Are there some people who just can't get the benefits of CBT?

I'd like to think I'm a reasonably intelligent person. I have a master's in social work, so I'm more than a little familiar with mental heath treatments. But the last round of talk therapy I've had was all centered around cognitive behavioral therapy. While I like the idea of attacking distorted thoughts, and I realize that other people have gotten a lot of benefits form it, the actual therapy itself felt so basic to me. It was as if I was getting talked down to and my emotions were totally being ignored because I was a bad girl who forgot her math homework.

Even when I tried to mention this to the therapist, she kept coming back to the mood charts and worksheets and such. It was as if there was only this one method, and even when it didn't work, she was bound and determined to make it fit. As far as I can tel from researching into other therapists, everybody seems to have jumped on the CBT wagon, so I'm not exactly thrilled at the idea of having more of the same.

Am I just so unlucky that CBT doesn't work for me, when it seems to work for everyone else? And what cna I do instead?

Hello, Moon Pigeon.
She only had one tool, therefore it had to be the right one.

Over the years CBT has done little or nothing for me. A certain percentage of people are not going to derive much benefit from it, and I believe serious researchers understand this.

Alternatives: Person/Client-Centered Therapy? Dialectical Behavior Therapy? Do-it-yourself? Given your background, you are in a good position to take charge of your own approach.

If I had a better grasp of my family history, I'd try to construct a "family diagram" (genogram) to gain potential insight into myself in that constellation of personalities.

Wishing you success in your search for something that works.

Had CBT in 1986-1987 when it was new. I was being treated for panic attacks. The psych doctor also drew mood charts and worksheets. It worked well for about a dozen sessions but then it became too predictable for me. And yes your right, it does seem to avoid your emotions after a while.

The only problem with asking that kind of question on this forum is we may not get a solid answer. Most users are utilizing this forum because they are currently coping with their depression. We may not get the opportunity to have many people who have benefited from CBT chime in.

As for me personally... I currently am not financially able to to see a therapist. I am working on a CBT workbook on my own. Although some of my thoughts and emotions are slipperry, I am still forging ahead. Wish me luck.

CBT isn't helping me one bit.

Though I'm sorry that people have not had luck with CBT, I can't say I'm surprised. I haven't had it as an individual therapy. I have been exposed to it in groups and felt it not only ignored emotions and was simplistic, but it had potential to do harm by "blaming the victim." I know more about it from the perspective of someone training to be a therapist. While there is tons of research supposedly proving its effectiveness and lots of agencies choose it, there are obvious problems with it.

In terms of what to do instead, which is the important thing here, there are some suggestions. I do think that DBT is better; it makes sure that it is not invalidating and teaches mindfulness and other skills. Still, it is in the same camp as CBT so may not be the answer. It would be easy to find out if it were a possibility by going online since a lot of the worksheets and such are available.

I myself do psychoanalytically-informed therapy and love it. It does address emotions, does deal with deeper issues, is able to handle complexity, and is also very personally tailored. Don't go by stereotypes about psychoanalysis. The new forms have thrown out a lot of that old stuff and are very focused on the relationship and very interactive. The relationship with the therapist in broad studies about what works is way more important that a particular technique. Unfortunately not all CBT therapists allow that as an emphasis.

I have not found that approach to really help me much at all.

I've just started CBT, not because I have any real hope that it is right for me but because that is all that is on offer. The trouble I have is not so much distorted thinking but not thinking or feeling at all. How can I challenge a mind that is devoid of thought?

However, I am hopeful that CBT might help out a little with the anxiety I'm getting this time around. I know I sound like I'm contradicitng myself saying I don't expect it to work but I hope it might. So far I've had two sessions out of a maximum of 12 and we haven't done any CBT at all.

Archipelago, thanks for the comment about blaming the victim, I'll watch out for that. In my job i have to deal with coworkers blaming the vicitms of crime, it gets me so mad.

You need a new therapist. There are nots of kinds of CBT and cold rationalisation obviously isn't going to change your feelings. My therapist noticed this with me and took me down a more 'compassion-based therapy' path which was actually quite painful but i think it has more hope of being successful as it actually involves making you feel things. Then there's behavioural activation and all that that doesn't try and delve into your deeper thoughts, it just tries to make you feel better by dealing with immediate problems in your behaviour.

Well said. This is a hard-to-tackle problem.

No therapy will work for everybody, that is just how it is. Even the research supporting CBT doesn't claim it's a panacea, just that it works for a lot of people.

Maybe you can try finding who uses a psychodynamic and/or interpersonal approach, if you want your emotions addressed that sounds like it might work better for you.

Personally during my worst depressive times I wouldn't have been able to do CBT because I was so cognitively impaired, I couldn't comprehend anything I read anymore at times.

CBT has never helped me. But that may be partially my gault, not being fully honest or being stubbornly silent.
I don't see the point of cbt nor how it can help. I kept bringing it up during sessions however we didn't get anywhere with it.

I have found CBT to be somewhat effective, but also insufficient. Once insight-oriented psychodynamic techniques are added to it, I find there's a synergy between them that works better for me. I just wish I had the finances to pursue that a lot further.

I have always liked CBT very much. How to process things better and look at things from a healthier perspective is a good thing. I don't think you need much therapy to learn and practice it. You can learn it on your own for that matter.

I don't think it has helped my depression so much but it may have I dunno. I don't think my depression is caused by faulty thinking I think it is the other way around. I think my depression causes faulty thinking and once I am deep in it CBT helps with fear of the future and anxiety but not really the depression. I can't think my way out of it.

I agree with zinco

I believe that the entire realm of the so called mental illness is genetic and is related to DNA. But because of the stigma it is put down to "brain chemistry" and gets a band-aid slapped on it in the form of medications. There is more and more evidence that connect mental illness with other physical illness like MS and others. There is evidence that the brain can change from thinking but that's not the total answer.

CBT can help but in a limited way. It can help make lifestyle changes that make it easier to handle the illness. It can help change the way a person reacts to the manifestations of MI like depression but I don't believe it is going to solve depression or any other MI on an organic level.

For some doctors they think the cart came before the horse by insisting that the way you think causes the depression and that causes the changes in the brain. I agree with zinco that the illness comes first and that causes the change in thinking that changes the brain. The answer is looking at the whole body not just the brain. In mathematics if you take out any part of the equation the entire thing is invalidated. The answer to MI will be found in science not conjecture and guess work.

People are referred to CBT under NHS for both depression and anxiety. For some it works, for others it doesn't. People are different and respond to things differently. CBT is supposed to be really effective at challenging negative thinking, looking at alternative more positive way of seeing and behaving in situations. The belief is that negative thoughts create negative feelings and behaviours. Both depression and anxiety are considered to be due to negative thinking, ideas, unhelpful habits. CBT works in the here and now. I have tried this myself type of therapy but didn't turn out well.

As an out patient I have been in CBT twice.I to can not grasp the CBT concept.It has been frustrating for the person presenting the lessons because I always kept asking questions and challenging certain concepts.It just felt like I was standing on my head upside down.The other problem for me about CBT is that this program felt like a form of following the person who created this program as guru.The one great thing I did get from this program was a great therapist who was part of this out patient program who left and went into her own practice.

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My therapist uses CBT. I don't foresee it helping me, unfortunately. At my last session, I even said to him, "I don't even know why I'm here." All he does is tell me to think positively and to not worry about things, which just doesn't resonate with me. The way I see it, walking around going, "Lalala. My life sucks, but I'm just going to think about butterflies and pretty flowers! Whee!" is practically insane.

I think CBT works well for conditioned response issues like with OCD behaviors and phobias. It doesn't seem like it's helpful for my depression.

Oh man, the positive thinking stuff....

I can't say it does much for me. Generally speaking I already know and to some extent do the things they are trying to teach me.

My current T is going with distractions right now, I'm always distracted. I am never doing nothing for the precise reason that I don't want to deal with my thoughts. Problem is distracting myself doesn't stop the thought returning.

The last T went with the 'detective' thing. When you have a bad thought you think of other possible reasons for that thought. Again something I already do. I am well aware of the other possible (and usually more logical) reasons for why something has happened but I don't feel them.

It's not my thought process that is the problem, it's my emotions.

If there are than I am certainly one of them.

So I'm up to session number 4, or 5, I've lost count. As far as I can tell we've not actually started any "therapy" yet, we're still doing groundwork. I may be wrong about that though.

So far I've got two big issues. First is the example I was given to explain how CBT works. I know I'm being picky and it was just one example but I assume the example is one that many people relate to, especially if CBT is going to work for them.

So here's the example, I've had a hard day so I go shopping to relax, I see someone I know but they appear to ignore me, I get upset and think they have ignored me because they don't like me and I go home feeling sick and unhappy. Apparently if, instead of getting upset and thinking the person doesn't like me, I think "Oh they look preoccupied I wonder if they are OK?" and then I ring them up when I get in to find out what's up, then I won't feel sick or unhappy.

Where do I begin with this example not being relevant to me? I don't go shopping to relax and I don't have friends, well I can just about imagine those scenarios so I'll go with them. The BIG problem is that if someone didn't see me, that is exactly what I'd think, they didn't see me, end of. I wouldn't worry why they'd ignored me, I wouldn't worry why they didn't see me (even though I'm quite hard to miss), I wouldn't make any assumptions about their motives at all, so I couldn't think myself better in that situation. I know there are no doubt other scenarios that may be more like my thinking pattern, but being given a scenario that is completely alien to me doesn't fill me with much hope.

The second issue I have is that we are now working on a problem defintion, the trouble is it isn't a definition it is a description. So either we are doing the process wrong or I am misunderstanding the process or quite simply the choice of word (defintion) is wrong. Again, a process that leaves so much uncertainty in my mind doesn't inspire me with confidence.

Despite these doubts I'm sticking with CBT (there's nothing else on offer) and hoping that somehow it will help me out of the rut I'm stuck in. Each session I hope, maybe today I'll get it.