[SarahSweden]

I see a temporary counsellor up until I can see a psychotherapist and there´s no deep attachment but what I got to know today still stings a bit.

My counsellor is very open about what she thinks about political decisions, issues within society and so forth. Among those things is the the situation at the facility we're in, where she works and we´re I´m one of the patients.


Several times she has pointed to the bad conditions for patients, how hard it is to get care and so on. I´ve gotten the impression that she isn´t that happy about working there and that she thinks many issues are handled badly by managers.

She perhaps do think like this but today I got to know that she´s allowed to bring her dog into her office as her boss likes dogs and her boss also has dog toys in her office. Toys that my counsellor´s dog gets to play with.

I was kind of surprised both because a patient could get an allergic reaction if she keeps her dog there several days a week and also because this gave me a different picture of both her boss and the facility.

It sure doesn´t sound like a workplace as she has described it to me before, that she liked their old boss much more, she even has pictures of her old boss on her office wall. By that I´ve gotten the impression that her conditions of employment weren´t that good.


But now, as this is very rare, when she told me she was allowed to bring her dog and the dog likes her patients and so on, it seems like a very nice environment to work within.


I´ve had some thoughts about how she pictures things before this as she has worked at this facility for many years and still she talks about it in negative terms. It makes me feel like she describes things to me in a more negative way than what´s reality just to make me feel like I´m not alone in having problems.

As I also found out she´s married, she has two dogs, a flat in the city center and so on I kind of feel that she doesn´t know about true problems. I feel a bit deluded even if she never lied about anything but perhaps made it seem her situation is worse than it truly is.


What do you think about all this?

[Nammu]

I think you are obsessing again. You do this with every T you've ever had, even tho you. Know she's only temporary you are fixating on her.

[Salmon77]

I don't see any relationship between the workplace allowing dogs and the way patients are treated there. Both things can be true. Just as a person can be married and live in a nice apartment and still have problems, or have experienced hard situations in the past. One thing doesn't negate the other.

Do you like dogs? Have you ever considered getting one? I know having a dog helps me a lot. If nothing else, it gets me up and moving, helps me keep a routine, etc.

[ArtleyWilkins]

The reality is that it is possible to find both positives and negative about a working environment.

It is possible to like your work and not necessarily like everything to do with your job.

Things are rarely completely all positive or all negative.

It is also quite possible to be married, have pets, and own a home and STILL know a great deal about "true problems." Who gets to decide what "true problems" are anyway?

[susannahsays]

Having the dog is one single detail of the work environment and would neither make nor break it. I fail to see how this is some sort of huge revelation that shows that she's a liar.

However, I do think it's rather unprofessional if she's spending your sessions whining about her work environment. Not only should your sessions be about you, but it's not really appropriate for her to be sharing all the complaints she has about the facility and management with you. It's just unprofessional.

[Rive.]

I would focus on my work with the therapist, rather than get distracted by these other, frankly, peripheral issues. That is where I would focus my energy.

Besides, one's conditions of employment might not be great but not all aspects and/or one might still enjoy one's job. It would not be important to my therapy.

[Misterpain]

Is it possible that you are making observations and forming opinions about T and who or what there life experience has or hasn't been ,as away of not working on yourself ?

Every T is temporary to some degree , but our problems issues etc remain semi permanent as we focus on the temporary and avoid doing the work to make T unemployed at least by us as clients .

[GeekyOne]

Originally Posted by SarahSweden

As I also found out she´s married, she has two dogs, a flat in the city center and so on I kind of feel that she doesn´t know about true problems. I feel a bit deluded even if she never lied about anything but perhaps made it seem her situation is worse than it truly is.

Sarah, with all due respect, you don't know anything about this woman.

You know that she has some training in mental health. That will include a basic understanding of "true problems". Her work in the clinic will flesh out that basic understanding and colour it with the experiences of the patients she's worked with, and that others have told her about.

One doesn't have to experience "true problems" to understand them enough to be empathetic, supportive, or have ideas on treatment and coping mechanisms.

Additionally, the fact that she is married, has pets, an apartment in a popular and/or expensive area of town - these are not exclusive of "true problems". Her apparent privilege doesn't mean that she has always had that privilege - you don't know what her life has been like, whether she has always had this level of relative wealth and stability, etc. I hope for the sake of her patients that if she has experienced mental illness, she is in treatment and remission, but you should know that it is very possible to be severely mentally ill and be extremely high functioning.

I am extremely high functioning. I have clawed my way up to a small amount of privilege, and I am very ill (but I don't look it). To you, I would look like her, and your assumptions are offensive. Not unusual - most people make similar assumptions. But they're still offensive.

[divine1966]

Things aren’t that black and white. I complain about things at work. It doesn’t mean I don’t love my job. I do. But there are always things to complain about. T thinks her last boss is better than new one, it doesn’t mean her new boss is horrible. I think my boss is far from great but she is a nice person. I think it’s unfair to assume she is unhappy just because she complained about something

Being married and having dogs and living in city center isn’t unusual or extravagant. You could look for single therapists of course, with no kids or dogs.

But you have to understand that since they work, they have income so they likely have somewhat decent ability to rent or buy a decent place. It’s just a reality.

It doesn’t mean they don’t understand problems. It’s just basic reality of people working, getting paycheck and buying stuff. It doesn’t mean they never had problems or don’t understand other people’s problems.

[divine1966]

It almost felt to me that you expecting therapists to be unhappy and struggling and when you find out it might not be the case, you are disappointed. I’d stop assuming things. Try to focus on what you need to improve and ask t for help in achieving that goal. Her dogs or husbands or her boss are not really relevant to your therapy and most of those things you think about therapusts’ lives are just assumptions. Not facts

[Misterpain]

On a side note ,I have a psychologist buddy who has his own therapy dog , he sometimes brings it to help patients deal with issues difficult issues , one comment he gets alot "when I saw you where a dog guy ,and it was healthy and happy , I figured you new something about keeping us alive " obviously I am not divulging anything anybody could identify , but you have to think all the walls a happy healthy dog can tear down by rolling over and saying rub my belly ,please"

I definately hear you on allergy issues and such , but that's part of patient selection ,intentional exposure vs accidental . I know locally you can't go near a medical office wearing perfume or cologne of any kind, and I had a partner for 11 1/2 years and never got discriminated against but I always had I'D and vet papers etc.. proving my partner was safe and certified .

[stopdog]

I like dogs and adore my own, but I don't want the therapist's dog at an appointment.

[tomatenoir]

I'm unclear as to why her being married and living in the city centre means she doesn't have true problems, or that she wouldn't be able to understand or help you. Has she said something that makes you think she doesn't get something you're going through or are you assuming she doesn't get it because you know a few details about her living situation? From your post, it seems like the latter.

I'm also married (because through dumb luck I met someone compatible) and live in the city centre (because my husband and I have been fortunate to have had decent paying jobs for the last four years). But I've also dealt with depression, lived in a basement apartment with raw sewage coming through the floor, have problems with family, and went through infertility and a miscarriage. You can have both good and bad fortune in your life -- most people do. Is it worth imagining what things you might not be seeing in her life?

You seem to focus a lot on your therapists' (presumed) quality of life and assume they can't help you because it's so different to yours.

I'd really encourage you to bring up the pattern you seem to be in (looking at a therapist's living area and marital status and then feeling like they won't get you/help you). This has popped up in several different posts you've written, so I'm not sure focusing on this particular therapist at this point in time will help. I'd look at what's happening again and again, then bring that to the table for discussion.

I hope that doesn't sound rude or preachy, it's just that you seem to be reliving the same experience over and over.

[Amyjay]

SarahSweden, again you are obsessing unnecessarily about things your T thinks or does or is, and then blame those things as reasons that T will be "unable to help you". But as this pattern repeats itself over and over in your relationship with therapist after therapist, it seems to be more apparent that the reason your Ts are unable to help you is because of your obsessive need to examine their lives and motives and actions instead of examining your own.

[WishfulThinker66]

About the dog, this is common. Dogs are often used in therapy. In fact, during my last hospital stay there were regularly two therapy dogs present. They kind of kept things real for me.

Now, as for everything else.... what is it to you how they lead their life? As long as they are performing their job adequately that is all you need to know. None of what you mentioned is anything that would impact her ability. Concentrate instead on what you can take away from the therapy. Try instead to find the positives in it instead of obsessing over what isn't your business or yours to control.

[here today]

Originally Posted by SarahSweden

. . .
Several times she has pointed to the bad conditions for patients, how hard it is to get care and so on.

. . .I kind of feel that she doesn´t know about true problems. I feel a bit deluded even if she never lied about anything but perhaps made it seem her situation is worse than it truly is.

What do you think about all this?

I wonder if the main problem or concern may be that you would like to trust her, you said in a previous post that you like her, and yet you are not sure how much you really can?

[nottrustin]

Just because she likes one aspect or even a few aspects about a person or job doesnt mean it is all wonderful. If you talk to many of my coworkers they will tell you a lot they dislike about their jobs or the system. However there are aspects they love.

I would be concerned if her complaining about the company is a regular thing..

I do understand and have on occasion thought Emdr T couldnt understand what I have gone through since she hasnt experienced it. There are a couple areas she even admits as much. I have realized though that it doesn't mean she cant have compassion about it. Sometimes her feedback or comments on thaese topics may miss the mark a bit but we discuss it and sometimes even by messing the mark I am able to come to my own realizations.

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. Yes, I agree that my counsellor can complain about some things at her workplace and at the same time also find other things positive. But she has repeatedly talked about how things were better in "the old days" and exemplified her standpoints with things that has happened to her and to her patients.

That doesn´t rime especially well with her boss allowing her to bring her dog to work as this isn´t a facility where they offer and kind of dog therapy or similar. Noone else (that I know of) brings his/her dog to work. To me it seems my counsellor gets advantages from "being friends" with her boss and that surely isn´t in line with all of those complaints she has brought to me. To me it becomes fake.

I agree there will never be a T "like me" because if he/she lived like I do he/she wouldn´t be a therapist. I though find the class differences between clients and therapists/counsellors problematic as I find it hard to really believe in them.

They also remind me of how rich people get richer and poor get poorer and more or less all my former counselors and therapists have never lived on welfare, they haven´t had such struggles. Of course, everyone has problems but I put this issue in a perspective where some citizens (including me) are excluded from society because of various reasons. Then meeting with a counselor who complains about minor things is just making me lose trust in her.

Originally Posted by divine1966

Things aren’t that black and white. I complain about things at work. It doesn’t mean I don’t love my job. I do. But there are always things to complain about. T thinks her last boss is better than new one, it doesn’t mean her new boss is horrible. I think my boss is far from great but she is a nice person. I think it’s unfair to assume she is unhappy just because she complained about something

Being married and having dogs and living in city center isn’t unusual or extravagant. You could look for single therapists of course, with no kids or dogs.

But you have to understand that since they work, they have income so they likely have somewhat decent ability to rent or buy a decent place. It’s just a reality.

It doesn’t mean they don’t understand problems. It’s just basic reality of people working, getting paycheck and buying stuff. It doesn’t mean they never had problems or don’t understand other people’s problems.

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. What I forget to mention in my first post is that I don´t see this counsellor for therapy, I see her more or less just for "chats" and follow-ups up until I can see a psychotherapist. Here, a counsellor isn´t necessary also a psychotherpist. My counsellor isn´t, she meets with patients to give them some general support, not therapy.

Where I live many people my age and especially even younger people, say around the age of 25-30 never get the opportunity to buy a flat, their income is too low. This is a great problem. Stockholm, where I live, has the world´s longest housing queue. People are forced to commute long distances and to live far away in worn-down suburbs.

By that, my counsellor is priviliged in a way many others only dream about. That doesn´t mean she might have marriage problems and similar but her work is well-paid, she owns a flat worth like $500 000. She knows nothing about living on welfare and her problems are minor to those not being able to rent a flat or who never gets a job. To me it´s just fake to sit there and pretending she knows anything about living like I or her other patients do. It´s similar with most T:s here, the majority is above the age of 50 and when they started working the job and housing market looked very different from today.

QUOTE=tomatenoir;6616631]I'm unclear as to why her being married and living in the city centre means she doesn't have true problems, or that she wouldn't be able to understand or help you. Has she said something that makes you think she doesn't get something you're going through or are you assuming she doesn't get it because you know a few details about her living situation? From your post, it seems like the latter.

I'm also married (because through dumb luck I met someone compatible) and live in the city centre (because my husband and I have been fortunate to have had decent paying jobs for the last four years). But I've also dealt with depression, lived in a basement apartment with raw sewage coming through the floor, have problems with family, and went through infertility and a miscarriage. You can have both good and bad fortune in your life -- most people do. Is it worth imagining what things you might not be seeing in her life?

You seem to focus a lot on your therapists' (presumed) quality of life and assume they can't help you because it's so different to yours.

I'd really encourage you to bring up the pattern you seem to be in (looking at a therapist's living area and marital status and then feeling like they won't get you/help you). This has popped up in several different posts you've written, so I'm not sure focusing on this particular therapist at this point in time will help. I'd look at what's happening again and again, then bring that to the table for discussion.

I hope that doesn't sound rude or preachy, it's just that you seem to be reliving the same experience over and over.[/QUOTE]

[SarahSweden]

Thanks. Yes, I kind of like her as a person but there´s always a downside to meet with a counsellor who shares. Even if I prefer that before a blank slate T. I forgot to mention that this counsellor isn´t seeing me for therapy but more of "supportive chats" up until I get to see a psychotherapist. That is, my counsellor isn´t a therapist.

I won´t see this counsellor for chats anymore when meeting with my new therapist and by that I can leave behind what she tells me, what she complains about and such. But I realise that I will never find a T who I can feel connected to in that sense that she has lived a similar life as mine. I think I run for a kind of illusion, that I will finally find someone who understands me and who understands my life conditions. But I won´t.

I´ve seen so many different people through mental health care, both for therapy, brief chats and so on and when looking them up afterwards, they all live on "fancy" addresses, they have high wages, they are almost always married.

A therapist might offer me some of their therapeutic skills and hopefully I can learn how to live a bad life without becoming more depressed and anxious than I already am. I will never succeed in anything and by that I have to learn how to be indifferent to that fact. I can´t strive for things and become upset when I learn a T is married or owns a flat.

Originally Posted by here today

I wonder if the main problem or concern may be that you would like to trust her, you said in a previous post that you like her, and yet you are not sure how much you really can?

[ScarletPimpernel]

Sarah
I was raised middle class. At 18, I was homeless living in a shelter. Not only homeless, but with no one and only a duffle bag of clothes. However, I now am married and though we don't have jobs, we live in an apartment just a few miles from the beach.

Do you think that I can't relate to you? Can you relate to me? Have you ever been homeless living in shelters or on the streets? Only food you get is from the generosity of others?

See for me, I don't need my T to have been homeless to understand me. I don't need her to have straved to understand. She understands because she empathetic. Because she's been trained to understand the pains in life.

You keep judging people based upon their social status. If you think they can't understand you, why do you think you understand them? What gives you that power?

[here today]

Originally Posted by SarahSweden

Thanks. Yes, I kind of like her as a person but there´s always a downside to meet with a counsellor who shares. Even if I prefer that before a blank slate T. I forgot to mention that this counsellor isn´t seeing me for therapy but more of "supportive chats" up until I get to see a psychotherapist. That is, my counsellor isn´t a therapist.

I won´t see this counsellor for chats anymore when meeting with my new therapist and by that I can leave behind what she tells me, what she complains about and such. But I realise that I will never find a T who I can feel connected to in that sense that she has lived a similar life as mine. I think I run for a kind of illusion, that I will finally find someone who understands me and who understands my life conditions. But I won´t.

I´ve seen so many different people through mental health care, both for therapy, brief chats and so on and when looking them up afterwards, they all live on "fancy" addresses, they have high wages, they are almost always married.

A therapist might offer me some of their therapeutic skills and hopefully I can learn how to live a bad life without becoming more depressed and anxious than I already am. I will never succeed in anything and by that I have to learn how to be indifferent to that fact. I can´t strive for things and become upset when I learn a T is married or owns a flat.

Two different sentences in this just touch my heart. I do so wish there were some comfort for you somewhere in this world.

[GeekyOne]

Sarah, as others have noted, you seem to get stuck repeatedly on this issue of the therapist (or support person) not having your lived experience, so they can't truly understand and help you.

Have you looked into peer support groups in your area? You might find folks there with a more similar life situation/experience. The trade-off, of course, is the level of training and that such relationships are typically two ways, with giving and receiving support. On the other hand, at least in North America, such groups are usually free - and some people find them very beneficial.


Some groups in North America would include the DBSA (depression/bipolar support alliance), refuge recovery, and 12 step groups like emotions anonymous. If you have relatives/loved ones with addictions (treated or otherwise), you would certainly be welcomed into Al-Anon or ACOA (Adult Children of Alcoholics) groups also.

[DocJohn]

This thread has been re-opened and unsupportive replies trimmed. As a reminder, please adhere to the community guidelines when replying to a thread of this nature. If your reply isn't offering emotional support to the OP, it may not be appropriate to post. If you don't feel like you can offer such support, please do not reply to such threads.

[SarahSweden]

Thanks for sharing this. I think you could relate to me and I can to some extent understand some of what you´re describing but mostly from what I´ve read and heard about homeless people on TV and radio. I don´t think anyone´s life is completely unrelatable but I though find class differences between therapists and patients as an issue. Not much has been written about it but some do look into it and try to study that phenomena.

For me it´s not about understanding, it's pure facts. To be able to own your flat in those areas my former therapists and counsellors live you must have inherited money or you have had work from when you were young and now you belong to upper middle class with high wages. You just have to look at the demographic stats to understand that.

Also, even if far from all clients think about class differences some do and it´s more important to ease and understand feelings of envy than knowing that "some day you could get there as well".

Originally Posted by ScarletPimpernel

Sarah
I was raised middle class. At 18, I was homeless living in a shelter. Not only homeless, but with no one and only a duffle bag of clothes. However, I now am married and though we don't have jobs, we live in an apartment just a few miles from the beach.

Do you think that I can't relate to you? Can you relate to me? Have you ever been homeless living in shelters or on the streets? Only food you get is from the generosity of others?

See for me, I don't need my T to have been homeless to understand me. I don't need her to have straved to understand. She understands because she empathetic. Because she's been trained to understand the pains in life.

You keep judging people based upon their social status. If you think they can't understand you, why do you think you understand them? What gives you that power?