 'weirdness'.

Originally Posted by Lauliza

...I am and always have been very fearful in nature, so I go to extremes and check (and re-check) the locks, closets, showers, under beds, cover all the windows at night, etc. When I asked if this was normal, I got a straight up "No, that is not normal"

Actually that is more or less what the girl on Dr. Phil was there for. Also, she couldn't be alone, never opened the curtains (on a really nice day she would open the blinds - max). She would call her parents to stay with her if her fiance couldn't be with her and would walk down the street with 911 predialed on her phone (which i've actually done before haha).

[kororain]

Originally Posted by junkDNA

well you all dont have the context of what we were talking about. or know anything about my history. it was just something that related to OPs question. dont judge me or my therapist. i feel like u are trying to invalidate me

Hey hey, don't feel like anyone is attacking you. I replied about the kidnapping thing, not because I doubted you, because I doubt myself! It was like, "OMG one more thing that makes me nuts... Great." It had nothing to do with you. It was all me. Cool?

As far as the poster who mentioned there is a lot more about kidnappings in the media now, I disagree. I was raised on a healthy dose of "stranger danger" and living in fear. And that was the 80s, man.

Originally Posted by tealBumblebee

To everyone who says their T says "what is normal?" How does that make you all feel? I don't think I would appreciate that answer honestly. Because I need boundaries and not someone to 'normalize' everything I do. I'd probably thank them but I wouldn't trust their opinions much if they suggested everything I did was "ok" or "normal".

That is not how I interpret it when my T says "what is normal?". Quite the opposite, in fact - nothing is "normal", because everybody is unique. And the times he's said it are when I have said "I am sure x is a normal thing to do/say", and T will point out that when I try to normalise e.g. emotional abuse, I am in fact running away from any attempt I could otherwise make to fix the situation.

He has never said it in connection with things I do or thoughts I have, only about things that are done to me. That's an important difference, I think. When I express thoughts or wishes of mine, which I think are weird or abnormal, T sometimes says "that is human", which is much better than saying that it's "normal".