Is it inevitable that a T will sometimes break promises?

divine1966 · May 24, 2015, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hankster

That raises the question - what if the t was speaking to your "inner child" in making that promise so she expected you to take it figuratively, but you dont believe in or dong understand the inner child concept, so you took it literally. Should a t NOT speak to your inner child, even though it seems very present to her? Or would you rather she join you in your denial of it? Talking rationally to you about it just brings up resistance. -- all this is why i am not a t! I think its hard enough breaking through unconscious resistance - conscious "talkable, logical" resistance makes me even more crazy!

I'd rather t didn't make promises she can't obviously keep.

I am not sure how promises differ if they are made to "inner child" or not. I am not sure what resistance you are referring to. With the exception of few times when t suggested something I wasn't going to do ( she eventually agreed it was unreasonable for me to do XYZ), I don't exhibit any resistance to anything. Did op ever say she is resistant? Or that she cannot be spoken to logically and rationally? I personally prefer people always speak logically and rationally to me rather than make crazy promises.

If op exhibited resistance to something, it still shouldn't mean t could make promises that are unprofessional and couldn't be kept.

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May 24, 2015, 07:08 PM

I did not find my therapist promises unprofessional. I took her promises literally, and expected her to keep them. She did. Once I figured out she wasn't going anywhere I looked for every reason why I should quit. I am not saying this was the op's situation at all. It was for me, and it worked out in our therapy. I am quite confident that I would be in a totally worse place, or at least the same place before I started therapy. I'm glad I went for a zip ride based on a promise. I don't think I would have gotten to a happy shore if I didn't. This is just how it worked out for me.

Lauliza · May 24, 2015, 09:39 PM

I don't think therapists should make promises that are not realistic and I think it is cowardly if they do - a cop out. Sure they can technically promise not to abandon you since it is unethical to do so. The real issue here concerns the definition of abandonment by ethical standards versus a client's standards - I think it's clear that the two are quite different and that's why clients are often so hurt. Regardless of whether an "inner child" is asking for reassurance or not, it's just wrong (and stupid, I think) for a T to make such promises. Promises made to a child by a parent cannot be replicated by other people - those promises are made in the context of unconditional love, something only a parent has. No matter what a T says, they are not that person and they cannot make those promises.

OP I do give your T credit for admitting her screw up- I think that's a rarity and she probably really is remorseful about it. But she is right and it is just something that needs to be accepted, as awful as it makes you feel.

May 24, 2015, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by notwithhaste

Long story short, my T promised that she would never abandon me. She nearly broke that promise a couple of weeks ago -- she told me that she “couldn’t do this anymore.” But then she changed her mind, and now she says that she “isn’t going anywhere.” But she won’t PROMISE, like she did before.

She says that she can’t make promises like that to me because it would constitute “taking me in as family,” and she can’t do that. She “has responsibilities to her family.” She says that she screwed up when she made that promise to me.

But she also says that I need to learn to accept that these things happen in relationships. People make promises, wanting to be able to keep them, and then they aren’t able to, and they end up breaking their promises. It “isn’t humanly possible” to always keep your promises – and she wasn’t being malicious; she made the promise because she really wanted to be able to keep it.

It sounds to me like her basic position is that, because she is human, she will inevitably end up breaking some of her promises, and if I want to have a relationship with her, I need to learn to accept that – and that acceptance will allow me to have better relationships outside of therapy, as well, because I will be able to tolerate people’s very human failings.

Am I wrong to expect more from a therapist? If I have “trust issues,” should I be able to expect a T to tread very carefully around those issues so as to not cause more damage? Or is that just unrealistic? Am I asking for too much?

I'm afraid to talk to T about it. I'm afraid that she will leave. And I feel like I should seek a second opinion, but I'm afraid to do that, too. Posting on here and getting feedback feels helpful...I hope I'm not annoying everyone with my posts. Thank you for reading.

I have read most all the post now, and then went back to your thread. I am not sure what the difference is in her statement when she says, "I am not going anywhere." That was said to me too. I saw that as the promise. Yes, a few times if I asked her to promise, she did say yes, "I promise". But, I guess in my mind if she didn't say I promise that statement alone would have been a promise in my mind.

I am having a hard time understanding that promise takes you in as "family."

i agree with her that it isn't always possible for a therapist or even a mom to keep a promise. To me, as long as a promise is made with good intentions, I can deal with the aftermath. Previous therapist never made promises to me and yet, their therapy left me like a piece of scrap buried in a smelly trash dump. It took me years to recover.

notwithhaste, I don't think you are expecting too much from your therapist. IMO, it is the therapist job to take your lead, and figure out how to work with you. She needs to gain your trust. It becomes difficult when therapist are not clear in the beginning of what they are truly capable of then start changing things because they can't handle it. The client truly suffers, and many times cannot be repaired.

I hope you will find your voice and spill your fears, so that your therapist can help you through this. Reading this board, can be enlightening, frightening, and darn right confusing to get your answer. It caused me to second guess everything. Give your therapist and yourself a chance to understand what "I'm not going anywhere," means.

In therapy, no one shoe fits all. And, my wish is that all those that choose to practice the different therapy professions (including my ex), bank that alongside their do no harm clause.

ScarletPimpernel · May 25, 2015, 04:14 AM

Ex-T made a ton of promises to me, one of them being to not abandon me. But she did.

Now that I'm on the other side of the situation, I do not believe any T should use the word promise for anything. Imo, it's inappropriate and only sets the T up for failure and the client for disappointment and/or pain.

New T doesn't make promises nor does she give me her word. Instead, she says she'll try her best.

I wish I never believed in ex-T's promises...

justdesserts · May 25, 2015, 06:04 AM

I think it's inevitable that therapists will break their promises because they are human, and unless they are single and their job is their life, we as clients can never expect to be more important than their own families, or their own selves to them. If they make a promise that implies something to that effect, that would require them to sacrifice their own mental health or relationships if something went awry, they are lying to themselves and a red flag should go up for both parties. I expect my therapist's priorities to be himself/his family, his church service, his work, and I know that I am just one part of his part. It gives me comfort to know that he has his priorities in line with what I think are healthy, even if it means, I'm down on the list.

PinkFlamingo99 · May 25, 2015, 10:15 AM

It worries me that she made that promise in the first place. It also worries me she took it away and is trying to make it seem like a lesson.

divine1966 · May 25, 2015, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PinkFlamingo99

It worries me that she made that promise in the first place. It also worries me she took it away and is trying to make it seem like a lesson.

I agree. What kind of lesson would that be, don't trust promises? I am really puzzled why people say it is not a big deal as people change. Sure they are humans but these are licensed professionals who are getting paid we are talking about not casual buddies or lovers. They are supposed to be responsible for what they say to their clients. I wouldn't blame a client. Client who believes such promise is most likely not in a good place to begin with. How is she/he to be blamed?

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missbella · May 25, 2015, 12:32 PM

That sounds like what is called a "non-apology." I hear what you describe an "I'm sorry" with an extra serving of didacticism. It's a confusing mixed message: I made a mistake, but it's your fault for believing me.

[quote=notwithhaste;4462608 She says that she screwed up when she made that promise to me.

But she also says that I need to learn to accept that these things happen in relationships.[/quote]

PinkFlamingo99 · May 25, 2015, 12:35 PM

The most healing thing I think I could have heard mine say after all this was "I messed up and hurt you, I'm so sorry, I was wrong."

But turning it into a "therapeutic lesson" like that deflects responsibility.

May 25, 2015, 01:03 PM

This is an issue where therapy is so confusing. On one hand people say therapists are human and allowed to make mistakes and of course they will and I agree with that. BUT on the other hand we're supposed to trust our therapists and believe they have our best interests at heart. People say "Oh just tell your therapist everything. They will help you through this. They know how to help you." I guess there has to be some kind of balance, but honestly some who go into therapy struggle with figuring this stuff out in the first place. It's crazy. Really, really crazy. Therapy is just crazy.

divine1966 · May 25, 2015, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by puzzle_bug1987

This is an issue where therapy is so confusing. On one hand people say therapists are human and allowed to make mistakes and of course they will and I agree with that. BUT on the other hand we're supposed to trust our therapists and believe they have our best interests at heart. People say "Oh just tell your therapist everything. They will help you through this. They know how to help you." I guess there has to be some kind of balance, but honestly some who go into therapy struggle with figuring this stuff out in the first place. It's crazy. Really, really crazy. Therapy is just crazy.

I am not sure why is it confusing? I doubt it is more confusing than any other job dealing with people.

Sure people make mistakes.

Sure one can apologize ( rather than blaming a client) and be forgiven but as in any job, especially licensed job and job dealing with people, some mistakes are not acceptable and some are too damaging. And in some circumstances mistakes are deadly

There are mistakes I can be forgiven for or written up for or sued for or fired on a spot for or forever lose my license. Saying "we are humans" isn't going to cut it.

People forget that this is a job not something they do for a leisure

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May 25, 2015, 01:24 PM

I don't really understand what you are trying to say. I explained in my post why therapy is confusing.

PinkFlamingo99 · May 25, 2015, 01:30 PM

I think the thing that is confusing is that a lot of people don't realize their therapists lie abd deflect just like anyone else.

Mine promised she would never lie to me and I believed her. When she lied I was beyond confused.

divine1966 · May 25, 2015, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by puzzle_bug1987

I don't really understand what you are trying to say. I explained in my post why therapy is confusing.

I don't find it confusing. Maybe you meant it is confusing for you. I think it is a hard job for a t and at times is a tough process for a client but I don't see it as confusing

I am trying to say that as any other licensed professional, that deal with people, therapists are responsible for mistakes they make and things they say, so making promises that cannot possibly be fulfilled is ridiculous. And if they still made a mistake they must apologize, and make amends and hope for the best. I don't find therapy any more confusing than any other profession when it comes to people.

You hold a responsibility for things you do and say every minute of the day, especially if you make obviously crazy statement.

Such as I would find it bizarre if my dentist promised me to always be there I find it crazy when therapist says that.

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May 25, 2015, 03:10 PM

Isn't it kind of a given when someone posts something it is their opinion? If I say therapy is confusing obviously I am talking about my opinion.

I don't really see what other professions have to do with anything. If I wanted to talk about them I would go to a board dealing with that profession.

PinkFlamingo99 · May 25, 2015, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by divine1966

I am trying to say that as any other licensed professional, that deal with people, therapists are responsible for mistakes they make and things they say, so making promises that cannot possibly be fulfilled is ridiculous. And if they still made a mistake they must apologize, and make amends and hope for the best. I don't find therapy any more confusing than any other profession when it comes to people. .

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I think the problem is when therapists WON'T apologize or admit wrongdoing. Maybe you've never had one like this, but a lot act infalliable. That's confusing and dangerous for the emotionally vulnerable populations they work with.

May 25, 2015, 03:12 PM

Puzzlebug, I think she was referring to therapists making crazy promises and that they should be responsible for that -- not you. I don't think Divine is disagreeing with you.

Perna · May 25, 2015, 03:18 PM

I don't have as much difficulty with "promise" as with putting too much weight on what is said. Everyone breaks promises if what is promised is interpreted differently by the one making it and the one the promise is being made to. Promises can be "legal" and those I would consider bad to break but emotional promises like, "I'll never leave you" feel good but that's about all they're good for? Everyone dies so everyone will leave.

"I'll never abandon you" is something I would immediately put qualifiers on if it were to be said to me. I would add, ". . .while we are working together". As a statement made between therapist and client, both people are individual adults so the meaning is unclear as both individuals are always responsible to themselves. Even insofar as one adult could conceivably abandon another, who gets to define the meaning of "abandon"? If I love you and am emotionally attached to you my perception is going to be unbalanced when it comes to whether you have abandoned me or not and why. Anger is one of the emotions one has to go through in grieving for a loved one because the loved one died and left one living. But I don't think anyone will "fault" the dying person for dying?

The answer isn't to not become attached to people, not to ever love because eventually we always, 100% lose those we love, but to become an individual who can support one's self and work through grief to recoup the parts of self we invested in the other so we will have them to invest again. Loving and growing hurts! But the alternative is death.

stopdog · May 25, 2015, 04:18 PM

Death is never the worst thing that can happen to a person, in my opinion.

ScarletPimpernel · May 25, 2015, 04:47 PM

Sounds mean, but I would have rather my T died than abandon me. Least then I wouldn't be mad at my T and would instead be mad at God. I could hold onto all my good memories w/o them being tainted by betrayal and pain.

And yes, my T qualified "abandonment". She was well aware of my definition and agreed to not do it, and still she did. And in an effort to justify her actions, she changed the definition of abandonment.

To be abandoned is worse than death, at least for me.

And promises should be kept unless extenuating circumstances change the situation. I keep all my promises. I keep my word. I kept my promises in my relationship with my T...

May 25, 2015, 05:13 PM

Therapists should be ethical about terminating clients. Period. End of story. There are codes of ethics they are supposed to abide by. Period. End of story. It's honestly not too much to ask. If there is an issue where a therapist feels unsafe then by all means terminate, but there are ethical ways to do this. If the therapist feels they cannot help the client any further then by all means terminate, but do it in an ethical way. If there is some other reason therapy cannot continue, fine, but end it ethically. It's not outrageous to expect this from a therapist. Or maybe I'm just crazy for thinking that the therapist has some responsibility in figuring out how to not abandon a client.

I've said this several times before, but I'll say it again: Many clients go into therapy because they need help with issues like abandonment or trust or similar problems. Isn't the therapist supposed to have some knowledge about how to handle these things? The burden of this should not be on the client. Two adults in a relationship doesn't mean the relationship is equal. Therapy is NOT like any other relationship no matter how much we try to pretend it is.

divine1966 · May 25, 2015, 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by puzzle_bug1987

Isn't it kind of a given when someone posts something it is their opinion? If I say therapy is confusing obviously I am talking about my opinion.

I don't really see what other professions have to do with anything. If I wanted to talk about them I would go to a board dealing with that profession.

Ok. Point taken. My bad. I didn't mean to upset you. I just sincerely felt puzzled why is therapy confusing. I understand.

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May 25, 2015, 09:25 PM

I'm not upset.

Nothing here upsets me anymore. LOL. But thanks for saying that.

divine1966 · May 25, 2015, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PinkFlamingo99

I think the problem is when therapists WON'T apologize or admit wrongdoing. Maybe you've never had one like this, but a lot act infalliable. That's confusing and dangerous for the emotionally vulnerable populations they work with.

It is a problem. I totally agree. No I didn't have therapists who were like that. But I have met plenty of people who take no responsibility for their actions so there must be therapists like that. I tend to believe that if my t repeatedly acted like that I would drop them and look for a new one. I wouldn't pay for bad service. No way. Few mistakes sure but more than that? No thanks

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