I think I have realised that I really don't know what appropriate levels of intimacy are and in therapy I am constantly second guessing myself as to what i should and shouldn't share.

I feel like I am not meant to become dependent on therapy and know I am suspectiable of becoming dependant on people and for some reason in a therapy relationship I feel even more exposed to that and feel more dirty about becoming dependant. I feel I should deal with things myself especially the intimacy parts about my desires and wants. I am ashamed a lot of the time for wanting simple things mainly because I feel people will mock these desires.


Because I don't know what is acceptable e.g. oversharing vs under sharing and knowing what to share and what not to share I become mute and don't share anything or just the tip of the iceberg.


Any tips or guidance of navigating the intimacy in the therapy room?

[stopdog]

I would suggest not sharing more than you are willing to lose or willing to be made fun about. I never found telling the therapist things to be easy or fun or a relief. Some others seem to report such, but I never did.

[piggy momma]

Hi there,

Interestingly enough, I was just talking to my T about this today. For us, we both agreed that there is no such thing as too much information, or oversharing.

Having said that, you shouldn't feel obligated to share anything you're not ready to share. Nothing should be forced. But, the more your therapist knows, the better they can help you.

A really good starting place would probably be the feelings you've expressed in this thread. If you are comfortable, tell your T the things you've said here, and see where the conversation goes. I'm betting it won't be as difficult as you think it is, and you'll feel some relief at getting it off your chest.

I still struggle with the thought of crossing a line. But my issue is getting to close and being mocked.
I think over the years its been about how T has responded to any efforts I've made toward her.

[BudFox]

I regret pretty much all intimacy in therapy. Wasn't appropriate. Intimacy should be reciprocal, not one-way, and not artificial.

As for oversharing and fear of being judged, that's part of the reason I think it is ill-adivsed...your emotional health is dependent on the reactions of a virtual stranger who is not exposed emotionally and not invested emotionally.

[LabRat27]

I definitely feel "dirty" and guilty about my emotional wants and needs, including intimacy. I worry about being "too much" for my therapist or the idea of him recoiling in horror/disgust if he knew the extent of it.
So the first thing is you're not alone and you're not doing anything wrong by feeling this way.
How your therapist responds will depend on a lot of things. In general, psychodynamic and trauma focused therapies are going to be more intimate, whereas as a CBT therapist will be less focused on or possibly even uncomfortable with a large degree of intimacy. It very much depends on the individual therapist, of course.
Being able to broach these subjects and not shock/horrify/disgust my therapist has been really important for me. My feelings about my own wants and needs and shame have been major contributing factors to my issues and my inability to treat myself kindly.

I recently brought up my inability to make eye contact with my therapist, especially when talking about topics I perceive as shameful. I asked if he was relieved that I didn't look at him and he said no, that he'd prefer to be able to make eye contact with me. I told him about feeling like I shouldn't be allowed to have that, that I was disgusting, etc.
He said he'd like for me to try to make more eye contact then to challenge that. That he wanted me to believe that I was worthy and deserving of that kind of intimacy.
Eye contact was a way for me to have a conversation about one aspect of emotional intimacy without addressing it directly, and it helped me feel out the situation and get reassurance that he was comfortable with it, even though I'm not.

Talking to your therapist about it is the standard advice (and usually the best advice) but it's not always easy. Finding a way to gauge your therapist's reaction before jumping into the topic can make it easier.
And if your therapist is more detached and not comfortable with emotional intimacy and that's something that's important to you, there are plenty of therapists who are.
Emotional wants and needs and wanting intimacy are normal and okay and not shameful. Experiencing those things intensely is especially common for those of us who didn't get those needs met in childhood.

If this resonates with you, I highly recommend the article Attachment to Therapist: A Primer
I've recommended it on here a few times before because it resonated with me so much and it made me feel less abnormal and ashamed. I actually brought some parts of it printed out to a therapist appointment to share with my therapist because there was a lot of it I couldn't bring myself to say aloud. My therapist was more accepting and understanding than I could have hoped for.

I hope you're able to talk to your T about it and that it goes well.

I think it is good to share things that are relevant to the issue(s) you want to address in your therapy but I would not take any pressure to talk about stuff that I don't want to. I am not sure there is really such a thing as oversharing in therapy sessions - their goal is to express whatever the client wants or needs, so I personally would not worry about that.

[satsuma]

I think it's good not to put yourself under too much pressure - that share more than what feels comfortable at the time, or to hold back from something you really want to share. My T used to say "you can't do therapy wrong".
Can you talk to your T about the topic of sharing and appropriate levels of intimacy in therapy? If you hear your T's take on this it might be helpful for figuring out how this can work in your therapy. From what I understand different Ts can have different approaches and it also depends on what kind of therapy you are doing, I think.

[Rive1976]

I have the opposite problem. My T shares alot. My last T shared nothing. This T told me last session that she was physically abused as a child. I didnt know how to respond. I wanted to say I am sorry but I just sat there in awkward silence.

[autonoe]

I am having the exact same issue right now in my own therapy, and it's actually causing me a lot of stress. I've come to the point that I don't know what to say anymore when I go, even though I certainly have not gotten into some of the events in my life that brought me to therapy in the first place. I don't know how to approach certain topics with my therapist, and I don't know how I will react to my own self if I try because these things are buried for a reason.

It's the old one-sided issue that causes me problems. Here is this person who hears my darkest, dirtiest moments in life, but shares very little in return and then asks me how I feel about it all. Well, obviously I feel pretty bad. What am I supposed to do with that? I feel like I just don't understand what this is supposed to be doing for me anymore, and the lopsided intimacy, or lack thereof, has me emotionally confused at times. At times I feel physically attracted to this person, at times I feel like we are friends, and then I walk out and realize he goes home to a life I am in no way a factor. It's a strange dynamic, and I don't know if I like it anymore.

Didn't mean to derail the thread, but I'd been thinking of making my own thread on this issue, so these are my thoughts. I don't know how there can be real intimacy in therapy when only one person is exposed, and the other person actively works to stay buttoned up.

[colorsofthewind12]

Originally Posted by autonoe

Didn't mean to derail the thread, but I'd been thinking of making my own thread on this issue, so these are my thoughts. I don't know how there can be real intimacy in therapy when only one person is exposed, and the other person actively works to stay buttoned up.

I have been thinking about that a lot. I don’t think you can call it intimacy when only one person is feeling it or at least expressing it. It seems more apt to call it a fantasy.

[unaluna]

Re one-way intimacy: you're the tomato plant, the t is the stake or cage. Its a complementary relationship. You are not giving each other the same thing. Thats not in the contract.

I guess i dont understand the question. Its not a situation of, you scratch my back, i'll scratch yours. Its more like, you cut my hair, i will pay you. Or my fallopian tubes, whatever.

I disagree intimacy is one way.
Just my email alone, this week where I asked T if she will forget me. And she replied "no, I actually I find myself thinking of you more" made me drop my phone with a, excitement and fear because I felt her intimacy toward me. And thought "wow, to feel that confident enough to freely express it"

[RaineD]

I also don't think it's completely one sided. It's somewhat lopsided, sure, but it's not one sided. And, yes, you're not giving each other the same thing, but there is giving and receiving on both sides. And it's not just money from the client either.

The relationship is real. It's different from other kinds of relationships, but it's real.

People debate over the "intimacy in therapy" topic quite often.In part, because intimacy can mean different things to different people. I personally don't like to describe what goes on in therapy as intimacy, mostly because my experiences when I felt that way were always balanced, mutually and equally involved relationships without stable, designated roles -more than merely sharing secrets and one person helping the other. But the dictionary definition of the word can fit what happens in therapy, I think. In any case, if someone wishes sharing very personal details intimate in the sense I described above about mutuality, of course that will run into issues with the structure of therapy. Maybe in that case it can help not to try to view it as something intimate but more what it literally is: a service where the the client seeks answers or just support and understanding to their most personal feelings, problems, behavioral tendencies etc. View it more clinically, like sharing uncomfortable, painful and disruptive issues about the body with a doctor and the doctor's role is to provide feedback and possible solutions that the client can explore. Of course, those that want to work on relational issues using the therapy relationship as a model are unlikely to benefit much from that very clinical approach, but I guess then exploring both the desire and blocks around sharing might be interesting.

For me, I can do one-sided sharing of even my hardest secrets if I want to but it only feels beneficial if I get feedback in the form of observations, possible explanations, solutions etc. If I more just want a place to unload and a person to wander together, not knowing anything about them will quickly get in the way. I got to know a lot about both of my Ts. The first one did not share much in session but puts an incredible amount of info on himself on the public web.The second made lots of disclosures in session - that was pretty much his way to empathize and sometimes, I think, to actually get lazy and not think about my stuff. The second was a much better fit with me in many ways, including the sense of companionship generated by our very interactive exchanges. It's not that he shared very vulnerable information on himself, just lots of information, typically as it related to mine. But it was more like how I interact with a friend (so it did generate some air of intimacy) than what I would want from a clinician. I did not find it super helpful as I can get similar from friends or colleagues anytime - there weren't any possible solutions provided. If I ever wanted to try therapy again, I would think harder about how I want to use therapy, what my expectations are, select a therapist that has the potential to fit with that and tailor the sharing accordingly. I also would not do the wandering all over the map but would stay more focused. This is something I only know now, from experience - it was not clear when I started therapy and even with the second T.

Originally Posted by 502041

I think I have realised that I really don't know what appropriate levels of intimacy are and in therapy I am constantly second guessing myself as to what i should and shouldn't share.

I feel like I am not meant to become dependent on therapy and know I am suspectiable of becoming dependant on people and for some reason in a therapy relationship I feel even more exposed to that and feel more dirty about becoming dependant. I feel I should deal with things myself especially the intimacy parts about my desires and wants. I am ashamed a lot of the time for wanting simple things mainly because I feel people will mock these desires.


Because I don't know what is acceptable e.g. oversharing vs under sharing and knowing what to share and what not to share I become mute and don't share anything or just the tip of the iceberg.


Any tips or guidance of navigating the intimacy in the therapy room?

I too find the relationship a bit hard to navigate. I want to be close, the closeness feels good, I don't know what her expectations are, and what she thinks is acceptable. Some T's seem to think closeness is what it's all about, others are more distant.

[ArtleyWilkins]

I never really thought about what I discussed in therapy as "intimacy;" the connotation of the word just doesn't sit right with me, but that's just semantic preference.

I did feel exposed and vulnerable in therapy because, after all, therapy was about being vulnerable enough to expose my fears and problems and needs to that objective other person in the room.

I shared what was relevant to what I was in therapy for which was not absolutely everything in my life, but is was the most personal things in my life which is why it was so exposing. It takes a lot of trust that the other person will listen and acknowledge and validate my experience. Fortunately, my therapists did just that, without judgment or shock.

I knew that I wanted to get to a place where I could move on, where my past wasn't running my present, and where my depression and anxiety weren't handicapping my life. With those goals in mind, I knew I had to be willing to expose those things about myself relevant to that history and my thinking and emotions about how things were going. That often meant I had to push past my comfort zone, but no one said working on these things was going to be easy.

Right now my husband is recovering from knee replacement surgery. He's going through the process of having to push just a bit past what feels comfortable in order to progress physically -- often in another kind of therapy, physical therapy. If he stays in his comfort zone, that knee is not going to work; in fact, he will risk the muscles atrophying and scar tissue building up, causing the knee to basically freeze. Therapy work is kind of like that for me. I was already that frozen knee, and in therapy I had to push just a bit past my comfort zone a bit at a time in order to make progress, and that meant being willing to have enough vulnerability to purposefully expose myself to that other person in the room.

I guess I don't use the word "intimacy" because intimacy connotes pleasure and love and comfort to me -- I have intimacy in my personal relationships with my husband and children, family and friends. Therapy was hard and painful work for me.

[chihirochild]

I almost always feel better after having told my therapist about something that I feel ashamed about. (Usually it feels God-awful in the moment, and then I feel some relief afterwards. Sometimes the relief is accompanied by an enhanced feeling of closeness with the therapist, which often feels nice to me.) I think it's one of those "act as if you don't feel ashamed and then you won't feel ashamed"/keeping the secret is worse than just talking about it things.

That being said, I have friends who have experienced serious traumas and for some of them, talking about any aspect of trauma in anything but the safest and most controlled circumstances can lead to dysregulation.

[TeaVicar?]

I think you could take this question into therapy with you and ask.

I also struggle with this but from what I've come to understand, we can talk about anything and most of the time the therapist has heard it all before anyway. It's really hard to trust though and shame is often very difficult to overcome.

[feralkittymom]

I can't say that my definition or experience of intimacy has anything to do with mutual disclosures or what I know of my T outside of the room. I can see where some may connect those things to developing trust, but they just don't speak to intimacy for me.

I experience intimacy as in the moment--what happens between me and a T about what I bring to a session. Who I am and what I do outside of that moment, and who the T is and what he does outside of that moment may be relevant to the big picture, but it doesn't contribute to the intimacy I experience in the moment. I think moments of intimacy are co-created, and their effects are immediate and cumulative. I think that's why unresolved ruptures are so destructive as they palpably break intimacy, while resolved ruptures enhance intimacy and cumulatively can result in greater trust.

Hard work and pain doesn't disclude intimacy.
In-to-me-see on a feeling level.
Whrn T said "I think about you..." she was letting me see inside off her.

Intimacy is a feeling experience.
Peiple can write words and words and over analyse as a, defense but at the end of the day, it's a, simple thing. You've either felt it or you haven't.

[Myrto]

I think intimacy in therapy, like others pointed out, is always fake and one-sided. Even when the therapist discloses something, they're still in control and they're not the ones spilling their guts. The clients are. I see therapists as voyeurs. All of them. When I look back on my own therapy, it's creepy how interested my ex-therapist was into some of the stuff I shared (and not at all in the rest -what a surprise). I think some distance is always good with these people, I wouldn't trust them too much.

[Anne2.0]

In my understanding of therapy, one of the clear rules is the focus, which is different than intimacy, is on the client and not the therapist. So therapy doesn't promise mutual disclosure or mutual focus, and for me that kind of mutuality wouldn't work.

But in this second round of therapy, fifteen years after my first round ended and I thought I was done with therapy forever, my therapist does a lot of self disclosure. I could probably collate the facts he's told me and write a reasonable biography. And while I don't feel he's ever crossed the line and made my therapy about him, if his self disclosure is a technique it is neutral at best. Outside the therapy room the level of self disclosure by a friend does relate but isn't everything to my overall sense of intimacy, but inside it doesn't.

For me intimacy is long range and short range, understood by both my feelings and my behavior. The long range of intimacy is in how comfortable and safe I feel talking about what's on my mind; the space itself, symbolic and "holding" the intimacy of my therapy. I still chicken out and avoid some things some of the time, but in general I can sit down now after almost a decade and get to the issue that is on my mind. This kind of intimacy is like the background.

Short range intimacy is more complicated, too many factors to really define. I think about that famous quote by Supreme Court justice Stewart (I think) about pornography, "I know it when I see it." But feeling like my T really "sees" me is a thread of intimacy, but I think most of what intimacy in therapy is like for me is when the dialog between us pushes me towards some new way of understanding about myself, my choices, the way I see myself. The value of articulating things that sometimes come from a more sub conscious place, seeing their connection to my past, or expanding my understanding of some of the core things I have difficult with. These are rarely about my T and what he says but more about how he keeps clearing a path for me in the emotional, murky jungle so I can see myself and what I'm struggling with more clearly.

[starfishing]

Originally Posted by 502041

I think I have realised that I really don't know what appropriate levels of intimacy are and in therapy I am constantly second guessing myself as to what i should and shouldn't share.

I feel like I am not meant to become dependent on therapy and know I am suspectiable of becoming dependant on people and for some reason in a therapy relationship I feel even more exposed to that and feel more dirty about becoming dependant. I feel I should deal with things myself especially the intimacy parts about my desires and wants. I am ashamed a lot of the time for wanting simple things mainly because I feel people will mock these desires.


Because I don't know what is acceptable e.g. oversharing vs under sharing and knowing what to share and what not to share I become mute and don't share anything or just the tip of the iceberg.


Any tips or guidance of navigating the intimacy in the therapy room?

It doesn't exactly sound like you're prone to oversharing. Besides which, I don't think there should really be such a thing if you're working with a good therapist and not using a chiefly behavioral modality. It does sound like it would be a really amazing thing for you to look at your feelings and difficulties around intimacy and dependency in therapy, and enlist your therapist's help in exploring those areas. I also struggle with a lot of shame around the possibility of depending on anyone or being vulnerable. Therapy has been an interesting, challenging microcosm of that for me, in some ways that I think will ultimately be very helpful.

I find that there's a lot of intimacy in my current therapy, and that that intimacy doesn't rely on how much I know about my therapist's personal life or how reciprocal I feel the relationship is. It's about the care with which he attends to my vulnerabilities, the way I listen to what he has to say, the way that he pours himself into the space when there's room and resonance to do so. It's an inherently intimate relationship in a very authentic way, though in my case it's been a slow intimacy. It's difficult, and sometimes confusing, and definitely real.

I dance a little bit in session and when I find the right time, I share something I've been meaning to let go of. Of course, at this point in my life, I am comfortable with who I am and who I am speaking with (And have dance experience as well). But you're concern to be somewhat guarded about your deepest?, darkest?, dirtiest? secrets is very sane. Your thoughts are your own, but utilizing guidance, a friendly ear or reflective interpretation could help, if not for anything else, to practice self-control.