Couch 121: An Intimate Chat.

Porque no los dos? I make genuine human connections all the time that have nothing to do with "emotional cuddles" (Eww).

Okay, granted, a permanent love relationship should not be a trainwreck, but why does that have to be fixed by therapy? By letting some stranger into your head to "emotionally cuddle" one?

I did actually assume she probably meant something like emotionally held, but cuddling is way more active than holding.

Yeah, exactly -- to me, holding simply means that a T is able to contain any crap I spew out and still "hold" the therapy space in a way that has me feeling safe enough to continue to spew crap out for as long as is needed.

Cuddling makes me want to throw up and fast-forward to becoming a cactus in this life (as opposed to waiting for my 8,567,432nd reincarnation).

That "emotionally cuddled" or emotionally held or whatever or however you want to phrase it. My t calls it "holding sacred space". Sacred not as in religious. but using the definitions "reverently dedicated to some person, purpose, or object" and "secured against violation, infringement, etc." Obviously it's dedicated to me and the purpose is figuring out me. And it feels like a safe space where I can talk about anything I want to without fear of judgement.

I guess in my case, it's that sacred space that is so important for me, that I haven't yet completely learned to hold for myself, is what keeps me going back....

This came to mind...emotionally cuddled? Maybe not on the first date.

I love that description- and now I'm realizing that I think that is what my therapy is, sort of. Not in that cuddles and hugs way, but in this Buddhisty, compassionate-love-for-all-beings way. The way he works is sort of a shortcut to eradicating shame and helping me figure out how to accept myself better and take care of myself.

Anyway, I think that description is quite genius- even though I know you meant it differently than how I'm regarding it!

6.5 hours?!?!?! omg.
Same here.
Well...that's nice...I suppose. My cat just makes the weirdest meow sound ever, and then throws up everywhere. Fun to clean on a beige carpet.

It feels to me like you all can take love for granted, as a given, if you can so easily reject it from a t, even as a professional love hack. If you dont need it, then hey, lucky you. Sincerely.

But im not looking my gift horse in the mouth - he plays hockey! Its not pretty in there!

I don't take love for granted. I'm just picky about who gives it to me.

Eta: I do take it for granted that once someone loves me, they will keep doing it.

I cant get thru to you. Its like youre made of stone (little avatar joke there. Who is that, anyway?)

Dunno...Buddha? It's in the avatar pictures PC provides.

But, see I think that's precisely the problem -- I DON'T think it's love from a T (not ATAT's cuddling T anyhow).

If it were, seriously, given my pathology, I'd probably be their slave for life and hand over my non-existent first-born to them (I totally 'get' being a sucker for it).

I think that's really what hurts the most -- at least for me -- that the trickery is in trying to offer a fake, inauthentic version of love because the real thing is real hard to come by (in general but also in therapy).

(Okay, I need to quit drinking at brunch or something).

Mimosas?

Nope, just beer and uhh....they were light beers (I give up my fake butch credentials at this point).

Oh boy, is there gonna be a Does my therapist love me debate here? Because we have not had one of those in a while, and it's always interesting. I think my therapist loves her work and I benefit from that.

ruhroh -- I still remember your yearning for the 'special snowflake' debate. Maybe we should combine them into a single thread and see how long it'll take to get it shut down?

Its like training wheels on a bike - you dont keep them on forever, and you dont do the Tour de France with them on! But at least you learn to ride without heading straight into trees or traffic or whatever.

Somebody can teach you about love without being your forever lover, just like somebody can teach you about sex without being your forever lover.

I get that the ideal situation is that you and your forever lover both discover these things together and that your parents prepare you for it. But - t is plan b.

I get that. So, I guess I should clarify -- I don't think it's not possible to have a genuine relationship (love included) with a T. I fully accept and understand that while I don't have any experience of it, other people can and do have 'real' / loving relationships with their Ts.

I guess where I disagree is that I just find it bizarre for a T to set it up that way -- almost take it for granted or assume that's the right thing for the client -- from the get-go without bothering to figure out where the client is (or actually build up to it)?

So, I suppose that's the difference -- I figure such things take time and understanding and a helluva lot of work. I'm then just terribly suspicious of any T who plays fast and loose with such terms (without actually putting in the time and effort to work with the individual client based on what they need), shall we say?

Fortunately, love does not have anything at all to do with the two therapists I see. For me, I do not go to therapy for any reasons having to do with love. I certainly don't look to a therapist to teach me about love. I don't have any reason to need to be taught about it and I have no reason to believe they know any more about it than I do.

I also don't get emotional holding that those guys go on about. I have no idea what they could possibly mean by that.

I wouldnt call it a full fledged genuine relationship - its more of an appetizer. An amuse-bouche! But yeah it has real ingedients. Quality not quantity? Preferable to the whole lot o' nuthin' i get from FOO.

Foo is not always the thing someone goes to a therapist for.

For me it sure has been. Not that it started out that way. I had no idea I was going to spend as much time on my FOO issues with t as I have.

Son had his 3rd t session this morning. He told me when he got home that he's done for awhile - he said they mutually agreed that he didn't need to come anymore. He still has 2 more free sessions on the EAP thing through our insurance, so his t said to call him of course if he wants to come back.

3 sessions. My son is such an over-achiever I swear!

What?! I thought I made that one up. Was it on Downton Abbey?

Training wheels, yes.