[Wishmouse]

Can't seem to get past my anger towards my therapist. She pushed and pushed for me to see a pychiatrist, and after 6 months of horrendous med-experiementation. She admitted to me that "she felt guilty for pushing and how she couldn't sleep at night because of the guilt and how bad she felt for letting me down... ". All I could hear was her asking me to say "its okay" so she could be excused, It was pathetic to witness. Part of me wants to loose my temper with her and part just never wants to see her again.

Am also going through med-withdrawal, so I am not really thinking rationally. A)Having exciting dreams about torturing people (sic), B)swinging between anger and depression; C) and visualising being shot in the head (can feel the steel against my temple etc.

How do I handle this?

[pegasus]

Mmm... well, meds can be helpful in times of distress, I'm not sure why your T feels guilty about that? It's up to the psychiatrist and you to work out the correct dosage and that can take some experimentation. I wouldn't give up on the meds just yet as they can help with the symptoms that you describe above. Also, it would be wise to keep having therapy, don't give up!

[kim_johnson]

Ah. Well... Someone or other (can't remember who) said something about how we have rage... And only the objects (people) who survive that onslaught are considered 'worthy'. There was something about that... Can't quite remember it...

Because your response is just one (of many possible) responses, you see. Sometimes... I feel immense compassion for my therapist when I sense a weakness / vulnerability. I step in to nurture him quite willingly (verbally, I mean) and while I'm doing that... I guess I imagine someone soothing and nurturing me in the same way. Or maybe physically holding me, even.

Do you have some kinds of needs / desires like that? Do you find them... As repulsive in yourself as you do in your therapist? Are you repulsed by perceived weakness more generally? Does it make you feel anxious? That things can be so easily hurt / damaged?

Even though your therapist might have been having a hard time of it... She may still pull through yet. Give her a chance?

[kim_johnson]

Do you worry that if your therapist perceives that vulnerability / need / plea for help in you that she will be disgusted with you and reject you?

Can you talk to her about that?

[Wishmouse]

Yes I do see it as pathetic had she never mentioned it, I would never have considered making her responsible, but now that she has painted this picture that she is to blame, its a little difficult to get that out of my mind.

[kim_johnson]

Have you ever done something in an attempt to help someone and found that your efforts hadn't seem to have helped at all?

Human beings aren't perfect...

[ECHOES]

I think that if she didn't care and have a strong desire to help you, she wouldn't have had such a strong reaction.
(What if she had had the attitude of "Oh well, win some / lose some." ?)
I think you have a great T there.

I'd be really annoyed at my therapist if he took that much responsibility as a result of my own choices. I'm not exactly sure why your therapist felt so guilty. She pushed you to see a pdoc because she thought it was in your best interest-- and now you had negative med experiences... I'm not sure how that is her fault. I think your therapist really needs to examine what is going on with her. My therapist heavily encouraged me to continue with my medication quest-- and he stood by me while I failed with my 15th, 16th, 17th, and 18th meds. He acknowledged that maybe I would be angry with him and pdoc for encouraging me to take meds that failed. I acknowledged that I do get angry at them because, well, who else am I going to angry at that for? But on the other side of it, it is no one's fault. It is my choice to decide to swallow the meds; my choice to keep trying. If the meds fail, and I get angry at pdoc and/or T, that is more of an expression of my frustration, than anything.

If you are handling med withdrawal with thoughts and visions of violence, I would immediately tell both your therapist and pdoc. You mentioned in your other post that you "dropped" your pdoc. Not a good idea. Even if you are not on meds, you are still going through withdrawal symptoms. Your pdoc should be involved in helping you handle this. You should also sort out which of these symptoms are results of the med withdrawals, and which are things you need to work out in therapy. You mentioned that your meds haven't done anything for you-- but were you experiencing these violent thoughts and mood swings while on them?

[RiverX]

Well, it looks to me like your T. was innappropriate, so some negative reaction in you comes from a healthy place, as I see it.
A lot of people dont undersand what a healthy apology is.
To apologise to someone for a mistake, it takes a straight forward and sincere apology, and acknowledge the impact on the other person, then do everyghing in ones power to amend what happened and learn from it. But to go on in the detail that she did, I think you're right, that she seems to be trying for your sympathy, which in fact just brings the focus back to her rather than leaving room for YOUR feelings, so its not really an amends, its just deepening the twist. Not very therapuetic.

I have learnt a long and hard path, I have had to sack numerous Ts even well known and published ones, but I think I have now found one who does his job well and sincerely, and I feel so lucky. But I had to go through terrible s...t disbilieving my own perceptions and feeling crazy.
Its ok to question oneself and to question ones T. , but when you know, you know, and from what you have described, I can understand your feelings.
From what I can see, your instincts seem right, folllow your intuitive and keep searching for what you need, you'll probably know it when you get it.
I think your anger is healthy, a healthy sign to follow, just one has to be creative with what we do with anger, ie to handle it for truth and the highest good as best as poss.
Keep going, you're doin fine.

riverx

[sunrise]

I think it is fine for a T to encourage a client to see a pdoc. (You used the word "push", though, so it sounds like T was going against your own inclination?) Once a client does see a pdoc, they can consult with the pdoc as to whether meds can help, whether they are appropriate, etc. It is not your T's fault that the med choices your pdoc and you made did not work out for you. But maybe your T will learn from this that meds are not the answer for everyone and not to "push" so hard in the future when the client offers resistance.

I do think it is odd your T is taking so much responsibility for this. She gave you a referral she thought would be helpful. It was up to pdoc and you to decide whether to proceed beyond the consultation stage. It does sound, however, that your T could have empowered you more to do what you felt was best for yourself. I hope you can talk to your T about this and tell her that you feel she is begging for you to absolve her. That must feel really uncomfortable.

The med issue is so charged, I can understand why you would be having some anger and angst about this, Wishmouse. My first therapist said she would not work with me if I took meds, so I felt really cornered and like I had no choice or she would drop me. What pissed me off was that after 6 months of working with me, she realized how ineffectual her CBT methods were and urged me to go see a psychiatrist. I ignored her advice. Too late for that. It really made me feel like early in therapy she hadn't taken my problems seriously and thought she could solve them with band-aids (get more exercise, get more sleep, talk to your friends, etc.). It was really invalidating to realize she hadn't believed the depth of my depression and pain, like I'd been faking it or something.

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
Am also going through med-withdrawal, so I am not really thinking rationally. A)Having exciting dreams about torturing people (sic), B)swinging between anger and depression; C) and visualising being shot in the head (can feel the steel against my temple etc.

How do I handle this?

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">Talk to your pdoc. I read in another thread that you had dropped your pdoc, but I hope you can keep some contact up since you are still on meds and having difficulty with withdrawal. Pdocs can help plan out a way to taper off gradually to minimize negative symptoms, and if the taper program is not working, can consult on how to alter it for better results.

Wishmouse, I also want to encourage you to keep up with therapy. I don't know what your presenting difficulties are, but I was able to beat my depression with the help of a second therapist, meds-free. He took a different approach (non-CBT) that was highly effective for me. Good luck.