The Couch - Cent Dix (110): A Little Bit of Everything, A Whole Lotta Nothing

Sorry this isn't relevant to food but I have a question. I am really trying to understand. Do young people always move in together before marriage? Doesn't anyone think it's wrong anymore? Does anyone get married first, and then have kids the way it used to be? When someone is in a relationship, they think "let's live together", but not let's get married? How could the whole world think that way now? Of course this is relevant to my T's family. I must be totally insane to think it's wrong? I apologize for posting here but don't know where else to do it. If anyone can PM me on this topic, I would love to hear from you.

I suspect that is very individual. You can think it is wrong; that is your prerogative to do so. Doesn't make you crazy; just means you have a certain set of behavioral standards that is different from others. So, don't move in with your boyfriend before you get married, Rainbow.

It isn't the whole world, but it is certainly quite accepted now. My 27-year-old son and his fiancee have been living together for several years now. I have no problem with that. They are adults and quite responsible. I probably would have moved in with my husband before we were married had we actually been living and working in the same area at the time.

I do agree that kids need to come after marriage rather than before, but I have no problem with the living together arrangement otherwise.

I think it's a choice made by individual couples. Some live together and marry later or never. Some get married either before or after living together. Some have kids after marriage, some have them before. There's no "always" about it and it's not a "whole world" thing.

Carolyn Hax, who runs a popular advice column at the WaPo has written a lot about it -- http://wapo.st/1pDBGp2

P.S. I'm not endorsing her stuff -- the question is moot for me.

When did this happen? The 70's? My parents were not religious or old-fashioned, but I knew that marriage came first. I actually suggested to my boyfriend that maybe we should live together, kind of as a joke. This was the 70s. But I knew my husband wouldn't agree! My friends all got married first but their kids moved in with partners. Guess that's when the change happened. It's not associated with morals anymore. I knew that and am not judging. I just can't comprehend it, and will want to discuss it with my T, who doesn't mind her daughters doing that. I don't why it's so triggering! Maybe this could be a thread but I don't really want it to be.

Who? Me? Late 80's. Or are you just talking in general? It probably started in the 70's when the concept of the woman being tied to the home to cook and raise the children became outdated by the way we live, two income households, etc. Women no longer being solely reliant on the man to support them; they can truly share their income. Why is your T's daughter's living arrangements fodder for discussion in session? It really isn't any of your business, and I suspect your T would even go as far to see her daughter's living arrangements aren't even her own business. I don't understand what this has to do with you I guess.

One of those useless sessions where I couldn't get important stuff out and the stuff I did get out(which was supposed to be a lead-in) was brushed away. Feel like i want a, whats the term on here? Do-over?

I'm so anti-marriage that I wish every couple would live together first. Probably avoid a lot of divorces, people figuring out they just can't make a go of it beforehand. This comes from a 42-year-old who married at 18 and divorced at 20. Two more failed long term relationships after that, and now going on my 3rd year of happily single.

Maybe it's a regional thing, maybe it's a societal thing. It's no longer taboo to get the milk for free, so to speak.

Sometimes no amount of living together helps. I lived with the ex for 14 years before getting married and well enmeshed in his little game by then....

Hey all, hope everyone is well.
Had the family over, well, mom's side. It was a blast to have us all together this time with the next set of kids. Wow did our house get warm! Lots of bodies...6 of the kids running around it got warm quick. But it was definitely lots of fun.

I agree wholeheartedly. Each of my 3 had me hooked within weeks. Took so long to get the guts up to get out, I wasted my youth. Hence my new happily single tag.

Hi, couch.

Well, I cleaned out my car and read one more chapter, then the ladies I live with invited me to go out to lunch with them. I needed a break, so I agreed. It was nice. Came home afterwards and took a nap. Didn't set an alarm and ended up sleeping too long (5 or 6 hours). Woke up, read one more chapter and had supper. Now I am procrastinating on reading my last chapter and doing my Common Core paper assessment. I have tomorrow as well. And even though it is 10:30pm here it is only 7:30pm school time (it is in MST, but where it is does not observe DST, so it is now 3 hours ahead instead of 2). So I have time. I have most of the day tomorrow. I will have no car, so I will be stuck at home...I do have CVS for a few hours in the evening, but I can come home after that and finish up. Staying busy is just my thing.

I need to clean my room as well. It is starting to get messy again. I just have trouble keeping things neat. What's wrong with me?

My teacher finally graded the first week's assignment. I got a 9.89/10. She said I formatted my citations incorrectly, so I guess the university's citation generator on the Writing Center's website is wrong...that's what I used since I am unfamiliar with APA format. Oh well. I will just try to find an example elsewhere on how to format citations. She said my reference page was fine, but my in-text citations were wrong. I got full credit on everything else on the rubric though. I just want my A so I cannot let my grade drop below a 95 (90-94 is an A-). I currently have a 99.08%, since I got full credit on participation last week. Participation would be bad not to get full credit on...all you have to do is make 8 substantial posts throughout the week. I will do fine in my courses, I am sure. I just want my 4.0 in my master's to show that I can achieve great things and am serious and responsible. I only had a 2.36 in my undergrad, so I want to redeem myself. Due to my low undergrad GPA, I am on provisional status in my grad work right now until I can prove I can maintain a 3.0 in my first 4 courses. Not bad, you have to have a 3.0 to graduate the program anyways.

Well, I need to try to go read my last chapter...it's only 23 pages. Then to reflect on it.

Later, couch

Well in my case, they only legalized gay marriage last year. So my wife and I lived together unmarried for 17 years. We would have happily gotten married after a year of dating if the government had let us.

You can NOT go wrong with any sort of bread. Its all delicious
Also every kind of chatt.

I would abolish all state recognized marriage for straight or gays - I may be the one lesbian who just did not care about the issue at all. I really just don't see the point at all. I have friends (straight and gay) who are married and it is fine with me if they want to do it but I do object to the State getting involved with it in any way (benefits etc) for anyone. For me, whether someone else is married or not has absolutely no bearing on me one way or the other.

Yes!! I agree with you. I think and believe that way myself. Please don't apologize.

We all have our issues, right or wrong. I believe if you truly love someone you're in it through all of it. To me, just living together, without a legal promise leaves the door of easiness open to just choose to leave. Not see the tough times through.

Thank you for staying your opinion! I respect it.

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Don't forget the dals and pulses - delicious.

I am so distracted by my session today I burned my lunch.

Speaking from experience, it is actually very hard to break up with someone when you are living with them. Inertia, as Carolyn Hax points out in that link, plus history, etc., and yes you still try to see the hard times through. Except that you don't have to go through divorce proceedings, which I've also done, you have to do everything else - separate belongings, any financial entanglements, find a new place to live, rebuild your life, maybe custody, etc.

I think living together is not a casual choice for most people. It's no longer "shacking up," as it was known in the 1980s.

I think that belittles the love/commitment of people who can't or dont want to get married for one reason or another. I certainly have been committed to my wife for 17 years but the government wouldn't give us the papers. Gay couples up til last year. Couples with immigration issues.
Couples whose belief systems eschew marriage because of its history of treating women as chattel but love each other nonetheless. Lots of couples..because you don't choose to be married doesn't mean you are looking for an easy way out.
Up til last year despite being unmarried my wife and I owned a house, two cars, a veterinary clinic, 2 horses, 4 dogs, a cat, 3 parrots, a raccoon and multiple aquariums together.
There is no easy way out there.

I don't really believe long term monogamy is always a good thing. It can be for some and if people do it - that is fine with me. I just don't see it as all that natural or implicitly the correct way to do relationships. In fact, it is one of the few things the first therapist I see and I agree on.

Here! Here! i am glad i am not the only one.

Well this lesbian ( since we had to put off the reception due to health issues) can not wait for this October when I shall wear a fancy rainbow wedding dress and put rainbow extensions in my hair and dress my horse up with glitter and a unicorn horn and have our pagan hand fasting and a cake covered in fondant rainbow ponies and dance the fall afternoon away with my honey..

I can hear you gagging from here, Stopdog!!

ETA: I have a Teeny tiny budget. So the cake may resemble a pintrest fail....
My gay hairdresser who married his long term boyfriend last year is so happy for us he will do the extensions free.
My horse won't actually want to participate in the wedding we don't actually need anything for him....
My Wiccan friend is going to do the ceremony
The horse rescue where we volunteer is providing the venue and food.
So hopefully I just need to buy a dress...

If it makes you happy - then have at it - I have endured much the same at various friends' weddings. Like I said, I am not actively trying to stop anyone who wants to do it - I just don't get the point of it for straights or gays except to get benefits.

I am one of those people who thinks monogamy is historically largely a social construct designed to protect property and lines of inheritance (by trying to make sure the heirs are legitimate).

I'm not advocating bigamy or cheating and I always stayed monogamous. But I don't know that we can all be like swans and mate for life.