When I first started seeing him I was really impressed at how caring and in touch he seemed. After a couple of meeting he offered to get my son to come because that's a huge part of my problem. it didn't work out well - the first date he got stuck in a longer than normal court hearing. The second time I had raging pneumonia and was unaware of the appointment till they called - I dragged myself out of my deathbed to go - my son and the "dr" had already been talking for at least a half hour. I didn't stay long because I felt like about as bad as you can and still be walking. I had asked the receptionist (the doctor's wife) to tell them I did not want them meeting without me but she said they already were. I asked her to try to get them to stop and wait for me but I guess she couldn't. The next meeting when I was a little better no one told me about so AGAIN my son was there, just him and my therapist. And when I finally got back it was not my imagination that my therapist was no longer sensitive to me but cold and aloof. Then I find out the next day he has a private meeting with my son - when I asked they said it was about something besides me but I don't buy it. Either way, I think this was wrong, for one thing I feel defensive having been the topic of discussion but with no way to know what was said. The next meeting my son blew me off (but didn't say so ahead of time) said he didn't want to come I guess his 2 sessions with MY psychologist sort of took care of it for him. The last meeting I had with my psychologist he spent the first 15 minutes reading email then he left to go to the restroom. When he returned i told him about my distress and ongoing obsession with suicide. Basically the extent of his input was, as to my son "too bad it has to be that way" and after my having stated that I am closer to an actual plan - he indicated times up and on the way out he said "take care of yourself'.

Its it just me or is there something wrong with this picture. He hasn't made any suggestions to me about what to do or anything positive. Anyway I wrote him later after I got home and outlined my misgivings and told him i would not return and I have heard nothing from him since which is fine with me because now in addition to feeling betrayed by my son, i feel betrayed by someone who was supposed to help me. i don't see having private conversations with my son as helpful - even if it is about something else which I dout, it makes me feel compromised. Is this standard procedure? I suspect not.

What I feel was needed and what I hoped for was that the lines of communication which were broken as never before - could be opened again. Instead it seems that both of them have formed an alliance against me. Nothing has been done to help my son re-establish communication and today I told both my children i never want to see either of them again - but thats only because that reciprocates what they've done to me. I needed help on all those issues and they are all turning their back on me. Now I'm angry at everyone including the doctor which is part of my BPD problem anyway so the way i see it is that after seeing him about 2 months things are much worse about as bad as it can get. i won't ask my children again because it would put me on the same level as a beggar and as someone who was always there for them I'm just trying to wrap my mind around this huge abandonment I always dreaded. it's here and everything my life is totally destroyed what little was left.

[moriteaparty574]

I think the first step would be to find someone somewhere that can give you the emotional support you sorely need right now. Next when you feel a little more stable and clear headed discuss your concerns honestly with your therapist and express your concerns if he continues to be cold and aloof and unfeeling then find a different therapist. Due to my lack of experience with BPD there isn't much I can suggest apart from these two things that seem to be the most logical. I hope what little I have to offer is helpful. Good Luck

[Fuzzybear]

((((((( hugs )))))))

I no longer can put my faith in him. My inner self is sending out signals that every time I have ignored them I have regretted. Something ain't right. I've got to find someone new. After having pointed out my resentment of and the fact that it was unethical for my psychologist to meet in private with my son without my knowledge when I am his client and to continue to do so when i specifically stated I was opposed to it. Combined with his callous cold attitude, like i said, something ain't right.

[Fuzzybear]

Cold and callous is NEVER acceptable. Grrrrrr

Hugs

Well, this subject has proven very prophetic as it turns out from the events of the day which are very long i apologize, but it is unavoidable considering all the things that transpired today.

I have tried to make this print smaller but its not working for some reason, sorry.

My day today:


I have been lamenting and desperate and have written in several places here the separation (and my ensuing sadness and confusion and sense of being "lost") that has developed between my son and I. As a matter of fact, i called him last night and left a tearful message for him that i missed him and was sad about our distance. He is, btw 48 years old. Up until about 3 months ago we have always had a good relationship and could talk about most anything. Then he moved in with this "person" whom i do not like for several reasons including that he himself said last summer she was bad news and he wanted to get away from her but she bought him flowers and he felt guilty so they got back together seeing each other.

She has been pressuring him to move in with her for years - he finally capitulated. He acknowledged she was manipulative - telling him she was moving away so he would move in and several other ways she herself later admitted were to manipulate him. In addition she deliberately excluded me from a surprise birthday party she had for him last April. I said i was hurt at the time but typically rather than defend me and ask why she excluded me he just glossed over as is his habit leaving me to "deal with it". i said I wanted an apology which I was informed would not be forthcoming.

Which makes it all the more remarkable today that he made it clear he had constructed a list of people he had judged I NEEDED to apologize to as though who appointed him the judge of me. He refused to acknowledge that I was hurt by being excluded by his new "THING" which made him feel righteous to have this list of people he decided I NEEDED to apologize to.

He seems to be of the opinion that it is my conduct that is unforgivably manipulative - which it has not been meant to be - it was part of the BPD. He seems to have gotten over her acknowledged manipulation but totally unwilling to give me any credit at all.


Anyway, there has been a growing distance, like my life usually goes, bad timing, since around Christmas. I bought him a new bicycle which was over $300 - a huge expenditure for me, the most expensive thing i ever got him. I wanted to send a message, that he is worth better than he's gotten, the leftovers of what he has after paying a ransom sum of child support. He has always liked bike riding since he got his with training wheels and just about grew up on bikes except to sleep. his bike was old and beat up - incredibly - he showed no interest in it at all - my other son was the one who opened the box to look at it. On hearing some of the details he said he liked his old style better blah blah - the tires, the handlebars, etc. it was very unlike him to be so ungrateful he wasn't brought up that way.

it did hurt my feelings very much. Trust me that with my income this was like I said huge for me as i struggle to make ends meet on a fixed income. I was nevertheless happy to spend it and not at all questioning my decision to spend such a huge sum. At least not until it became how uncharacteristically ungrateful he was - I had been so excited to give it to him but it was a huge disappointment for me and set the stage for our growing distance. me feeling hurt and he being totally unapologetic for his lack of appreciation. i did not expect him to fall at my feet but i certainly did not expect the indifference - his brother was the one who opened the box - he was the one who listed the shortcomings of his gift.

He couldn't wait to get away on Christmas day, lying about having forgotten a gift or his granddaughter when it became clear he had gone not for the forgotten gift but to retrieve and show up at a later family gathering with his person that unbeknownst to me he had moved in with. I had stated i did not want to be around her and would not invite her to my home so his surreptitious activity bringing her to a gathering at his daughter/my granddaughter's house that day knowing that i didn't want to see her was disrespectful.

Its my feeling he should have had the character, if that's what he chose, to be honest, to say he had decided to include her and leave me free to go or not but instead he was 'sneaky' about it. Its not a matter of whether I'm right to choose to distance myself - its my choice and his choice who he lives with --- the issue was his flagrant disregard and lies.


Anyway since that time i have been sick with not just an ongoing severe depression lasting for years, in addition severe "raging" pneumonia as my doctor put it and just when I was getting over that I sprained my ankle (still over 2 weeks later swollen and in need of mending) which has laid me up under doctors orders to keep it elevated so it kept me sitting with plenty time (too much time) to think. I could not distract myself as usual by doing some project or whatever.


During the course of all this my son adamantly refused to come to visit or help in any way. i told him earlier that I wish for Christmas he had given me, if i could choose a gift (he got me nothing but that was ok I don't need anything and he has a tight budget) - I would choose an hour of his time to come and just sit with me like the old days, just him and me. he never acknowledged my request. The last I heard his new bike was still in the box. he also owes me $10 which he refuses to pay which is also unlike him.


I have BPD, which has heretofore been more or less latent but recent developments have brought it out shocking even me -- and I have tried to educate him about what it involves. i have emailed him info, as well as taking the trouble to send info thru the mail. When i asked he said he did not look at it which sends a clear message to me that I am not important - I thought in addition that it was rude and dismissive. He has not been exposed to this before and in fact it is a startling development to me as i have never had such extreme volatility - but it is clear to me it is due to the subject matter which began the whole thing, my unresolved anger at my mother. in truth it took me decades to realize there was anything wrong on the part of my mother and that it was "me"..


During the past few months our relationship has seriously deteriorated. I was under the impression that he just did not understand the BPD nor what I was struggling with and that if I could explain he would return to his formerly supportive self. He knows I have had depression from the time he was young so its nothing new but the BPD diagnosis is. I think the BPD came to the surface as a result of his ignoring my pleas, which frustrates me, getting no response I escalated what i said to try to get a response and the longer he ignored me the more hateful my messages. I do not like what I said nor do i approve yet I understand how it came about. it is a side of me that was as much a shock to me as to him. We got in this cycle of me going thru various emotional states none of which seem to motivate him to help. I went from sad/crying and talking about remembering the precious times when he was little, reminding him i had always been there emotionally for him (which my own mother was very cold and detached and actually not just distant but vindictive and punitive if I dared not do as she wanted always, even after graduating high school. I also went thru periods of extreme anger and rage which as i read is part of the BPD thing. I'm not proud of it but like other diseases its not something I set out to have.


he totally turned away from me and seemed to think he was practicing TOUGH LOVE.


We had met once at my psychologist's office whom i hoped could help us get some sort of communication and understanding going on but then I got the pneumonia and the short of it was I met with him at the psychologist once when I had the pneumonia and was so sick I had to leave. Before I got there the psychologist went against my wishes and began the appt just with my son. The next appt I wasn't advised of and so now we have almost 2 hours of he and my son meeting together. The next meeting he told me he didn't care to come anymore. Meanwhile I noticed a significant shift in attitude from the psychologist - very unsympathetic, very uncommunicative and unsupportive offering no solutions just saying it was too bad my son and i were apart but that's the way it was. he was also dismissive of my ongoing thoughts of suicide and told me at our last appt to "take care of myself". I realized something was amiss and decided to quit seeing him and wrote an email telling him why which he never responded to. Then I learned that he was still meeting with my son - but he said about something else, either way, I think it was unethical to do so especially when i specifically stated I did not want it to continue. He ignored me, never responded and continued to meet with my son.


Monday night it was odd and uncharacteristic of the past 3 months or so, i thought, my son called numerous times, maybe 5 or so, asking me would i meet him at the psychologist office and I told him no and why but he kept pressuring me. i told him to forget it i no longer trust him nor do i feel comfortable sharing any info with him being present. he called me again around noon again asking would I go. All of this was quite odd as he's been fairly well ignoring me and showing no interest in getting together despite my pleas. finally I called my son and i said i would meet with him but not at the doctor's office. So we agreed on a restaurant between his work and where i live. We had not been together for months - I got there first and I was nervous and i thought how odd, that this son i have known for over 45 years that I should be so nervous meeting him and how sad that was. When my son came in it was very awkward. i had determined to try to take a positive tone, not challenging him just trying to reach out as we used to but he began immediately accusing me of lying, he said things like "your broken leg looks fine to me I see nothing wrong" I said it was not broken it was sprained and he said you told me it was broken. I said I did initially before going to the hospital but there I found it was a severe sprain but he said NO YOU DIDN'T. I knew what I told him. He was being totally unpleasant telling me I needed to apologize and basically reading me the riot act so i told him to leave as i did not care to discuss anything with him in the accusatory manner he was in. i acknowledged to him I had said hurtful things but I also said that it was at least partially due to his ignoring me which provoked me to say something to get him to respond, etc. So I admitted my part in the distance but for him it was totally my fault and everything i said he would say "no you didn't". After he left he called me a couple times and said, we can talk again but not if you are going to be hateful. And i said it was his attitude that started the unpleasantness and again he said no it wasn't. i said this is stupid i don't want to argue with you. i left the restaurant in about 10 minutes as I had ordered a hamburger. It really didn't taste good but I wasn't going to waste it especially as it was meat which i rarely eat but when i do I think that since it involved an animal that it was sinful to waste. Anyway when i got outside i was surprised to see my son's car still there two spaces from mine. I was out of the mood to meet with him and went to my car, i felt afraid of him and i wanted to go home. he was on the phone when I went out but he hung up. Anyway when i opened my car door he would not let me get in and I said for him to get away from me but he refused. Finally I said ok then I will call 911 and you can deal with the police because technically he was guilty of unlawfully interfering and depriving me of my freedom. Which phased him not. Finally I managed to get into the car when he walked away but he came back and brazenly tried to grab my car keys. I will never, i think in my life, forget the feeling of his hands restraining me, trying to grab my car keys.

By now i was totally taken aback by his brazen behavior which he has never done before. it turns out he had called the police before I did and that the whole thing was a setup for the police to get there under the guise that i needed to go into a mental facility against my will. My mother did the same thing to me in the same manner NOT TO HELP but as retribution for crossing her. And here is my son who turned cold and abusive now doing the same as my mother - he had not tried to help, had not said anything at all if he believed I was depressed and needed help he certainly showed no concern or empathy so it seemed clear to me it was vindictive and to dispose of me.

Luckily the police officer was not heavy-handed - we talked at length and he said I seemed in control and not in need of going to the facility. Meanwhile my son was filling the other officer's head with the worst he could dredge up showing him mean email (but none of the conciliatory ones on my part). It became clear to me then why he had pushed me to meet at the psychologist office, the two of them connived together to "put me away". needless to say I was offended at his plotting against me. The officer said he probably just was worried about me but i said i don't believe that because he has been totally distant and cold, he never came to me with anything but coldness.

After an hour or so I was "allowed" to leave and go home. In that time, though, it was hard for me to realize my son had plotted against me. I do not believe it was to be helpful because if he was concerned for me he showed nothing of that only a need to control and get even. it was hurtful realizing that but in a way it set me free. Because i had been thinking my son just did not understand and that if I kept trying to communicate he would finally hear what i was saying when the truth was the person who did not understand was me.


I did not realize that my son had turned so totally against me and vindictive and hateful, that is not my imagination. To think that he had plotted with this psychologist who I did not know that well but I was his client not my son. it occurred to me that my son was dead. The son I had been hoping to connect with did not exist any longer. And it has set me free. i have no desire to contact him in anyway nor do I wish to see him or know anything about him. I do not care what he does or with whom, i am free of him.


This is all sort of mind blowing, that within 3 months we have come to this. But it was revealing and I felt a sense of peace come over me ever since. The rage i felt is gone, replaced with sadness but i am at peace, as much as i can be it was as though my son died today. And i did send him that one email simply stating that it was a sad day in that I found out my son was dead.


And that is the end of it. it was shocking, i could not believe he would be so deceitful and plotting. i told you he had spent far more time with the psychologist and me not there to know what was said. i plan on filing a complaint against the psychologist as i had stated specifically i did not want them meeting.


The whole thing was a nefarious scheme. originally I had opened this can of worms, it became clear, hoping to find the acceptance and love and support of my son I never got from my mother. In reality what i got was a re-affirmation of her judgment of me that as she told me quite clearly when i was younger that I was not the kind of person anyone would be drawn to so whoever was nice to me I should not make waves. Which is probably how i ended up in such abusive relationships.


Do you see the irony, that i wished to "deal with" my hurt and unacknowledged feelings of anger toward my mother so i could put it behind me and what i got was almost a duplication of what she did - she too had me locked up when i was almost 18 as a vindictive move, she came to gloat when I was locked up at the state mental hospital which was not a helpful place it was a warehouse.


i am at once lost sort of with this new realization but i am also free because i realize there is nothing I can do or say to reach my son again, he has proven himself a bold, rude, audacious traitor. And I do believe it was helpful - i did not need to be locked up i needed to feel his support which was denied me. now that i see his true character - i am free of the anger and hurt and rage which has been so pervasive for these many months. Which proves he was wrong - he did not want to help me, he wanted to get me somewhere that i could not contact him, where i was "safe" and out of the way - and wash his hands of me.


What an incredible earth-moving day but also a day of being set free. I do believe that had i not listened to "my voice" and had instead gone to meet at the psychologist office that i would be locked up now. That the two of them together would have had the greater credibility - me being 'crazy' and all. And if they had been successful I do not think i would have ever recovered from the duplicity, the physical aggression, the deviousness of what they obviously had planned.


This has been one of the strangest days of my life, my son that i have adored forever is gone.


I could say much more about the things my mother did to me but this is long enough already but suffice it to say she was a cruel physically and emotionally abusive person, vindictive, manipulative (including faking heart attacks to get sympathy as a way of inducing guilt).

I do not believe, ultimately, he meant to be helpful because if I was as "sick" as he made me out to be he should not have been so callous. Apparently in his mind people can be mentally ill/depressed but that they get no allowance whatsoever if they are. They get judged mentally unsound yet incredibly deserving of no help or consideration. That is what is so revealing (but sad) to me.


I realize this is long and I apologize but the earth shattering life altering events of the day - I wanted to document and explain. I wanted to share my sadness but the first peace of mind I have felt in months. Which proves I did not need to be LOCKED AWAY - i need to remember that feeling any time i might begin to feel sad we are not together so that it will help me keep this feeling of peaceful freedom, albeit bittersweet. I know that for the rest of my life i will never forget the memory and the feel of being physically restrained by my son shall never leave me.

[Sinking Feeling]

I just hope your not paying any money for this. I certainly wouldn't.

Originally Posted by Sinking Feeling

I just hope your not paying any money for this. I certainly wouldn't.

You were incredibly generous to have sloshed thru everything I wrote above, I do wish it wasn't so long but i wanted to make the whole thing as clear as possible.

Money for the counseling? I have paid just what the insurance paid and no more, thankfully. If that's what you are referring to, i too would be very opposed to paying anything to help the person who I contacted to help me who seems to have incredibly ended up colluding with my son. I still find it hard to believe that he did that. It is nothing i would have ever anticipated. But i do remember telling a friend that i did not want to go because a little voice (the one we all have and sometimes listen to and sometimes not) told me I was right in my feelings of loss of confidence and inability to feel comfortable talking with him or entrusting him with any further confidences in the future.

It does occur to me that the tendency would be for people including the officers to believe my son over me because any allegation or admission of mental health / emotional problems automatically makes you suspect, which is not right imo. Thankfully the officer i was talking to was a stand-up guy.

I was grateful driving home and once getting there, to be free to sit with my dogs on my patio - that I was not locked up somewhere which would have been on top of everything else the ultimate betrayal if my son had been successful, the ultimate insult.

[Rose76]

You need to find another therapist. What this psychologist has done is not standard procedure, and has been very inappropriate. I'm wondering if your son paid for the time he spent with this psychologist, which I strongly suspect he did. I hate to say it, but I think this psychologist was just drumming up business, by recruiting your son as another client. The whole thing sounds like a big mess.

In therapy, degrees don't tell you who you'll do best with. Find someone new, who might not even be a psychologist . . . maybe a master's level counselor. You and your son need to have a bit more separation on one level, even though that doesn't mean that you shouldn't have time together. Who he takes up with romantically is his business, and you need to stay out of that. You and your son need to know what is appropriate to share and what is not. Sharing the services of this psychologist is so inappropriate, it's beyond words. I would discourage you from having anything to do with that psychologist again.

Whether you and your son have any business sitting in therapy together is altogether an open question. I would say that, for a good while, it will not be appropriate. I would very strongly urge you to get a female therapist. I have nothing against men, and I've known women who swear by their male therapists, but I think there is a lot of potential for excess problems with cross-gender therapeutic relationships. Actually, I think a lot of men do better with female therapists, as well.

A good female therapist who is of sound mind can provide you with some good role modeling on how to process things. Men's minds tend to work differently from women's minds, and you are never going to learn to think like a well-functioning man.

You, in particular, seem to need someone who will not be emotionally aloof from you, as this male psychologist was. Not every woman therapist will be right for you either.

Find someone whom you can build a trusting relationship with . . . and leave your son out of getting in the middle of it. Of course, you will need to discuss your issues with your son in therapy. But the more I read of what's above, the clearer it is that you need to have a "son-free" zone to go to for working on your issues. By all means, discuss this whole debacle with the new therapist. There is a lot of food for thought in all that happened.

Also, PC Forums might be a useful place for you to brainstorm some things in between visits to a competent and caring therapist. But it really does sound like you badly need help and support from a good, ethical professional. I think anyone who's gone to a number of therapists has met some shady ones along the way. I know I have. But a lot of them are very good. Trust your gut.

Originally Posted by Rose76

You need to find another therapist. What this psychologist has done is not standard procedure, and has been very inappropriate. I'm wondering if your son paid for the time he spent with this psychologist, which I strongly suspect he did. I hate to say it, but I think this psychologist was just drumming up business, by recruiting your son as another client. The whole thing sounds like a big mess.

In therapy, degrees don't tell you who you'll do best with. Find someone new, who might not even be a psychologist . . . maybe a master's level counselor. You and your son need to have a bit more separation on one level, even though that doesn't mean that you shouldn't have time together. Who he takes up with romantically is his business, and you need to stay out of that. You and your son need to know what is appropriate to share and what is not. Sharing the services of this psychologist is so inappropriate, it's beyond words. I would discourage you from having anything to do with that psychologist again.

Whether you and your son have any business sitting in therapy together is altogether an open question. I would say that, for a good while, it will not be appropriate. I would very strongly urge you to get a female therapist. I have nothing against men, and I've known women who swear by their male therapists, but I think there is a lot of potential for excess problems with cross-gender therapeutic relationships. Actually, I think a lot of men do better with female therapists, as well.

A good female therapist who is of sound mind can provide you with some good role modeling on how to process things. Men's minds tend to work differently from women's minds, and you are never going to learn to think like a well-functioning man.

You, in particular, seem to need someone who will not be emotionally aloof from you, as this male psychologist was. Not every woman therapist will be right for you either.

Find someone whom you can build a trusting relationship with . . . and leave your son out of getting in the middle of it. Of course, you will need to discuss your issues with your son in therapy. But the more I read of what's above, the clearer it is that you need to have a "son-free" zone to go to for working on your issues. By all means, discuss this whole debacle with the new therapist. There is a lot of food for thought in all that happened.

Also, PC Forums might be a useful place for you to brainstorm some things in between visits to a competent and caring therapist. But it really does sound like you badly need help and support from a good, ethical professional. I think anyone who's gone to a number of therapists has met some shady ones along the way. I know I have. But a lot of them are very good. Trust your gut.

I don't trust females overall so I am not looking for a female therapist. I did not seek out a psychologist that's just who I ended up with.

The issue is not about who he's living with the issue was initially that she lied about having invited me to his surprise birthday party last year.

I have thought about it and if anything, I think this has a lot to do with the fact that about the same time all this started he gave up his decade long struggle fighting his ex-wife's parental alienation of their son. I thought we had a real chance of winning but after all that he just folded at the last minute. i was helping him with his court documents and arguments.

I think he has always been a nice guy - he certainly was to the woman who betrayed him for among other things, not agreeing to have another child with her THANK GOD he already pays a kings ransom for a child he can't see.

I think FINALLY after 45 years of being a nice guy he realized what a total screw job she did on him and so now he has decided to turn over a new TOUGH GUY leaf - he wants to get tough with somebody and since his ex is out of reach he elected me, not consciously but anyway.

Before you advise people to stay out of stuff you need to be sure you have the facts straight.

I am not discussing anything with my son or involving him in anything because I told him as far as I'm concerned he died - the son I knew certainly did - so I have no interest in who he lives with or anything else. I will never ever forget as long as i live how it felt physically and spiritually/emotionally the hands of the child I raised with love physically restraining me the goal being to "deal with" me and get me out of the way, in essence kidnapping me legally, not because he cared but to get even.

He did not mean to help me, if he had he would not have been so callous or purposely tried to invoke my anger to use against me.

[Rose76]

It sounds like the police, at least, were somewhat reasonable. Anyone restraining you physically, as you describe, is guilty of "false imprisonment," and can be subject to arrest. If anyone earnestly thought you were a danger to yourself, their only recourse would be to call the police. Your son has no right to put his hands on you.

It does sound to me like your psychologist's conduct was not what I would be willing to accept. I hope you do find someone to see who will act differently and be supportive of you.

[Thunder Bow]

You are in a bad process with your son and Therapist. The Therapist is caught up in it as much as you and your son are. Time to back out on the whole deal, and give yourself some room and space from all of them. Maybe a long vacation spent alone will help. Time to trust yourself, with out all that support you think you need.

i agree, i think you need another T. this guy doesn't sound ethical.

Originally Posted by Rose76

It sounds like the police, at least, were somewhat reasonable. Anyone restraining you physically, as you describe, is guilty of "false imprisonment," and can be subject to arrest. If anyone earnestly thought you were a danger to yourself, their only recourse would be to call the police. Your son has no right to put his hands on you.

It does sound to me like your psychologist's conduct was not what I would be willing to accept. I hope you do find someone to see who will act differently and be supportive of you.

Thank you for your thoughtful response. It sometimes takes me a while to see the whole picture but I have since arrived at the probably conclusion that the psychologist turned against me due to a comment that I made when we had a short discussion of the state of the world today and I said I was not happy with Obama for not closing the borders to Ebola like all other countries.

He put a video on you-tube mocking people who want to blame Obama for everything (he is black himself - and i deny being a racist or I never would have shared such intimate details with someone I'm said to hate) As i look back that is when his attitude changed. I believe that he called my son and asked him to come back because my son said he was through - and I think he poisoned my son's mind. I realize that may sound a bit paranoid but it seems logical to me because they are both equally cold to me - and, I was just thinking today - don't know why it didn't occur to me earlier - that part of the psychologists job should have been to educate my son about BPD so that he might not take my anger personally. I think he failed to educate my son and that he and my son put their heads together and hatched a plan to humiliate me and deprive me of my freedom. That seems a good way to get vengeance.

If my son really wanted to help something like "Mom I'm worried about you - I think you should consider checking into a clinic - I'll take you if you want to go so you don't feel afraid."

He had no intentions of such a thing - the first words out of his mouth were accusatory and belligerent - it is hard for me to 'wrap my mind around' any child of mine scheming to humiliate me and i do believe he did - there is no other explanation for his entreaties to meet suddenly where before there were none and then his alienating words. And after talking for only 3 minutes or so he went outside and immediately called the police. Are we to believe that within that 3 minutes I went off into babbling lunacy. Funny because the waitress saw nothing odd about me.

I am lucky that the restaurant I chose was in Johnson County Kansas as its an entirely different environment, a wealthy county, as opposed to Jackson County Missouri where I live which is very much rough and tumble and a good place to go if you want to commit suicide by cop.

Knowing that my son WANTED to humiliate me - and the memory of his hands on me forcefully restricting me - and I looked in his eyes that appeared not sad but smug at his actions.- is right at the top of my list of my most painful memories.

Yes, I realize my son violated the law legally/technically - I even told him that while he was restraining me - he didn't bat an eye. he was cold and calcuating and cunning. Can you imagine if what I do not know but suspect is true had come to fruition - if I was confined because of the grudge my psychologist had toward me - they could have deliberately given me medications that would make me worse. STUFF HAPPENS. it sounds paranoid - people tend to disbelieve people like us the MENTALLY ILL you know, which makes us vulnerable. My mind was fortunately working quite well that day and unlike some days I was able to explain myself coherently and intelligently - the officer even said so. Oh if they had been successful - what kind of attitude to start out with locked away knowing my son did it out of vengeance.

I have always been fairly well attuned to others, their moods etc. and insight into their actions - not because I am clairvoyant but because I am very observant. I observe myself and others a lot - its part of my 'thing" in this case a good thing.

The things I suspect are not wild imaginings - it is only common sense that the way to help someone is not to force them to be wisked away in handcuffs. Maybe if they were a real threat and refused to listen but that was not the case.

I do not feel as angry - just sad and bewildered i would never have thought my sons capable and apparently my younger son has taken advantage of the situatioin to not return calls or emails. My son wants to humiliate me but I think, as much as I am loathe to have any self-esteeem, that his treatment of me is what was disgraceful.

Thanks for your thoughts - of course I'm glad your thinking is similar to mine. its not easy to appreciate comments in the alternative.

Originally Posted by 8888an8888

i agree, i think you need another T. this guy doesn't sound ethical.

I'm glad you agree and my convictions in that regard are growing now with the realization that by all appearances he did not spend his time with my son explaining about BPD or my son would not have had such animosity. I plan on filing a complaint - whether it does any good or not is beside the point. We should do our part - if others fail on follow thru we needn't feel guilty. Who knows how many other people his inability to maintain a professional outlook and conduct could or has harmed.

Originally Posted by Thunder Bow

You are in a bad process with your son and Therapist. The Therapist is caught up in it as much as you and your son are. Time to back out on the whole deal, and give yourself some room and space from all of them. Maybe a long vacation spent alone will help. Time to trust yourself, with out all that support you think you need.

I do feel, and if i understand you agree also, that the psychologist has ceased to be a source to promote understanding and assistance and has become a part of the problem. He should have withdrawn himself if he could not contain his own emotions.

Originally Posted by 8888an8888

i agree, i think you need another T. this guy doesn't sound ethical.

I said as much to my son - his response was "he seems like a nice guy to me" which I took to be an attempt on his part to somehow infer that I'm just such a negative loser and disagreeable old woman that is the problem - my instincts tell me my judgment is correct.

What this therapist trained in DBT? from what I've read about DBT and therapy, (as I have BPD too) it's best to find one who is trained in DBT. I know that it can be difficult to find them ( I know I've had a hard time finding one who has the training), but the success rate is higher if you are able to get a therapist who really knows how to help you best with DBT. I hope you find a therapist that can really help you. .

Originally Posted by MMBean

What this therapist trained in DBT? from what I've read about DBT and therapy, (as I have BPD too) it's best to find one who is trained in DBT. I know that it can be difficult to find them ( I know I've had a hard time finding one who has the training), but the success rate is higher if you are able to get a therapist who really knows how to help you best with DBT. I hope you find a therapist that can really help you. .

After this last disaster my top priority is to find a therapist who is a professional and will not betray me by trying to turn my son against me and by refusing to help me - but not having the decency to say he won't help me - but by being sly, cunning, cold and caluculating. The natural tendency when "someone like me" says such a thing is to assume I am delusional and paranoid but I am not. I just have always had good insight, I've had to have to survive - the trouble was I didn't always listen - now I do.

[Nammu]

I'm sad for you that everything is so black and white, those that are not with you are against you. I hope you find a therapist that can help you with the DBT.

Originally Posted by MMBean

What this therapist trained in DBT? from what I've read about DBT and therapy, (as I have BPD too) it's best to find one who is trained in DBT. I know that it can be difficult to find them ( I know I've had a hard time finding one who has the training), but the success rate is higher if you are able to get a therapist who really knows how to help you best with DBT. I hope you find a therapist that can really help you. .

No - I don't think he was - he wasn't registered on the AMA'S site among their psychologists - I don't know how they decide who goes there or if they sign up for their names there. Monday i will get back to work on it and keep the things you said in mind definitely thanks. I have a terrible time with "concepts" like DBT - I did with biofeedback and just ended up being very frustrated but I won't judge it till I try it I have ADD and have a hard time concentrating.

Thank you Charley for your good wishes.