How do you get the courage to apply for jobs at all? I'm going to have a problem after I graduate next May because I just can't apply for anything. Anything I'm interested in, I'm not qualified for. I also hate the fact that I'm going to have to move back home because it's the only place I might be able to make a few bucks (literally) on a job I like. I doubt I'll ever make enough money to live on my own. Which means never dating or anything...

That's bothering me more and more. It's hard enough to imagine dating anyway, but if I do, I'm forced to date people I'm not really interested in or I have to stay away from my parents, so they don't know anything about who I date. But it doesn't matter anyway, as I couldn't find someone who's interested in me that I'm interested in. Those people literally don't exist. And then there's the problem of I can't and won't admit that I'm attracted to someone as it always gets a negative response.

And sorry I don't have any more words of wisdom or suggestions today...

[shortandcute]

Hi everyone! I was diagnosed with social phobia but my therapist thinks there's a chance it's probobly avoidant personality disorder. The social phobia is still on my M.H. records, tho. Anyway, just wanted to say HI.

[two sons]

Hi everyone,
I am really sorry I don't post much. To be honest, I read your posts every day (several times a day), but responding is really not easy for me. So I think it probably appears that I am not a very supportive or caring person and I am really sorry.

Today I am struggling to stay out of the bed. My tdoc wants me to go to sleep at 10 p.m. and get up at 6 a.m. According to tdoc more sleep than 8 hours can be too much. Well, this is probably the hardest assignment tdoc has ever given me and I am totally failing, as usual.

Originally Posted by shortandcute

Hi everyone! I was diagnosed with social phobia but my therapist thinks there's a chance it's probobly avoidant personality disorder. The social phobia is still on my M.H. records, tho. Anyway, just wanted to say HI.

Hello! To my understanding there are a lot of similarities between the two. But whatever your diagnosis ends up being, feel free to come back and post again.

Originally Posted by two sons

Hi everyone,
I am really sorry I don't post much. To be honest, I read your posts every day (several times a day), but responding is really not easy for me. So I think it probably appears that I am not a very supportive or caring person and I am really sorry.

Today I am struggling to stay out of the bed. My tdoc wants me to go to sleep at 10 p.m. and get up at 6 a.m. According to tdoc more sleep than 8 hours can be too much. Well, this is probably the hardest assignment tdoc has ever given me and I am totally failing, as usual.

Nah...you don't appear unsupportive at all. I think everyone here understands it's difficult sometimes for people to post and sometimes too difficult to post at all.

I don't know what to tell you about sleep...I usually have the opposite problem and am wide awake for most of the night.

But anyway, I don't remember if I mentioned it before on this thread or not that I'm attempting online dating and maybe this time I won't delete my profile (for like the hundredth time). I've struggled enough at just being truthful about my orientation (or at least what's the most correct now).

What's even harder is writing a profile. It's not that I can't write...I'm good at writing. I just can't write about myself. It all sounds stupid and/or untrue. Or at least it doesn't sound believable.

And I certainly can't write messages to other people. Nope. If there's someone I'm interested in, I can't ever imagine them being interested in me.

[Lamplighter]

Hi all again - hope everyone is coping ok with, maybe even enjoying (?) the new year.

I seem to have done a major plummet recently and am struggling getting myself on an even keel so am not posting as much as I might otherwise.

Had a thought about this thread which might be helpful to AvPD'ers and well anyone who struggles to post generally - practise using this thread to post something about yourself. Don't feel obligated to write supportive stuff and don't feel bad for having comments about yourself seemingly 'hanging' for all the world to read - it really is good practise in overcoming this infernal need to withdraw obliterate our traces disappear...

Orange Moira was that the British Doctor Who you were watching? Just wondered if there was a US version

ShortandCute welcome here, hope you can bring yourself to post more about yourself

Two Sons good luck with trying to sleep less, I'm more like Iate I'd love to be able to sleep the might AND day away (mind you getting up really late always depresses me so it's a catch-22 really.)

IATE good luck to you too with online dating - yeah it's hard writing positive stuff about oneself - I hope you do manage a glowing profile and that you leave it up. Well done you anyway for attempting it I think that's great!

Happy New Year everyone

I don't see how it's going to be successful seeing as no one (at least not of the correct gender) have sent me a message and I can't send others messages.

Actually, I feel like I can't post anything anywhere...I want to post things in the creative forum...like music recordings or poetry or prose. Or even plays...I've done it all. I'm too afraid to post anything though.

It's the same with the website I'm making for my future composing/arranging business...everything I write and do just seem dumb. And I don't know what I'm doing when it comes to websites! I'm so overwhelmed right now and school hasn't even started up again!

Back to the dating problem, every time I visit my profile the worse I feel about it... Like I want to puke every time I see the word "Gay" next to my picture. I think it's going to go...or I'm going back to "straight" and will just have to talk to guys.

[OrangeMoira]

Hi! I had an interview and offer for a temporary assignment today! 12 weeks!! I'm so excited! My stomach feels really sick, though. I will journal tomorrow (tonight if I'm not too exhausted) and try to slow down the worries to look at them. My head's kinda spinning. I start Monday.

I.Am.The.End, I was too afraid to even go to my graduation. When it came down to it, I really needed a break from people. Then I had to use tools I know have helped before, like journalling/meditation/exercise/affirmations/reading about mental illness. I had to chip away at the big block in my brain for five months alone in a room before I could make my brain flexible enough to believe I could try for jobs. I still haven't applied or even looked for full time jobs in my field. One entry level clerical job, which I was qualified for 15 years ago with no school. Two temp volunteer jobs. And those are victories--really! I'm just trying bit by bit and trying everything I can to help myself.

I always wished there was someone to sit and listen to me complain about how hard it was and reassure me while I did applications. If you ever have that wish and think it will help you look for jobs, feel free to PM me!! Anything I can do to help.

Also, I'm bisexual and happy about it! But I think all queer people go through hard times figuring out their identity. But keep the label or chuck it: it's your life! Good luck on your dating endeavors. Always an adventure online!! Yes, it's harder if you don't post on anyone else's...it'll take a bit more time that way, but you're bound to meet someone!! Everyone likes musicians...I should know; I married one.

Hi shortandcute! Your name makes me smile!!

Two sons, I feel rotten if I have less than 9 hours of sleep. I think I feel less depressed, but more anxious. And my preferred sleeping time would be 1am-10am. Doesn't mean it's ideal...good luck shifting your schedule!

By the way, I'll have been on this site for five years in February and I lurked for two (I think) years before that. I only broke 100 posts last year, and just hit 254! It was just hard to post, to feel "seen" by people and exposed. I would regret what I did post and agonize over it. If I disappear for 6 months it's because I'm having trouble, not because I don't care. So I get where you're coming from, I think! I sure don't think you're unsupportive.

And speaking of worries about posting, sorry about all the novels. I just can't stop myself... My brain says if I explain something part-way someone might misunderstand me and get upset at me, so I have to keep explaining. Ugh, sorry!! Not that realistic, brain!!

Torn, yes, it's British Doctor Who. I get all but the latest season on Netflix online. Love it, but it's always so sad!! Good reminder that we can just post observations on the daily thread and don't have to feel obligated to respond or be supportive. Thanks! Is that one of the issues you've had with posting less lately? Or is it just the need to withdraw? Hope you're feeling better today. Take it easy on yourself!!

Originally Posted by OrangeMoira

I.Am.The.End, I was too afraid to even go to my graduation. When it came down to it, I really needed a break from people. Then I had to use tools I know have helped before, like journalling/meditation/exercise/affirmations/reading about mental illness. I had to chip away at the big block in my brain for five months alone in a room before I could make my brain flexible enough to believe I could try for jobs. I still haven't applied or even looked for full time jobs in my field. One entry level clerical job, which I was qualified for 15 years ago with no school. Two temp volunteer jobs. And those are victories--really! I'm just trying bit by bit and trying everything I can to help myself.

I always wished there was someone to sit and listen to me complain about how hard it was and reassure me while I did applications. If you ever have that wish and think it will help you look for jobs, feel free to PM me!! Anything I can do to help.

Also, I'm bisexual and happy about it! But I think all queer people go through hard times figuring out their identity. But keep the label or chuck it: it's your life! Good luck on your dating endeavors. Always an adventure online!! Yes, it's harder if you don't post on anyone else's...it'll take a bit more time that way, but you're bound to meet someone!! Everyone likes musicians...I should know; I married one.

I've already graduated before, so I know I have no trouble with that. And none of the jobs I actually want are jobs you apply/interview for (unless you include auditioning). If you're a composer (which I am) you just go get commissions and actually you need someone to "promote" you if you want to write for college wind ensembles (where the money is...and what I like doing, at least when I'm not doing 4 pieces at once on top of all the other commissioned stuff). I also want to be in/start a band. I don't know how to go about that as I'd have to be close to those people/really trust them in order to actually write songs (I'm referring to a rock band specifically in this case). If I go back to live in my hometown, I can get spots in a mariachi band and a jazz band by name recognition only (anywhere else I'd probably have to audition). I don't really want to move back though...I don't know. I don't feel like I have a choice anymore.

I know one thing—if I move back to my hometown, I'm not dating. Ever. I'll probably never date wherever I am but it is 100% certain if I'm that close to my parents and the worst homophobes (two different groups of people) in the US, I will never date. Although I doubt I'd be able to have any music performed in that town (especially if people find out I'm not straight) as every concert will be picketed and people won't be able to get in. It's not like I think these people are going to physically hurt me, I just don't want an angry mob following me around. Guess if I move back home, I'll have to marry a dude.

I'm not sure you understand my position here...if I have any level of fame at all (which I will unless I completely leave music as I already have a little) I can't date without ruining my career. Unless of course I only date guys.

I might take you up on that PM offer though.

[Lamplighter]

Aw brilliant Moira about the job! Well done you and I'm so glad for you . Hey it sounds like you really do know and understand your own internal set up and are determined to deal with it - you must be feeling a bit proud of yourself for what you've achieved? I would if I were you .

My brain says if I explain something part-way someone might misunderstand me and get upset at me, so I have to keep explaining

Snap! I find myself getting really pedantic and saying the same thing five times but with subtle word variations. Then I read other people's posts and think, how come I can't manage short and to the point????? Comes of always being misunderstood so I now go overboard trying to make sure I'm REALLY CLEAR in what I'm trying to convey. LOL.

I'm posting less than I normally would dunno why really. Maybe the need to withdraw a bit, more like yeah I do feel obligated to respond to every thread I read (which is impossible!) and feel really bad if I don't reply and usually that's ok because I want to talk to people, want to be supportive and have that people contact, but sometimes when things go a bit haywire in my brain (like now) it all feels like too much and I suffer big guilt trips about it. It's not quite as simple as 'learning to say no' but along those lines. Maybe. Wouldn't be so bad if the motives were truly altruistic but there's a lot of self interest involved, so the guilt really has a field day .

I.Am.The.End it sounds like going home is not a good idea . Do you really think you'll end up doing that? I hope not for your sake. If you have this much success as a musician and have such ambition as you describe, I can't help but think that your dating issues are less to do with your avoidant fears and more to do with your gender doubts/fears (that's what it sounds like anyway.) It must be frightening to think that because of your orientation your career is under threat. I hope you can find a way of resolving that dilemma soon.

As for me, don't know what's wrong with my head recently but I'm feeling very alienated and alone and cut off from the world. I'd like to withdraw but cutting off from people scares me even more than being around them, what a hellish no win situation

[OrangeMoira]

I was just having a serious crisis; reading this thread and responding took me down a lot! So nice to connect. Hope it's helpful for others, too. I think I will make a separate post about the issue I had today so I don't get off-topic!

IATE, sounds like you really are between a rock and a hard place. If you move home, you can perform in bands and make money, but you would need to hide your identity for safety. If you don't move home, there is no guarantee that you can find steady work, but you would have more freedom in your personal life. I'm sorry you come from such a hateful community; it's understandable that you have conflicts about your own feelings now.

Do you think that if you were able to move to a more accepting community you might also find a more vibrant artistic community? Hate to over-generalize, but the sort of communities with rampant homophobia are not usually centers of artistic expression! If you didn't move home and managed to make a living somehow, couldn't you have your success and your personal life? Lots of musicians have a day job for a paycheck--is that a compromise you don't want to or definitely cannot make? I know working a job you hate can kind of drain your artistic expression! Then again, hiding who you are (if who you love/date is important to your ideas about yourself) could be an obstacle, too. Hugs to you. That really is a tough situation. Thanks for explaining better.

Torn, I have a book called "the book of no," and I love it--try to flip through it every few months to remind myself that I have a right to set limits. I think AvPDers usually have problems being assertive. I wonder whether most of us with those traits also feel over-responsible for others? It stinks to have one part of your brain want to help others and one part of your brain want to run from others. For me, I think it's partly my poor inner concept that drives me to make up for my "badness" by helping other people; I think it's the only way to make up for it.

BTW, I don't think your posts here come across as pedantic (I hope it's helpful to hear a third party giving a different viewpoint and it's not invalidating--because it was also nice to hear that you understand the feeling!).

[Blue Coral]

Hi all, Happy New Year! I haven't been checking in because all I have been doing is working or sleeping, or trying to sleep (having some trouble there lately so I am exhausted).

OrangeMoira about working retail-for me it i think it helped. It was NEVER easy but being forced to interact with people I think was good for me.

Take care everyone, I'll try to check in more often.

[Lamplighter]

Hi BlueCoral nice to see you still posting, good one .

I'm just checking in, feeling absolutely rubbish things are just getting out of hand right now - I always freak out when I lose sight of what I can be doing to help myself, and it now feels like I'm back to square one and nothing has changed. This just goes on and on and on and I can't seem to make myself better no matter what I do. Times like this I hate being me and get really scared at being inside my own head so the less time I'm alone with my thoughts the better

[CaptainArgh]

Hey all, I'm CaptainArgh. Checking in

Well, I'm back in school, just made it through my first week and it was horrible. I'm alone 70-80% of the time and so when I'm actually around people I'm too uncomfortable to interact, so I don't hardly interact. I don't participate in any of that social networking crap that other people seem to be so into, so no matter what I do, I'm always going to out of the loop and everyone is going to think I'm a loser.

That's fine. Even if I had friends, it'd be a fake friendship. They would never actually get to know me. They all push me away at some point (usually pretty hard) so it's better not to get emotionally invested in people at all.

I'm just done. If this is what my life is going to be, then I'm going to keep wishing that the universe puts me out of my misery. What did I do to deserve feeling like this ALL THE TIME?! Where it never gets better and there's no hope. I give up. I just wish I could go through with offing myself, but noooo.

So pathetic that my social life is spent waiting around for someone to reply to my messages on various message boards...and even worse how I can never stay in one place very long as I either get kicked out or everyone gets tired of me.

[Lamplighter]

I'm so sorry IATE that your first week back at school was so crap. I take it they were all new people and not anyone you'd met last year already? For what it's worth I don't think hanging around message boards is pathetic - forums have been my lifeline for a couple of years now and I really appreciate having at least that level of people contact - even if I don't post so much it's nice to read other people's messages and get a sense of vicarious belonging that way.

I haven't posted here in a little while, seem to be spreading myself a bit thin at the moment, running to stand still kind of feeling. As it's a check in thread I thought I'd check in with myself and remind myself that at the moment therapy is going bloody brilliantly and so I'm feeling a whole lot more positive hopeful optimistic and basically just BETTER than I have for a very long time. Which doesn't make me any less scared of other people and their perceived negative reactions to me, but maybe a bit easier to cope with them when it happens.

No, they're all people I know...there may be one or two new people who I haven't really been around before, but the rest are people I know.

What kind of therapy is actually working? Is he/she a specialist? I always found that in therapy they either didn't understand or they just humiliated me.

[Lamplighter]

IATE If they are people you already know, would that not make it easier to relate to them (as opposed to total strangers with whom you have to be more on guard because they're an unknown quantity?)

I take it you're not a fan of therapy then? Up until my latest T I'd have agreed with you - especially on the didn't understand front. What has helped I think, is the fact that I'm now seeing an experienced clinical psychologist whereas all the Ts before that were just bog standard not terribly widely experienced or deep counsellor-style therapists (though they liked to call themselves psychotherapists.)

I have read that CBT and other behaviourally based approaches are quite useful for AvPD - personally CBT is anathema to me with its emphasis on 'challenging'. What's helping me is the fact that my T is focusing on the relationship between us, trying to establish trust first (a very tall order that one!), and though she is trained in CBT modalities, she's adapting her approach to suit what I need and not vice versa. Really it's a question of shopping around until you find the right 'fit'. It's also a question of being committed to healing - being avoidant makes it a bit too easy to quit therapy (or any relationship) the moment it gets difficult or painful or uncomfortable, and being able to stick it out with a decent T is the key factor in its working. Actually that applies across the board, not just in AvPD

Sorry for the lecture, it's just that I've only really just started with this T (20 sessions so far at twice a week) and am really over the moon at how positively it's going, so I'm a bit of an advocate for therapy at the moment.

On that note though, as my check in for the day, I'm really pissed off that I got a flat tyre today which meant I couldn't make my therapy session. While I'm not exactly attached, I still really wanted to see my T. Got to wait till Thursday now . Lol maybe I should be posting in the therapy forum. I never seem to have time at the moment to get to all the forums in which I'd like to post.

[two sons]

Hi everyone,
I have started this email numerous times - maybe this time I will not delete it! Sorry I have not been more active here. I really mean to post, but it's hard to crawl out of this old shell.

I also see a clinical psychologist weekly and I am totally dependent on those sessions and it really upsets my routine when tdoc has to cancel for some reason.

I absolutely dread this Thursday when I have my first appointment with a new pdoc. I know I am very difficult for these pdoc's and it just makes me feel bad to rehash all this craziness again with a new person.

[Lamplighter]

Glad you could bring yourself to post Two Sons! You have my sympathies re starting with a new Pdoc and having to tell your story all from scratch. I hope s/he is a good one and makes you feel comfortable and understood.

Good luck!

Originally Posted by Torn Mind

IATE If they are people you already know, would that not make it easier to relate to them (as opposed to total strangers with whom you have to be more on guard because they're an unknown quantity?)

I take it you're not a fan of therapy then? Up until my latest T I'd have agreed with you - especially on the didn't understand front. What has helped I think, is the fact that I'm now seeing an experienced clinical psychologist whereas all the Ts before that were just bog standard not terribly widely experienced or deep counsellor-style therapists (though they liked to call themselves psychotherapists.)

I have read that CBT and other behaviourally based approaches are quite useful for AvPD - personally CBT is anathema to me with its emphasis on 'challenging'. What's helping me is the fact that my T is focusing on the relationship between us, trying to establish trust first (a very tall order that one!), and though she is trained in CBT modalities, she's adapting her approach to suit what I need and not vice versa. Really it's a question of shopping around until you find the right 'fit'. It's also a question of being committed to healing - being avoidant makes it a bit too easy to quit therapy (or any relationship) the moment it gets difficult or painful or uncomfortable, and being able to stick it out with a decent T is the key factor in its working. Actually that applies across the board, not just in AvPD

Sorry for the lecture, it's just that I've only really just started with this T (20 sessions so far at twice a week) and am really over the moon at how positively it's going, so I'm a bit of an advocate for therapy at the moment.

On that note though, as my check in for the day, I'm really pissed off that I got a flat tyre today which meant I couldn't make my therapy session. While I'm not exactly attached, I still really wanted to see my T. Got to wait till Thursday now . Lol maybe I should be posting in the therapy forum. I never seem to have time at the moment to get to all the forums in which I'd like to post.

I'm just as nervous, if not more so around people I know, with the exceptions of a few. I think it's because they know things about me.

Sorry, I'm not going to be convinced that therapy will ever work, but it's good that it's working for you.

Originally Posted by two sons

Hi everyone,
I have started this email numerous times - maybe this time I will not delete it! Sorry I have not been more active here. I really mean to post, but it's hard to crawl out of this old shell.

I also see a clinical psychologist weekly and I am totally dependent on those sessions and it really upsets my routine when tdoc has to cancel for some reason.

I absolutely dread this Thursday when I have my first appointment with a new pdoc. I know I am very difficult for these pdoc's and it just makes me feel bad to rehash all this craziness again with a new person.

I feel for you there too...I don't think I could open up to anyone again, even though I will eventually to get my meds, but yeah...

I hope it goes well for you on Thursday.

And don't worry if you don't feel like posting, to be honest I haven't really been feeling like posting lately either.

In fact, I feel pretty bad. I feel so comfortable about being by myself that I feel uncomfortable and panicky when I'm around other people, especially if I know them and we're in a small space. As in someone is in my "personal space".

I'm having so many problems not self-harming.

My psychiatrist gave me a new med to try that supposed to help regulate the oscillations of my emotions so I don't get too low or high. Obviously it takes a while to kick in.

Mehhhh....

[two sons]

Hi everyone,
Well, I saw the new pdoc yesterday and it did not go well. I was so overwhelmed and anxious (after sitting in the waiting room) that I made an idiot out of myself. I sure wish my old pdoc was still here. It is so hard for me to talk to pdocs. New pdoc rx'd Prozac because I was able to communicate with her that I cannot afford Cymbalta anymore. Then I made the mistake of telling her about my suicidal thinking (tdoc tells me I fantasize about suicide and he is right) and pdoc thought I should go in the phosp! I said no way. Anyway, I did not do a good job of communicating with her other than telling her I am a no good, worthless, idiot.

Originally Posted by two sons

Hi everyone,
Well, I saw the new pdoc yesterday and it did not go well. I was so overwhelmed and anxious (after sitting in the waiting room) that I made an idiot out of myself. I sure wish my old pdoc was still here. It is so hard for me to talk to pdocs. New pdoc rx'd Prozac because I was able to communicate with her that I cannot afford Cymbalta anymore. Then I made the mistake of telling her about my suicidal thinking (tdoc tells me I fantasize about suicide and he is right) and pdoc thought I should go in the phosp! I said no way. Anyway, I did not do a good job of communicating with her other than telling her I am a no good, worthless, idiot.

I'm sorry it didn't go so well. I've been making an idiot of myself all week at school myself...

I don't like psychologists myself. The one I have now is at least one I feel I can trust...sort of. I feel really uncomfortable around her and I can't communicate with her either. It took until the last time I saw her to discuss my crazy mood swings (whether it's bipolar or a mood disorder etc.). It's unlikely that I'm bipolar, but I have some sort of mood disorder apparently...I think. She also told me what else I have and I don't remember if she mentioned AvPD. So I'm really confused...

[Puffyprue]

I am wondering anyone with AvPD has Control-Me syndrome?

[shortandcute]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa...!!!!!!!!!!@#$%^&*(

[beatles1234]

Hello everyone, it took me a while to gain enough courage to post this (I have the same issue every time I go to post something). I've been feeling like crap recently, constantly tired no matter how much sleep I get and everything has been so overwhelming though today I feel slightly better.