[lido78]

I don't know if this qualifies as a disorder, but I purposely fantasize about how my relationships will end in order to "prepare for the worst." My father cheated on my mother and, when I was young, I promised myself I'd never get hurt that way and never be so unaware as my mother was. By telling myself this and practicing my breakups, I've probably destroyed numerous relationships. I've basically practiced being suspicious and never been able to trust anyone 100%. I do not want to do this, as I'm well aware of how damaging this is, but it is a defense mechanism that's been in place so long, I don't know how to make it go away. I try to distract these thoughts by focusing on my partner's real behavior (rather than my fantasies) but I slip too often and usually end up in a negative place of my own creation. Honestly, I practice how the conversation will go if I ever discover a partner cheating but, in actuality, I've never discovered that a partner ever HAS cheated...I don't do any of this with my partner...it's all in my mind....but it makes me suspicious of otherwise trustworthy men....I desperately need a way to retrain my brain....because I want to trust and love without fear any more. Hope this makes sense.

[Perna]

Practicing is very common and a good mechanism to know how to use if done in a positive manner such as practicing a speech or interview, etc.?

However, assuming relationships will end rather than be successful or feeling you have to practice because you won't be able to deal with unhappiness or unpleasantness in the moment is probably not a good idea. I would work on staying with the relationship and person rather than jumping ahead and missing what you do have now? You cannot be both places; with the other here, now, or in the future which only you can design as it is a fantasy, never exists.

[lido78]

I know...it's something that I'd really like to work on eliminating from my life but am not sure what concrete steps to take as this is somethive I've probably done for about 30 years now. When I find myself drifting into imagining the (negative) future, I try to distract myelf and find that yoga also helps to focus the mind by focusing on breathing. But, I definitely go to it in weaker moments and am hoping others may have some additional mental "tricks" that I can use....I'm not a backward looking person (don't really like talking or focusing on the past) but I have a LOT of trouble staying in the present....my professional life is centered around anticipating future problems and this doesn't really help in my personal life. Basically, ferretting out the bad stuff for clients is what I'm paid to do, so I'm always trying to anticipate the negative so that the clients can fix stuff before everything really goes down hill. I'd like to be able to use my skills in the area for work but then turn it off when I leave the office...not been too successful so far though!

[shezbut]

lido,

I have a long history of using this technique as well. I have hesitatingly opened myself more to the last two men that I've been with (first one: married for 14 years; the second: been together for 2 years) ~ but I've never been able to completely trust anyone.

Very low self-esteem/self-hate is my core issue. The trick for you, is to determine what the core issue is for you. From there, you can work on overcoming the issue to finally be able to trust men. For instance, do you trust women? Do you like yourself? Are you able to have healthy friendships with men and women? Just a few Q's to think about.

[lido78]

Shez...very interesting questions that I'll really have to think about. I'm sure my main issue is the way my parents' relationship broke up...the result being that I actually promised myself at age 12 to never trust any man 100% (to reserve at least 5% of my heart no matter what). Some time in my early 30s, though, I realized how this practice really hurt my ability to be happy in the long run, but I can't seem to break this habit!!!

My father cheated on my mother and got caught in a fairly complicated lie that embarrassed my mother in a public way. He said he was traveling overseas on business and that he would not be able to go with my mother to her college reunion b/c his flight home was cancelled due to fog...my mother only found out this was not true when a friend said to her "So nice to see ***** last night and his friend from overseas." He'd actually never gone abroad but had his "lady friend" visit him from overseas and took her out in public to an event he normally would have attended with my mother. Needless to say, the ***** hit the fan and things went down hill from there.

I probably do have some self-esteem issues but no more than the average woman. My issue is that I don't completely trust either women or men...the woman that he cheated with was someone I knew and who knew my mother...I just know that deep down, people really are capable of just about anything...I have friendships with both men and women, but I have more male friends than female...mostly because the male friendships can be more superficial (i.e., safer for me) and women tend to want to be closer. I guess that I expect more from women (rightly or wrongly) and allow only a few to get really close.

I actually do like myself and think that I'm a decent person...but, I probably hold others to a high standard and, when they disappoint me, am fairly quick to end a friendship if I feel as if trust may be in question. But, I don't know if I assess people in a clear way...I may see stuff that really isn't there and use it as an excuse to run away emotionally....

How did you actually improve your level of trust?

[shezbut]

Hi lido,

Thanks for responding, and putting some thought into things. That's good!

I admit, I use old reliable sexuality to hook a man. (Not like I put any planning into this, but I can see this pattern as I look back.) I give my physical 100% to the man. They're new and interesting, so I'm there emotionally as well. As time passes, my sexuality ebbs a bit ~ and I go into a paranoid phase that I can't hold onto him without.

We always make it through the paranoia, which makes me a bit more comfortable and "safe". During that paranoia, I often tell him that I'm scared. Afraid that the relationship won't make it, he doesn't love me, etc. The two always reassured me that I was okay, the relationship is okay, and they love/d me. Well, you have probably heard that you can't love another until you love yourself ~ and that's a real BIG problem for me. I don't love myself. I never have. Anyway...I think that this is where that huge paranoia of mine stems from.

While I want to feel true love towards "Joe", according to some psychosocial theories, I am unable to truly love another because I don't love myself. So, this creates a lot of tension and paranoia. I think that these guys are great. Really, I do! Yet, year after year I really struggle despite all that they put up with and I try so hard to please them (physically and emotionally). It feels like a seesaw to me!

Did I answer your Q? I think that the gist is that I've kind of forced myself to stay in the romantic relationships because I'm terrified of losing the man. I have shared my fears throughout, which tested their commitment levels to me & relieved a bit of stress as well. That does deepen my level of trust, to an extent. I still hold myself back a little (sometimes a lot) from my boyfriend for fear of being seen the way I see myself... and that's something I just can't even imagine doing.

[lido78]

Thanks for sharing your experience. Mine is similar although not so much on the sexual side. With the current boyfriend, also going on about 2 years, I have told him that I get scared and that I'm aware that, based on how he's actually treated me, the fear is a bit irrational. He is normally very patient with me and we work through it. For the past couple of months, however, he's experienced a lot of personal stress due to business reasons, so he's been much less patient and made some choices that definitely made me feel more insecure, which leads to the fear.

So, I've been at a bit of an orange or yellow alert lately and I'm very uncomfortable with myself. Although I like myself on a conscious level (pretty clear on my good points and my bad ones), your post has made me wonder if down deep, even deeper than my consciousness, I have some self-hate/dislike going on. I'm thinking this may be the case because even if I can't totally trust men, if I were 100% okay with myself, this wouldn't turn into anxiety and fear...maybe there is some underlying thoughts of "maybe I'm not good enough" and this is what's REALLY causing the turmoil. Hmmm....I'm not so sure then how I really do see myself or how I imagine others may see me....something to think through a bit more. Thank you!

[Perna]

Originally Posted by lido78

my professional life is centered around anticipating future problems and this doesn't really help in my personal life. Basically, ferretting out the bad stuff for clients is what I'm paid to do, so I'm always trying to anticipate the negative so that the clients can fix stuff before everything really goes down hill. I'd like to be able to use my skills in the area for work but then turn it off when I leave the office...not been too successful so far though!

I think the difference is that you are ferreting out real possibilities for future problems for your clients, they have an actual "thing" that can go wrong, machinery can break or they can get sued, etc. whereas in relationships, there's no "thing", no discrete problem, it's wholly open-ended and you are perhaps trying to close it off some so you can contain or control it.

I was interested in when you said you try to distract yourself when you find yourself thinking up future scenarios; why not just practice thinking up good scenarios instead of bad ones? If you are going to live in the future, you might as well make it a good one? No, you don't have to picture marrying a guy and having 2.5 gorgeous children by him :-) but I would take the actual (like you do with your clients) of what you know of him (Is he honest? Does he seem sincere? Are you comfortable being and talking with him?) and project that out or, if there are negatives, I'd start thinking of them "now" instead of waiting until they bloom? If you catch him lying, picturing him breaking your heart later is not useful? Practice watching for current problems you identify and talking about them.

Yes, when you are talking with clients about what material to make an item out of and need to know the relative strengths and weaknesses down the road (do you want the roof that lasts 15 years or the more expensive one that lasts 20?) there isn't a roof yet so it is natural to look at the future-roof but a relationship that is already in progress has things going on now and can be steered better by dealing with the problems now.

[lido78]

Perna...practicing good scenarios is a wonderful suggestion. I'd love to be able to do this and greatly admire my friends who are both optimistic and realistic. I guess that I could just try to do this initially as an exercise and see if it becomes more of a learned behavior. It's very hard though...I always worry that thinking on the positive side of things means that I won't catch real danger signs (i.e., "ignorance is bliss"). Unfortunately, in my childhood, I did catch the danger signs before my mother did with regard to my father's affair and she blew me off (at least externally) saying that I had a really interesting imagination...so, I'm not totally sure of my instincts on certain things

Either way though, a more optimistic attitude is called for...right now, rather than experiencing pain just once (when a negative incident actually happens), I actually experience it tenfold (each time I imagine it)...and, I know that's no real way to live!

[Open Eyes]

lido,
I posted some advice to you in the PTSD forum. So far your questions are revolving around your past and I have brought up my ideas on what your struggles may mean.

I am sorry that you noticed your fathers infedelity before your mother did. But you can't look for it in every man you meet to the extent you are now. Ofcourse that was a very troubling experience for you. But you need to spend time learning about how to develope your own successful relationships. You haven't had that yet, you only really know one bad experience that has truely effected you.

(((((Hugs)))))
Open Eyes

[lido78]

Thank you Open Eyes....I'll take a look at your other post as well. It was one experience that, unfortunately, I've replayed in my head too many times....not the affair, per se, but watching my mom be completely blindsided by it...to her credit, she picked up and simply moved on...but I hated that it was not exactly a family secret and that she had to deal with it being somewhat public.

[Open Eyes]

(((((lido78)))))

You "all" had to deal with it being somewhat public, it happened to all of you, that is what your feeling. It is hard on children when this happens.

[lido78]

Yes, you're right. We even had family friends try to show support by being very critical of my father. That just made it worse because then I had to either defend him or agree with them. What kid wants to make that choice and address her own father's infidelity with people outside the family?