Friend is toxic narcissist

I continued talking about this situation on a thread about hoovering.

I have gotten many comments on this thread and the other thread.

I think the very best advice is to take the spotlight off the narcissist and shine it on my own life...and create more happiness.

That keeps the vampires away.

I’ve been on as long as you. My original concerns were for three difficult relationships. My mother, husband, and this (now ex) friend.

During these years, have other relationships devolved for you? My point is I am self-examining how much is me and how much is them.

I have two healthy friendships with women. One long term of 40 years remains and one I’ve known for six. I have no issues with acquaintances or people I work with. So it’s no just me across the board.

But I have had fallout with some key others, which really shocked me. It’s a long story, but my sisters and dad really don’t care about me at all.

I’m pretty sure my mother would be diagnosed NPD, but she is elderly and was not previously as ill as she is now. I would agree though I learned some bad ways from her. I’m looking inward toward myself and trying to explain to myself whatever it is that i have done that caused others to treat me so badly.

I’m not suggesting there is anything bad or wrong about you. I’m always looking at the whole picture in myself to try to understand and justify what is happening.

For example, with my ex friend, I did confide in her all my stuff thinking this is the supportive relationship friends have. Then she threw all my stuff in my face to criticize me about it, non helpful, hurtful. She also gossiped about me using the ammunition I gave her to others. Geez, with friends like that, who needs enemies? Now, was I having faulty thinking in the first place to confide my problems to my friend? See what I’m saying here?

Did we somehow cause people to treat us badly? Did we attract narcissists and are they even actual narcissists? Are we members of families filled with narcissists or is this just how normal people are?

Please don’t take offense. I am not at all suggesting there is anything wrong with you. It’s just this is how I think and have beat myself up about this because I am suffering from really toxic relationships. How much is me and how much is them? (Just a rhetorical question)

Thanks for this. I think I came on here to Psych Central because everything was unraveling. My older sister had just died and she was a toxic narcissist. So I was experiencing complicated grief. And in the late stages of her illness I was thrust back into family dynamics I had been avoiding and came up against a few other narcissists in my family. ON TOP OF ALL THIS...I had gotten myself into a toxic post divorce relationship...with someone who turned out to be really crazy, stalking me and such. I had a falling out with a woman I had been working with for ten years...because when I confronted her about some of her crazy narcissistic ways she turned nasty. That's how you can really tell a narcissist. If you confront them and they have a meltdown.

During this time I got rid of a couple of newer friends who also seemed toxic. Not so much nasty but with what seemed like moderate substance abuse problems. I didn't want to be around that.


Long story...I ended up with an empty life. This was so weird...because it seemed like just the second before that...I had a boyfriend...a best friend...a sister...brothers...a mentor and working colleague and productive work...and a smattering of local friends. It seemed like in one fell swope it was all gone.

I then moved to a rather isolated area geographically speaking - that was unfamiliar - after living in the same area for over 20 years...and for the past three years have really struggled to understand what happened to my life.

It is only recently that I have started to feel...less confused. This relationship I have been talking about was kind of the last one to go. And I depended on this friend.

I have to now build a whole new life from the ground up. I have a few neighbors who seem to want to become friends. It is the first overture...from a new and fresh place. I feel a bit battered but I had better get over that...

It’s quite eye opening when you finally see people and things for what they are. Once you see it, you can’t unsee it.

Thank you for this pearl of wisdom. It is so true. Once we see how things are...it seems impossible to go back. It is frightening...but I guess it is also growth. Thanks for your comment. It was short and sweet. (As you always are when you post on PC)

I will add that I recently unblocked a narcissist on my Facebook (just to see what would happen out of curiosity) and low and behold, he came back looking for me to resupply him, by messaging me, "What happened?" I deleted his message and put him on Facebook block again.

I know you aren't going to block your friend, DechanDawa as that is your choice. I'm just giving you another perspective. When I'm done with people, I'm done with them. Burn me once, shame on you. Burn me twice, shame on me.

Clearly, this narcissist guy won't leave me alone if I don't block him on Facebook. So, I have to keep him blocked now on Facebook, for my safety's sake. Hence my "unblock" to see if he'd leave me alone or continue to bother me. Well, looks like I have to keep him on block now, on Facebook, or he'll continue to bother me with messages.

I'd only leave people on my Facebook and would hide their profile from my newsfeed if I was taking a break from them temporarily. It doesn't seem like you want to cut off this childhood friendship as much as you just want to take a break from her, or you'd just delete her and be done with her.

I agree with your observation, ennie, b/c I have encountered these types myself. They are incredibly hard to label b/c they are so talented at disguising themselves. But, you can catch them if you listen to how they speak and watch how they manipulate people.

As to my narcissist's message "What happened?" That's his way of trying to re-hook me into supplying him with my attention online again, which I won't do anymore. Even his ex-girlfriend cut him off the same way, blocking him on her Facebook. He's still friends with her other family members which is alarming b/c he can reach her through them. I'm just bringing up this example of a true narcissist to show you what they are capable of, when given access to you in any way they can get it. He thought by asking me "What happened?" he could re-engage me. He knows what happened: I blocked him b/c of his narcissistic behavior. I caught on to the red flags he showed me, and I cut and ran. If I don't keep him blocked, he'll continue to try to manipulate me emotionally and I won't allow that to happen.

If you truly don't want this friend to emotionally manipulate you anymore, then you need to cut off access to her, instead of keeping her around to see how she'll respond. That's like poking a hornet's nest -- eventually you'll get stung by doing that. Best to just cut and run and grieve the loss of this toxic friendship. You'll never get an explanation from her as to why she chooses to treat you so badly. Narcissists starve their victims just enough to keep them attached, with false hope and false expectations that the narcissist will meet their emotional needs. And that is the great lie of being friends or in a relationship with a narcissist. They will NEVER give you what you want. Ever.

I agree with this advice. If you close one door and keep another open, you would be sending a mixed message to a narcissist. A lack of consistency may even be seen as a weakness by a narc.

If you (OP) want to let her down gently, you could set your FB status as "Social Media fast" and not log on for a while. If she doesn't get the instant gratification of getting to you, she may move on...

...but I can't guarantee it seeing Blanche's case above and given my own experience with a narc.

But why not give this a try, since it may be helpful for you to get a break from this person anyway.

You seem independent and I respect that you will make your own decision in the end. But I think other people's experience can be useful to keep in the back of your mind as a reference.

Well said Sisabel, well said.

Thank you ennie.

I feel like you - DechanDawa- are giving your narcissist friend mixed messages by not being straightforward with her. That could come back to bite you in the end and cause you more emotional grief and pain than you deserve.

The rule of thumb with people is to always be direct with them, so they know what to expect from you. Even if they don't like the boundaries you put up, too bad. Those boundaries are for your own protection, DechanDawa.

It's hard to stand up to a friend you've known your whole life. But if you want her around, then you need to accept her for the way she treats you. If you don't accept her mistreatment of you, you owe it to yourself to hold her accountable. Otherwise if you don't hold her accountable, she'll think it's ok to continue to hurt you and mistreat you b/c you never speak up for yourself. I know it can be scary to confront someone who has a strong personality, but it comes down to who matters more to you: your toxic friend's feelings, or your own?

Maybe you should just delete your Facebook account altogether. My account is only up for business purposes. I don't mess with it.

I have other reasons for not wanting to mess around with blocking, unblocking etc.


Have you ever heard of the "grey rock" technique? That is what I am practicing. It is the most effective method in a situation like this. I have used it before successfully.

[QUOTE=StreetcarBlanche;6532213]Thank you ennie.

I feel like you - DechanDawa- are giving your narcissist friend mixed messages by not being straightforward with her. That could come back to bite you in the end and cause you more emotional grief and pain than you deserve.

The rule of thumb with people is to always be direct with them, so they know what to expect from you. Even if they don't like the boundaries you put up, too bad. Those boundaries are for your own protection, DechanDawa.

It's hard to stand up to a friend you've known your whole life. But if you want her around, then you need to accept her for the way she treats you. If you don't accept her mistreatment of you, you owe it to yourself to hold her accountable. Otherwise if you don't hold her accountable, she'll think it's ok to continue to hurt you and mistreat you b/c you never speak up for yourself. I know it can be scary to confront someone who has a strong personality, but it comes down to who matters more to you: your toxic friend's feelings, or your own?[/QUOTE



Thanks for the advice which I am sure you are giving in good faith.

I have used the grey rock technique before effectively.

I believe...in the end...it has to do with psychic energy.

I have been friends with this person for 50 years, practically since infancy. We communicate through energetic channels. It was the kind of friendship...where...just thinking about her would cause her to call me.

The point here that everyone is missing is about Facebook, social media, etc. being the most important consideration.

Believe me this person has countless ways of hoovering. We grew up in the same community and know hundreds of the same people. Long before Facebook there were other ways people communicated socially. Some are still in effect in small towns.

I want to minimize damage. I don't want every cousin of mine knowing my business.

So, yes, I am stepping lightly around this.

As I have said before...in other threads...my best advice came from Golden Eve. If we strengthen our own lives and introduce a lot of positivity...demons will naturally fall away because there will be no energy, psychic or otherwise, to feed off.

We become codependent to narcissists because there are weakness in our own life...such as...imbalances, substance abuse, lack of confidence and self esteem.

In truth...and this has been after a lot of soul searching...I can see where this situation has nothing to do with the "other" and is more a wake up call about my own life.

PS You were involved in blocking, unblocking and then blocking a narcissist on your Facebook. This was feeding their energy. If you had applied the grey rock technique you could have psychically cut off the energetic connection with this person. You can find information on the grey rock technique online. Esteemology is a very good site on recovery from narcissistic abuse.

I don't need to set my Facebook account on media fast. I use it as a business platform and don't post personal photos on it.


If this person wants to "like" political and social issue posts of mind...I have decided I really don't care. I always get a lot of likes and I am not going to mess with my FB account. Anyway, FB is so yesterday. I primarily use other social media outlets this person does not access.

After much soul searching I have decided to turn this thread on its head...and suggest that...when we have let narcissists get a foothold into our lives...it has nothing to do with them...and everything to do with us.

Other the years I was complacent about boundaries. I let things go. I allowed others to say things that were rude and offensive.

We have to ask ourselves...why we continue with such codependent patterns.

Real freedom comes from within.

I have effectively used the grey rock technique in the past. I am going to apply it now.

Obviously someone I have known from childhood and who is still in my hometown has many ways of hoovering. We know hundreds of the same people. Our lives our enmeshed. If I am stepping lightly around this I have my reasons.

I can't imagine ever having any connection with this person again. I am so done. Why should I continue to relate to someone who is rude, hurtful, and offensive? I am so over it.

I think I found a good solution for the facebook issue. I went on and was able to ‘unfollow’ any new posts from my mother and sister (heaven help me!) and I was able to set my new posts to be ‘friends except my mother and sister’ and I’m pretty sure no one else on facebook can see that setting to know I did it. This way, I didn’t cause any drama by unfriending or blocking, but I won’t be bothered by them.

This thread got me thinking that I am truly bothered by their antics on stupid facebook, and why should I let them chase me off there?

I had posted a video of my son playing guitar at a school show, mostly because his music teacher asked to see it. I was glad that my mom called and said she enjoyed it. But then she had to say how my sister liked it and commented. What bugs me is that my sister treated me cruelly several months ago (which was the first conflict ever had with her), refused to apologize, and never called me again. So why is she liking my posts? It does bother me. It feels like control and disrespect or it is hoovering without actually ever having to apologize.

Thanks all for the helpful posts that got me to block them for my own peace of mind.

Maybe doing this will alleviate any discomfort your ex friend’s likes are giving you, DD.

On this thread people keep saying that when they are done with someone they are done.

Really, you are never done.

We are karmically connected to every single person in our lives.

The Buddhists teach...even if we accidentally bump into a stranger in the grocery store...that brief and fleeting interaction...connects us to that stranger on some level. That is how interconnected we all are, in fact.


I think...we need to look deep within ourselves...and unhook patterns of abuse. Just "cutting off" the person does nothing.

I see every life situation as a learning opportunity.

I am trying to understand the dynamics of this situation on a deep level. I doubt if just cutting this person off FB is going to undo 50 years of friendship.

But when something ends...we want closure, when, in fact, only death ends the relationship.


When someone dies then there is no more relating. I went through this recently with my only sister. She was a toxic narcissist up until the end. It was very painful because I wanted resolution and a few apologies, as well, and it never happened.


I think, probably, my gradually going no contact in this situation has something to do with my sister's death. I had a lot of complicated grief...both love and anger...when my sister died.


Big changes in relationships send shock waves through our system. We need to be gentle with ourselves and apply a lot of self-care while dealing with this situations.


Odd that no one on this thread has advised me to be gentle with myself, take care of myself, apply self care, positivity, and happiness in my life. (My life has been kind of a mess since dealing with this...and self care has been difficult.)


In the end....compassion is what heals. Lots of compassion.

I have used all the settings to hide, block, and selectively choose who sees my stuff...for years.

You see, you posted a picture of your family on FB. I don't do that. I don't post any photos of my adult child. He hates FB and deleted his account long ago and I respect his privacy and never post pictures of him. We both have other niche social media accounts on other sites.


I mostly have my Facebook up as a business profile. I do freelance work...and I am presently looking for part-time work. I have heard that it is good to keep up one's FB account to have a social profile. To prove that you exist! I notice others don't post information about their work experience. I do post that stuff.

If someone wants to find out information before hiring me they will find basic stuff on FB about my education, career path, and experience. They won't find pictures of me with friends and family. They will see posts I make on social and political issues. That's where I get my likes. I am creative with my posts and how I present issues - with graphics and stuff...and people like that. Gee, people must be really bored! But I do get a lot of likes on my political and social issues posts.

Right now I am very involved with Plastics Pollution Prevention and policies around that. Most of my FB posts are about that.

DechanDawa: I think we've come in full circle here and you seem to know what's best for yourself better than anyone else. So then I'd say follow your heart. Good luck.

Of course, take care of yourself. Golden Eve said that, maybe on another thread.

With my sister, I deeply want her to care for me and feel bad for having hurt me. She’s obviously not going to. I didn’t officially end anything. Just really, none of them care.

You may want to look at the whole relationship with your friend. Has she been very hurtful time and again? Is this something that can be repaired?

With my friend that I no longer speak to, she was very toxic for a long time and there was no repairing it. She refused to have any respect for me. I had to block her because she was harassing me with texts. Then she never called again to apologize because she also truly didn’t care.

This may or may not be the case with your friend.

Hmm. Thanks, I think? I mean...I have been following my heart all along. It's a journey...with many twists and turns. If recovery from narcissistic abuse was easy the Internet wouldn't be filled with hundreds of sites devoted to it.

My friend is "covert" which means she is mostly very nice. Her manipulation is...in the form of interfering and giving unsolicited advice and treating me like a victim of life...which I am not. Of course, she never apologizes.

I sympathize with you regarding your sister. My sister was out-of-touch with me for several years (cruelly) then she became terminally ill. Suddenly she was back in touch and insisted on a big family reunion (of adult siblings) before she died. It was horrific! I tried to get out of it but my niece called me and practically threatened me...to insist I show up. She even paid for my travel expenses which because of distance were quite expensive. This required me to interface with several other toxic members of my family.

My sister did not change -- even up into the end. Gave me nothing. Nothing. It was so painful. There she was...near death and on palliative chemo...chain-smoking (My God) and drinking coffee...and spouting off her usual crap. And I thought, "My God...even on death's door they don't change." During this time I was being bullied by other toxic siblings who showed up.

It sounds like I didn't love my sister. I did. But in the end...she gave nothing. Nothing. She just drifted off on the waves of her own lifelong self-absorption.

Try to detach from your sister a bit. It's not worth it to be hurt by someone who simply...doesn't care.

SORRY FOR THE DOUBLE POST WHICH I CANNOT SEEM TO DELETE. I DON'T KNOW ABOUT OTHERS BUT I HAVE BEEN HAVING A LOT OF TECHNICAL PROBLEMS WITH THIS SITE THIS WEEK.


My friend is "covert" which means she is mostly very nice. Her manipulation is...in the form of interfering and giving unsolicited advice and treating me like a victim of life...which I am not. Of course, she never apologizes.

I sympathize with you regarding your sister. My sister was out-of-touch with me for several years (cruelly) then she became terminally ill. Suddenly she was back in touch and insisted on a big family reunion (of adult siblings) before she died. It was horrific! I tried to get out of it but my niece called me and practically threatened me...to insist I show up. She even paid for my travel expenses which because of distance were quite expensive. This required me to interface with several other toxic members of my family.

My sister did not change -- even up into the end. Gave me nothing. Nothing. It was so painful. There she was...near death and on palliative chemo...chain-smoking (My God) and drinking coffee...and spouting off her usual crap. And I thought, "My God...even on death's door they don't change." During this time I was being bullied by other toxic siblings who showed up.

It sounds like I didn't love my sister. I did. But in the end...she gave nothing. Nothing. She just drifted off on the waves of her own lifelong self-absorption.

Try to detach from your sister a bit. It's not worth it to be hurt by someone who simply...doesn't care.

Leaving this thread open as it has struck a chord.

I invite others to share their experiences.

There is no "right" or "wrong" way to deal with this kind of situation.

We are all trying to heal.

[QUOTE=DechanDawa;6532333]Well, I live by the rule of thumb that to keep my power, I have to block the person from my life. Sure, he could easily "friend" my friends on Facebook if he wants to, to get access to me that way (so he can trash talk me to my friends). But I'm not worried because I have more faith in my friends' loyalty to me and protecting me from him.

I'm a very intuitive person so I can respect that psychic connection that you have with this friend whom you've known for 50 years. I also suspect you don't want to deal with the fallout, of the hundreds of mutual friendships and acquaintances who would become aware that you and your friend disconnected.

It's par for the course, however, when you disconnect from a toxic person that there will be interpersonal fallout, whether it's on a familial or workplace, or social level. You can't just end a friendship and not have the world know about it. Someone in your mutual social circles will find out. But, that is inevitable.

I'm not going to let the narcissist stay friends with me on Facebook. I will never unblock him again. I blocked him from my cellphone number and email address. I don't care about his feelings. I don't care if he feels satisfaction that I blocked him. I have my power back, by blocking him. If I left him on my Facebook page, he would still have access to me and I won't let that happen.

I read about the grey-rock method of not reacting to narcissists. The articles I read, suggest a combination of using the grey rock method and blocking the narcissist from all social media, email and cellphones. The fact that the narcissist tried to hook me with "What happened?" as soon as I unblocked him from my Facebook, shows me that it wasn't safe for me to keep him even hidden on my Facebook page b/c he'd still have access to my life.

I don't care if he tries to trash talk me to our mutual acquaintances or tries to ruin my reputation. The people who know me, who like me, won't let him do that. And the people who don't know me, who like him, will believe him. Either way, I've cut off access to him by blocking him, so I'm feeling confident I won't have to ever deal with him again, even on a psychic level anymore.

I wish you the best of luck with your friend of 50 years. I also follow Buddhism and believe every living thing is connected on a metaphysical level. But, that doesn't mean we are required to compassionately stay connected to a source of toxicity -- esp. if that source is a person who is out to harm us.

[QUOTE=StreetcarBlanche;6532488]



Wait a minute. Did you unfriend that person on FB? Is that the same as blocking? I mean if you...yeah, unfriend someone and block them then they are gone. I am not sure why you went on and on about this person here. You keep talking about him. You see, energetically you have not let go. It seems like maybe you should delete your FB account altogether as it appears to be a source of problems for you.

Buddhist metaphysics teaches interconnectedness. It is simply a FACT that we are all interconnected. Truly the only way to heal...from the Buddhist perspective...is to extend compassion. Buddhists always extend compassion even to their enemies.

But I was not talking about Buddhist practice but rather Buddhist metaphysics. In truth the teachings on Buddhism can be pretty unrealistic in real life. Buddhism is not a very self-protective religion and historically has not respected women's rights.

I want to avoid drama while disconnecting from my friend. I don't want to stir up a big hornet's nest of vindictiveness. So in that respect I am a bit Buddhist, I guess, though mostly lapsed.

I believe Grey Rock Technique can be applied energetically. I had a situation of a very abusive relationship ending and a bit of stalking. People advised me to get a restraining order, change my number, change the locks on my door, buy a gun etc. Finally...I did nothing. Absolutely nothing. I didn't change my number or do any of that other stuff. I simply applied a Grey Rock mentality. I just moved on with my life.

I applied Grey Rock by detaching from all the relationship drama and went on with my life...and it worked. The person eventually just faded away.

It was much more peaceful than a lot of the drama everyone else was suggesting.